₦airaland Forum

Theflint1:
Data says it's a lie.

I think migration would be regularized, maybe even easier for legal migrants...the idea of illegals walking right into the US will never make sense.

When did Trump first assume office in his first term?
That's how you know immigration suffered under trump

larride:
In any election, opposition need massive turnout to defeat incumbent party.

In Nigeria, opposition will be discouraging their own base with talk of election rigging and the likes that those who should turn the election in their favor will just sit at home thinking their vote won't kuku count.

Last year election, more people voted the opposition than the incumbent party. APC had 8m+ votes, the opposition (PDP, LP, NNPP) had over 14m+ votes. Those opposition were all in the same party months before splitting for the election.

I don't think it's about massive turnout per se, it's the fact that the voting process is made more difficult than it should otherwise be. Like for example, why can't voter registration be available to be done anytime of the year, or voting possible with any valid ID card.

liveLongNprospa:
When did Trump first assume office in his first term?
That's how you know immigration suffered under trump

2017, I'm referring to his average numbers, and not the initial dip which I'm sure you want to point out...these things are not designed to be specific numbers yearly.

izzou:
[color=royalblue]If your head was the one of that lady that they broke bottle in February last year, would you bother voting again?

Or you spent hours to vote, and people just zoom in with bikes and tear and destroy the papers, would you come out?

We cannot even be comparing the US to Nigeria now. We are far far behind in terms of credibility, talk more of getting people to vote.[/color]

True

larride:
In any election, opposition need massive turnout to defeat incumbent party.

In Nigeria, opposition will be discouraging their own base with talk of election rigging and the likes that those who should turn the election in their favor will just sit at home thinking their vote won't kuku count.

Last year election, more people voted the opposition than the incumbent party. APC had 8m+ votes, the opposition (PDP, LP, NNPP) had over 14m+ votes. Those opposition were all in the same party months before splitting for the election.

Theflint1 was lamenting about the poor turnout of voters in Nigerian elections and while trying to explain reasons for poor turnout in Naija elections; you made the error of alluding the reasons to opposition making allegations of rigging and their votes not counting.

Rigging is real in Nigerian elections and there are little or no consequences for rigging elections in Nigeria. The fact that INEC is not really independent in their conduct of elections is worrisome. INEC would always side with the party that rigged and they declared winner.

Election violence is another issue in Nigeria. Party loyalists, hoodlums and even security agencies assault voters and supporters of other parties in broad daylight in different elections in this country. Some non-state actors will even say it live on camera that they will deal with anybody not voting for their own candidate in their area, the police will see the videos and do nothing about it.

There's no how u will see massive voters turn out with this flawed electoral system we have currently in operation in Naija. Even if opposition tell their members to turn up in mass numbers at the polling unit, it will only take few hoodlums armed with dangerous weapons to scatter the ballot box and chase the determined voters away.

Nigeria still has a very long way to go in this democracy thing we say we dey do. When I remember some of the disgraceful things that happened during that 2023 general elections, I just shake my head.

Theflint1:
True

[color=royalblue]After standing under sun, this is how my vote ended.

Then you want me to come 4 years later and vote

[/color]

izzou:
[color=royalblue]If your head was the one of that lady that they broke bottle in February last year, would you bother voting again?

Or you spent hours to vote, and people just zoom in with bikes and tear and destroy the papers, would you come out?

We cannot even be comparing the US to Nigeria now. We are far far behind in terms of credibility, talk more of getting people to vote.[/color]

Regardless the opposition still need to ginger their base to vote. Did you forget what happened in 2020 US election? Trump claimed he was rigged out, his supporters even stormed the Capitol, some were arrested, some are in jail currently. Infact Trump said the election was interfered with.

This 2024 election, Trump kept urging his base and supporters to come out in record numbers to vote. The first step to winning an election is making sure your base come out en masse to vote.

Why i understand there's no comparison between US and Nigeria but elections are the same everywhere. Opposition need massive turn out of their base to win.

