₦airaland Forum

BlueRayDick:
In a nuthsell he's a younger and maybe taller Gabriel Jesus

Yup!

BlueRayDick:
I read the thing I just dey laugh. I don watch Havertz for almost 4 years week in week out and I no see any of these qualities. At this point it appears when Jude of Chelsea thread dropped the Havertz hype, he handed it over to Spy and he he intends to outdo Jude in the new assignment.

Shey na the same Havertz wey dey play like drunkard he dey describe as having technique and guile of Ozilsque & Berbatovic kinikan knikan...?

Like nothing dey surprise me seeing that attributes associated with Havertz. Sometimes you'll wonder what this guy does that will make you look at Ozil/Berbatov/ballack and still think he has any of this gifted attributes like them. Na either massive Pr or Jazz cos this one is more than normal eyes.

I don tell Spy say na him be the new Jude for this thread. Havertz must be so proud of their loyalty for elevating mediocrity into godlike height

mostob:
Omo...where all these rumours dey comot sef? First, it was Mayoral..now it is Joshua. I think Joshua is from Bayern academy.

He's from Bayern academy.

I no even know anything about am sef but he's probably mid. If we can't get a top striker, make we just manage Nketiah and Jesus laidat.

What's the need of selling free Nketiah to buy another Nketiah

BlueRayDick:
I sensed it was going to happen. But e no make sense say na after we commot FA and Carabao cup we come recall am

This next 5months go be like.... ucl kon dey again.

mostob:
Yea... he is in Dubai. Pensioner sef follow them.

I dunno what to say. Even the Onana talk, i do pray it's not the only January talk we would take as serious.

Jodera:
There was a reason I asked you that time how many open play headers have Saka actually scored when you were saying that Saka should leave corner kick duties and compete for headers.



As for Jota, he's is their killer!!.

Jota have been out since due to injury and he's just returning. Ask any Liverpool fan, Jota is always a firm favourite to always start when fit.

Alexis is shorter than him but still use head. I hate when attackers can't use head, especially for empty net. He needs to totally step UP that aspect abeg.

To imagine we were connected to him before Liverpool took over again.

daveP:
Marquinhos has been recalled.

Someone with only one start I think since he went on loan. I don’t think his return was at Arsenal’s request, I think Nantes were done. I guess he gives us some depth but I don’t see Arteta involving him in the league or UCL.

Roland17:
Someone with only one start I think since he went on loan. I don’t think his return was at Arsenal’s request, I think Nantes were done. I guess he gives us some depth but I don’t see Arteta involving him in the league or UCL

What's the depth if he won't be involved in either competition?

So many dross depth in this team

daveP:
Alexis is shocker than him but still use head. I hate when attackers can't use head, especially for empty net. He needs to totally step UP that aspect abeg.

To imagine we were connected to him before Liverpool took over again.

Lol... I don't know if contesting for aerial duels can be taught sha. (Except free headers).

I don't just know if he can step up in that sha (cos I don't really know anyone who's a professional who is bad at header later turned good)

Jodera:
What's the depth if he won't be involved in either competition?

So many dross depth in this team

Baba, wetin you say make I talk na?

He adds no value to us right now. No one is going to take him on another loan. Some of our transfers dey annoy me.

Imagine if we took the money spent on Kai Kai/ Raya and scraps like Marquinhos to buy a solid midfielder?

Baba I don tire.

Jodera:
Na only for blogs and football sites him deh possess all these techniques right from when him dey Chelsea. Everywhere else apart from the most important place — the pitch!!

This guy PR must be studied!!

Berbatov himself said Kai is the closest to him in terms of skill and techniques. So you doubting my point is the one who needs to get informed. When people make statements ask for evidence before dismissing them.

Jodera:
Trossard never die.
We knew what he can do at LCM in preseason and if given some run of games, he'll excel there cos he's shown he got it. Presently we've ESR too who's back.

