₦airaland Forum

Lukuluku69:
Because He Wills it!

What is more is that God now allows for a TURNING/REPENTANCE for Man even when Man stumbles .

That's what it means to be born anew. In Islam it is called TAUBAH. TURNING to Allah in sincere Repentance

So it is the will of God that evil should enter the world and cause suffering and death to humans?

Truthseeker10:
So again I ask you, is God responsible for all the sufferings in the world today? Yes or no?

God is not responsible.

No.

Lukuluku69:
God is not responsible.

No.

But you just told me that it is the will of God for evil to enter the world.

Did the first man have a choice not to commit evil?

Truthseeker10:
So it is the will of God that evil should enter the world and cause suffering and death to humans?

Lol

Death and Suffering are simply The Nature of the present order of things.


Man is a mortal being.

He is to Toil here which you refer to as suffering.


I will have to excuse myself now. I will be back though. I want to enjoy the sun outside.

Truthseeker10:
But you just told me that it is the will of God for evil to enter the world.

Did the first man have a choice not to commit evil?

Of course The first man was warned not to approach The Tree Of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He disobeyed.

Lukuluku69:
Lol

Death and Suffering are simply The Nature of the present order of things.


Man is a mortal being.

He is to Toil here which you refer to as suffering.


I will have to excuse myself now. I will be back though. I want to enjoy the sun outside.

😂😂😂death and suffering are the nature of the present order of things set by your God but when they occur you feel bad and blame other humans for it?
You are funny oo.

Lukuluku69:
Of course The first man was warned not to approach The Tree Of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He disobeyed.

How was he to obey when God had destined for him to disobey even before he was created?

Truthseeker10:
😂😂😂death and suffering are the nature of the present order of things set by your God but when they occur you feel bad and blame other humans for it?
You are funny oo.

It is human nature to grieve. That's why in Islam we have this refrain from God we came to Him we return.

I will blame you if you steal from me but we say from God we came when a thunderstorm take something away from me.

Truthseeker10:
How was he to obey when God had destined for him to disobey even before he was created?

He was not destined to disobey. The Free Will God granted him made him disobey.

Lukuluku69:
He was not destined to disobey. The Free Will God granted him made him disobey.

So are you saying that God did not see Adam disobey even before he Created Adam?

Lukuluku69:
It is human nature to grieve. That's why in Islam we have this refrain from God we came to Him we return.

I will blame you if you steal from me but we say from God we came when a thunderstorm take something away from me.

So God created you to suffer and die and also made you to grief?

ALISMILE:
With all due respect to you, you are making claims about things you know nothing about

ALISMILE:
Islam is spreading because it’s the only logical religion that provides logical answers to every question, and also because it is the only religion that is able to withstand any objective scrutiny by all the standards

Since you were a former Christian, I ask you to show me what you consider about the Christian Faith illogical or irrational and I will do my best to answer you.


You may ask me any question and I will oblige you sir.


I am waiting!

TenQ:
Since you were a former Christian, I ask you to show me what you consider about the Christian Faith illogical or irrational and I will do my best to answer you.


You may ask me any question and I will oblige you sir.


I am waiting!

I can’t remember you asking this
Now that you have asked, the foremost most illogical of Christianity is the idea of Jesus being God

I do not know for certain which idealogical sect of Christianity you belong, some don’t believe Jesus is God

Another very illogical concept is the trinity: a concept not found in the Bible, even the term is not in Bible. How can 3 ever be one?

Let’s start with this, but I have more

ALISMILE:
I can’t remember you asking this
Now that you have asked, the foremost most illogical of Christianity is the idea of Jesus being God

I do not know for certain which idealogical sect of Christianity you belong, some don’t believe Jesus is God

Another very illogical concept is the trinity: a concept not found in the Bible, even the term is not in Bible. How can 3 ever be one?

Let’s start with this, but I have more

Any Christian who doesn't accept the FULL teachings of the Bible is NOT one.