BlueRayDick:
Theflint1 was lamenting about the poor turnout of voters in Nigerian elections and while trying to explain reasons for poor turnout in Naija elections; you made the error of alluding the reasons to opposition making allegations of rigging and their votes not counting.

Rigging is real in Nigerian elections and there are little or no consequences for rigging elections in Nigeria. The fact that INEC is not really independent in their conduct of elections is worrisome. INEC would always side with the party that rigged and they declared winner.

Election violence is another issue in Nigeria. Party loyalists, hoodlums and even security agencies assault voters and supporters of other parties in broad daylight in different elections in this country. Some non-state actors will even say it live on camera that they will deal with anybody not voting for their own candidate in their area, the police will see the videos and do nothing about it.

There's no how u will see massive voters turn out with this flawed electoral system we have currently in operation in Naija. Even if opposition tell their members to turn up in mass numbers at the polling unit, it will only take few hoodlums armed with dangerous weapons to scatter the ballot box and chase the determined voters away.

Nigeria still has a very long way to go in this democracy thing we say we dey do. When I remember some of the disgraceful things that happened during that 2023 general elections, I just shake my head.

These are the issues, people saying they won't come out to vote is a response to the issues we have with elections.

Say person come out vote for Nigeria, knowing all of these issues, the person deserve thumbs up.

Theflint1:
I don't think it's about massive turnout per se, it's the fact that the voting process is made more difficult than it should otherwise be. Like for example, why can't voter registration be available to be done anytime of the year, or voting possible with any valid ID card.

If you follow election news yesterday, there will lots of difficulties with some counties voting machine breaking down and stopping people from voting. Voting can't be possible with any valid ID. you should know the process we currently run is to safeguard against rigging. Even in develop nation, voter registration is an important part of the process. I do agree though that voter registration should be open round the clock

larride:
Regardless the opposition still need to ginger their base to vote. Did you forget what happened in 2020 US election? Trump claimed he was rigged out, his supporters even stormed the Capitol, some were arrested, some are in jail currently. Infact Trump said the election was interfered with.

This 2024 election, Trump kept urging his base and supporters to come out in record numbers to vote. The first step to winning an election is making sure your base come out en masse to vote.

Why i understand there's no comparison between US and Nigeria but elections are the same everywhere. Opposition need massive turn out of their base to win.

Your belief in Nigeria's corrupted processes is admirable, but I think there's a way a process becomes so corrupted that it becomes unfit for purpose.

larride:
If you follow election news yesterday, there will lots of difficulties with some counties voting machine breaking down and stopping people from voting. Voting can't be possible with any valid ID. you should know the process we currently run is to safeguard against rigging. Even in develop nation, voter registration is an important part of the process. I do agree though that voter registration should be open round the clock

If we have a national database, voting can be possible with any ID...there are boxes we check that make other processes easy. Even the issue of underage voting, make sure every birth is registered and biodata captured up to a certain age for citizens (maybe through monthly allowance for every Nigerian child) and this under age voting thing can be curbed.

Theflint1:
These are the issues, people saying they won't come out to vote is a response to the issues we have with elections.

Say person come out vote for Nigeria, knowing all of these issues, the person deserve thumbs up.

In fact, I feel more than ever a lot more people got disappointed in how the 2023 General elections turned out to be. Imagine traditional rulers initiating sacred traditional rites just so people will turn out to vote their preferred candidate.

How do u encourage such person to come out for next election. Will he feel safe voting against the popular candidate in such community? Is it not better to just stay in ur house for future elections?

How do encourage a first time voter in a place like Rivers where Wike carried out the wickedest rigging in Nigerian Election history and nothing happened ? Zero consequence! How will such first time voter ever consider going out to queue and vote when he knows someone can just mutilate result sheets and make his vote not count?

BlueRayDick:
Theflint1 was lamenting about the poor turnout of voters in Nigerian elections and while trying to explain reasons for poor turnout in Naija elections; you made the error of alluding the reasons to opposition making allegations of rigging and their votes not counting.

