₦airaland Forum

DaddyCoool:
I'll TEACH you patiently as I taught the other guy. All I ask is that you show some appreciation:

There is only ONE God and he has always been, and he has always been by himself. BUT he has also ALWAYS had a "son" (remember, he was by himself yet has always had a "son"}. Then some 2000 years ago a human body was prepared and this "son" dwelt in that body to accomplish some assignments on earth, after which he returned to the "Father".
If there is any part you don't understand tell me let me clarify

so you refuse to believe what is revealed because of this

gohf:
so you refuse to believe what is revealed because of this

Revealed?

Aemmyjah:
Rumors of wars
Religious hypocrisy
Disobedience to parents
Rampant love of money
Global preaching of the goodnews

All these occured in the bronze age?

But there are no "rumors of wars" today, only wars!
In biblical times there were rumors of wars because information traveled very slowly and hard. Not so today. Today either there is a war or there is not!

SonofElohim1379:
Any more questions?

Please next time past the verses as text not photo, nairaland isn't that convenient to use.

John 12:28; 13:32; 16:4; 17:1&5
According to you what John wrote in this five verses show that Christ was glorified as God and contradicts the Philippians 2:9-11 I quoted. Right?

gohf:
Please next time past the verses as text not photo, nairaland isn't that convenient to use.

John 12:28; 13:32; 16:4; 17:1&5
According to you what John wrote in this five verses show that Christ was glorified as God and contradicts the Philippians 2:9-11 I quoted. Right?

Okay here are the verses


John 12:28 Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

John 13:32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him. John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


John 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:


John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Any more questions?

Truthseeker10:
What is the meaning of the word 'GOD' that is in the middle of the diagram?

How many persons combine to form the word one 'GOD' in the middle of the diagram?

you are still not getting it, if a Man is a doctor, a father and a teacher does that mean doctor, father and teacher are what makes up that man? I am not saying that is what what the Trinity is, but just as you cannot say a man that is in different positions or offices is made up of those office or position so also, the father, Son, and holy spirit are persond of the one God.

SonofElohim1379:
Okay here are the verses


John 12:28 Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

John 13:32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him. John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


John 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:


John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Any more questions?

you didn't answer the question
According to you what John wrote in this five verses show that Christ was glorified as God and contradicts the Philippians 2:9-11 I quoted. Right?

Nachmonides:
Hebrews 1:4-6 explicitly states: "So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs." How does this align with the claim that Jesus is "one of them"?

I told you how matters like this can be resolved wisely the best way is to take things bit by bit! John 16:12-13

The spirit son of God whose life was transformed to become a human earned himself a position higher than all his brothers after a successful earthly mission.
That's why God said all creatures must obey him not that he is God rather he got that high position after his achievement.

MaxInDHouse:
During the time Jonathan was in office was there WARS going on in some places and even in northern part of Nigeria?

You guys just love arguments below is what you asked specifically "RUMORS OF WAR"

Just seeing this. Nonsense. The biblical statement is "rumors of wars" NOT "possibility they'd be a war". "Rumors of wars" means "unverified info of wars going on"! Which won't apply today!

gohf:
you didn't answer the question
According to you what John wrote in this five verses show that Christ was glorified as God and contradicts the Philippians 2:9-11 I quoted. Right?

How does it Contradict?

What does verse 11 say in that same Phillipians?

DaddyCoool:
Just seeing this. Nonsense. The biblical statement is "rumors of wars" NOT "possibility of wars". "Rumors of wars" means "unverified info of wars going on"! Which won't apply today!

So rumor and possibility aren't related right?

I'm sorry for disturbing you please continue your argument with your kind it's OK!

SonofElohim1379:
How does it Contradict?

What does verse 11 say in that same Phillipians?

post it let see what verse 11 says...
To the glory of God not to his own glory.

SonofElohim1379:
Okay here are the verses


John 12:28 Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

John 13:32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him. John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.


John 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:


John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Any more questions?

Okay I have more time now, so you say these verses above show that "Christ was glorified as God" yet NONE of them, NOT ONE of them states that Jesus Christ is glorified as god or becomes a god.

First verse from John 12:28, let's read from verse 27


John.12.27 - Now my soul is deeply troubled. Should I pray, 'Father, save me from what lies ahead'? But that is the very reason why I came!
John.12.28 - Father, bring glory to your name." Then a voice spoke from heaven, saying, "I have already brought it glory, and I will do it again."

Jesus was troubled and prayed, he was not a god but a man before God and the next verse doesn't show Christ being glorified as a god.

