₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
The Bible made it clear that there are many spirit sons of God who serve as princes in heaven {Daniel 10:13} but why are we only concerned about just one out of all these princes? {Isaiah 9:6) it's because he is the only one who surrender his life to live among us {Isaiah 6:8 compare to John 12:41} so we can perceive all the qualities of his father through his presence in our midst.
For instance if we are to talk about Gabriel he is the person who is standing in front of God in heaven {Luke 1:19} the spirit son who first revel against God also has a lofty position in heaven that's why he could drag many angels under him to join him in his rebellious act. So Christians were talking about the man Jesus for us to know how great he was before coming to the earth so we can show appreciation by obeying what he told us in the scriptures all spirit sons of God are Gods in their respective positions {Psalms 82:1; 6} but none of them is Almighty like their father! Psalms 83:18



None of God's spirit sons need to be here in the first place but Jesus love humans from the time of creation {Proverbs 8:31} that's why he volunteered to take up that mission Paul wasn't talking about his divine status at Hebrews 13:8 rather he was referring to his attitude for instance he wrote:
For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. 1 Corinthians 2:16 KJV

For “who has come to know the mind of Jehovah, so that he may instruct him?” But we do have the mind of Christ. NWT

Check the two translations KJV is not clear because instead of using God's divine name they used the title Lord thereby confusing the reader. What Paul meant here is nobody has seen God in action before so we can't say much about His thinking but since Christ Jesus has walked with humans we can speak about how he thinks hence we know his thoughts.
Now back to Paul's letter to the Hebrews he is now telling us that Christ's thought remains the same always {Hebrews 13:8} so whoever depends on what Jesus taught is totally safe because Christ will never change his line of judgement!
For clearer understanding that it was after his earthly mission he was exalted read Philippians 2:5-11

Thank you for your detailed responses as always.

I have read all that you have written and I must confess, you haven't addressed the issues I presented. Forgive me if I failed to see them if you have. I wrote about how scriptures tells us about the pre-existence, divinity, uniqueness of sonship, and the position he was exalted to that could never have been something beyond his nature; If truly he is God.


These are the thoughts I conveyed in my last text.
Please can you touch on them focusing on them without digression?

Nachmonides:
Thank you for your detailed responses as always.
I have read all that you have written and I must confess, you haven't addressed the issues I presented. Forgive me if I failed to see them if you have. I wrote about how scriptures tells us about the pre-existence, divinity, uniqueness of sonship, and the position he was exalted to that could never have been something beyond his nature; If truly he is God.
These are the thoughts I conveyed in my last text.
Please can you touch on them focusing on them without digression?

All spirit sons of God (angels) has the same nature that's why the scriptures called them God's Sons! Job 38:7

What concerned us is that one of them became human and lived with us on this planet so whatever Paul is saying doesn't nullify the fact that he is one of God's spirit sons who share the same nature with God in heaven.
When God said:

“Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness" Genesis 1:26

It simply means we humans share God's glory which was lost after Adam sinned! Romans 3:23

So don't think of Jesus beyond what he stands for he only came to teach us by thoughts , words and actions how we can connect back to the glory we lost in the garden of Eden {John 1:11-12} had it been that Adam didn't fall we wouldn't have any need of Jesus at all because Adam would have been the one teaching us how to keep the glory God gave man on planet earth.
That's why the scriptures compared Jesus to Adam! 1Corinthians 15:45

Think of what you're missing because of this idea of over hyping Jesus, six of you on this thread all wanted to speak about the position of Jesus and God even though all of you agreed that Jesus is God yet you're stuck in arguing over his nature.
What is the hazard of this?
Instead of thinking about how to do the work Jesus assigned to his disciples you guys keep arguing, insulting and abusing one another over his nature.
If that's what Jesus is all about how are you doing the work he gave Christians? Matthew 28:19-20

For your information true Christians are to form a network of believers throughout the earth {Act 1:8} in preparation for the kingdom of Christ by searching for friends of peace {Luke 10:6} and teaching them what the Prince of Peace commanded {Matthew 28:20} that's how we are going to do God's will which is forming a big and happy family of peace loving worshipers throughout the earth {Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3} failure to do so means we are just hyping Jesus for unjust course! Matthew 7:21-23

Truthseeker10:
So according to the diagram, The father, the son, and the Holy Spirit do not make up one word 'God'? If yes, what makes up the one word 'GOD' that is in the middle of the diagram?

