₦airaland Forum

TenQ:
I am sure you know that this isn't prayers: it is a report of what actually happened with Jesus and His Disciples as narrated by Allah himself.

1. Are you trying to explain away EXACTLY what Allah said for something you want him to have said!?
2. Is Allah not better in speech that anyone in existence: if he is, why can't we trust that Allah mean exactly what he said?

If we go EXACTLY with what Allah said,


Let me break it down according to the Qur'an
1. The disciples of Jesus are no prophets
2. Allah did not even speak directly to Mohammed
3. The disciples asked Jesus for food from Allah
4. Jesus spoke to Allah about this request
5. Allah spoke directly to the Disciples





I want to believe that Allah speaks clearly and is perfect in grammar! I hope that I am correct with this assumption!


Unless you show otherwise, Allah was indeed speaking DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus: BUT they are not prophets
So, my Question:
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus when they are not prophets?

Mr man this is not a valid argument neither is it sensible. Even a child knows by reading the simple verse that Allah didn’t speak to the disciples directly.

Also Allah is aware of the request in the first place even before Jesus asked him for it. And why is it such a big deal that Allah answered the disciples through Jesus. Or what exactly are you getting at.

If someone sends your brother to you for a favour and your bother says “Brother, our neighbor wants to borrow charger” and you replied “I dont borrow charger anyhow but i will borrow them this time but if they spoil I will visit them”

Did you go to your neighbor’s house yourself to deliver the response?

Didn’t you still communicate with your neighbor through your brother?


Typing is a tedious task my brother especially pointless typing

tunnyl:
Mr man this is not a valid argument neither is it sensible. Even a child knows by reading the simple verse that Allah didn’t speak to the disciples directly.

Also Allah is aware of the request in the first place even before Jesus asked him for it. And why is it such a big deal that Allah answered the disciples through Jesus. Or what exactly are you getting at.

If someone sends your brother to you for a favour and your bother says “Brother, our neighbor wants to borrow charger” and you replied “I dont borrow charger anyhow but i will borrow them this time but if they spoil I will visit them”

Did you go to your neighbor’s house yourself to deliver the response?

Didn’t you still communicate with your neighbor through your brother?


Typing is a tedious task my brother especially pointless typing

Notice how you used the word them in your example because the instructions doesn't belong to my Brother but to the Neighbour.



So, looking strictly to what Allah said exactly:
Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to you, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among you—then indeed I will punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Who is the first YOU in the verse?
Who is the Second YOU in the verse?
Who is the HIM in the verse?

The answers will tell us who Allah was speaking to: do you agree with this?



Unless you show otherwise, Allah was speaking to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus:
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus?

In Surah al-Maidah (5:115), Allah speaks to the disciples of Isa (Jesus) through him as they ask for a heavenly table (maidah), delivering a profound message that combines both mercy and a serious warning about disbelief following a miracle.

Allah’s response is twofold: Mercy and Warning.

“I will send it down to you...”

This reflects Allah’s mercy and His acceptance of their prayer.

“...but whoever disbelieves thereafter...”

Here lies a stern warning: anyone who disbelieves after witnessing this miracle will face severe consequences.

This is because witnessing a divine miracle comes with immense responsibility.

To turn away after such a sign is not just ignorance; it’s a deliberate and arrogant rejection.

honesttalk21:
In Surah al-Maidah (5:115), Allah speaks to the disciples of Isa (Jesus) through him as they ask for a heavenly table (maidah), delivering a profound message that combines both mercy and a serious warning about disbelief following a miracle.

Allah’s response is twofold: Mercy and Warning.

“I will send it down to you...”

This reflects Allah’s mercy and His acceptance of their prayer.

“...but whoever disbelieves thereafter...”

Here lies a stern warning: anyone who disbelieves after witnessing this miracle will face severe consequences.

This is because witnessing a divine miracle comes with immense responsibility.

To turn away after such a sign is not just ignorance; it’s a deliberate and arrogant rejection.