Next John 13
John.13.31 - As soon as Judas left the room, Jesus said, "The time has come for me, the Son of Man, to enter into my glory, and God will receive glory because of all that happens to me.
John.13.32 - And God will bring me into my glory very soon. (This is NLT)


Now NIV
John.13.32 If God is glorified in him, God will glorify the Son in himself, and will glorify him at once. (NIV)

Still doesn't state that Jesus Christ was glorified as a god or was to be glorified as a god. But will be glorified in GOD

Even we who make it will be glorified
Rom.8.18 Yet what we suffer now is nothing compared to the glory he will give us later.
Rom.8.30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

So because we will be glorified doesn't mean we will be glorified as God..

Okay John 16

John.16.13 - When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not be presenting his own ideas; he will be telling you what he has heard. He will tell you about the future.
John.16.14 - He will bring me glory by revealing to you whatever he receives from me.
John.16.15 - All that the Father has is mine; this is what I mean when I say that the Spirit will reveal to you whatever he receives from me.

The Holy Spirit will glorify Jesus by revealing his words to us which Jesus received from the Father. As simple and straightforward as this statement is please surprise me by understanding it.

John 17, let's read from 1 to 5, and not skip verses shall we

John.17.1 - When Jesus had finished saying all these things, he looked up to heaven and said, "Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son so he can give glory back to you.
John.17.2 - For you have given him authority over everyone in all the earth. He gives eternal life to each one you have given him.
John.17.3 - And this is the way to have eternal life--to know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, the one you sent to earth.
John.17.4 - I brought glory to you here on earth by doing everything you told me to do.
John.17.5 - And now, Father, bring me into the glory we shared before the world began.


Now where God is is glorious that's why we have hope for that glory, to enter into glory, if you had such hope you wouldn't be making such silly mistakes and accusing that this verses means Christ is glorified as a god.

Do you understand what it means for Jesus to be glorified and return glory back to God. Do you understand the great importance of being resurrected after a public roman execution, overcoming death. This isn't just overcoming poverty or sickness, but overcoming the biggest insurmountable problem of humanity, death.

And that's why we believe that Jesus, like he said in verse two, has received authority to give us eternal life.

Jesus whom you falsely accused as a god, said there's is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD, so you also accuse him of lying against God or declaring himself as a false god who glorified himself??

But Jesus didn't, he humbled himself and OBEYED ALL God commanded of him. Jesus the sinless man is not God and didn't become a god.

MaxInDHouse:
So rumor and possibility aren't related right?

I'm sorry for disturbing you please continue your argument with your kind it's OK!

Nope. "Unverified info of wars going on" is clearly what the Bible meant.
Today either there is a war or there is not! There are no "rumors of wars"!
In biblical times there were rumors of wars because information traveled very slowly and hard to verify. Not so at all today

gohf:
Okay I have more time now, so you say these verses above show that "Christ was glorified as God" yet NONE of them, NOT ONE of them states that Jesus Christ is glorified as god or becomes a god.

First verse from John 12:28, let's read from verse 27


John.12.27 - Now my soul is deeply troubled. Should I pray, 'Father, save me from what lies ahead'? But that is the very reason why I came!
John.12.28 - Father, bring glory to your name." Then a voice spoke from heaven, saying, "I have already brought it glory, and I will do it again."

Jesus was troubled and prayed, he was not a god but a man before God and the next verse doesn't show Christ being glorified as a god.

Next John 13
John.13.31 - As soon as Judas left the room, Jesus said, "The time has come for me, the Son of Man, to enter into my glory, and God will receive glory because of all that happens to me.
John.13.32 - And God will bring me into my glory very soon. (This is NLT)


Now NIV
John.13.32 If God is glorified in him, God will glorify the Son in himself, and will glorify him at once. (NIV)

Still doesn't state that Jesus Christ was glorified as a god or was to be glorified as a god. But will be glorified in GOD

Even we who make it will be glorified
Rom.8.18 Yet what we suffer now is nothing compared to the glory he will give us later.
Rom.8.30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

So because we will be glorified doesn't mean we will be glorified as God..

Okay John 16

John.16.13 - When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not be presenting his own ideas; he will be telling you what he has heard. He will tell you about the future.
John.16.14 - He will bring me glory by revealing to you whatever he receives from me.
John.16.15 - All that the Father has is mine; this is what I mean when I say that the Spirit will reveal to you whatever he receives from me.

The Holy Spirit will glorify Jesus by revealing his words to us which Jesus received from the Father. As simple and straightforward as this statement is please surprise me by understanding it.