Rigging is real in Nigerian elections and there are little or no consequences for rigging elections in Nigeria. The fact that INEC is not really independent in their conduct of elections is worrisome. INEC would always side with the party that rigged and they declared winner.

Election violence is another issue in Nigeria. Party loyalists, hoodlums and even security agencies assault voters and supporters of other parties in broad daylight in different elections in this country. Some non-state actors will even say it live on camera that they will deal with anybody not voting for their own candidate in their area, the police will see the videos and do nothing about it.

There's no how u will see massive voters turn out with this flawed electoral system we have currently in operation in Naija. Even if opposition tell their members to turn up in mass numbers at the polling unit, it will only take few hoodlums armed with dangerous weapons to scatter the ballot box and chase the determined voters away.

Nigeria still has a very long way to go in this democracy thing we say we dey do. When I remember some of the disgraceful things that happened during that 2023 general elections, I just shake my head.

Everything you have said is true but we have seen INEC cancel polling unit results because of violence, we have seen then cancel LG result because of violence and like that.

Even last year election, opposition polled more votes than APC that won. almost double APC votes. the only reason why APC is still in power is because the opposition votes were divided.

The opposition apart from being divided need to always preach people coming out en masse to vote and holding the government responsible for safeguarding the voters. The higher the number of turnout of voters, the harder it is to rig.

BlueRayDick:
In fact, I feel more than ever a lot more people got disappointed in how the 2023 General elections turned out to be. Imagine traditional rulers initiating sacred traditional rites just so people will turn out to vote their preferred candidate.

How do u encourage such person to come out for next election. Will he feel safe voting against the popular candidate in such community? Is it not better to just stay in ur house for future elections?

How do encourage a first time voter in a place like Rivers where Wike carried out the wickedest rigging in Nigerian Election history and nothing happened ? Zero consequence! How will such first time voter ever consider going out to queue and vote when he knows someone can just mutilate result sheets and make his vote not count?

And as long as elections are rigged, politicians owe no loyalty to electorates cause they know the process that brought them in doesn't depend on them. It'd take a miracle for a candidate that rigged his way in to have in his heart a desire to perform.

Theflint1:
If we have a national database, voting can be possible with any ID...there are boxes we check that make other processes easy. Even the issue of underage voting, make sure every birth is registered and biodata captured up to a certain age for citizens (maybe through monthly allowance for every Nigerian child) and this under age voting thing can be curbed.

You may be right.

larride:
Everything you have said is true but we have seen INEC cancel polling unit results because of violence, we have seen then cancel LG result because of violence and like that.

Even last year election, opposition polled more votes than APC that won. almost double APC votes. the only reason why APC is still in power is because the opposition votes were divided.

The opposition apart from being divided need to always preach people coming out en masse to vote and holding the government responsible for safeguarding the voters. The higher the number of turnout of voters, the harder it is to rig.

You are right that the opposition is divided , but division between members of opposition is not the reason why there's poor voters turnout. This is not even about APC, PDP, LP or any other party in particular.

The reason why there's abysmal voters' turn out is the fear of electoral violence majorly and blatant rigging without real consequences. Let there be serious and direct consequence for sabotaging the electoral processes and let's see if things won't change for better.

The INEC REC in the infamous Adamawa governorship election(I can't recall his name again), Nothing of grave consequence has happened to him since that saga.

People who threatened voters pre-election and then carried out their threats, nothing has happened to them. There are videos and pictures of those who scattered polling units in different parts of the countries, we did not get any report of police parading them in their hundreds and prosecuting them.

Even if Opposition leaders appeal to their members from now till tomorrow, some will not turn up because nobody wants to get harmed for voting a politician that may not even perform in office. I will not see NURTW guys wielding ax and machete at polling unit to enforce voting in favor of their fave; then I will say I want to be stubborn to vote my own candidate against all odds.

BlueRayDick:
In fact, I feel more than ever a lot more people got disappointed in how the 2023 General elections turned out to be. Imagine traditional rulers initiating sacred traditional rites just so people will turn out to vote their preferred candidate.