It is very convenient for you to explain away the LITERAL words of your Allah for your own INTERPOLATIONS.

This is why you cannot answer direct questions based on the verse.


So, looking strictly to what Allah said exactly:
Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among YOU —then indeed I will punish HIM with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Who is the first YOU in the verse?
Who is the Second YOU in the verse?
Who is the HIM in the verse?

The answers will tell us who Allah was speaking to: do you agree with this?



Unless you show otherwise, Allah was speaking to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus:
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus?

TenQ:
It is very convenient for you to explain away the LITERAL words of your Allah for your own INTERPOLATIONS.

This is why you cannot answer direct questions based on the verse.


So, looking strictly to what Allah said exactly:
Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among YOU —then indeed I will punish HIM with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Who is the first YOU in the verse?
Who is the Second YOU in the verse?
Who is the HIM in the verse?

The answers will tell us who Allah was speaking to: do you agree with this?



Unless you show otherwise, Allah was speaking to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus:
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus?

In your mind you think this is a smart argument that you have confused and cornered those muslims but I am telling you point blank that this argument is very childish and makes no sense at all because this is pure english. Don’t you understand english?

Common english!


Who is YOU
What is HIM

Common english you are trying to complicate something simple. Which one is God spoke to the disciples. Does it make sense? And whats the big deal if God spoke directly to the disciples.

Mr man rest abeg!

TenQ:
It is very convenient for you to explain away the LITERAL words of your Allah for your own INTERPOLATIONS.

This is why you cannot answer direct questions based on the verse.


So, looking strictly to what Allah said exactly:
Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among YOU —then indeed I will punish HIM with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Who is the first YOU in the verse?
Who is the Second YOU in the verse?
Who is the HIM in the verse?

The answers will tell us who Allah was speaking to: do you agree with this?



Unless you show otherwise, Allah was speaking to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus:
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus?

honesttalk21:
In Surah al-Maidah (5:115), Allah speaks to the disciples of Isa (Jesus) through him as they ask for a heavenly table (maidah), delivering a profound message that combines both mercy and a serious warning about disbelief following a miracle.

Allah’s response is twofold: Mercy and Warning.

“I will send it down to you...”

This reflects Allah’s mercy and His acceptance of their prayer.

“...but whoever disbelieves thereafter...”

Here lies a stern warning: anyone who disbelieves after witnessing this miracle will face severe consequences.

This is because witnessing a divine miracle comes with immense responsibility.

To turn away after such a sign is not just ignorance; it’s a deliberate and arrogant rejection.

Remember they had asked him in Quran 5:112 O `Isa, son of Maryam! Can your Lord send down to us a Ma'idah from heaven?

They further said they wanted to eat from it and be reassured that he (Jesus) had been truthful to them.

Indeed you know the reliance of Jews on miracles as a means to deepen spiritual purpose and affirm a prophet’s mission and message.

عَلَيْكُمْ (upon you) is plural.
It refers to Jesus and his disciples together, but more immediately the disciples, since they were the ones requesting the miracle.

The threat of punishment is not to Jesus, but to anyone among the disciples or their people who disbelieves after witnessing the miracle.

Elijah called fire down from heaven to prove the Lord is God, yet the nation of Israel continued to waver in unbelief.

1 Kings 18:21 (ESV):
"And Elijah came near to all the people and said, 'How long will you go limping between two different opinions? If the Lord is God, follow him; but if Baal, then follow him.' And the people did not answer him a word."

John 12:37 (NIV):
"Even after Jesus had performed so many signs in their presence, they still would not believe in him."

Acts 7:51–52 (ESV):
"You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute?"

honesttalk21:
Remember they had asked him in Quran 5:112 O `Isa, son of Maryam! Can your Lord send down to us a Ma'idah from heaven?

They further said they wanted to eat from it and be reassured that he (Jesus) had been truthful to them.

Indeed you know the reliance of Jews on miracles as a means to deepen spiritual purpose and affirm a prophet’s mission and message.