Your TWO questions is essentially just ONE Question: and it is the misunderstanding of TRINITY by Muslims.
Lets clear some things before I answer your questions
1. The God of the Jews and Christians is ONE
God is ONE Being!


2. The God of the Jews and Christians can and ALSO does enter into His creation without ceasing to be Almighty.
The LORD fellowships with Adam and Eve in the Garden: Genesis 3:8
"And they heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day..."
God appears to Abraham as one of three men: Genesis 18:1-33
The LORD appears to Abraham as one of three men. Abraham serves them food, and one of them (identified as the LORD) announces the birth of Isaac.
God Wrestling with Jacob Genesis 32:24-30
Jacob wrestles with a man until dawn, and afterward, he realizes he has seen God face-to-face.
God Appearing to Moses in the Burning Bush Exodus 3:1-6
God speaks to Moses from a burning bush that is not consumed.
God on Mount Sinai Exodus 19:18-20
The LORD descends on Mount Sinai in fire, with smoke, thunder, and a loud trumpet blast.
God Leading Israel in a Cloud and Fire Exodus 13:21-22
God leads Israel as a pillar of cloud by day and fire by night.
God Appearing as the personage called The Angel of the Lord
Appearing to Hagar (Genesis 16:7-13)
Speaking from the burning bush (Exodus 3:2)
Appearing to Gideon (Judges 6:11-22)
Appearing to Samson’s parents (Judges 13:3-22)

3. The God of God of the Jews and Christians is a Spirit known as "The Holy Spirit"
What did Jesus teach?
God is SPIRIT (the infinite Spirit) who is EVERYWHERE.
John 4:24:
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

As the Holy Spirit, God is INVISIBLE either on the earth (Physical Realm) or the heavens (Spiritual realm). The Holy Spirit is like AIR (RUACH) whose Presence through His actions can only be felt. In other words, the Holy Spirit is the Omnipresent existence of God.

Thus, the whole of the Universe (Physical and Spiritual) is INSIDE the Spirit of God as God the Holy Spirit is INVISIBLE

Psalm 139:7-10:
"Where can I go from Your Spirit? Or where can I flee from Your presence? If I ascend to heaven, You are there; if I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there. If I take the wings of the dawn, if I dwell in the remotest part of the sea, even there Your hand will lead me, and Your right hand will lay hold of me."
Jeremiah 23:24:
"Can a man hide himself in secret places so that I cannot see him? declares the Lord. Do I not fill heaven and earth? declares the Lord."


Acts 17:28a summarises it by telling us that we all LIVE inside God (as the Holy Spirit).
Act 17:28
"For in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, 'For we are also His offspring.'"

4. The FATHER is the VISIBLE Image of the INVISIBLE God in the Heavenly Realms.
The Father is the ONE the Angels serve on His throne in Heaven
The Father is the VISIBLE image of the invisible God in the Heavens who sits on the throne in heaven to preside over it.


This is why in Genesis 19:24, YHWH on earth could rain down fire from YHWH in heaven.

Genesis 19:24
"Then YHWH (on earth with Abraham) rained on Sodom and on Gomorrah sulfur and fire from YHWH out of the heavens."


5. The WORD aka the SON is the VISIBLE Image of the INVISIBLE God EVERYWHERE

The Word (The Son , Jesus) on Earth is the VISIBLE image of the invisible God, the Messenger of God's presence.

Colossians 1:15:
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation"


This is why in the Throne room of the FATHER in Heaven, you cannot SEE the Holy Spirit. You can only see the Father and the Word (the Lamb, the Son) because ALL EXISTENCE are inside Him



In summary,
The Holy Spirit: Is the Infinite Omnipresence Expression of God in whom ALL THINGS consist within
The Father: Is the Visible Expression of the Invisible God in the Heavenly Realm who presides on His throne in Heaven
The Word aka the Son: Is the Visible Expression of the Invisible God in every other realms of Existence for by Him EVERYTHING visible and Invisible were Created


6. How does Jesus Christ come in as God?
What the Bible teaches is the the WORD became HUMAN known as Jesus Christ!
John 1:14
So the Word became human and made his home among us. He was full of unfailing love and faithfulness. And we have seen his glory, the glory of the Father’s one and only Son.