How do u encourage such person to come out for next election. Will he feel safe voting against the popular candidate in such community? Is it not better to just stay in ur house for future elections?

How do encourage a first time voter in a place like Rivers where Wike carried out the wickedest rigging in Nigerian Election history and nothing happened ? Zero consequence! How will such first time voter ever consider going out to queue and vote when he knows someone can just mutilate result sheets and make his vote not count?

Inspite of all these, Alex Otti won in Abia, Father Alia won in Benue, even Yusuf won Ganduje candidate in Kano. APC almost lost Kaduna Governorship election.

2023 election was largely peaceful. Violence only happened in Lagos and Rivers, the process went smoothly in most of the other states. Lagos and Rivers election were not the decider of the Presidential election, infact the opposition won 1 of those 2 states, give the opposition those 2 states and nothing will change in the final outcome. APC will still win.

If the opposition talking points is then now centered on what happened in Lagos and Rivers and using it to discourage their own base from coming out en masse to vote, its giving easy victory to the incumbent party.

Look back to Osun 2022 Governorship election, in 2018, Adeleke and PDP claimed they were rigged out. in 2022, their slogan was come out and vote and then defend your vote. You need people to come out and vote and then defend it.

Our democracy is not there yet and our electoral system still need more reforms and perfection but opposition still need more people to come out and vote. It's the same everywhere.

Congratulations to the 47th President of the United States of America Donald Trump

The World of Football celebrates with you Sir.

Congratulations to Chelsea for winning FIFA Club World Cup 2025

GloriousGbola:
don't jinx it


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BG-_ZDrypec

this was snl after the 2016 election

also this


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHG0ezLiVGc

2016 all over again

BlueRayDick:
You are right that the opposition is divided , but division between members of opposition is not the reason why there's poor voters turnout. This is not even about APC, PDP, LP or any other party in particular.

The reason why there's abysmal voters' turn out is the fear of electoral violence majorly and blatant rigging without real consequences. Let there be serious and direct consequence for sabotaging the electoral processes and let's see if things won't change for better.

The INEC REC in the infamous Adamawa governorship election(I can't recall his name again), Nothing of grave consequence has happened to him since that saga.

People who threatened voters pre-election and then carried out their threats, nothing has happened to them. There are videos and pictures of those who scattered polling units in different parts of the countries, we did not get any report of police parading them in their hundreds and prosecuting them.

Even if Opposition leaders appeal to their members from now till tomorrow, some will not turn up because nobody wants to get harmed for voting a politician that may not even perform in office. I will not see NURTW guys wielding ax and machete at polling unit to enforce voting in favor of their fave; then I will say I want to be stubborn to vote my own candidate against all odds.

And abysmal voters turnout makes it easy for vote buying, rigging and violence. It's easy to buy out 50 people compared to say 400. its easy to inflate votes when turn out is low and it's easy for 2 or 3 thugs to chase 50 then to chase 400.

The higher the voters turnout, the harder it is to rig or to intimidate with violence.

BlueRayDick:
You are right that the opposition is divided , but division between members of opposition is not the reason why there's poor voters turnout. This is not even about APC, PDP, LP or any other party in particular.

The reason why there's abysmal voters' turn out is the fear of electoral violence majorly and blatant rigging without real consequences. Let there be serious and direct consequence for sabotaging the electoral processes and let's see if things won't change for better.

The INEC REC in the infamous Adamawa governorship election(I can't recall his name again), Nothing of grave consequence has happened to him since that saga.

People who threatened voters pre-election and then carried out their threats, nothing has happened to them. There are videos and pictures of those who scattered polling units in different parts of the countries, we did not get any report of police parading them in their hundreds and prosecuting them.

Even if Opposition leaders appeal to their members from now till tomorrow, some will not turn up because nobody wants to get harmed for voting a politician that may not even perform in office. I will not see NURTW guys wielding ax and machete at polling unit to enforce voting in favor of their fave; then I will say I want to be stubborn to vote my own candidate against all odds.