The diagram is clear, it says that God is the father, God is the Son and God is the holy ghost but however the father is not the Son neither the Son the holy ghost. Like saying the man is the teacher, judge, and father but father is not the same as teacher neither the same as judge. In the case of Trinity we are not talking of positions or offices but rather personhood.

DaddyCoool:
Nope. "Unverified info of wars going on" is clearly what the Bible meant.
Today either there is a war or there is not! There are no "rumors of wars"!
In biblical times there were rumors of wars because information traveled very slowly and hard to verify. Not so at all today

you mean like the "cold war" between USA and Russia. Was it ever confirmed?

Was there not one about North Korea one time like

SonofElohim1379:
The Word (Yeshua) is God

No need for useless back and forth as the Scripture has made it quite clear that even a little child will understand.

you lie against scripture making that you people's nonsense about trinity clear, and NO child who reads the bible would believe that's why you all have to come up with numerous different ways to hide a lie by corrupting what is actually written

Steep:
The diagram is clear, it says that God is the father, God is the Son and God is the holy ghost but however the father is not the Son neither the Son the holy ghost. Like saying the man is the teacher, judge, and father but father is not the same as teacher neither the same as judge. In the case of Trinity we are not talking of positions or offices but rather personhood.

the question is, when the man is a judge is he also teaching in the classroom, can he be all three at the same time?


You guys have gone from Godhood to personhod. Okay so they are all the same person?
Tagging: Truthseeker10

Nachmonides:
Thank you for your detailed responses as always.

I have read all that you have written and I must confess, you haven't addressed the issues I presented. Forgive me if I failed to see them if you have. I wrote about how scriptures tells us about the pre-existence, divinity, uniqueness of sonship, and the position he was exalted to that could never have been something beyond his nature; If truly he is God.


These are the thoughts I conveyed in my last text.
Please can you touch on them focusing on them without digression?

not to come into a conversation I wasn't following but your statement "the position he was exalted to that could never have been something beyond his nature; If truly he is God."

Are you saying Jesus was exalted because he is a god?

Steep:
you are still not getting it, if a Man is a doctor, a father and a teacher does that mean doctor, father and teacher are what makes up that man? I am not saying that is what what the Trinity is, but just as you cannot say a man that is in different positions or offices is made up of those office or position so also, the father, Son, and holy spirit are persond of the one God.

the answer to your question is YES, the man is a doctor, a father and a teacher, a professor in medicine possible is who He is based on his severally degrees and experiences.

So the son is an office and the Holy Spirit is an office and the Father is an office which one person God has, now is God in heaven or on earth?

If you say both or avoid my questions like you and your fellows do, hope others can see your nonsense. If you say both, then God is on earth, so why does scripture say God is coming if He is already here?

If you say He is coming in a different office, then does He occupy three offices at the same time or nullify the others with his complete presence?

If He doesn't and occupies all three, how does He do it, as one God or as three different persons?

If you say one, then that means He nullifies the rest

If you say three it means God isn't one but three and If God is three why then do you insist that God is one?

Is it because God himself said He alone is God? But you believe He is three and since you cannot be lying then you mix it into that, three gods you believe in are one?

Nachmonides:
Christ's Preexistence and Divinity: John 1:1-3 declares that Jesus (the Word) was with God and was God, affirming His eternal deity, not a position earned. Philippians 2:6-9 shows that His exaltation after His earthly mission was a restoration of glory, not a promotion beyond His nature.