Na only you dey feel say no we no get people when actually with or without his signing we for still go far.

We have tried Trossard there and seen his ability. He is not better than Kai at all in that LAM position.

The closest I can vouch for is ESR who himself is basically untried. Even though I have preference for him.

Until Partey comes back and Rice plays that role as a CM, the best we have there is Kai Havertz

Jodera:
Lol... I don't know if contesting for aerial duels can be taught sha. (Except free headers).

I don't just know if he can step up in that sha (cos I don't really know anyone who's a professional who is bad at header later turned good)

make he still dey avoid am na. He think say na beans? Ucl football go change his OT. Lol

Spy360:
You have the benefit of hindsight.

Even at that, Kai still possesses the technique and guile of an Ozilesque/Berbatovic midfielder that if he clicks would be of devastating effect. Right now it's not so, but he has the potentials.

Neither Ozil or Berbatov played in the deep role he is being asked to play. His skillset of disappearing for large chunks of the game or making off the ball runs and then appearing in the box to score crucial goals is not what you need in that CM position.

It is not even about his quality but about his fit for the team. And this is not hindsight cos I knew both he and Mount were the wrong fit for the clubs that bought them right from when they were bought.

I don’t want to delve into your Ozil comparison too much but if Havertz stole the eyes of everybody on this thread and wore telescope and binoculars for all the eyes he still won’t have half the vision of Ozil.

P. S I was a Havertz fan when he was in Germany.

afrodoc2:
Neither Ozil or Berbatov played in the deep role he is being asked to play. His skillset of disappearing for large chunks of the game or making off the ball runs and then appearing in the box to score crucial goals is not what you need in that CM position.

It is not even about his quality but about his fit for the team. And this is not hindsight cos I knew both he and Mount were the wrong fit for the clubs that bought them right from when they were bought.

I don’t want to delve into your Ozil comparison too much but if Havertz stole the eyes of everybody on this thread and wore telescope and binoculars for all the eyes he still won’t have half the vision of Ozil.

P. S I was a Havertz fan when he was in Germany.

Bold 1: Such qualities can still be effective. Lampard was known to make off the ball movements into the box to score several goals to devastating effect.

Bold 2: is a subjective opinion. The managers that signed them knew what they wanted from them. That it is not appreciated is a different thing and an afterthought.

Spy360:
Bold 1: Such qualities can still be effective. Lampard was known to make off the ball movements into the box to score several goals to devastating effect.

Bold 2: is a subjective opinion. The managers that signed them knew what they wanted from them. That it is not appreciated is a different thing and an afterthought.

1) You are comparing apples and oranges. Lampard usually played with 2 more defensive minded midfielders in order to make those runs, whether it was Mendes and Makelele or Essien and Makelele. That was when he played his best. Havertz can't play the same when his partners are Odegaard and Rice. It leaves an imbalance and lack of control in your midfield.

Lampard essentially played as the most advanced midfielder (the 10) in those successful Chelsea sides. That is the role Odegaard plays in your team albeit a bit skewed to the right. Your team required a deeper lying player to replace Xhaka not a German McTominay/VDB with excellent PR.

2) So, because the managers decided to sign them they can't be wrong? I better not find any evidence of you criticizing a manager on this site then, since a manager making a decision automatically makes it right. Also, it is not an afterthought if people predicted that it would not work out before it happened. That is the very opposite of afterthought.

Spy, Havertz is averaging 22.8 passes per game in the EPL. Can you name another starting midfielder in a top side who is averaging such poverty numbers?
Your answer might reveal some truths to you.

Spy360:
You have the benefit of hindsight.

Even at that, Kai still possesses the technique and guile of an Ozilesque/Berbatovic midfielder that if he clicks would be of devastating effect. Right now it's not so, but he has the potentials.

When will he click? When will he unleash the so called potential? After 10 seasons?