Unless you match the people you're fighting violence for violence, the extent to which you can fight candidates that are ready to rig elections depends on the extent to which they're ready to yield. It doesn't matter whether opposition candidates register under one party, if the party in charge means to rig a particular election by every means possible, they'd rig it.

And you can't convince regular citizens to go toe-to-toe with government backed thugs (agbero's, police and army), you'd need your own version of these guys to wage your violence, but after you use violence and all to win, what then happens to the violent thugs that saw you over the finishing line.

larride:
Inspite of all these, Alex Otti won in Abia, Father Alia won in Benue, even Yusuf won Ganduje candidate in Kano. APC almost lost Kaduna Governorship election.

2023 election was largely peaceful. Violence only happened in Lagos and Rivers, the process went smoothly in most of the other states. Lagos and Rivers election were not the decider of the Presidential election, infact the opposition won 1 of those 2 states, give the opposition those 2 states and nothing will change in the final outcome. APC will still win.

If the opposition talking points is then now centered on what happened in Lagos and Rivers and using it to discourage their own base from coming out en masse to vote, its giving easy victory to the incumbent party.

Look back to Osun 2022 Governorship election, in 2018, Adeleke and PDP claimed they were rigged out. in 2022, their slogan was come out and vote and then defend your vote. You need people to come out and vote and then defend it.

Our democracy is not there yet and our electoral system still need more reforms and perfection but opposition still need more people to come out and vote. It's the same everywhere.

You see, u are the one drawing conclusion that opposition talking point is centered majorly around Rivers & Lagos. That is not the case here.

I can give u instances of elections in the last 2 years that have been frayed with different electoral malfeasance.

The Osun election you mentioned which Oyetola lost, there were serious allegations of rigging. In fact the Tribunal ruled in favor of Oyetola that there was over voting favoring Adeleke. That shows the system had serious irregularity.

Adamawa elections had it's own issues with rigging and even a REC declared a candidate winner before conclusion of result collation.

The Kogi off season election wasn't free of these irregularities; same is the recently concluded Edo elections.


See just take the point in my post and don't see it as a non APC supporter castigating elections conducted by APC led government.

Let there be serious consequence for those who sabotage electoral process be it an INEC staff, a security agent, a politician, a political thug, etc. The people will definitely turn up in mass to vote their preferred candidate.

larride:
Regardless the opposition still need to ginger their base to vote. Did you forget what happened in 2020 US election? Trump claimed he was rigged out, his supporters even stormed the Capitol, some were arrested, some are in jail currently. Infact Trump said the election was interfered with.

This 2024 election, Trump kept urging his base and supporters to come out in record numbers to vote. The first step to winning an election is making sure your base come out en masse to vote.

Why i understand there's no comparison between US and Nigeria but elections are the same everywhere. Opposition need massive turn out of their base to win.

[color=royalblue]Trump urged his base to come out because he had faith in the system; at least to some level.

Until you achieve that, we would be expecting less voters per election year

From the look of things, 2027 election will have less voters than 2023, and the reason is not because Obi or Atiku asked people not to vote.

You already know why [/color]

Case in point Osun

2018 election

APC - 255,505
PDP - 255,023

Both party total votes = 510,528

There was a rerun election when the election was declared inconclusive while PDP Adeleke was leading with 355 votes.

2023 election

PDP - 403,371
APC - 375,027

Both part total votes = 778,398

That's more than 20% increase in the number of voters turnout and Adeleke won easily with more than 27k votes.

Opposition need massive voters turnout. Infact it's their only pathway to winning.

izzou:
[color=royalblue]Trump urged his base to come out because he had faith in the system; at least to some level.

Until you achieve that, we would be expecting less voters per election year

From the look of things, 2027 election will have less voters than 2023, and the reason is not because Obi or Atiku asked people not to vote.

You already know why [/color]

And until the opposition can get massive turnout of their base to come out and vote regardless of what they might think of the system, the incumbent will always win then.

larride:
And abysmal voters turnout makes it easy for vote buying, rigging and violence. It's easy to buy out 50 people compared to say 400. its easy to inflate votes when turn out is low and it's easy for 2 or 3 thugs to chase 50 then to chase 400.