The Word became Human so that He can pay the price for the consequence of our sins against God.
That is, the SON became the ransom for the punishment of Hell for anyone who will TRUST in His SACRIFICE.


TRINITY is NOT in the Bible
just as
TAOHEED is not in the Quran

The Problem is:
1. Islam doesn't know why it was necessary for Jesus to come
2. Islam does not know why Jesus was unique amongst Humans
a. Why is Jesus the only Human who is a co-creator of Life with Allah?
b. Why Jesus is not dead but taken up to Allah till today?
c. Why was Jesus born from a Virgin?
d. Why is Prophet Isa the only human being who the the Word and Spirit of Allah?
e. What was Allah trying to achieve by deceiving Mary the mother of Jesus, the Apostles and other Disciples of Christ that Jesus was crucified and died on the cross?
2. None of the 99-plus names of the God of Islam is YHWH
3. Islam doesn't even know that a Human being is a Trinity

TenQ:
Any Christian who doesn't accept the FULL teachings of the Bible is NOT one.

Your TWO questions is essentially just ONE Question: and it is the misunderstanding of TRINITY by Muslims.
Lets clear some things before I answer your questions
1. The God of the Jews and Christians is ONE
God is ONE Being!


2. The God of the Jews and Christians can and ALSO does enter into His creation without ceasing to be Almighty.
The LORD fellowships with Adam and Eve in the Garden: Genesis 3:8
"And they heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day..."
God appears to Abraham as one of three men: Genesis 18:1-33
The LORD appears to Abraham as one of three men. Abraham serves them food, and one of them (identified as the LORD) announces the birth of Isaac.
God Wrestling with Jacob Genesis 32:24-30
Jacob wrestles with a man until dawn, and afterward, he realizes he has seen God face-to-face.
God Appearing to Moses in the Burning Bush Exodus 3:1-6
God speaks to Moses from a burning bush that is not consumed.
God on Mount Sinai Exodus 19:18-20
The LORD descends on Mount Sinai in fire, with smoke, thunder, and a loud trumpet blast.
God Leading Israel in a Cloud and Fire Exodus 13:21-22
God leads Israel as a pillar of cloud by day and fire by night.
God Appearing as the personage called The Angel of the Lord
Appearing to Hagar (Genesis 16:7-13)
Speaking from the burning bush (Exodus 3:2)
Appearing to Gideon (Judges 6:11-22)
Appearing to Samson’s parents (Judges 13:3-22)

3. The God of God of the Jews and Christians is a Spirit known as "The Holy Spirit"
What did Jesus teach?
God is SPIRIT (the infinite Spirit) who is EVERYWHERE.
John 4:24:
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

As the Holy Spirit, God is INVISIBLE either on the earth (Physical Realm) or the heavens (Spiritual realm). The Holy Spirit is like AIR (RUACH) whose Presence through His actions can only be felt. In other words, the Holy Spirit is the Omnipresent existence of God.

Thus, the whole of the Universe (Physical and Spiritual) is INSIDE the Spirit of God as God the Holy Spirit is INVISIBLE

Psalm 139:7-10:
"Where can I go from Your Spirit? Or where can I flee from Your presence? If I ascend to heaven, You are there; if I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there. If I take the wings of the dawn, if I dwell in the remotest part of the sea, even there Your hand will lead me, and Your right hand will lay hold of me."
Jeremiah 23:24:
"Can a man hide himself in secret places so that I cannot see him? declares the Lord. Do I not fill heaven and earth? declares the Lord."


Acts 17:28a summarises it by telling us that we all LIVE inside God (as the Holy Spirit).
Act 17:28
"For in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, 'For we are also His offspring.'"

4. The FATHER is the VISIBLE Image of the INVISIBLE God in the Heavenly Realms.
The Father is the ONE the Angels serve on His throne in Heaven
The Father is the VISIBLE image of the invisible God in the Heavens who sits on the throne in heaven to preside over it.


