₦airaland Forum

Expanse2020:
Afọju open yours eyes and read the caption on the hadith to know...
Àlàyé bajẹ the site you post the caption have been exposed teytey for your lie...no one is buying it again🤪🤪🤪🤪

It is Sunan Abu Dawud / Hadith 2116 not yours Sunan Abi Dawud

Oju wereyyy ara e kuku ti fo already

AntiisIam:
Abirun, sebi you kuku see where I copied it from. Walai ti e ti run jegejege olofo


Sunan Abu Dawud / Hadith 2116

Source: https://quranx.com/hadith/AbuDawud/Hasan/Hadith-2116/#:~:text=Sunan%20Abu%20Dawud%20%2F%20Hadith%202116&text=The%20Messenger%20of%20Allah%20(%EF%B7%BA,I%20was%20nine%20years%20old.

Oponu I showed him the authentic hadith he still de argue..
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ọlọhun ni wo ọmọ werey

AntiisIam:
It is Sunan Abu Dawud / Hadith 2116 not yours Sunan Abi Dawud

Oju wereyyy ara e kuku ti fo already

Oponu ni what Abi Dawúd and what is Abu Dawúd🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ọpọnu go learn before you argue
Is there a different between Olohunkemi àti ọlọrunkemi🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ofonu omo

Expanse2020:
Oponu ni what Abi Dawúd and what is Abu Dawúd🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ọpọnu go learn before you argue

Olofo sebi you kuku see where I copied it from..

I even sent you the link wereyyy pataki

Expanse2020:
Oponu I showed him the authentic hadith he still de argue..
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ọlọhun ni wo ọmọ werey

Wow, eleribu here comes the authentic hadith from sunnah.com


Koni ragba fun e laye ati ni isinku e iwo wereyy omo ofo yii

Expanse2020:
Oponu ni what Abi Dawúd and what is Abu Dawúd🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ọpọnu go learn before you argue
Is there a different between Olohunkemi àti ọlọrunkemi🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 ofonu omo

Sebi you believe in sunnah.com.. Mo ti finish e kpatakpata iwo omo alaye run yii.. Make I laugh in Arabic

O ma sofo danu nii iwo eru lasanlasan ekeji aja yii

Source:
https://sunnah.com/search?q=%22nine+years+old%22

Expanse2020:
Oponu I showed him the authentic hadith he still de argue..
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ọlọhun ni wo ọmọ werey

You must never in your miserable life come back here again.. Mo tan wereyyy ara e not until you fall my hand

Shey na me no go no say Abu Dawud and Abi Dawud is the same, o ti pe gan nah I've been dealing with useless slaves like you on nairaland. Is like saying Antiislam and Antiislaam are different


Mi ti finish e kpatakpata, koni ragba fun isinku e iwo omo ale jati-jati yii

Sebi you kuku trust in sunnah.com and mi ti fi the same sunnah.com finish miserable life e

Expanse2020:
Afọju open yours eyes and read the caption on the hadith to know...
Àlàyé bajẹ the site you post the caption have been exposed teytey for your lie...no one is buying it again🤪🤪🤪🤪

Shey o wa ri wipe aiye e tiwa baje kpatakpata bayii. Oya talk say sunnah.com had been exposed teytey too. Imagine you're even laughing at your own madness, chaii sorry ehn.


Now judge between you and I, tani aiye e tiwa baje, tani aiye tiwa run, tani ti e tita? YOU ARE THE ONE because mi ti fi sunnah.com that you strongly believe in to finish your useless, miserable and hopeless life.

Look for nearest lagoon and jump inside it sogbo. Alaye run jegejege omo ale jati-jati

Invite the league of your alfas and imams here to come and confront me as you're too very small and cheap for me to handle

Expanse2020 abirun don avoid dis topic.. Never in your miserable life argue here again, is that clear abunu omo odeson

AntiisIam:
Expanse2020 abirun don avoid dis topic.. Never in your miserable life argue here again, is that clear abunu omo odeson

Ọpọnu which one did you abandon
Am not jobless as you to be wasting my time on internet with w fool likeyou

Expanse2020:
Ọpọnu which one did you abandon
Am not jobless as you to be wasting my time on internet with w fool likeyou

Ahahahahaha.. It is now you're not jobless asinwin but you were jobless when trying defending sunnah.com as the most reliable site that never shows Muhammad having sex with Aishat when she was 9yrs of age abi bawo but shocked when I finally shown you the stupidity in your messenger's life having intercourse with his great grand daughter as narrated from the sunnah.com you love so much.

Walai koni ragba fun e seh aaje, o ma s'oriburuku nii for defending Muhammad here

Qasim6:
Dunce you know nothing about your Bible to be giving opinion here.

Why did Peter call him a prophet in Acts 2:30 if he was not a prophet?