Christ's Unchanging Nature: Hebrews 13:8 states, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." His divine status was never dependent on earthly achievements.

What do you have to say to these?

by this your believe you nullify the fact and truth that Jesus was rewarded. So Jesus was not promoted according to you.

So Jesus who was given a name above every other name under God was not rewarded but restored back to glory..

Now tell us what was Jesus's name before he was given a name, that at the mention of his name... you know the rest? And secondly why that name wasn't given since he had the name ever since, why was it a promise from God. Did God lie and hide salvation while men suffered.

If the lamb according to Revelation had already collected the book and overcome the serpent, why wait four thousand years.

Do you know what someone who heard you u guys lies said to me on this nairaland because of people like you, that god is dumb, why wait thousands of years.


You will run away, but for the sake of others, let me ask you

Christ's nature is unchanging yet you believe Christ is god, so did God die on the cross? This is one of the questions that came from someone else as well.

If Christ doesn't change them he came as god and died as god and returned back to being a god?

"His divine status was never dependent on earthly achievements."

So Christ didn't have to obeyed God

Nachmonides:
Lol, I'm also laughing at the science of it.

We're literally on the same page on that.
I don't also believe it.

Listen to this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wL9eo9QaJb4

Steep:
The diagram is clear, it says that God is the father, God is the Son and God is the holy ghost but however the father is not the Son neither the Son the holy ghost. Like saying the man is the teacher, judge, and father but father is not the same as teacher neither the same as judge. In the case of Trinity we are not talking of positions or offices but rather personhood.

I never said the father is the son.

how many persons form the one word 'GOD' according to the diagram?

gohf:
the question is, when the man is a judge is he also teaching in the classroom, can he be all three at the same time?


You guys have gone from Godhood to personhod. Okay so they are all the same person?
Tagging: Truthseeker10

Don't mind them. They don't even know the meaning of the word 'GOD' according to their trinity doctrine. There can never be a GOD without the three persons according to their doctrine but they don't want to admit it.

LordReed:
LMFAO! By Orion's beard you must be on crack. Bwahahahahahaha!

How can the flooding in a river basin be evidence of a global flood? Are you using your brain or is it the crack talking? LMAO.

What suffices you as proof of flood?

Image123:
What suffices you as proof of flood?

A global flood will leave the same footprint all over the globe and not just geologically. Having animals depart and return to their biomes would leave markers. The flora too would also have markers from such an event. These are just the ones that occur to me, I am sure experts in the various fields of science would come up with many more.

MaxInDHouse:
The Bible made it clear that there are many spirit sons of God who serve as princes in heaven {Daniel 10:13} but why are we only concerned about just one out of all these princes? {Isaiah 9:6) it's because he is the only one who surrender his life to live among us {Isaiah 6:8 compare to John 12:41} so we can perceive all the qualities of his father through his presence in our midst.
For instance if we are to talk about Gabriel he is the person who is standing in front of God in heaven {Luke 1:19} the spirit son who first revel against God also has a lofty position in heaven that's why he could drag many angels under him to join him in his rebellious act. So Christians were talking about the man Jesus for us to know how great he was before coming to the earth so we can show appreciation by obeying what he told us in the scriptures all spirit sons of God are Gods in their respective positions {Psalms 82:1; 6} but none of them is Almighty like their father! Psalms 83:18



None of God's spirit sons need to be here in the first place but Jesus love humans from the time of creation {Proverbs 8:31} that's why he volunteered to take up that mission Paul wasn't talking about his divine status at Hebrews 13:8 rather he was referring to his attitude for instance he wrote:
For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. 1 Corinthians 2:16 KJV

For “who has come to know the mind of Jehovah, so that he may instruct him?” But we do have the mind of Christ. NWT

Check the two translations KJV is not clear because instead of using God's divine name they used the title Lord thereby confusing the reader. What Paul meant here is nobody has seen God in action before so we can't say much about His thinking but since Christ Jesus has walked with humans we can speak about how he thinks hence we know his thoughts.
Now back to Paul's letter to the Hebrews he is now telling us that Christ's thought remains the same always {Hebrews 13:8} so whoever depends on what Jesus taught is totally safe because Christ will never change his line of judgement!
For clearer understanding that it was after his earthly mission he was exalted read Philippians 2:5-11

That's a bold statement that KJV is not clear, confusing the reader. I'm one who is faithful to the original Greek.