The same Kai we all watched at Chelsea for 3 season whose only highlight was his Champion league goal in the final. Here we are hoping he will click for us while serious title contenders like Liverpool and Man city have solid players in all departments with alternatives if anyone messes up.

We hope to win a title, yet Arteta is busy shoving “when he clicks” down our throat week in week out when we know the team is going against two monster teams (at least for now) for the EPL title.

We wouldn’t even be having Havertz talk if the coach had used his brain to buy a performing player like he did with Rice.

Everyday, Havertz this, Havertz that. Smith Rowe or even Zichenko will give more while playing his position if given the same opportunity.

Roland17:
Baba, wetin you say make I talk na?

He adds no value to us right now. No one is going to take him on another loan. Some of our transfers dey annoy me.

Imagine if we took the money spent on Kai Kai/ Raya and scraps like Marquinhos to buy a solid midfielder?

Baba I don tire.

Likeeee.... Na we just use our hands dig ourselves enter this ffp matter with open eyes.

E just dey tiring!!

daveP:
make he still dey avoid am na. He think say na beans? Ucl football go change his OT. Lol

Personally, I think nobody will look at whether you're good in head or not if really you're good at what you do with your legs.

See Salah for example, he hardly contests for headers too and the few he's scored is mostly empty net/free headers yet nobody is seeing it as issues. And there are so many examples aside those two.

Not saying it's not important but personally there are many more important facets of his games he needs to improve on that's up in the scale of preference than headers.

Spy360:
Berbatov himself said Kai is the closest to him in terms of skill and techniques. So you doubting my point is the one who needs to get informed. When people make statements ask for evidence before dismissing them.

Berbatov said so. I'm sure even late Beckenbauer, Kahn and so many other good to great players especially ex German players and pundits said so too which I why I said the guy PR or JuJu must be so so strong and massive. I mean, the only evidence you think/feel the guy is good is because pundits/ex players said so

We wey don watch am for more than 3 years now and we know say there's nothing like unique talent in this guy not to talk of the "generational talent" he's been attributed with.

His talent is always on pundits mouth, ex players mouth, blogs/site but Never on the pitch!!

This guy Jazz/Grace and PR or whatever is so massive that it needs to be taught in school as a course on its own.

Spy360:
We have tried Trossard there and seen his ability. He is not better than Kai at all in that LAM position.

The closest I can vouch for is ESR who himself is basically untried. Even though I have preference for him.

Until Partey comes back and Rice plays that role as a CM, the best we have there is Kai Havertz

How many times have Trossard played there this season?
Just once aganst West Ham but you think that's enough.

Meanwhile when Havertz started there beginning of season and was dropping stinkers you were here telling us how he needs more games to click and acclamatize.

You've forgotten so soon that Trossard won our preseason best player and what position did he played while winning that? LAM

At least, the preseason performance will show you that if given more game time there he'll surely deliver but of course you won't know.

Havertz will Never be missed in this team!!

E just dey pain me say person laidat no dey go injury or collect straight red card

I believe Havertz is the Carlos Kaiser of our time.
Scam otu footballer.

afrodoc2:
Spy, Havertz is averaging 22.8 passes per game in the EPL. Can you name another starting midfielder in a top side who is averaging such poverty numbers?
Your answer might reveal some truths to you.

When he's always running, why will he pass?

Always running away from the ball and Spy will tell us it's "off the ball runs"

Jodera:
When he's always running, why will he pass?

Always running away from the ball and Spy will tell us it's "off the ball runs"

You can't play in that position and be focussed on off the ball runs.

Other CMs are making 45-60 passes per game and the guy is making 22 passes per game. When he makes his off the ball runs who is he leaving his primary job to? The guy is a hybrid of McTominay and VDB.

Last season Xhaka was making about 42 passes per game. Now his replacement is making just over 50% of that meaning there are 20-22 times per game this season where instead of being in position to receive the ball from his teammate and control the game the guy is off elsewhere on the pitch doing God knows what.

afrodoc2:
You can't play in that position and be focussed on off the ball runs.