David was severely punished for the shameful and criminal act. But what about Muhammed?
Muhammed sleeping with his own adopted wife's son is immoral. Even the community frowned at such. Muhammed had to produce a verse to cover his indignity.
What people dont know is that the marriage of Muhammed to zainab led to the the end of adoption in the arab community. Muhammed claimed Allah told him to marry his adopted son's wife to show people that adoption illegal.
So of all ways to prove a point, the best Allah could see is covetousness.

SIRTee15:
David was severely punished for the shameful and criminal act. But what about Muhammed?
Muhammed sleeping with his own adopted wife's son is immoral. Even the community frowned at such. Muhammed had to produce a verse to cover his indignity.
What people dont know is that the marriage of Muhammed to zainab led to the the end of adoption in the arab community. Muhammed claimed Allah told him to marry his adopted son's wife to show people that adoption illegal.
So of all ways to prove a point, the best Allah could see is covetousness.

What exactly did David do and how was he punished?

No bro, adoption is not entirely illegal in Islam. They just can't take your name as surname. Make everyone bear him papa name.

The purpose of the marriage was to stressed the fact that if you are not blood related, then you are not blood related and the prophet did not sleep with Zainab while she was married to Zaid, the prophet married Zainab after they were divorced.

And Yeah, Allah gave him permission to marry Zainab. We strongly believe the Qur'an is the word of God. Except if you can prove otherwise.

Qasim6:
What exactly did David do and how was he punished?

David committed adultery and murder- He sinned and brought the wages of sin into his household.
How was he punished? - God rejected his prayer when he called on God to help him remove the burden of sin he brought into his home with his hands.

Qasim6:
No bro, adoption is not entirely illegal in Islam. They just can't take your name as surname. Make everyone bear him papa name.

The purpose of the marriage was to stressed the fact that if you are not blood related, then you are not blood related and the prophet did not sleep with Zainab while she was married to Zaid, the prophet married Zainab after they were divorced.

Yeah, so it's ok to marry the wife of someone that calls u father and u call son just because u are not related? So women have finished in your locality and the only one that entered your eye is the ex wife of your adopted son.
So u don't see anything wrong with having sex with a woman who also had sex with your adopted son- a child that grew up in your home and calls u father.
in case u dont know, that's an abimnation in most african culture. Try that in Yorubaland and see tongues wagging.
In African culture, Any child that calls u father and u call him son is as good as your child.
Go and read about Okonkwo and Ikemefuna in things fall apart.
Okonkwo was told, 'do not have a hand in that boy's death because he calls u father'.
It's a pity most african culture have better morality than what is in the Quran.

Qasim6:
And Yeah, Allah gave him permission to marry Zainab. We strongly believe the Qur'an is the word of God. Except if you can prove otherwise.

Allah didnt tell Muhammed anything. He simply followed his own covetuous desires. Muhammed turned Allah into his own errand boy that gives ayah for every Muhammed's personal problem.
Even Aisha smelled a rat and had to comment 'Seems your Lord is quick to grant u your heart desire' noticed she said your Lord and not our Lord. that shows skepticism on the part of Aisha.

and Allah being the word of God is a joke.
I took u up on it the last time but u ran away. I hope u stay longer this time.
Now I will bring 3 evidence to prove that Quran cant be from God

1. Tell me about the men in the cave in surah Al-kahf. who are they in real history?
2. Is Allah all knowing and all powerful? according to the Quran is Allah omniscient and Omnipotent?
3. Is paedophilia a sin according to the Quran? (pls dont bring up age of Aisha here- this is not about Aisha). This is about the Quran.
According to the quran, is paedophilia a sin.
In case u dont know what paedophilia is sexual intercourse btw an adult and a prepubescent girl- a girl who is yet to attain puberty.

SIRTee15:
David committed adultery and murder- He sinned and brought the wages of sin into his household.
How was he punished? - God refused to answer his prayer when he called on God to help him remove the burden of sin he brought into his home with his hands.


Yeah, so it's ok to marry the wife of someone that calls u father and u call son just because u are not related? So women have finished in your locality and the only one that entered your eye is the ex wife of your adopted son.
So u don't see anything wrong with having sex with a woman who also had sex with your adopted son- a child that grew up in your home and calls u father.
in case u dont know, that's an abimnation in most african culture. Try that in Yorubaland and see tongues wagging.
In African culture, Any child that calls u father and u call him son is as good as your child.
Go and read about Okonkwo and Ikemefuna in things fall apart.
Okonkwo was told, 'do not have a hand in that boy's death because he calls u father'.
It's a pity most african culture have better morality than what is in the Quran.

Allah didnt tell Muhammed anything. He simply followed his own covetuous desires. Muhammed turned Allah into his own errand boy that gives ayah for every Muhammed's personal problem.
Even Aisha smelled a rat and had to comment 'Seems your Lord is quick to grant u your heart desire' noticed she said your Lord and not our Lord. that shows skepticism on the part of Aisha.

and Allah being the word of God is a joke.
I took u up on it the last time but u ran away. I hope u stay longer this time.
Now I will bring 3 evidence to prove that Quran cant be from God

1. Tell me about the men in the cave in surah Al-kahf. who are they in real history?
2. Is Allah all knowing and all powerful? according to the Quran is Allah omniscient and Omnipotent?
3. Is paedophilia a sin according to the Quran? (pls dont bring up age of Aisha here- this is not about Aisha). This is about the Quran.
According to the quran, is paedophilia a sin.
In case u dont know what paedophilia is sexual intercourse btw an adult and a prepubescent girl- a girl who is yet to attain puberty.

