₦airaland Forum

Elose11:
It was the British historians such as professor Robin Law, swayed by Reverend Samuel Johnson’s pretentious history of the Yorubas, that invented the claim that by the 1860s, Oyo had become the greatest empire in precolonial Nigeria. However, all the earliest writers of Yoruba history such as the Danmasanin Katsina and Sultan Bello in the 1880s, never mentioned of the existence of any Oyo empire.




The first Europeans to visit Oyo itself, including captain Hugh Clapperton and the Lander brothers never recorded that Oyo was an empire and neither did they speak of any great empire in the Oyo vicinity.

In 1668, Olfert Dapper described the Benin kingdom in details, but never mentioned any nearby great Oyo kingdom. However, the first documented mention of Oyo was two years later in 1671.

For hundreds of years, no precolonial European map mentioned any Oyo kingdom, let alone Oyo empire, even though the same European maps repeatedly depicted the Benin, Zegzeg, Borno and other kingdoms of those days.



More importantly, there has not been any documented evidence to prove that Oyo once conquered its neighbors into and empire. Dahomey, Akure, Ile Ife, Ilesha, the Owu, Ijesha, the Egba, Ijebu, the Ondos, the Owo, the Ugho, the Ekiti and a host of others, were never part of any Oyo empire.

Instead, in 1793, the Portuguese resident Archibald Dalzel, wrote as a living witness, that the Oyo kingdom was part of the Nupe empire, and was still paying annual tributes to the Etsu Nupes at the end of the 18th century.

The question we should ask ourselves is, how could Oyo have been one of the greatest empires in precolonial Nigerian history by the 1690s, when over one hundred years later in the 1790s, it was still a small kingdom paying tributes to the Etsu Nupes?

https://news-af.feednews.com/news/detail/fa1282be2b062b14907289a5e44d82e2?client=news

samuk:
In order to take what you have written seriously and not as some exaggeration from some story tellers, do you have any written eyewitness historical accounts to these events.

Secondly, I am not saying there wasn't an Oyo village whose Alaafin was regarded as the leader of the Yoruba people, this is not what I am saying.

What I am saying is there is no independent verifiable sources or eyewitness historical accounts to support the claim that Oyo was an empire or a kingdom. At best it was a Yoruba village that tried to control other Yoruba villages, sometimes calling on the Oba of Benin for help when he is unable to subdue his rebellious Yoruba neighbours.

Anybody can wake up and write anything as history, this is why I always request for eyewitness historical accounts to support such claims.

If Oyo was an empire in the 1600s and 1700s the way you guys are claiming, why are there no independent eyewitness accounts written by Europeans who documented all notable West Africa kingdoms and empires starting from the 1400s to the 1800s.

All that was written about Oyo until 1824 were all hearsay, not first hand accounts. Why are there no European eyewitness that visited this so called great Oyo empire or Kingdom until 1824, other great kingdoms and empires from Itsekiri, Benin to others were all visited and documented but not Oyo, why was the supposed great Alaafin of Oyo not visited until 1824?

When the Europeans finally visited Oyo in 1824 for the first time, all they saw was a small village struggling for survival from his Yoruba neighbours, they didn't see a kingdom or empire.

The ease at which the Fulani took over Ilorin and converted most Yoruba people and their Obas from Ilorin to Ibadan to Islam is enough evidence that Oyo wasn't an empire let alone a formidable one with great cavalry.

If you have an independent verifiable written eyewitness historical accounts about this supposed great Oyo empire, present them. Usually, when people make claims here and you request for evidence to support their claims, they resort to insults. Hope you are different.

SirNewtonNG:
You are a pure e hater. Despite the maby evidences and facts posted you continue to vehemently display ignorance, troll and undermine yoruba history. I hope whatever yoruba people are doing that's making you this frustrated will continue to go on in your life. Waste of sperm

Jameseddi1:
Ok provide evidence from European at that time like the rest Africa empire

Jameseddi1:
Ok provide evidence from European at that time like the rest Africa empire

Jameseddi1:
Ok provide evidence from European at that time like the rest Africa empire

SirNewtonNG:
Infact scrap that! I'll spoon feed you.