This is why in Genesis 19:24, YHWH on earth could rain down fire from YHWH in heaven.

Genesis 19:24
"Then YHWH (on earth with Abraham) rained on Sodom and on Gomorrah sulfur and fire from YHWH out of the heavens."


5. The WORD aka the SON is the VISIBLE Image of the INVISIBLE God EVERYWHERE

The Word (The Son , Jesus) on Earth is the VISIBLE image of the invisible God, the Messenger of God's presence.

Colossians 1:15:
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation"


This is why in the Throne room of the FATHER in Heaven, you cannot SEE the Holy Spirit. You can only see the Father and the Word (the Lamb, the Son) because ALL EXISTENCE are inside Him



In summary,
The Holy Spirit: Is the Infinite Omnipresence Expression of God in whom ALL THINGS consist within
The Father: Is the Visible Expression of the Invisible God in the Heavenly Realm who presides on His throne in Heaven
The Word aka the Son: Is the Visible Expression of the Invisible God in every other realms of Existence for by Him EVERYTHING visible and Invisible were Created


6. How does Jesus Christ come in as God?
What the Bible teaches is the the WORD became HUMAN known as Jesus Christ!
John 1:14
So the Word became human and made his home among us. He was full of unfailing love and faithfulness. And we have seen his glory, the glory of the Father’s one and only Son.

The Word became Human so that He can pay the price for the consequence of our sins against God.
That is, the SON became the ransom for the punishment of Hell for anyone who will TRUST in His SACRIFICE.




The Problem is:
1. Islam doesn't know why it was necessary for Jesus to come
2. Islam does not know why Jesus was unique amongst Humans
a. Why is Jesus the only Human who is a co-creator of Life with Allah?
b. Why Jesus is not dead but taken up to Allah till today?
c. Why was Jesus born from a Virgin?
d. Why is Prophet Isa the only human being who the the Word and Spirit of Allah?
e. What was Allah trying to achieve by deceiving Mary the mother of Jesus, the Apostles and other Disciples of Christ that Jesus was crucified and died on the cross?
2. None of the 99-plus names of the God of Islam is YHWH
3. Islam doesn't even know that a Human being is a Trinity

Do you agree with the diagram below?

Truthseeker10:
Do you agree with the diagram below?

Perfectly in Agreement

Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

TenQ:
Perfectly in Agreement

Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Truthseeker10:
So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

You have started again without answering any of my questions

How can your SOUL which is YOU be with You if it is YOU?

What happens at death when your SOUL Leaves You BODY
Again: My Questions


Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

TenQ:
You have started again without answering any of my questions

How can your SOUL which is YOU be with You if it is YOU?

What happens at death when your SOUL Leaves You BODY
Again: My Questions


Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

I don't know the answers to the questions that you are asking me. I am here to learn you can teach me.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Truthseeker10:
I don't know the answers to the questions that you are asking me. I am here to learn you can teach me.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Very funny!

You are like a child who doesn't even know how to count to ten asking questions about Integral Calculus!


If you can't get to understanding the Trinity of Man, how would you not be confused and bewildered by the Trinity of God?

So, I am starting at the very basics!



Will you please go back to read up my post you initially reacted to. If you have any questions on it, be my guest!

ALISMILE:
I can’t remember you asking this
Now that you have asked, the foremost most illogical of Christianity is the idea of Jesus being God

I do not know for certain which idealogical sect of Christianity you belong, some don’t believe Jesus is God

Another very illogical concept is the trinity: a concept not found in the Bible, even the term is not in Bible. How can 3 ever be one?

Let’s start with this, but I have more

It's not illogical.
The concept of Trinity is found in the bible Psalm 45:6–7,Psalm 110:1,Isaiah 6:8,Genesis 3:22,Nehemiah 9:30,Isaiah 48:16,Matthew 22:41–45.

Your prophet didn't understand the concept of Trinity thereby making Allah dumb🥲.