Other CMs are making 45-60 passes per game and the guy is making 22 passes per game. When he makes his off the ball runs who is he leaving his primary job to? The guy is a hybrid of McTominay and VDB.

Last season Xhaka was making about 42 passes per game. Now his replacement is making just over 50% of that meaning there are 20-22 times per game this season where instead of being in position to receive the ball from his teammate and control the game the guy is off elsewhere on the pitch doing God knows what.

I don tell Spy last week say Havertz na German McTom. He's one of the reasons Martinelli suffers too cos instead of him to have any sort of relationship with Martinelli to drag player away from him, he'll be running into the box for God knows what.

I've always said it that once we're with the ball, this guy is a ghost. You'll never ever see him.

afrodoc2:
1) You are comparing apples and oranges. Lampard usually played with 2 more defensive minded midfielders in order to make those runs, whether it was Mendes and Makelele or Essien and Makelele. That was when he played his best. Havertz can't play the same when his partners are Odegaard and Rice. It leaves an imbalance and lack of control in your midfield.

Lampard essentially played as the most advanced midfielder (the 10) in those successful Chelsea sides. That is the role Odegaard plays in your team albeit a bit skewed to the right. Your team required a deeper lying player to replace Xhaka not a German McTominay/VDB with excellent PR.

2) So, because the managers decided to sign them they can't be wrong? I better not find any evidence of you criticizing a manager on this site then, since a manager making a decision automatically makes it right. Also, it is not an afterthought if people predicted that it would not work out before it happened. That is the very opposite of afterthought.

Your analysis is almost correct but you got no 1 wrong may be it because you are not an Arsenal fan as we know that on that left wing the LB inverts into midfield creating a double pivot with Rice which pushes the Kai into advanced positions similar to Odegaard on the right. Kai has scored 5 goals this season. In comparison the highest goal scorer has 9. Gabriel Jesus and Odegaard have 7 each.

As per no 2, I am sure you wouldn't be having this conversation if Kai turns to prime Zinidine Zidane. Therefore it's all afterthought.

toluxe0075:
When will he click? When will he unleash the so called potential? After 10 seasons?

The same Kai we all watched at Chelsea for 3 season whose only highlight was his Champion league goal in the final. Here we are hoping he will click for us while serious title contenders like Liverpool and Man city have solid players in all departments with alternatives if anyone messes up.

We hope to win a title, yet Arteta is busy shoving “when he clicks” down our throat week in week out when we know the team is going against two monster teams (at least for now) for the EPL title.

We wouldn’t even be having Havertz talk if the coach had used his brain to buy a performing player like he did with Rice.

Everyday, Havertz this, Havertz that. Smith Rowe or even Zichenko will give more while playing his position if given the same opportunity.

Kai signed a 4year contract and he is barely into half a year with us. And he hasn't done badly compared to Vieira and Nelson.

If Partey was fit, Kai would have been coming from bench because Rice will play that position. But as it stands now he isn't doing bad for me. He is better than all the other options we have including Trossard who is more suited to Martinelli role.
If Partey was av

Jodera:
Berbatov said so. I'm sure even late Beckenbauer, Kahn and so many other good to great players especially ex German players and pundits said so too which I why I said the guy PR or JuJu must be so so strong and massive. I mean, the only evidence you think/feel the guy is good is because pundits/ex players said so

We wey don watch am for more than 3 years now and we know say there's nothing like unique talent in this guy not to talk of the "generational talent" he's been attributed with.

His talent is always on pundits mouth, ex players mouth, blogs/site but Never on the pitch!!

This guy Jazz/Grace and PR or whatever is so massive that it needs to be taught in school as a course on its own.

No everyone will have tactical eyes.

The managers, players and ex-players and national team coaches and myself know what we see.