This one doesn't know what he is talking about. I really hope it's not jealousy driving you into absurdities. I really hope so.

(1) First of all, the Archibald Dalzel you mentioned actually documented that the powerful kingdom of Dahomey was under Oyo's imperial control and domination (paying annual tributes all along) until when Oyo began having internal issues. This lasted up to about 100 years.

(2) The statement from Archibald that Oyo paid tribute to Nupe around 1791 (during Oyo's imperial height) is a statement he obtained from the Dahomeans (who were under Oyo).

The statement is not found in Nupe traditions, neither is it found in Oyo's traditions. It is a swipe by Dahomey against its Oyo overlord. it has no corroboration in the traditions of the actual parties involved (i.e. 1700s Nupe and 1700s Oyo).



(3) Apart from the well-known Archibald Dalzel who wrote about Oyo's imperial domination of the Dahomey region in the 1700s, another European who wrote about Oyo's activities in the region in the 1600s is the Dutch Merchant, William Bosman. He has the following to say about one of Oyo's attack in the region.

"These being all Horsed, and a warlike Nation, in a short time mastered half of the King of Ardra's territories, and made such a slaughter among his subjects, that the Number of the Dead being innumerable, was commonly express'd by saying, "They were like the Grains of Corn in the Field ..." This Nation strikes such a terror into all the circumjacent Negroes, that they can scarce hear them mention'd without trembling: And they tell a thousand strange Things of them."

SirNewtonNG:
An 1800s Addition Among Several Others:

Regarding the tradition of military exellence in relation to Horsemanship and marksmanship (with bow and arrow) which became the passion and favorite sport of Oyo, Richard Lander commented on the Oyo people; on a second visit to Oyo-Ile in 1826, after a journey through Bariba, Hausa and Nupe countries; as follows:

The Oyo cavalry "have the reputation of being the best bowmen in Africa; and the young men soon become excellent marksmen by frequent practice and steady perseverance ... They amuse themselves daily by attempting to discharge arrows through a small hole made for the purpose in a wall, at a great distance from the standing ground, and I have frequently seen individuals accomplished this difficult task three successive times ... from a distance of up to one hundred yards. ... it requires great and unceasing practice to attain to so much perfection."

Reference:
Richard Lander: Records of Capt. Clapperton's Last Expedition to Africa, London, Henry Colborn & Richard Bentley, 1830, Vol. 2, p.222.

NOW I'LL BE INTERESTED TO KNOW AND GIVE YOU THE WORK YOU GAVE ME. CAN YOU GIVE ME ANY ACCOUNTS THAT DESCRIBE BENIN AS AN EMPIRE FROM EUROPEANS PRE OR DURING 1800. I'LL WAIT

samuk:
You can't nitpick what you like, you are right by saying that what the Europeans wrote about Oyo before their actual visit to Oyo in 1824 were hearsay, not eyewitness historical accounts.

The first time the Europeans visited Oyo and the Alaafin of Oyo was 1824, the Europeans met an Alaafin who was facing rebellion from his yoruba neighbours. The Alaafin told the Europeans that he has requested military assistance from the Oba of Benin.

There is no historical records of any eyewitness that actually witnessed Oyo being an empire.

There are simply no evidence that Oyo was an empire, if it was, the Europeans who were very active in west Africa between 1400-1800 would have visited for first hand account. The Europeans visited Lagos which was under Benin in 1602, they visited Itsekiri, Benin and other notable kingdoms and empire but never visited Oyo.

Oyo and Ife are just yoruba creations which can't be found in world history until 1824.

1824 is when yoruba eyewitness historical records began proper, know this and know peace.

Elose11:
It was the British historians such as professor Robin Law, swayed by Reverend Samuel Johnson’s pretentious history of the Yorubas, that invented the claim that by the 1860s, Oyo had become the greatest empire in precolonial Nigeria. However, all the earliest writers of Yoruba history such as the Danmasanin Katsina and Sultan Bello in the 1880s, never mentioned of the existence of any Oyo empire.