The trinity he alludes to include Mary, something only found in a certain heretical sect of Christianity🤔

Your Allah didn't know the difference, he ended up spewing misconceptions about trinity.

Even from the very beginning, God said let us make man in our own image!

If I were to ask you, who was God talking to —even giving you the benefit of a doubt by assuming for this instance that God is Allah.

Will you say he was talking to angels🤨?
Your most pathetic excuse is "majestic plural" which implies another problem for your Allah!

Why then did Allah think "majestic plural" is more glorifying than singular constructs? 🤨

Obviously your best answer will be that Allah knows best, entirely avoiding the discourse!

Now back to the subject matter, In Christianity we believe in the existence of three co-equal and co-eternal persons united in purpose.

TenQ:
Very funny!

You are like a child who doesn't even know how to count to ten asking questions about Integral Calculus!


If you can't get to understanding the Trinity of Man, how would you not be confused and bewildered by the Trinity of God?

So, I am starting at the very basics!



Will you please go back to read up my post you initially reacted to. If you have any questions on it, be my guest!

I have read your initial post and that is why I've asked you the question below.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Truthseeker10:
I have read your initial post and that is why I've asked you the question below.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

And I asked you about something extremely elementary about the Trinity of Man but you don't know the answer.

Then, go back to read or you are beyond redemption!

TenQ:
And I asked you about something extremely elementary about the Trinity of Man but you don't know the answer.

Then, go back to read or you are beyond redemption!

You can teach me about the Trinity of Man.

Kindly answer the question.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Truthseeker10:
You can teach me about the Trinity of Man.

Kindly answer the question.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

I teach with questions sir . From what you know in Islam to what is difficult for you to comprehend.



Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

TenQ:
I teach with questions sir . From what you know in Islam to what is difficult for you to comprehend.



Do you agree that
1. Your BODY is YOU
2. Your SOUL is YOU
3. Your SPIRIT is YOU

Is your BODY the same as your SOUL?
Is your SOUL the same as your SPIRIT?
Is your SPIRIT the same as your BODY?

Explain what the soul is with a Bible verse.

Truthseeker10:
Explain what the soul is with a Bible verse.

Sorry sir!

What is Soul (NAFS) in Islam?

Truthseeker10:
You can teach me about the Trinity of Man.

Kindly answer the question.

So if the Diagram say that God is The Father, The son and the Holy Spirit, How can the Word Who is God be with God according to John 1:1?

Let me chime in a bit but before I do let's set standards and rules for our engagement.

I fancy aristotelian inquisitions, being one of the tools in my arsenal, but it's rather unbecoming the way you use them.

Aristotle would not be proud of this travesty of yours.

If you can guarantee this then we will discuss whatsoever topic that fancies your boat.

Logic, reasoning, along with scriptural basis will be used through out the discourse🤨.
It won't be one side infinitely asking the same question but instead a free flowing exchange!

Let me know when you are ready🙃

TenQ:
Sorry sir!

What is Soul (NAFS) in Islam?

Funny🤭

TenQ:
Sorry sir!

What is Soul (NAFS) in Islam?

I don't know. What is the soul according to the Bible?

Gabrielshow24:
Let me chime in a bit but before I do let's set standards and rules for our engagement.

I fancy aristotelian inquisitions, being one of the tools in my arsenal, but it's rather unbecoming the way you use them.

Aristotle would not be proud of this travesty of yours.

If you can guarantee this then we will discuss whatsoever topic that fancies your boat.

Logic, reasoning, along with scriptural basis will be used through out the discourse🤨.
It won't be one side infinitely asking the same question but instead a free flowing exchange!

Let me know when you are ready🙃

If you know the answer, let me have it.
If you ask me a question I don't know, I will tell you I don't know.

Truthseeker10:
If you know the answer, let me have it.
If you ask me a question I don't know, I will tell you I don't know.

We have been down this road before,
We both know how it ends.

Your hypocritical self abuses rules of discourse.

That's why we must settle it beforehand!!!
I want to see how long you will be able to last without your facades 🤨!!!