Kai is a space controller and that skill set is difficult to see. The same way a dribbler is difficult to see.

Spy360:
Your analysis is almost correct but you got no 1 wrong may be it because you are not an Arsenal fan as we know that on that left wing the LB inverts into midfield creating a double pivot with Rice which pushes the Kai into advanced positions similar to Odegaard on the right. Kai has scored 5 goals this season. In comparison the highest goal scorer has 9. Gabriel Jesus and Odegaard have 7 each.

As per no 2, I am sure you wouldn't be having this conversation if Kai turns to prime Zinidine Zidane. Therefore it's all afterthought.

For No 1: Explain how the guy that Kai replaced averaged 42 passes per game while the partner for both of them Ødegaard averages 50 passes per game while Kai averages 22 passes per game.

For No 2: You keep making the wrong comparisons. Zidane never played as deep as that in midfield. Kai does not have the skillset to play in the position he is currently playing in.

The team has to have balance. You can’t just put goal scorers or players with attacking skill in every position. A team of 11 Messis will lose to Brentford.

P.S Your definition of afterthought is strange. Before the season started i said a fit ESR would be a better fit than Havertz. So how can it be afterthought if I said it BEFORE it happened?

Jodera:
How many times have Trossard played there this season?
Just once aganst West Ham but you think that's enough.

Meanwhile when Havertz started there beginning of season and was dropping stinkers you were here telling us how he needs more games to click and acclamatize.

You've forgotten so soon that Trossard won our preseason best player and what position did he played while winning that? LAM

At least, the preseason performance will show you that if given more game time there he'll surely deliver but of course you won't know.

Havertz will Never be missed in this team!!

E just dey pain me say person laidat no dey go injury or collect straight red card

I am also convinced that given time Trossard will click in that LAM position. I have also held the opinion that our best bet there is even ESR. I have so much conviction that he will overtake everybody in that position if his injuries allow him.

But for now it's all about Kai.

This is what you should get.

afrodoc2:
For No 1: Explain how the guy that Kai replaced averaged 42 passes per game while the partner for both of them Ødegaard averages 50 passes per game while Kai averages 22 passes per game.

For No 2: You keep making the wrong comparisons. Zidane never played as deep as that in midfield. Kai does not have the skillset to play in the position he is currently playing in.

The team has to have balance. You can’t just put goal scorers or players with attacking skill in every position. A team of 11 Messis will lose to Brentford.

P.S Your definition of afterthought is strange. Before the season started i said a fit ESR would be a better fit than Havertz. So how can it be afterthought if I said it BEFORE it happened?

Let me start with the bolded. As much as I support the claim, it is still yet to happen. So how does that affect Kai's position?

For No 1, Kai is a space controller. He is not a ball juggler, he is not a pass master. He is a space controller. We can decide to play a dribbler there instead of a passer. Xhaka was more of a passer. A dribbler will equally make less passes. It all depends on what the manager wants. The most important thing is the overall output. Kai has 4 league goals already. In comparison Xhaka scored 7 in his best season for us. In that season we scored more goals in a season in our PL history.

No 2, is largely subjective opinion and you are fully entitled to it. But same does Arteta, myself and every other coach that manages Kai.

Spy360:
Let me start with the bolded. As much as I support the claim, it is still yet to happen. So how does that affect Kai's position?

For No 1, Kai is a space controller. He is not a ball juggler, he is not a pass master. He is a space controller. We can decide to play a dribbler there instead of a passer. Xhaka was more of a passer. A dribbler will equally make less passes. It all depends on what the manager wants. The most important thing is the overall output. Kai has 4 league goals already. In comparison Xhaka scored 7 in his best season for us. In that season we scored more goals in a season in our PL history.

No 2, is largely subjective opinion and you are fully entitled to it. But same does Arteta, myself and every other coach that manages Kai.

Space wetin?

Can you name other space controllers in midfield that you know?