Someone already lectured him thoroughly yet he remained stubborn

tunnyl:
Someone already lectured him thoroughly yet he remained stubborn

He knows and is deliberately taunting in my own opinion.

tunnyl:
In your mind you think this is a smart argument that you have confused and cornered those muslims but I am telling you point blank that this argument is very childish and makes no sense at all because this is pure english. Don’t you understand english?

Common english!


Who is YOU
What is HIM

Common english you are trying to complicate something simple. Which one is God spoke to the disciples. Does it make sense? And whats the big deal if God spoke directly to the disciples.

Mr man rest abeg!

I did not ask who is YOU
Neither did I ask what is HIM

I said:
Who is the first YOU in the verse?
Who is the Second YOU in the verse?
Who is the HIM in the verse?


The question is easy for anyone who intend to speak the Truth.





BTW:
Why do Muslims find the truth so difficult and inconvenient to speak?

honesttalk21:
Remember they had asked him in Quran 5:112 O `Isa, son of Maryam! Can your Lord send down to us a Ma'idah from heaven?

They further said they wanted to eat from it and be reassured that he (Jesus) had been truthful to them.

Indeed you know the reliance of Jews on miracles as a means to deepen spiritual purpose and affirm a prophet’s mission and message.

عَلَيْكُمْ (upon you) is plural.
It refers to Jesus and his disciples together, but more immediately the disciples, since they were the ones requesting the miracle.

The threat of punishment is not to Jesus, but to anyone among the disciples or their people who disbelieves after witnessing the miracle.

Elijah called fire down from heaven to prove the Lord is God, yet the nation of Israel continued to waver in unbelief.

1 Kings 18:21 (ESV):
"And Elijah came near to all the people and said, 'How long will you go limping between two different opinions? If the Lord is God, follow him; but if Baal, then follow him.' And the people did not answer him a word."

John 12:37 (NIV):
"Even after Jesus had performed so many signs in their presence, they still would not believe in him."

Acts 7:51–52 (ESV):
"You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute?"

Are you saying clearly that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to BOTH the Disciples?

Let me see if I understand you?

In the verse was
1. A first YOU : Allah's speech probably to both Jesus and His Disciples
2. A second YOU : Allah's speech strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus
3. A HIM : Allah's speech also strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus

Is this above correct?

tunnyl:
Someone already lectured him thoroughly yet he remained stubborn

I didn't ask for the summary of the story as it is clearly stated by Allah.

My question was simple and is only one.


Looking strictly to what Allah said:
Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among YOU —then indeed I will punish HIM with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Allah was obviously speaking DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus



My Question was simply:
How did Allah speak DIRECTLY to the disciples of Jesus knowing that they were not prophets?



This was my question as I understand the storyline by Allah!

TenQ:
Are you saying clearly that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to BOTH the Disciples?

Let me see if I understand you?

In the verse was
1. A first YOU : Allah's speech probably to both Jesus and His Disciples
2. A second YOU : Allah's speech strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus
3. A HIM : Allah's speech also strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus

Is this above correct?

You probably should look at the variations in terms translated to mean you.

The term ʿalaykum (you) usually indicates a collective address, meaning it refers to everyone present or being spoken to. In the context of this verse about the miracle, it likely includes all those who witnessed the event, like the disciples and possibly Jesus himself.

Following this the term minkum (you) adds a more selective touch. It means "from among you" or "some of you." Here, it implies that the message or outcome is directed at a specific group within the larger audience.

Allah’s punishment is not collective for the entire group,but is targeted at any one individual within the group or larger audience who disbelieves. This is why you now have him.

PS don't forget that Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus

honesttalk21:
You probably should look at the variations in terms translated to mean you.

The term ʿalaykum (you) usually indicates a collective address, meaning it refers to everyone present or being spoken to. In the context of this verse about the miracle, it likely includes all those who witnessed the event, like the disciples and possibly Jesus himself.

Following this the term minkum (you) adds a more selective touch. It means "from among you" or "some of you." Here, it implies that the message or outcome is directed at a specific group within the larger audience.