The higher the voters turnout, the harder it is to rig or to intimidate with violence.

The bold was proven wrong in the last election tho. I followed the election live on TV and I saw some polling units that were scattered in that Eti Osa LGA. Despite elections holding in private estates with hundreds on voters on ground, they were attacked and chased away by political thugs.

Go and ask Falz, Chioma Akpotha and co what happened to them at Ikate, Elegushi side. No matter how una many, if the hoodlums carry dangerous weapons una go fear for una lives run

akwesenana:
Damn. My mum is taller than my dad, and my sister is the only short one.

Yup. It is known. Does not work 100% of the time sha but more often than not.

larride:
Case in point Osun

2018 election

APC - 255,505
PDP - 255,023

Both party total votes = 510,528

There was a rerun election when the election was declared inconclusive while PDP Adeleke was leading with 355 votes.

2023 election

PDP - 403,371
APC - 375,027

Both part total votes = 778,398

That's more than 20% increase in the number of voters turnout and Adeleke won easily with more than 27k votes.

Opposition need massive voters turnout. Infact it's their only pathway to winning.

Voter turnout increased by over 40% in 2022, yet Adeleke won with just about 7%...I don't think this is a very good example of high voter turnout preventing rigging, cause that 2022 election was very close too.

BlueRayDick:
You see, u are the one drawing conclusion that opposition talking point is centered majorly around Rivers & Lagos. That is not the case here.

I can give u instances of elections in the last 2 years that have been frayed with different electoral malfeasance.

The Osun election you mentioned which Oyetola lost, there were serious allegations of rigging. In fact the Tribunal ruled in favor of Oyetola that there was over voting favoring Adeleke. That shows the system had serious irregularity.

Adamawa elections had it's own issues with rigging and even a REC declared a candidate winner before conclusion of result collation.

The Kogi off season election wasn't free of these irregularities; same is the recently concluded Edo elections.


See just take the point in my post and don't see it as a non APC supporter castigating elections conducted by APC led government.

Let there be serious consequence for those who sabotage electoral process be it an INEC staff, a security agent, a politician, a political thug, etc. The people will definitely turn up in mass to vote their preferred candidate.

No election is perfect, not just in Nigeria but all over the world, every nation seeks to continue to reform and perfect their electoral process.

In the case of Adamawa, The rightful winner was declared winner irrespective of what the REC did. Same as in Abia. The means the system might not be perfect but it does get it right in a lot of ways.

Adeleke won in the Supreme Court the same way Oyetola won in the Supreme court. Infact it was the same context that Oyetola use to win in 2018 that Adeleke also used to win in 2023 at the Supreme Court.

INEC can't battle election violence, that's the job of the security operatives.

Finally, there's nowhere in my post that's defending APC or anything so i don't know where you think this argument is anything about APC.

The simple truth is that in any election, for opposition to win, it needs massive turnout of their base. that's the basis of my argument and post to theflint1.

BlueRayDick:
The bold was proven wrong in the last election tho. I followed the election live on TV and I saw some polling units that were scattered in that Eti Osa LGA. Despite elections holding in private estates with hundreds on voters on ground, they were attacked and chased away by political thugs.

Go and ask Falz, Chioma Akpotha and co what happened to them at Ikate, Elegushi side. No matter how una many, if the hoodlums carry dangerous weapons una go fear for una lives run

4 thugs go hijack plane of over over 2000 persons closely packed together and na con 400 persons dem no go chase.

Theflint1:
Voter turnout increased by over 40% in 2022, yet Adeleke won with just about 7%...I don't think this is a very good example of high voter turnout preventing rigging, cause that 2022 election was very close too.

in 2018, Oyetola won by 1k votes. in 2023, Adeleke won by 27k votes. Clear winning. That's how opposition win. It's easy to overturn 1k votes, it becomes hard to look for 27k spread of votes.