τίς γὰρ ἔγνω νοῦν Κυρίου, ὃς συμβιβάσει αὐτόν; ἡμεῖς δὲ νοῦν Χριστοῦ ἔχομεν.

Transliteration
"Tis gar egnō noun Kyriou, hos symbibasei auton? Hēmeis de noun Christou echomen."

Literal Translation: "For who has known the mind of the Lord, who will instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ."

KJV is closer to the Greek in terms of a literal word-for-word rendering. It accurately translates Κυρίου as "Lord" and maintains the original structure and flow of the text.

NWT slightly diverges by translating Κυρίου as "Jehovah," which reflects a theological interpretation rather than a strict adherence to the Greek.


If faithfulness to the Greek text is the priority, KJV is the closer match. The NWT introduces a theological nuance that is not explicit in the original Greek.



That's one of the reasons why people love the KJV.
So, your statement could be rephrased as Paul should have used Jehovah and not Lord, confusing his readers.

Don't you think that's a very bold statement to make, do you know the implications of that statement?

Gohf, I will answer your questions. Give me a few moments.

Truthseeker10:
I never said the father is the son.

how many persons form the one word 'GOD' according to the diagram?

Does the diagram tell you it is the persons that forms God?

gohf:
the question is, when the man is a judge is he also teaching in the classroom, can he be all three at the same time?


You guys have gone from Godhood to personhod. Okay so they are all the same person?
Tagging: Truthseeker10

That is why is God is God, he is beyond man.


Gone from Godhood to personhood you cannot understand English?
Godhood- the state of being God
Personhood- the state of being a person.

gohf:
you mean like the "cold war" between USA and Russia. Was it ever confirmed?

Was there not one about North Korea one time like

In biblical times there would be rumors in Israel that Jebusites were fighting Amalekites. That's what "rumors of wars" refered to. There are no "rumors of wars" today. If Israel starts bombing Gaza you'd hear and see it all over internet, TV, radio, newspapers, even up to video of the actual bombing!

Steep:
Does the diagram tell you it is the persons that forms God?

What does the diagram say form God?

Truthseeker10:
What does the diagram say form God?

Where does it talk about forming God?

LordReed:
A global flood will leave the same footprint all over the globe and not just geologically. Having animals depart and return to their biomes would leave markers. The flora too would also have markers from such an event. These are just the ones that occur to me, I am sure experts in the various fields of science would come up with many more.

Have you experienced one before, or know people who experienced one before to be certain of these? What makes one an expert, a Ph.D in science?

Nachmonides:
That's a bold statement that KJV is not clear, confusing the reader. I'm one who is faithful to the original Greek.
τίς γὰρ ἔγνω νοῦν Κυρίου, ὃς συμβιβάσει αὐτόν; ἡμεῖς δὲ νοῦν Χριστοῦ ἔχομεν.
Transliteration
"Tis gar egnō noun Kyriou, hos symbibasei auton? Hēmeis de noun Christou echomen."
Literal Translation: "For who has known the mind of the Lord, who will instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ."
KJV is closer to the Greek in terms of a literal word-for-word rendering. It accurately translates Κυρίου as "Lord" and maintains the original structure and flow of the text.
NWT slightly diverges by translating Κυρίου as "Jehovah," which reflects a theological interpretation rather than a strict adherence to the Greek.
If faithfulness to the Greek text is the priority, KJV is the closer match. The NWT introduces a theological nuance that is not explicit in the original Greek.
That's one of the reasons why people love the KJV.
So, your statement could be rephrased as Paul should have used Jehovah and not Lord, confusing his readers.
Don't you think that's a very bold statement to make, do you know the implications of that statement?