Allah’s punishment is not collective for the entire group,but is targeted at any one individual within the group or larger audience who disbelieves. This is why you now have him.

PS don't forget that Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus

You started with the truth BUT concluded it with a LIE. Let me reiterate the Truth of what you said which had been consistent with what I said.

1. The first YOU is COLLECTIVE indicating that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to Jesus AND His Disciples
2. The second YOU is EXCLUSIVE indicating that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to only the Disciples of Jesus ALONE.

The LIE you concluded with: that Jesus was speaking THROUGH Jesus to His Disciples.

If Allah was speaking to the Disciples through Jesus, Allah would have said:

Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to THEM, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among THEM—then indeed I will punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

OR

Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among THEM—then indeed I will punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Either of these two versions above will indicate that Allah was speaking to the Disciples THROUGH Jesus
I want to believe that Allah speaks clearly and is perfect in grammar!


Unless you show otherwise, Allah was indeed speaking DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus: BUT they are not prophets
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus when they are not prophets?

TenQ:
Are you saying clearly that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to BOTH the Disciples?

Let me see if I understand you?

In the verse was
1. A first YOU : Allah's speech probably to both Jesus and His Disciples
2. A second YOU : Allah's speech strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus
3. A HIM : Allah's speech also strictly DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus

Is this above correct?

Bros go and buy Brighter Grammar or essential English textbook abeg.

tunnyl:
Bros go and buy Brighter Grammar or essential English textbook abeg.

Can you see your life outside!?


Islam cannot withstand scrutiny: Why?
The Lies keep getting EXPOSED!

Unfortunately, the mantra of Muslims seem to be:
Don't confuse me with the TRUTH because I have already up my mind.

This is the stance that lead people to Hell Fire!
A person willfully holding on to a LIE they honestly wish to be True!

If the Disciples of Jesus were not Prophets, how did Allah speak DIRECTLY to them?

TenQ:
You started with the truth BUT concluded it with a LIE. Let me reiterate the Truth of what you said which had been consistent with what I said.

1. The first YOU is COLLECTIVE indicating that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to Jesus AND His Disciples
2. The second YOU is EXCLUSIVE indicating that Allah was speaking DIRECTLY to only the Disciples of Jesus ALONE.

The LIE you concluded with: that Jesus was speaking THROUGH Jesus to His Disciples.

If Allah was speaking to the Disciples through Jesus, Allah would have said:

Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to THEM, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among THEM—then indeed I will punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

OR

Qur'an 5:115
Allah said, "Indeed, I will send it down to YOU, but whoever disbelieves afterwards from among THEM—then indeed I will punish him with a punishment by which I have not punished anyone among the worlds."

Either of these two versions above will indicate that Allah was speaking to the Disciples THROUGH Jesus
I want to believe that Allah speaks clearly and is perfect in grammar!


Unless you show otherwise, Allah was indeed speaking DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus and Jesus: BUT they are not prophets
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus when they are not prophets?

Ouch so you gave out your mischievous intent. The arabic terms translated to you are illustrated and the other for him shown but you wish to equate Jesus to ? May this be forbidden.

Your following preferred translation is captured in the explanations regarding alaykum and minkum of Arabic translated to you. Oops you didn't slow down.

Why didn't the disciples ask Allah by themselves if they communicated with Allah directly?


Remember I have told you what you often try to do before? Never truthful in your statements.

honesttalk21:
Ouch so you gave out your mischievous intent. The arabic terms translated to you are illustrated and the other for him shown but you wish to equate Jesus to ? May this be forbidden.

Your following preferred translation is captured in the explanations regarding alaykum and minkum of Arabic translated to you. Oops you didn't slow down.

Why didn't the disciples ask Allah by themselves if they communicated with Allah directly?


Remember I have told you what you often try to do before? Never truthful in your statements.

Since you disagree with the two "would have being" translations of the Quran, we are left with just one option.

Against your preferred re-interpretation of the Quran, Allah spoke DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus!