In Islam it is permissible for a man to marry the former wife of his adopted son after the divorce has taken place and her waiting period (`iddah) has concluded.

This ruling was revealed to eliminate any cultural misunderstandings and to clarify that the rules concerning marriage and family in Islam are based on biological relationships, not on adoptive ties.

That's the short straight forward answer.


Islamic doctrine (Shariah) always takes precedence over cultural practices. Islamic doctrine is derived from the Qur'an, the Sunnah (teachings and practices of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh), and other recognized sources of Islamic jurisprudence. These form the core of Islamic law and guide the beliefs, worship, and daily life of Muslims.

honesttalk21:
In Islam it is permissible for a man to marry the former wife of his adopted son after the divorce has taken place and her waiting period (`iddah) has concluded.

This ruling was revealed to eliminate any cultural misunderstandings and to clarify that the rules concerning marriage and family in Islam are based on biological relationships, not on adoptive ties.

That's the short straight forward answer.


Islamic doctrine (Shariah) always takes precedence over cultural practices. Islamic doctrine is derived from the Qur'an, the Sunnah (teachings and practices of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh), and other recognized sources of Islamic jurisprudence. These form the core of Islamic law and guide the beliefs, worship, and daily life of Muslims.

we are both saying the same thing, we know its ok to marry your adopted son ex wife in Islam.
But why is it moral.
does that sound normal to u? is it something u will embrace outside of islam?
a child that grew up in your home, fed and clothe him. sent him to school, helped him settle in life.
When it was time to marry, brought his wife to u as his wife and u gave your blessing. U even presided over the marriage and join their hands in marriage.
Then later on married same girl when her first marriage failed.
women don finish for this world.
common, use your sense. This isn't normal. It's wrong man.

Besides how come this verse was dropped after muhammed married his adopted son's wife and tongues started wagging
Why didnt Allah dropped the verse without any drama just like he dropped the verse on divorce? was there any drama attached to that?

SIRTee15:
David committed adultery and murder- He sinned and brought the wages of sin into his household.
How was he punished? - God rejected his prayer when he called on God to help him remove the burden of sin he brought into his home with his hands.

Do you have problem with God for him not to have stripped David off his Prophethood and kingship for committing adultery and murder? Because I know you will agree with me that most African culture shun at adultery and murder and in a working African community any leader that commited such crimes would have been stripped off of his leadership role.

SIRTee15:
Yeah, so it's ok to marry the wife of someone that calls u father and u call son just because u are not related? So women have finished in your locality and the only one that entered your eye is the ex wife of your adopted son.
So u don't see anything wrong with having sex with a woman who also had sex with your adopted son- a child that grew up in your home and calls u father.
in case u dont know, that's an abimnation in most african culture. Try that in Yorubaland and see tongues wagging.
In African culture, Any child that calls u father and u call him son is as good as your child.
Go and read about Okonkwo and Ikemefuna in things fall apart.
Okonkwo was told, 'do not have a hand in that boy's death because he calls u father'.
It's a pity most african culture have better morality than what is in the Quran.

Allah didnt tell Muhammed anything. He simply followed his own covetuous desires. Muhammed turned Allah into his own errand boy that gives ayah for every Muhammed's personal problem.
Even Aisha smelled a rat and had to comment 'Seems your Lord is quick to grant u your heart desire' noticed she said your Lord and not our Lord. that shows skepticism on the part of Aisha.

and Allah being the word of God is a joke.
I took u up on it the last time but u ran away. I hope u stay longer this time.
Now I will bring 3 evidence to prove that Quran cant be from God

Yeah, tongues will wag. But at the end of the day it is a relationship that is permissible in Islam, We can't be wiser than God that permits the relationship. And if you do it without committing adultery with the lady or murdering your adoptive son and not causing their separation by instigating problem between them, then you have no sin in the sight of Allah.

Yeah, Qur'an is a revelation from God of the universe, and Prophet Muhammad is the last prophet of that God. It's ok if Aisha was Jealous, it's a normal thing, She's just being a woman. You can't interpret that as she doubting the prophet hood of her husband.

SIRTee15:
1. Tell me about the men in the cave in surah Al-kahf. who are they in real history?
2. Is Allah all knowing and all powerful? according to the Quran is Allah omniscient and Omnipotent?
3. Is paedophilia a sin according to the Quran? (pls dont bring up age of Aisha here- this is not about Aisha). This is about the Quran.
According to the quran, is paedophilia a sin.
In case u dont know what paedophilia is sexual intercourse btw an adult and a prepubescent girl- a girl who is yet to attain puberty.

