₦airaland Forum

Sterope:
➜You want me to trust your opinion based on your limited knowledge. I am a Muslim. I would rather trust God.

Why should I want or need you to trust my opinion? I don't get it! By the way, I have yet to state an opinion on this so far. So?

Circular argument

He is a creator. Ever living, ever lasting. Which defeats your question he can't be created. No begining and no end.

He says there is life after death. Your consciousness remains but not in your body and I abide by that.

Kobojunkie:
At what point was this higher consciousness born and what is the evidence of its birth? What is the benefit of this higher consciousness? And by the way, isn't this what speculating is all about?

Sterope:
➜Circular argument
➜ He is a creator. Ever living, ever lasting. Which defeats your question he can't be created. No begining and no end. He says there is life after death. Your consciousness remains but not in your body and I abide by that.

I am afraid you lost me there. Wetin concern "circular argument" with any of the questions wey I ask abeg?

2. Wait a second... a moment ago, we were discussing what happens when we die. But now I see you have seguewayed into talking about what some deity thinks or says of death. Why? Also, there are over 4000 different deities out there each with their unique ideas regarding death, so what makes you think your deities idea should be introduced in the case when death is common to us all but your deity isn't?

So, earlier when you mentioned some higher consciousness, you were not referring to the human consciousness acquiring a higher status but of a completely different and non-human consciousness which you considered of higher status?

Which was why I stated earlier on- I am a Muslim and my judgement comes from the Qur'an.

You are not dead. You can't say 100% there is no life beyond this life. You can't also create life. So he's, I am discounting whatever opinion you or him has about life or death. Objectively, you are wrong. You don't know.

I could be wrong too because I don't know either but it would be foolish to outrightly says there isn't life after death. There is so much we don't know. We have very limited knowledge about the world.

With our limited knowledge it is wiser to consider the higher consciousness (God). My God says there is life after death so yes there is. I don't care what other diety says.

Kobojunkie:
I am afraid you lost me there. Wetin concern "circular argument" with any of the questions wey I ask abeg?

2. Wait a second... a moment ago, we were discussing what happens when we die. But now I see you have seguewayed into talking about what some deity thinks or says of death. Why? Also, there are over 4000 different deities out there each with their unique ideas regarding death, so what makes you think your deities idea should be introduced in the case when death is common to us all but your deity isn't?

So, earlier when you mentioned some higher consciousness, you were not referring to the human consciousness acquiring a higher status but of a completely different and non-human consciousness which you considered of higher status?

Sterope:
➜Which was why I stated earlier on- I am a Muslim and my judgement comes from the Qur'an.
➜You are not dead. You can't say 100% there is no life beyond this life. You can't also create life. So he's, I am discounting whatever opinion you or him has about life or death. Objectively, you are wrong. You don't know.
➜I could be wrong too because I don't know either but it would be foolish to outrightly says there isn't life after death. There is so much we don't know. We have very limited knowledge about the world.
➜With our limited knowledge it is wiser to consider the higher consciousness (God).
➜My God says there is life after death so yes there is. I don't care what other diety says.

1. But the sayings of your Allah don't apply to me and those who don't believe his version of things, right? Again, there are over 4000 different deities, all of them with different ideas regarding the place of death. Yes, you are free to believe the stories told you by your Allah but without proof, it is all speculation, right?

2. But I don't need to first die before I know the facts I had previously stated regarding death, right?

3. So, you admit that your belief is mere speculation?

4. How could that be wiser if we have no way of proving its higher consciousness or evidence that claims attributed to him hold water?

5. Recall this is the same deity whose claims you admitted earlier you have no proof of. Sure, you don't need to and may not care what other deities say but since you have no evidence or fact as far as claims attributed to your God — all you have are speculations — shouldn't you at least let the speculation be just that, speculations?

Who says it applies?

However you don't have enough knowledge to outrightly dismiss life after death? Or anything about the creation. You know nothing.

The complexities of life itself is proof of God.

Kobojunkie:
1. But the sayings of your Allah don't apply to me and those who don't believe his version of things, right? Again, there are over 4000 different deities, all of them with different ideas regarding the place of death. Yes, you are free to believe the stories told you by your Allah but without proof, it is all speculation, right?

2. But I don't need to first die before I know the facts I had previously stated regarding death, right?

3. So, you admit that your belief is mere speculation?

4. How could that be wiser if we have no way of proving its higher consciousness or evidence that claims attributed to him hold water?

5. Recall this is the same deity whose claims you admitted earlier you have no proof of. So?

Sterope:
➜Who says it applies? However you don't have enough knowledge to outrightly dismiss life after death? Or anything about the creation. You know nothing.
➜The complexities of life itself is proof of God.

According to you, it is speculation, is it not?