Let's figure out something here.

Please read Psalms 110:1 and explain.

Image123:
Have you experienced one before, or know people who experienced one before to be certain of these? What makes one an expert, a Ph.D in science?

Experienced what?

How is "what makes one an expert" a question relevant to this discussion?

Steep:
Where does it talk about forming God?

.so you don't know what the word 'GOD' is made up of in the diagram?

Nachmonides:
Gohf, I will answer your questions. Give me a few moments.

👍

MaxInDHouse:
Let's figure out something here.

Please read Psalms 110:1 and explain.

Hebrew (Masoretic Text)

יְהוָה נְאֻם לַאדֹנִי שֵׁב לִימִינִי עַד־אָשִׂית אֹיְבֶיךָ הֲדֹם לְרַגְלֶיךָ



> Transliteration

Yahweh ne'um la'Adoni shev limini ad ashit oyvecha hadom leraglecha




> Literal Translation

"The LORD said to my Lord: 'Sit at My right hand until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet.'"


Comparison Between KJV and NWT

King James Version (KJV)

"The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool."

New World Translation (NWT)

"Jehovah declared to my Lord: 'Sit at my right hand until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.'"



+ Divine Name (YHWH):

KJV: Uses "The LORD" (in all caps), the traditional way of representing the Hebrew name Yahweh without pronouncing it.

NWT: Explicitly uses "Jehovah," which is the transliteration of the Tetragrammaton (YHWH).


++ Second "Lord" (Adoni):

Both versions translate Adoni as "my Lord," recognizing it as a title of respect and authority.



+++ Action of Sitting:

Both agree on the command to "sit at My right hand," representing honor, authority, and exaltation.



++++ Enemies as a Footstool:

Both convey the same imagery of God making the enemies of the Lord (Messiah) subordinate, though the NWT phrases it slightly differently ("a stool for your feet" instead of "thy footstool".


The main difference lies in the rendering of the divine name. The NWT prioritizes the use of "Jehovah" to reflect God's personal name, while the KJV follows traditional Jewish reverence by substituting it with "LORD."

The overall meaning remains consistent between both translations, emphasizing God's promise to exalt the Messiah and subdue His enemies.

Steep:
That is why is God is God, he is beyond man.


Gone from Godhood to personhood you cannot understand English?
Godhood- the state of being God
Personhood- the state of being a person.

it's only you that understands english, infact you by yourself is dictionary.
But somehow you don't even understand how you went from writing godhood to personhod that is why you are responding like this because if you did and this is your response then you are deceiving yourself.

So your answer to the question , "when the man is a judge is he also teaching in the classroom, can he be all three at the same time? Is that God can be three people at the same time yes or no. Don't be cunny at least be straightforward for once.

Nachmonides:
+++ Action of Sitting:

Both agree on the command to "sit at My right hand," representing honor, authority, and exaltation.

Nachmonides:
Christ's Preexistence and Divinity: John 1:1-3 declares that Jesus (the Word) was with God and was God, affirming His eternal deity, not a position earned. Philippians 2:6-9 shows that His exaltation after His earthly mission was a restoration of glory, not a promotion beyond His nature.

Christ's Unchanging Nature: Hebrews 13:8 states, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." His divine status was never dependent on earthly achievements.

What do you have to say to these?

Please this is also you that wrote this
"+++ Action of Sitting:

Both agree on the command to "sit at My right hand," representing honor, authority, and exaltation."

Nachmonides:
Hebrew (Masoretic Text)

יְהוָה נְאֻם לַאדֹנִי שֵׁב לִימִינִי עַד־אָשִׂית אֹיְבֶיךָ הֲדֹם לְרַגְלֶיךָ



> Transliteration

Yahweh ne'um la'Adoni shev limini ad ashit oyvecha hadom leraglecha




> Literal Translation

"The LORD said to my Lord: 'Sit at My right hand until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet.'"