The men are some early Christians they happened to have lived during the time of one of the Roman persecutions, they were trying to hide out in the cave and God caused them to sleep for 300 years and they woke up at a time when Christianity had became the religion of the Roman empire. Many historical Christian documents attested to that, they are venerated in some number of churches.
But I trust you to go the way of secular historians that will treat the story as legend and myth. you have done it before, I won't be surprised if you do it again.

Allah is all knowing, all powerful and his knowledge is everywhere.

Having sex with prepubescent girl is a sin in Islam.

SIRTee15:
we are both saying the same thing, we know its ok to marry your adopted son ex wife in Islam.
But why is it moral.
does that sound normal to u? is it something u will embrace outside of islam?
a child that grew up in your home, fed and clothe him. sent him to school, helped him settle in life.
When it was time to marry, brought his wife to u as his wife and u gave your blessing. U even presided over the marriage and join their hands in marriage.
Then later on married same girl when her first marriage failed.
women don finish for this world.
common, use your sense. This isn't normal. It's wrong man.

Besides how come this verse was dropped after muhammed married his adopted son's wife and tongues started wagging
Why didnt Allah dropped the verse without any drama just like he dropped the verse on divorce? was there any drama attached to that?

As stated in my reply.

The rules concerning marriage and family in Islam are based on biological relationships, not on adoptive ties.

No matter how much you say or document an adopted child can never be a blood relation despite emotions, sentiment or thinking.

We shouldn't seek to bring in addendums such as are women finished.

The question to first ask is why did the marriage fail in the first place? Despite a growing increase and acceptance of divorce in the world this is one of the most disliked but permissible things in the face of Allah.

It's permit stems from when it is no longer possible for the marriage to continue. Indeed there are very many marriages today that barely exist as a charade for public display. The individual torture for the married couple is unexplainable.

Then we know the general view of marrying divorcees especially in Africa. It is often disliked and frowned up.

Note the use of the word guide. It is not absolute or mandatory. Knowledge, wisdom and critical thinking is very important.

Note however that you inclusion of the phrase you presiding over the marriage is not absolute or guaranteed. Anyone can preside over the marriage more so when you are not the sole wedding officiant.

You state the verse was dropped later? I don't get you. Was it abrogated by another verse or what exactly do you mean please?

Note too that.

Islam places strong emphasis on preserving family ties and relationships. In the case of marrying your adopted son's divorced wife, it can actually serve to strengthen family bonds rather than break them.

If marrying your adopted son's divorced wife brings about happiness and fulfillment for both parties involved, then it is considered permissible within the boundaries of Islamic law.

honesttalk21:
As stated in my reply.

The rules concerning marriage and family in Islam are based on biological relationships, not on adoptive ties.

No matter how much you say or document an adopted child can never be a blood relation despite emotions, sentiment or thinking.

We shouldn't seek to bring in addendums such as are women finished.

The question to first ask is why did the marriage fail in the first place? Despite a growing increase and acceptance of divorce in the world this is one of the most disliked but permissible things in the face of Allah.

It's permit stems from when it is no longer possible for the marriage to continue. Indeed there are very many marriages today that barely exist as a charade for public display. The individual torture for the married couple is unexplainable.

Then we know the general view of marrying divorcees especially in Africa. It is often disliked and frowned up.

Note the use of the word guide. It is not absolute or mandatory. Knowledge, wisdom and critical thinking is very important.

Note however that you inclusion of the phrase you presiding over the marriage is not absolute or guaranteed. Anyone can preside over the marriage more so when you are not the sole wedding officiant.

You state the verse was dropped later? I don't get you. Was it abrogated by another verse or what exactly do you mean please?

we not talking about divorce here. we talking about marrying your adopted son ex wife.
if your adopted son is getting married, U as his adopted father will approve of the marriage and help join the couples hands in marriage.
In Yoruba culture, the bride will even sit on your lap on the wedding day as sign she's now your daughter in law and part of your family.

How u find it acceptable to have sex with someone who had called u daddy and who u referred to as daughter in law is really perplexing.
Your argument of divorce having problem getting married makes no sense. There are millions of divorcee looking for new husband, how come its your daughter in law your eyes dey chook.
sorry, I dont know bout u but I find it nauseating knowing a woman previously known by someone that calls me Father.
That quran says its permissible doesnt make it right.
We have our culture b4 Islam and our culture frown at such despicable act.

Qasim6:
Do you have problem with God for him not to have stripped David off his Prophethood and kingship for committing adultery and murder? Because I know you will agree with me that most African culture shun at adultery and murder and in a working African community any leader that commited such crimes would have been stripped off of his leadership role.

At the time of the kings, the nation of Israel was no longer a theocracy. The people had rejected God as their head of state and demanded for a king.
God warned them of the consequences but Israelites insisted for a king.
So affairs of the nation was no longer directly in God's hand, the Israelites managed their nation as they deem fit.
If they were happy with a murderer and an adulterer as king, that's their choice.
remember when God rejected Saul as king, he continued to be king of Israel until he was killed in battle.
When God anointed David as king, he wasn't king until may years later when the people finally accepted him after a civil war against Saul's son.
The people decide what they wanted.