2. Be that as it may, the fact is there are over 4000 different deities reported. So, which of the 4000 is the one for whom these complexities serve as proof of? Or maybe he is not even among the 4000 known.

Even kids are born with the natural disposition to belief in God.

You look at the world and you don't wonder and admire its intricacies..Lol.

Kobojunkie:
According to you, it is speculation, is it not?

Sterope:
➜Even kids are born with the natural disposition to belief in God. You look at the world and you don't wonder and admire its intricacies..Lol.

You are missing the point. This is not about whether one believes in a deity or not but whether the claims attributed to the particular deity surrounding the issue of death are factual or not.

You are missing the connection
1. We lack sufficient knowledge to make any definitive argument against life after death.

2. The world operates with such an unbelievably precision from the laws of physics to the fine-tuning of the solar system. The idea that all of this happened without any intelligent cause is improbable. It is reasonable to consider there is something else out there science do not yet.

3. Modern research have suggested that humans naturally believe in a higher power from childhood. It is called Fitra in Islam, the belief that we are all born with that natural disposition. This points to something deeper within our nature.

4. Lack of physical evidence does not negate the belief in the higher power. Unless you are claiming that science sees and knows all. We live in a world people have dreams/intuition that transcends time and actual knowledge. Science is yet to provide an answer for that. You cannot study consciousness does not mean it doesn't exist.

5. My perspective is influenced by my faith, but it does not make it irrational. Belief in the unseen is not unique to my religion, it also exists in scientific theory

Kobojunkie:
You are missing the point. This is not about whether one believes in a deity or not but whether the claims attributed to the particular deity surrounding the issue of death are factual or not.

Dtruthspeaker:
Yet, the nearer you are to the death, the more your fear for death increases.

It clearly means that you are aware and conscious of what is going to happen to you after you enter death exactly how you were conscious that you are enter in death.

People in Coma, paralysis and Alzheimers show you that brain activity has little business with living.

Is a person who is near to death, dead?

Dtruthspeaker:
Everybody knows that is why they are 99% are afraid of death and a 1% are happy when it arrives.

So what happens at death? Tell us.

Dtruthspeaker:
We did not create water and yet we foresensed how swimming will be.

Same thing for fire. We also foresensed how burning will be and that is why evil people must be afraid of hellfire.

So what burns in hell fire?

sonmvayina:
Learn the Torah...
That is the only guide for us to make good and rewarding judgement...

Where does the Torah mention marduk

Sterope:
Circular argument

He is a creator. Ever living, ever lasting. Which defeats your question he can't be created. No begining and no end.

He says there is life after death. Your consciousness remains but not in your body and I abide by that.

In what form does consciousness remain after death?

In whatever it was before the body was created.

In Islam, body decayed or gone but the consciousness (soul) remains aware. The Qur'an says there is unseen barrier until the day of rising.

In what exact form, gas, energy, etc? Only God knows!

People feel the death of a loved one before hearing of it. Which suggest we consciousness isn't just physical.

Truthseeker10:
In what form does consciousness remain after death?

Sterope:
In whatever it was before the body was created.

In Islam, body decayed or gone but the consciousness (soul) remains aware. The Qur'an says there is unseen barrier until the day of rising.

In what exact form, gas, energy, etc? Only God knows!

People feel the death of a loved one before hearing of it. Which suggest we consciousness isn't just physical.

So where does the consciousness go after death?

Sterope:
✓ You are missing the connection
1. We lack sufficient knowledge to make any definitive argument against life after death.
2. The world operates with such an unbelievably precision from the laws of physics to the fine-tuning of the solar system. The idea that all of this happened without any intelligent cause is improbable. It is reasonable to consider there is something else out there science do not yet.
3. Modern research have suggested that humans naturally believe in a higher power from childhood. It is called Fitra in Islam, the belief that we are all born with that natural disposition. This points to something deeper within our nature.
4. Lack of physical evidence does not negate the belief in the higher power. Unless you are claiming that science sees and knows all. We live in a world people have dreams/intuition that transcends time and actual knowledge. Science is yet to provide an answer for that. You cannot study consciousness does not mean it doesn't exist.
5. My perspective is influenced by my faith, but it does not make it irrational. Belief in the unseen is not unique to my religion, it also exists in scientific theory

Again, you admitted earlier that this is all speculation and hence also not factual claims regarding belief and after life, yes? 🤔

Now, of course, I am against folks making definitive statements regarding that which is unknown, regardless of which side they are on.

What speculation?

That The existence of life itself dictates there is something higher.

Unfortunately for you, many religions across the universe do believe in the existence of consciousness after death. What happens to that consciousness is mainly the bone of contention.

I am against folks making definitive statements that dismisses the complexities of this world and folks who haven't experienced death before.