John 17, let's read from 1 to 5, and not skip verses shall we

John.17.1 - When Jesus had finished saying all these things, he looked up to heaven and said, "Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son so he can give glory back to you.
John.17.2 - For you have given him authority over everyone in all the earth. He gives eternal life to each one you have given him.
John.17.3 - And this is the way to have eternal life--to know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, the one you sent to earth.
John.17.4 - I brought glory to you here on earth by doing everything you told me to do.
John.17.5 - And now, Father, bring me into the glory we shared before the world began.


Now where God is is glorious that's why we have hope for that glory, to enter into glory, if you had such hope you wouldn't be making such silly mistakes and accusing that this verses means Christ is glorified as a god.

Do you understand what it means for Jesus to be glorified and return glory back to God. Do you understand the great importance of being resurrected after a public roman execution, overcoming death. This isn't just overcoming poverty or sickness, but overcoming the biggest insurmountable problem of humanity, death.

And that's why we believe that Jesus, like he said in verse two, has received authority to give us eternal life.

Jesus whom you falsely accused as a god, said there's is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD, so you also accuse him of lying against God or declaring himself as a false god who glorified himself??

But Jesus didn't, he humbled himself and OBEYED ALL God commanded of him. Jesus the sinless man is not God and didn't become a god.

Soo much writing and obfuscation without making sense. Your argument is simply all over the place

Observe this scripture carefully

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

If God the Father Glorifies Jesus with his own self, what does it imply?

Have you forgotten that Yeshua is the word of God? Can God be seperate from his Word?

It's just common sense and needs no further arguments

gohf:
But Jesus didn't, he humbled himself and OBEYED ALL God commanded of him. Jesus the sinless man is not God and didn't become a god.

So what is he AND why did the Father raise him from literally death to be worshipped with him as God all these centuries??
Why not just simply let him stay dead and avoid the blasphemy??

DaddyCoool:
So what is he AND why did the Father raise him from literally death to be worshipped with him as God all these centuries??
Why not just simply let him stay dead and avoid the blasphemy??

God didn't do that, you people did

SonofElohim1379:
Soo much writing and obfuscation without making sense. Your argument is simply all over the place

Observe this scripture carefully

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

If God the Father Glorifies Jesus with his own self, what does it imply?

Have you forgotten that Yeshua is the word of God? Can God be seperate from his Word?

It's just common sense and needs no further arguments

oh KJV has NKJV you know
John.17.5 And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.

How can what I wrote not make sense to you but KJV language does, dont you see there's something wrong with you.

Can God be separate from his word?
Do you even read your Bible or is it there as a poetry book of thou and thy

He sent forth His word, and healed them. calling it God's word doesn't separate God from His word, His word doesn't have to be a god for it to agree (be one) with God. God's word na messenger

gohf:
oh KJV has NKJV you know
John.17.5 And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.

How can what I wrote not make sense to you but KJV language does, dont you see there's something wrong with you.

Can God be separate from his word?
Do you even read your Bible or is it there as a poetry book of thou and thy

He sent forth His word, and healed them. calling it God's word doesn't separate God from His word, His word doesn't have to be a god for it to agree (be one) with God. God's word na messenger

Okay what does this say ?

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:2 The same was in the beginning with
God

1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.


Still confused?

gohf:
God didn't do that, you people did

"You people" raised him from the dead to be worshipped as God??
Na wa for you o

DaddyCoool:
"You people" raised him from the dead to be worshipped as God??
Na wa for you o

changing the purpose for a thing is what devil is good at

SonofElohim1379:
Okay what does this say ?

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:2 The same was in the beginning with
God

1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.


Still confused?

never asked you what it says nor did I tell you I was confused.

Before you joined the conversation you should have at least read what has previously been postedbut instead you are jumping from one thing to another like a confused human being.

DaddyCoool:
But there are no "rumors of wars" today, only wars!
In biblical times there were rumors of wars because information traveled very slowly and hard. Not so today. Today either there is a war or there is not!

I'm sure you've not listened or been listening to the news
Next turn

gohf:
never asked you what it says nor did I tell you I was confused.

Before you joined the conversation you should have at least read what has previously been postedbut instead you are jumping from one thing to another like a confused human being.

The Word (Yeshua) is God

No need for useless back and forth as the Scripture has made it quite clear that even a little child will understand.

SonofElohim1379:
The Word (Yeshua) is God

No need for useless back and forth as the Scripture has made it Quiet clear that even a little child will understand.

which scripture? Is it the one of God or of Satan.