Qasim6:
Yeah, tongues will wag. But at the end of the day it is a relationship that is permissible in Islam, We can't be wiser than God that permits the relationship. And if you do it without committing adultery with the lady or murdering your adoptive son and not causing their separation by instigating problem between them, then you have no sin in the sight of Allah.

That's fine, no problem. It's your religion.
But it only shows most african culture have better moral values and uphold higher moral standard than the Quran.
u may protest it but It's what it is. Fact dont lie.
A lot of people in Africa will be very uncomfortable with the idea of a man getting married to someone he previously called 'my daughter in law' and who called him father.

Qasim6:
Yeah, Qur'an is a revelation from God of the universe, and Prophet Muhammad is the last prophet of that God. It's ok if Aisha was Jealous, it's a normal thing, She's just being a woman. You can't interpret that as she doubting the prophet hood of her husband.

That hadith didnt say anything about Aisha being jealous, that's a misinterpretation of the hadith by modern muslims.

Qasim6:
The men are some early Christians they happened to have lived during the time of one of the Roman persecutions, they were trying to hide out in the cave and God caused them to sleep for 300 years and they woke up at a time when Christianity had became the religion of the Roman empire. Many historical Christian documents attested to that, they are venerated in some number of churches.
But I trust you to go the way of secular historians that will treat the story as legend and myth. you have done it before, I won't be surprised if you do it again.

Forget about the myth/legend part, I'm not talking about that this time.
since u admitted they were christians and the Quran call them believers- what was their beleive.
As christians what did they beleive in?
Did they beleive Jesus died for their sins? Did they believe Jesus was crucified, died and rose on the 3rd day.

Qasim6:
Allah is all knowing, all powerful and his knowledge is everywhere.

If Allah is all powerful, why does he think he need a partner if he wants to have a Son.
If he's all knowing, how come he didnt know its possible to have a son without the need for a partner.

surah 6.101
[He is] Originator of the heavens and the earth. How could He have a son when He does not have a companion and He created all things? And He is, of all things, Knowing.

Qasim6:
Having sex with prepubescent girl is a sin in Islam.

I think u may want review your answer again. I already asked Antichristian and he said having sex with a prepubescent girl in Islam is not a sin.

SIRTee15:
I think u may want review your answer again. I already asked Antichristian and he said having sex with a prepubescent girl in Islam is not a sin.

The fact that it is permissible to marry a young girl does not mean that it is permissible to have intercourse with her; rather that should not be done until she is able for it. I never used those word you created in bold! Stop telling lies on me o!

It was related on the authority of Abu Sa’id Sa’d bin Malik bin Sinan al-Khudri (RadhiyAllahu ‘anhu) that the Messenger of Allah (SallaAllahu ‘alayhi wasallam) said:

“There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm”

SIRTee15:
At the time of the kings, the nation of Israel was no longer a theocracy. The people had rejected God as their head of state and demanded for a king.
God warned them of the consequences but Israelites insisted for a king.
So affairs of the nation was no longer directly in God's hand, the Israelites managed their nation as they deem fit.
If they were happy with a murderer and an adulterer as king, that's their choice.
remember when God rejected Saul as king, he continued to be king of Israel until he was killed in battle.
When God anointed David as king, he wasn't king until may years later when the people finally accepted him after a civil war against Saul's son.
The people decide what they wanted.

That's a beautiful spin.
Same David that was anointed by Samuel (another Prophet)?
Same David that God said he will appoint to be his firstborn, and the most exalted of the kings of the earth in Psalm 89:27?
What you guys don't realise is you can not have the Bible as scripture and have the audacity to open your mouth to attack the Qur'an on moral grounds or any other ground for that matter.

SIRTee15:
That's fine, no problem. It's your religion.
But it only shows most african culture have better moral values and uphold higher moral standard than the Quran.
u may protest it but It's what it is. Fact dont lie.
A lot of people in Africa will be very uncomfortable with the idea of a man getting married to someone he previously called 'my daughter in law' and who called him father.

This can easily be thrown back at you.
Abraham marrying his half sister, Jacob marrying two sisters at the same time. Lot sleeping with his daughter. I'm not sure a lot of people in Africa would be very comfortable with these as well or what do you think?

SIRTee15:
That hadith didnt say anything about Aisha being jealous, that's a misinterpretation of the hadith by modern muslims.

Yeah, Neither did the Hadith say she's doubtful of her husband Prophethood.

SIRTee15:
Forget about the myth/legend part, I'm not talking about that this time.
since u admitted they were christians and the Quran call them believers- what was their beleive.
As christians what did they beleive in?
Did they beleive Jesus died for their sins? Did they believe Jesus was crucified, died and rose on the 3rd day.

Don't tell me you don't know there are early Christianity sects like the Basilidians that rejected the crucifixion. Basilides claimed to have been taught his doctrines by Glaucus, a disciple of Apostle Peter.