The first Europeans to visit Oyo itself, including captain Hugh Clapperton and the Lander brothers never recorded that Oyo was an empire and neither did they speak of any great empire in the Oyo vicinity.

In 1668, Olfert Dapper described the Benin kingdom in details, but never mentioned any nearby great Oyo kingdom. However, the first documented mention of Oyo was two years later in 1671.

For hundreds of years, no precolonial European map mentioned any Oyo kingdom, let alone Oyo empire, even though the same European maps repeatedly depicted the Benin, Zegzeg, Borno and other kingdoms of those days.



More importantly, there has not been any documented evidence to prove that Oyo once conquered its neighbors into and empire. Dahomey, Akure, Ile Ife, Ilesha, the Owu, Ijesha, the Egba, Ijebu, the Ondos, the Owo, the Ugho, the Ekiti and a host of others, were never part of any Oyo empire.

Instead, in 1793, the Portuguese resident Archibald Dalzel, wrote as a living witness, that the Oyo kingdom was part of the Nupe empire, and was still paying annual tributes to the Etsu Nupes at the end of the 18th century.

The question we should ask ourselves is, how could Oyo have been one of the greatest empires in precolonial Nigerian history by the 1690s, when over one hundred years later in the 1790s, it was still a small kingdom paying tributes to the Etsu Nupes?

https://news-af.feednews.com/news/detail/fa1282be2b062b14907289a5e44d82e2?client=news

SirNewtonNG:
A benin man wakes up one morning and all he can think about is how to denigrate the yoruba people and one its greatest state by questioning its existence while also describing it Wonders will never end
How low will you people's self esteem go?? I'm happy Tao12 as usual as schooled you guys

Christistruth00:
Ask the Ashanti if the Oyo Empire didn’t defeat them at the Battle of Atakampe in Togo in 1764, then Ask the Nupe if the Oyo did not defeat them and take a big Part of their Territory from them up to the River Niger after Alaafin Orompoto the only female Alaafin and her Army defeated them using Horses that she had imported from Timbuktu.

After that ask the Dahomey if they did not pay tribute to the Alaafin of Oyo for almost a Century

Then we will start from there

chopnaira:
Benin kingdom & Dahomey were paying tribute to Oyo empire, this was recorded by Sir Alfred Moloney when he arrived Lagos during the fall of Oyo empire in 1830.

Christistruth02:
Benin paid tribute to Oyo starting with Alaafin Oranmiyan but that was well before the British arrived
According to Oyo Historians Benin was still paying tribute to Oyo in the days of Alaafin Sango and he was the 3rd Alaafin which must have been around the 13th Century

RedboneSmith:
There's not the slightest figment of evidence in the oral traditions to support this. In the days of Sango, Oyo was still consolidating its hold in the Oyo metropolitan areas, after throwing off the control of Owu. It had not achieved empire status yet, and it was in no position to exert tribute from faraway Benin.

RedboneSmith:
I was expecting you to show me where it said that Benin was paying tribute under Oranmiyan and Sango. This your screenshot is not it. You people on Nairaland have to learn to understand what I say and be able to respond appropriately. Oyo was not an empire under Sango, or even Oranmiyan. In those early days, Oyo was preoccupied with consolidating its hold on the Oyo heartland. It was still struggling for control of the Oyo heartland with Owu, Nupe and Bariba at that time. It was in no position in those early days to exert tribute from anyone, let alone Benin.

If (and its a very big IF) Benin ever paid tribute to Oyo, this could not have been before the late 17th century. In any case, we know that Benin under Ehengbuda was able to resist Oyo incursion into the area it controlled and established a frontier with Oyo at at Otun; and from what we know, both kingdom respected each others territories.

Christistruth02:
Benin Paid Tribute to Oyo starting with Alaafin Oranmiyan who was Benin’s overlord

RedboneSmith:
You can say it a million times, dear. But without actual substantiation in the traditions and in the literature, you're just talking nonsense.