When faced with the truth you choose to run from it like darkness flesh from light

Aemmyjah:
I'm sure you've not listened or been listening to the news
Next turn

I've never heard news where they said "there are rumors that there are wars going on". Not in today's world. They would tell you whether a war has broken out and what stage. In biblical times there could be rumors in Israel that Jebusites were fighting Amalekites!

DaddyCoool:
Nope. "Unverified info of wars going on" is clearly what the Bible meant.
Today either there is a war or there is not! There are no "rumors of wars"!
In biblical times there were rumors of wars because information traveled very slowly and hard to verify. Not so at all today

OK Sir!

Aemmyjah:
I'm sure you've not listened or been listening to the news
Next turn

This is year 2025, i won't waste my precious time with any arrogant person if i discover a person is not humble enough to learn i will quickly discharge myself and waka pass.
We are going in search of the lost sheep of the house of Israel {Matthew 10:6} not argumentators. Titus 3:9

MaxInDHouse:
This is year 2025, i won't waste my precious time with any arrogant person if i discover a person is not humble enough to learn i will quickly discharge myself and waka pass.
We are going in search of the lost sheep of the house of Israel {Matthew 10:6} not argumentators. Titus 3:9

Just stop the "rumors of wars" stuff. I find it annoying!

Steep:
you are still not getting it, if a Man is a doctor, a father and a teacher does that mean doctor, father and teacher are what makes up that man? I am not saying that is what what the Trinity is, but just as you cannot say a man that is in different positions or offices is made up of those office or position so also, the father, Son, and holy spirit are persond of the one God.

So according to the diagram, The father, the son, and the Holy Spirit do not make up one word 'God'? If yes, what makes up the one word 'GOD' that is in the middle of the diagram?

MaxInDHouse:
I told you how matters like this can be resolved wisely the best way is to take things bit by bit! John 16:12-13

The spirit son of God whose life was transformed to become a human earned himself a position higher than all his brothers after a successful earthly mission.
That's why God said all creatures must obey him not that he is God rather he got that high position after his achievement.

Christ's Preexistence and Divinity: John 1:1-3 declares that Jesus (the Word) was with God and was God, affirming His eternal deity, not a position earned. Philippians 2:6-9 shows that His exaltation after His earthly mission was a restoration of glory, not a promotion beyond His nature.

Christ's Unchanging Nature: Hebrews 13:8 states, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." His divine status was never dependent on earthly achievements.

What do you have to say to these?

Nachmonides:
Christ's Preexistence and Divinity: John 1:1-3 declares that Jesus (the Word) was with God and was God, affirming His eternal deity, not a position earned. Philippians 2:6-9 shows that His exaltation after His earthly mission was a restoration of glory, not a promotion beyond His nature.

The Bible made it clear that there are many spirit sons of God who serve as princes in heaven {Daniel 10:13} but why are we only concerned about just one out of all these princes? {Isaiah 9:6) it's because he is the only one who surrender his life to live among us {Isaiah 6:8 compare to John 12:41} so we can perceive all the qualities of his father through his presence in our midst.
For instance if we are to talk about Gabriel he is the person who is standing in front of God in heaven {Luke 1:19} the spirit son who first revel against God also has a lofty position in heaven that's why he could drag many angels under him to join him in his rebellious act. So Christians were talking about the man Jesus for us to know how great he was before coming to the earth so we can show appreciation by obeying what he told us in the scriptures all spirit sons of God are Gods in their respective positions {Psalms 82:1; 6} but none of them is Almighty like their father! Psalms 83:18

Nachmonides:
Christ's Unchanging Nature: Hebrews 13:8 states, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." His divine status was never dependent on earthly achievements.

What do you have to say to these?

None of God's spirit sons need to be here in the first place but Jesus love humans from the time of creation {Proverbs 8:31} that's why he volunteered to take up that mission Paul wasn't talking about his divine status at Hebrews 13:8 rather he was referring to his attitude for instance he wrote:
For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. 1 Corinthians 2:16 KJV

For “who has come to know the mind of Jehovah, so that he may instruct him?” But we do have the mind of Christ. NWT

Check the two translations KJV is not clear because instead of using God's divine name they used the title Lord thereby confusing the reader. What Paul meant here is nobody has seen God in action before so we can't say much about His thinking but since Christ Jesus has walked with humans we can speak about how he thinks hence we know his thoughts.
Now back to Paul's letter to the Hebrews he is now telling us that Christ's thought remains the same always {Hebrews 13:8} so whoever depends on what Jesus taught is totally safe because Christ will never change his line of judgement!
For clearer understanding that it was after his earthly mission he was exalted read Philippians 2:5-11