And I am of the opinion the original Apostles did not teach a crucified Jesus. Because we know they (especially James) were the enemies of Paul.
And we see Paul scolding the Galatians in one of his letters

"O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified."

We know James sent men to the Galatians to correct Paul false teachings.
Who do you think was bewitching the Galatians to think otherwise about the crucifixion?

So there are early Christ followers that did not believe the crucifixion. The companions of the cave could easily have been a follower of any of those sects.

SIRTee15:
If Allah is all powerful, why does he think he need a partner if he wants to have a Son.
If he's all knowing, how come he didnt know its possible to have a son without the need for a partner.

surah 6.101
[He is] Originator of the heavens and the earth. How could He have a son when He does not have a companion and He created all things? And He is, of all things, Knowing.

God owns everything.
the sinner, the righteous, Satan, Jesus, Muhammad. All the planets. Everything and anything we can think of. So why is God going to need a Son?

SIRTee15:
I think u may want review your answer again. I already asked Antichristian and he said having sex with a prepubescent girl in Islam is not a sin.

No, it is a sin to have sex with young girls that are yet to reach puberty.

Would you consider having sexual relations with a girl of 17 in a country like France and the likes that have the age of consent as 16 a paedophilia act?

What was Christianity age of consent in the 2nd century?

AntiChristian:
The fact that it is permissible to marry a young girl does not mean that it is permissible to have intercourse with her; rather that should not be done until she is able for it. I never used those word you created in bold! Stop telling lies on me o!

It was related on the authority of Abu Sa’id Sa’d bin Malik bin Sinan al-Khudri (RadhiyAllahu ‘anhu) that the Messenger of Allah (SallaAllahu ‘alayhi wasallam) said:

“There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm”

So a 54 year old man sleeping with a 9 year old girl is not harming her?

Go and give your 9 year old daughter to one agbaya to be sleeping with her!

AntiisIam:
Ahahahahaha.. It is now you're not jobless asinwin but you were jobless when trying defending sunnah.com as the most reliable site that never shows Muhammad having sex with Aishat when she was 9yrs of age abi bawo but shocked when I finally shown you the stupidity in your messenger's life having intercourse with his great grand daughter as narrated from the sunnah.com you love so much.

Walai koni ragba fun e seh aaje, o ma s'oriburuku nii for defending Muhammad here

Orietiburu
Werey hey no bible pass those who wrote it...
Bible say David is a prophet werey dey argue blantly after seeing truth from the passage..
O mase fun ọmọ to nje ẹrú..

Expanse2020:
Orietiburu
Werey hey no bible pass those who wrote it...
Bible say David is a prophet werey dey argue blantly after seeing truth from the passage..
O mase fun ọmọ to nje ẹrú..

Ti ori awon ti o bi e koba buru, wereeyyy ara e ought to answer this question just to clear everything once and for all

This is the 6th times I'll be asking oloriburuku, Asiara, omi-eran, omo ale jati-jati ara e to tell me

WHO IS A PROPHET AND WHAT QUALIFIES SOMEONE TO BE A PROPHET?

Qasim6:
That's a beautiful spin.
Same David that was anointed by Samuel (another Prophet)?
Same David that God said he will appoint to be his firstborn, and the most exalted of the kings of the earth in Psalm 89:27?

I dont understand your problem with David having favour with God
Yes he sinned but he realised his mistake and repented, he asked God for forgiveness and he was he forgiven.
so what's the issue.
God forgives your iniquity no matter how dirty, just dont expect him to lift the consequence of your sin just because he forgave your iniquity.
For as many he loves, he chastise.
That's the lesson in the story of David and bathsheba.

Qasim6:
What you guys don't realise is you can not have the Bible as scripture and have the audacity to open your mouth to attack the Qur'an on moral grounds or any other ground for that matter.

The scripture is God inspired and useful for rebuke, correction, training and teaching for righteousness. Not everything in the bible is for us to follow. some were written for us to learn from such mistake.

[quote author=Qasim6 post=131832999]This can easily be thrown back at you.
Abraham marrying his half sister, Jacob marrying two sisters at the same time. Lot sleeping with his daughter. I'm not sure a lot of people in Africa would be very comfortable with these as well or what do you think?

But u dont see Christians defending it as right. That Jacob or Lot did it doesnt make it right.
Mosaic law clearly forbid incestious union or intimacy and drew a clear line regarding this things- read the book of Leviticus.

Qasim6:
Don't tell me you don't know there are early Christianity sects like the Basilidians that rejected the crucifixion. Basilides claimed to have been taught his doctrines by Glaucus, a disciple of Apostle Peter.

So are u claiming these 7 sleepers were basilideans? Is that what u saying? because basilideans believe Jesus was a sinner who had his sin washed away at baptism and then became first born of God.
Look here if u want to appeal to Gnosticism to argue your case, then u need to find one whose believe align with the beliefs in the the Quran.
I asked about their believes because the Quran called them believers, and no Christian sect - gnostic or not shared same belief about Jesus as written in the Quran.
No christian sect ever believed Jesus was a mere prophet all through his life. There is always a variation in the transformational change in the person of Jesus that made him a saviour or elevated towards divinity amongst the gnostic sect.