Thus, you should answer the question
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus when they are not prophets?


See how you cannot answer a direct question because of preferred lies!?

TenQ:
Since you disagree with the two "would have being" translations of the Quran, we are left with just one option.

Against your preferred re-interpretation of the Quran, Allah spoke DIRECTLY to the Disciples of Jesus!

Thus, you should answer the question
How did Allah speak to the disciples of Jesus when they are not prophets?


See how you cannot answer a direct question because of preferred lies!?

Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus or isn't that clear?

Busted your attempt to make Jesus equal to Allah. May Allah be praised above any and everything

honesttalk21:
Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus or isn't that clear?

Busted your attempt to make Jesus equal to Allah. May Allah be praised above any and everything

So, you needed to rewrite the direct words of Allah just because you needed to affirm the lies of your scholars!

Muslims do NOT believe in their Allah: is an understatement!
Muslims calling White as Black is the nature of their spirit: LIES!

May you be delivered from your self deception!

On the day you choose the TRUTH, you will receive Freedom from satanic deception. Unfortunately, desiring this Truth must come from you first!

John 8:32
Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

honesttalk21:
Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus or isn't that clear?

Busted your attempt to make Jesus equal to Allah. May Allah be praised above any and everything

Oh now I i understand the game he was playing. Mtcheeew.

TenQ:
So, you needed to rewrite the direct words of Allah just because you needed to affirm the lies of your scholars!

Muslims do NOT believe in their Allah: is an understatement!
Muslims calling White as Black is the nature of their spirit: LIES!

May you be delivered from your self deception!

On the day you choose the TRUTH, you will receive Freedom from satanic deception. Unfortunately, desiring this Truth must come from you first!

John 8:32
Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

What is rewritten please? The Arabic?

Please show which Arabic is wrongly translated?

For someone that sneakily tried to slip Jesus spoke through Jesus into your interpretation.

Your book's verses perfectly apply to you. Please change for your own good.


John 12:37 (NIV):
Even after Jesus had performed so many signs in their presence, they still would not believe in him.

Acts 7:51–52 (ESV):
"You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute?"

Mr honesttalk21
I don't know what is wrong with Nairaland. Here it is again

shadeyinka2:
Mr honesttalk21
I don't know what is wrong with Nairaland. Here it is again

Can you answer why the disciples asked Jesus to ask Allah to send down the table in Quran 5:112:[And remember] when the disciples said, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, can your Lord send down to us a table [spread with food] from the heaven? [Jesus] said," Fear Allah , if you should be believers."?

When did they start speaking to/with Allah by themselves?

Were Allah's wishes/instructions not communicated to them through Jesus?

Please show the verse or verses of Allah directly communicating with the disciples.

shadeyinka2:
Mr honesttalk21
I don't know what is wrong with Nairaland. Here it is again

TenQ:
The LIE you concluded with: thatJesus was speaking THROUGH Jesus to His Disciples.

You see who is calling white black and black white?

Show this lie of yours in the Quran. (Jesus speaking through Jesus 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣)

Mr honesttalk21

I don't know what is wrong with Nairaland. Here it is again


Let's see again
Nairaland is getting

shadeyinka2:
Mr honesttalk21

I don't know what is wrong with Nairaland. Here it is again


Let's see again
Nairaland is getting

Glad you understand but like to make a silly, stupid fuss.

Allah spoke to the disciples through Jesus and warned who will still disbelief of severe punishment.

If Allah communicated to the disciples directly other than through inspiration or Jesus please show and prove beyond reasonable doubt.

If that were the case why then was Jesus a prophet to them?


Islam doesn't make any reference to the number of disciples. What particular relevance that is.

John 12:37 (NIV):
Even after Jesus had performed so many signs in their presence (Tenq,nairaltq,shadeyinka2), (Tenq,nairaltq,shadeyinka2) still would not believe in him."

Acts 7:51–52 (ESV):
"(Tenq,nairaltq,shadeyinka2) stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute?

honesttalk21


Do not hate the Truth!


Bye!