₦airaland Forum

aribisala0:
All these stories are hearsay
You are not a witness
Crucially it DOES NOT MATTER

I am from Lagos State
The Alaafin and all these tales are totally inconsequential in my life whether true or not I do not care
The Oyo Empire is dead . The Oba of Lagos is more relevant

So, why are you having PTSD if it didn’t concern you?


I did not say.

Lagos boys oh, this history is for you.

The write up says “regarding the supremacy between Oyo and life”

It was my own commentary.

I started with a refresher of history.

I ended by saying all these fights you people are fighting online doesn’t matter, the kings are not fighting over supremacy.


But, your response so far shows just how inconsistiquential it is.


Rubbish.


The name “Ife” have, and will forever define whatever you think you or your king is today.

The name, “Oyo” have, and will forever define who you or your king is today.

No one is saying the empire is alive today.

But you that keeps going on about it being alive is a testament that it is alive.

And may the empire remain alive in the minds of you and your generations to come.

May you be the reason why the glory of the empire will be resurrected, even to your own detriment.

May you and your kinds never recover from these PTSD till the glory of this part of the world be resurrected again.

May you never recover.

Fryx:
So, why are you having PTSD if it didn’t concern you?


I did not say.

Lagos boys oh, this history is for you.

The write up says “regarding the supremacy between Oyo and life”

It was my own commentary.

I started with a refresher of history.

I ended by saying all these fights you people are fighting online doesn’t matter, the kings are not fighting over supremacy.


But, your response so far shows just how inconsistiquential it is.


Rubbish.


The name “Ife” have, and will forever define whatever you think you or your king is today.

The name, “Oyo” have, and will forever define who you or your king is today.

No one is saying the empire is alive today.

But you that keeps going on about it being alive is a testament that it is alive.

And may the empire remain alive in the minds of you and your generations to come.

May you be the reason why the glory of the empire will be resurrected, even to your own detriment.

May you and your kinds never recover from these PTSD till the glory of this part of the world be resurrected again.

May you never recover.

Please explain how Oyo defines me or my king

Was Alaafin of Oyo the first king in what we call Yoruba land

You people wake up overdose on Abula and start making declarations
So because you say something it becomes reality

Today Alaafin is not superior to anyone outside Oyo State

Once upon a time Alaafin dominated SOME Yoruba kingdoms
Did they invite him to dominate them or did he do so by force?
It was force
Today he no longer has such power
THE END

Arguing about Supremacy is like arguing whether Abacha is superior to Tinubu

Make it make sense

aribisala0:
Please explain how Oyo defines me or my king

Was Alaafin of Oyo the first king in what we call Yoruba land

You people wake up overdose on Abula and start making declarations
So because you say something it becomes reality

Today Alaafin is not superior to anyone outside Oyo State

Once upon a time Alaafin dominated SOME Yoruba kingdoms
Did they invite him to dominate them or did he do so by force?
It was force
Today he no longer has such power
THE END

Arguing about Supremacy is like arguing whether Abacha is superior to Tinubu

Make it make sense

May you never recover. Ase.

Fryx:
May you never recover. Ase.

Omoode o kii n gun ogede ki o ma yo baara
Owo ti Ogede ba gbe ara re ni o fi n na
Ogede oro ni je ogidi oonde kisa
O ti fi enu ko oo ma fi sise sise ti ewure n se se ayo
O ti wa ibinu Elegba o ti ika abukun si Laalu l'oju
Baba mi a fi esi to ye o

illicit:
Oh my bad...

I thought this is a class, I now realize it's a one man talking to himself thingy

Enjoy yourself

Nothing more, nothing less.

He opened the thread to get cheeky, holding himself as the custodian of knowledge. He says we can google all, showing that what he posted was complete copy and paste from google, with no verification of what he was posting. Giving readers no chance to share opinion with him, we should leave him alone, as he does not know what he is talking about.

He should be allowed to continue as a man alone.