That's why I'm asking u what is the believe of these men in the caves the Quran call beleivers.

Qasim6:
And I am of the opinion the original Apostles did not teach a crucified Jesus. Because we know they (especially James) were the enemies of Paul.
And we see Paul scolding the Galatians in one of his letters

"O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified."

We know James sent men to the Galatians to correct Paul false teachings.
Who do you think was bewitching the Galatians to think otherwise about the crucifixion?

I already debunked these your lies in previous argument, your response was the typical denial of Muslims polemics when they are cornered with irrefutable facts- deny the book and start shouting its corrupt, which is what u did with the book of Acts claiming its as pro Paul; not minding your hypocritical self first quoted from the book of acts initially to argue your case agiainst Paul!!!
Good thing is I have dislocated your thought process from ever quoting from that book again to defend your lies.


first and foremost, lets make something clear.
Other apostles of Jesus preached about the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus. Peter and John wrote about it.
1 peter 1.3
Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.

1 John 2
My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

Even Peter agreed with the message and letters of Paul and called it scriptures.

2 Peter 3
Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.


Paul himself wrote that he consulted with the Peter and James and presented his gospel before them for confirmation and verification.

Galatian 1
18 Then after three years, I went up to Jerusalem to get acquainted with Cephas and stayed with him fifteen days. 19 I saw none of the other apostles—only James, the Lord’s brother. 20 I assure you before God that what I am writing you is no lie.
Galatian 2
I went in response to a revelation and, meeting privately with those esteemed as leaders, I presented to them the gospel that I preach among the Gentiles. I wanted to be sure I was not running and had not been running my race in vain.

Paul also wrote that the first gospel message he received about Christ was from James and the church leaders!!!
1 Corinthians 15
For the gospel I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. 6 After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. 7 Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, 8 and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.

above passage is called the Corinthians creed, a creed formulated by the apostles within 5 years of the death of Christ. So how can u say the apostles didnt teach the death and resurrection of Christ!!!


regarding Paul's conflict with other apostles- that has to do with his personality
Paul had a choleric personality and he's strongly opiniated. choleric are very firm and resolute about their opinion, and that's why people who dont understand then call them difficult.
For example, Paul disagreed with Barnabas on Mark in the book of acts when they were to embark on their 2nd missionary journey. Paul felt Mark didnt deserve a 2nd chance, Barnabas thought otherwise. They couldnt resolve the issue and had to split on the 2nd missionary journey.
Eventually Barnabas was proved right because Mark was very useful not only to the work of God- he wrote the gospelof Mark, but also to Paul himself- he was with Paul in his last days.
Does that doesnt mean Paul 2nd missionary journey was false? No, instead it was a huge success. This 2nd mission enabled him penetrate deep into asia minor and for the first time, the message of Christ reached Europe. Most of Paul's letters were to churches he established in the 2nd journey.
Yes Paul choleric personality frequently put him at logger heads with other apostles on matters of doctrine but NEVER on the core belief of the FAITH.

Qasim6:
So there are early Christ followers that did not believe the crucifixion. The companions of the cave could easily have been a follower of any of those sects.

Above is a lie.
The 7 Christians believed in the 2nd coming of CHRIST AND RESSURECTION OF THE DEAD IN FLESH.
And then Maximilian said to him: “Believe us, for in truth Our Lord has raised us before the day of the great resurrection. And so that you might believe firmly in the resurrection of the dead, verily we are raised as you see, and live. And like the child is in the womb of his mother without feeling harm or hurt, in the same wise we have been living and sleeping, lying here without feeling anything.”

And after giving this witness, they inclined their heads to the earth, and gave up their spirits at the command of Our Lord Jesus Christ, and so died.

So I asked again, if u are saying these men are Christians and the Quran calls them believers....what is their believe?

Qasim6:
God owns everything.
the sinner, the righteous, Satan, Jesus, Muhammad. All the planets. Everything and anything we can think of. So why is God going to need a Son?

U didn't answer my question. We know Allah claimed he's omnipotent and omniscience, but we need to put the claim to test to prove its credibility.
claim is not enough, the evidence backing up such claim should never be in doubt
But Allah's thinking is depicting him as he's dependent on another existence if he decides to have a son, that's the issue.
Why should Allah's ability to bring forth a son be dependent on another being if he's all powerful.
we know Allah will never have a son, but if he decides to have one, he still cannot do it; because he has no compatible spouse that WILL HELP HIM BRING FORTH THE SON.
Above is the crux of the matter.
If Allah is all powerful, why should he think he needs help from another existence to produce a son. Why is he incapable of bringing forth a Son by himself.

Note this are hypothetical statement made by Allah himself in the Quran, so dont bring up the issue of debating theoretical impossibilities.