Comparison Between KJV and NWT

King James Version (KJV)

"The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool."

New World Translation (NWT)

"Jehovah declared to my Lord: 'Sit at my right hand until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.'"



+ Divine Name (YHWH):

KJV: Uses "The LORD" (in all caps), the traditional way of representing the Hebrew name Yahweh without pronouncing it.

NWT: Explicitly uses "Jehovah," which is the transliteration of the Tetragrammaton (YHWH).


++ Second "Lord" (Adoni):

Both versions translate Adoni as "my Lord," recognizing it as a title of respect and authority.



+++ Action of Sitting:

Both agree on the command to "sit at My right hand," representing honor, authority, and exaltation.



++++ Enemies as a Footstool:

Both convey the same imagery of God making the enemies of the Lord (Messiah) subordinate, though the NWT phrases it slightly differently ("a stool for your feet" instead of "thy footstool".


The main difference lies in the rendering of the divine name. The NWT prioritizes the use of "Jehovah" to reflect God's personal name, while the KJV follows traditional Jewish reverence by substituting it with "LORD."

The overall meaning remains consistent between both translations, emphasizing God's promise to exalt the Messiah and subdue His enemies.

Interestingly,

Jesus quotes the same Psalms 110:1 in Matthew 22:44



Matthew 22:44 (quoting Psalm 110:1)
"The Lord said to my Lord, ‘Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet.’”

Jesus applies this verse to Himself, identifying as the "Lord" (Kyrios) to whom Yahweh speaks.

"Kyrios" is the Greek counterpart for Hebrew "Adonai" or "Adoni"

John 20:28
"Thomas answered and said to Him, ‘My Lord and my God!’"

Here, Thomas explicitly calls Jesus "Lord" (Kyrios) and "God" (Theos), affirming His divinity.


Here's the immediate context to V.44

Matthew 22:41-46

+ The Pharisees' Questioning:
Earlier in Matthew 22, Jesus is confronted by the Pharisees, Sadducees, and Herodians, each trying to trap Him with difficult theological or political questions (e.g., about paying taxes, marriage in the resurrection, and the greatest commandment).


++ Jesus’ Counterquestion:
After answering their challenges, Jesus turns the tables and asks the Pharisees a question about the identity of the Messiah:
“What do you think about the Messiah? Whose son is he?”

The Pharisees believed the Messiah would be a descendant of King David, a political and earthly ruler who would restore Israel's kingdom.

However, they did not fully grasp the divine nature of the Messiah.

The Pharisees respond: “The son of David.”



+++ Jesus Quotes Psalm 110:1:
Jesus challenges their understanding by quoting Psalm 110:1:
“The LORD said to my Lord, ‘Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet.’”
Then He asks,
“If then David calls him ‘Lord,’ how can he be his son?”

By quoting Psalm 110:1, Jesus reveals that the Messiah is more than just a human descendant of David.

In the psalm, David refers to the Messiah as "my Lord" (Adoni), implying the Messiah is greater than David and has divine authority.


++++ The Pharisees’ Silence:
The Pharisees are unable to answer, and from that point, they stop questioning Him.

Jesus connects the psalm's imagery of sitting at God’s right hand to His own role as the exalted, divine Messiah.

This challenges the Pharisees’ limited, earthly view of the Messiah and points to Jesus’ dual nature as both human (a descendant of David) and divine (Lord over David).

gohf:
Please this is also you that wrote this
"+++ Action of Sitting:

Both agree on the command to "sit at My right hand," representing honor, authority, and exaltation."

Yes I wrote it. What about it?

LordReed:
Experienced what?

A global flood.

How is "what makes one an expert" a question relevant to this discussion?

Maybe i can find one for you that attests to a global flood, since you seem to want an expert.