Kobojunkie:
Again, you admitted earlier that this is all speculation and hence also not factual claims regarding belief and after life, yes? 🤔

Now, of course, I am against folks making definitive statements regarding that which is unknown, regardless of which side they are on.

Sterope:
➜What speculation? That The existence of life itself dictates there is something higher. Unfortunately for you, many religions across the universe do believe in the existence of consciousness after death.
➜What happens to that consciousness is mainly the bone of contention.
➜I am against folks making definitive statements that dismisses the complexities of this world and folks who haven't experienced death before.

Why is it unfortunate for me that billions of people are hooked on what is possibly a delusion?

2. Well, it could simply mean that the consciously simply dies in much the same way the body does at the end of life. Millions believing otherwise would not change this if it were to turn out the fact.

3. Dismisses complexity or dismisses the possibility of the particular delusion you cling to.

Steep:
If life is a product of random mindless atoms bumping on each other, then life ultimately has no meaning, good and evil are just figment of imagination, heck what does imagination even mean. Rape, murder, stealing etc are matter of taste, love is just a product of chemical reaction, why punish a set of atoms for crimes. The atheistic world view ultimate lead to despair, chaos and nihilism, atheists cannot successfully live out their world view.

More often than not, it's the people least acquainted with the freedom and/or pleasure of creating their own meaning and purpose, that are obsessed with the concept of "meaninglessness". If you're incapable of ethical behavior, without being nudged and coerced by divine threats, then you probably need to sit down, and re-examine your own moral compass, lmao.

TheDevilsBride:
More often than not, it's the people least acquainted with the freedom and/or pleasure of creating their own meaning and purpose, that are obsessed with the concept of "meaninglessness". If you're incapable of ethical behavior, without being nudged and coerced by divine threats, then you probably need to sit down, and re-examine your own moral compass, lmao.

what do you even mean by being moral? Because if we are just a bunch of atoms being moral means absolutely nothing. What freedom? In your world view free will does not exist. Pleasure is nothing more than a chemical release which can be synthesis in the lab. Why are you obsessed? I am only describing your world view. Morality does exist in the athsietc world view, it's all Bunch of atoms competing for meaningless existence.

TheDevilsBride:
More often than not, it's the people least acquainted with the freedom and/or pleasure of creating their own meaning and purpose, that are obsessed with the concept of "meaninglessness". If you're incapable of ethical behavior, without being nudged and coerced by divine threats, then you probably need to sit down, and re-examine your own moral compass, lmao.

What exactly is morality?

Truthseeker10:
What exactly is morality?

what do you think it is? 😊

gohf:
what do you think it is? 😊

Explain

Truthseeker10:
Explain

you think morality is explain?

gohf:
you think morality is explain?

Explain what morality is

Truthseeker10:
Explain what morality is

don't you know what morality is?

gohf:
don't you know what morality is?

No...explain.

Truthseeker10:
No...explain.

don't you have Google or a dictionary?

gohf:
don't you have Google or a dictionary?

Ok thank you

Uwa bu ulo akwukwo - Life is a school system. You are only here cos you keep failing in all your incarnations. You are here cos you failed in your past life. You are here to correct the mistakes of your past life. As you fail you become "Born Again", Reborn to continue your lesson untill you pass. When you pass then you qualify to ascend into the higher realm churchians call Heaven. In heaven you are taught and schooled about many things. You become and elder and ancend to earth anytime you are sent here to correct many who are lost in this ignorant religious system. You become an ascended master when you return here. Mind when you exceed the numbers of time given to pass and still failed, you aren't coming back again. Such ppl when they become angry for not giving another chance they become evil - the evil and wicked spirits you know

The Churchians are highly ignorant on this issue. They think heaven is a place that anyone who believes in what they don't know will go to. The Christ who is an ascended great master even taught them that heaven is on earth. Only a Few ppl who passed their lessons here are privileged to enter. To enter you must ascend with a glorious body - you will be taken up like Christ, Elijah and Enoch. They ascended bodily. This is what the Churchians ignorantly call rapture. They claim you will go to heaven if you die lol. The true God is a God of the living not dead. The dead can't see him. The dead go to their various realms until the season of their incarnations. To support this with the bible, if you read somewhere in Revelation 9 you will see where some righteous dead ppl were asking God to avenge them of those who killed them on earth. This is tells you that they are not in heaven and after they have been restored they will return to earth.
Dead ppl remain on their realms good or bad not heaven.
If you pass your exams here you will ascend like Christ and others. Death can't hold you again. You become a master who comes and go. Religion is full of many errors and can't help one on their mission on earth. This is why you need to know the true God yourself. Their is a spirit, a God within you that can teach everything you seek cos all you have in religions are full of errors