Qasim6:
No, it is a sin to have sex with young girls that are yet to reach puberty.

so if sleeping with a prepubescent girl is a sin, then explain why the Quran writes that husband should wait 3 months before divorcing their prepubescent wives.
If the husband is not sleeping with his prepubescent girl, why would he have to wait 3 months to be sure she's not pregnant b4 divorcing her.

Qasim6:
Would you consider having sexual relations with a girl of 17 in a country like France and the likes that have the age of consent as 16 a paedophilia act?

What was Christianity age of consent in the 2nd century?

irrelevant to the discussion here. The issue here is objective morality which can only come from God.
humans are free to shift the age of consent as they like. Even if they move it to 2yrs, it doesnt change the objective morality from God.
That's why I asked u, is pedophilia a sin in Islam?

AntiChristian:
The fact that it is permissible to marry a young girl does not mean that it is permissible to have intercourse with her; rather that should not be done until she is able for it. I never used those word you created in bold! Stop telling lies on me o!

It was related on the authority of Abu Sa’id Sa’d bin Malik bin Sinan al-Khudri (RadhiyAllahu ‘anhu) that the Messenger of Allah (SallaAllahu ‘alayhi wasallam) said:

“There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm”

ARE U OK?
if the husband is not harming the little girl, why did your Quran say men should wait 3 months b4 divorcing a prepubescent girl.
If the husband is not wounding the poor girl in the other room, why would your Allah say the husband should wait 3 months and be sure the girl is not pregnant b4 kicking her out of his house.
answer my question.

SIRTee15:
I dont understand your problem with David having favour with God
Yes he sinned but he realised his mistake and repented, he asked God for forgiveness and he was he forgiven.
so what's the issue.
God forgives your iniquity no matter how dirty, just dont expect him to lift the consequence of your sin just because he forgave your iniquity.
For as many he loves, he chastise.
That's the lesson in the story of David and bathsheba.

I do not have problem with David or anyone having favour from God.

Infact the story is alluded in the Qur'an, but the Qur'an does not go into full details of what happened, but I know David took something that was not his. He realised his sins and was full of repentance and he was forgiven. The main lesson of the story is if we sincerely seek forgiveness of our sins, God is always ready to welcome us back without the sacrifice of himself or his supposed son.

What we are pointing out to you is this. This is a Prophet of God that you have in your scripture to have committed adultery and murder and you want to attack the Prophethood of Prophet Muhammad for marrying the ex wife of an adopted son.
-The Prophet and zayd are not related by blood
-The Prophet did not commit adultery with Zaynab.
-The Prophet did not murder Zayd to have his way
-The Prophet did not cause their separation.
So what is the fuss all about??

SIRTee15:
But u dont see Christians defending it as right. That Jacob or Lot did it doesnt make it right.
Mosaic law clearly forbid incestious union or intimacy and drew a clear line regarding this things- read the book of Leviticus.

Yeah, the book of leveticus did not forbid one from marrying the ex wife of one adopted son too. and Deuteronomy allowed one to marry the wife of one deceased brother which some people are still going to find absurd.

I believe we should not over worry ourselves about what people are going to say to actions that are not sins in the sight of God.

For example one is allowed to marry the wife of a deceased brother, they both want the relationship but they are worried about what people are going to say then they resolve to fornicating in secret, what that simply mean is that they fear people more than they fear God.

SIRTee15:
So are u claiming these 7 sleepers were basilideans? Is that what u saying? because basilideans believe Jesus was a sinner who had his sin washed away at baptism and then became first born of God.
Look here if u want to appeal to Gnosticism to argue your case, then u need to find one whose believe align with the beliefs in the the Quran.
I asked about their believes because the Quran called them believers, and no Christian sect - gnostic or not shared same belief about Jesus as written in the Quran.

I am not saying they are necessarily Basilidians, I'm just pointing out the fact there are early Christians that believed Jesus was not the one nailed to the cross. Infact some believed it was Simon of Cyrene and it is most likely the reason why the writer of Gospel of John writing very late had to remove Simon of Cyrene from his plot to stress the narrative that Jesus was the one on the cross.

Let's leave the argument of if the New testament is corrupt or not for now.
Let's just analyse this statement of Paul

"O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified."

Who was bewitching the Galatians to think Jesus was not crucified if there are no group that believed he wasn't?

And even if the Sleepers held the view that Jesus was crucified and resurrected after 3 days that did not negate them as believers in as much as they didn't associate partner with God.

SIRTee15:
No christian sect ever believed Jesus was a mere prophet all through his life. There is always a variation in the transformational change in the person of Jesus that made him a saviour or elevated towards divinity amongst the gnostic sect.

That's why I'm asking u what is the believe of these men in the caves the Quran call beleivers.

What exactly are you working? What do you mean no Christian sect ever believed Jesus was a mere prophet all his life?

The Ebionites which scholars believed to have held a view closer to that of the original Apostles believed Jesus was a mere man, a prophet, they denied his divinity and pre-existence. So what are you talking about?