Today and in my view, both the Ooni and Alaafin thrones are expired for any functional consequence.
While ife is the spiritual source of Yorubas and Ooni, the father and spiritual head, Alaafin, by empirical historical account of the exploits, conquest, power, size and influence of his empire, was the political head, controller and director of the Yorubaland. This is just as Rome has the Pope as its spiritual head while the Italian president is the political head.
But it is important to understand that the context of the current controversy is political and economic, not fundamental to the culture and traditions of the yorubas.
Having outlived their political relevance, traditional rulers, according to the Nigerian 1999 constition (as amended) are mere relics of colonial history. Their relevance is only for ceremonial or memorial purposes.
To tell of the limitless ordinariness of their majesties is to interogate and place value on their roles and contributions during the pre and colonial days. At the heart of that interrogation lay the big question of the relevance and capacity of those stools as bulwark of defence, protection and self preservation of the people, against colonialism. - the greatest existential threat of hat time people.
For instance one is wont yo ask : where was the imperial and invincible Alaafin (son of death, sickness and misfortune sacredly protected and indulged by his parents) and many other such hyperbloated rulers, when the british came, systematically penetrated through trade and religion and later waged wars of conquest on the yoruba city states? Where were these spiritual heads and man-deities when the whiteman captured Kings and warlords, conquered and subdued them like lambs, chained some of them like whores and tied them to the stern poles in ships? What happened to the hyperbolic powers of the Alaafin?
It is a sad record of our history that the whiteman killed some of the kings and banished others while plundering their resources and laying their land to waste. For example Oba Akitoye of Lagos (1845) and Oba Kosoko of Lagos (1851), Jaja of Opobo (1887), Oba Ovoranweni of Benin(1897), Akarigbo Oyebajo of Ijebu remo (1915), Awujale Adenuga of Ijebu Ode (1923) etc were all interdicted, subdued, deposed and banished. The case of Jaja and Oba of Benin were even more pathetic as they were hunted like rats, captured, chained jailed, humiliated, demystified and disgraced before their subjects before banishing them to exile.
The case in the north was also not different as many Emirs (Zakis) were also treated like savages, dethroned and banished into wasteland of regret and damnation. Such include Emir Umar Mohammed of Bauchi (1902), Aliyu Karofi Babba of Kano (1903), Yero Dan Musa of Katsina (1903), Dan Yaya of Ningi (1904) among others.
So to ask in direct terms in the cases of Yoruba land where the Ooni is to be seen as the Lord, deity and overall master and spiritual imperator, where was the so called His Imperial Majesty, the Oonirisa of the source - the emperor of heaven and earth, father of all kings, owner of all lands....the wi d, rhw fire, the spirit ... and all his so called spiritual powers when the whiteman did the unthinkable to his so called children, their lands, culture, tradition, resources and the entire kingdoms?
All their spiritual powers and claim to out-of-this-world spirituality, invincibility and esoteric charm and medicine failed!
The british and Portuguese and others travelled from several thousands of miles over the seas, dressed in auster sewn uniforms, conquered them with a snap on the Cockerell neck.
Why didn't these "majesties", use their so called majestic spiritual powers and hyperbolic reputation to fight for the yorubas during the Nigerian civil war, Covid 19 and the fulani herdsmen invasion of recent?
So what became of all those oversewed agbada, bellowing gowns, convoluted sacks and tailoring pieces worn by those kings? What became of all the self praise, maximas comparisms, failed and untenable grand identities of yesteryear that the ceremonial yes men of today wear when they are even more irrelevant than their forebears who designed and claimed those appealations?
The point can be made again that what we see demonstrated are just "effizzies" and ego boosting as pathway for economic and political relevance. The Ooni and Alaafin do not own any land or any human being beyond their imagination.
Their letter of appointments stipulates them as nothing but curators of tradition and customs of the lamd. Such include artefacts, festivals and other relics of cultural memories.
Both imperial majesties and other kind of local majesties and highnesses are staff of the local government chairman, who by the 1999 constitution (as amended) have no role in governance. They are recognised merely as chiefs. They can be queried, suspended and removed from office. with the clearance of the Governor.
In essence, the struggle between the Ooni and Alaafin are is needless. As non constitutional leaders of their communities, who are bounded by state laws, One would expect them to concentrate on larger socio economic development challenges facing the communities and cities they represent. By galvanising culture and influencing economic transformation.
The should be more interested in influencing government policies and programmes to intervene in the lives of their communities.
The key struggle should be about mobilisation and orientation of their people, especially the youths towards blending with the opportunities of globilisation. The Ooni of Ife at least, must be commended for his deliberate and steady initiatives in this regard so far.
I will not say a word about Alaafin.

Fryx:
Ibadan that Alaafin gave a Bashorun to oversee them or what?


Ibadan that takes order from Alaafin Atiba or what?

Ibadan, whose citizen comprises of the old empire or what?

Don't be unfortunate. Which ibadan takes order from alafin. Oyo empire already collapsed. Ibadan is the new sheriff in town

ElevationD:
Nothing more, nothing less.

He opened the thread to get cheeky, holding himself as the custodian of knowledge. He says we can google all, showing that what he posted was complete copy and paste from google, with no verification of what he was posting. Giving readers no chance to share opinion with him, we should leave him alone, as he does not know what he is talking about.

He should be allowed to continue as a man alone.

quick one.....as an Igbo man, why are you concerned with Yoruba history and narration. A quick check on your post shows you are part of the keyboard warriors of Ibo extract..throwing jibes back at Yoruba peeps. so i'm a bit curious as to why you are invested in Yoruba people discourse on their monarchy

This is an excellent summary of what is found in many history books including Prof Falola's.

Fryx:
Before I start, I must say that I am not going to go into very detailed discussions here. I am just going to give a bird eye view of the history of Ife and Oyo as a whole.

However, note that what I am writing here is gleaned from books written by the earliest explorers that came to these part of the world, the records of the artifacts gotten recently from Ile ife, and other accounts as told by my uncles.

For anyone wondering, I am a descendant of Obatala, and while we don’t primarily stay anymore in Ifon Orolu Kingdom (which is where Obatala descendants resides till date), we founded the current kingdom where we dwell in, and thus, my family still hold a very important traditional role, and each time I visit my hometown, I asked questions.

Apart from asking questions, I read, I researched, and I use common sense.

Based on what I have learnt so far, here is what you should know about the relationship between the Old Ife Empire, the Old Oyo Empire, and who the Yorubas are.



Noticed I called Ife an empire.

Ife is indeed an empire, and it’s not a small empire.

Ife has been in existence for over 5000 years.

Ife was in existence during the time of King David and king Solomon of the Bible, and it’s a well known empire, encompassing the most of west Africa.

Ife has a big and popular market at that time (Igbomekun) that people came to from all part of the world to trade, so it’s a very big and well known empire.

However, it is not an empire founded on bloodletting, neither is it an empire founded on conquests.

Ife was a confederation.

Different primordial kings from this part of the world, speaking related languages came together to form the empire.


Each kings have their own kingdom that they rule over, and among these kings, an Olofin is chosen. The Olofin is like the supreme king.

Ile Ife is the headquarters of these kings, and they all have their base there.

While I can only remember the title “Olofin” for now, they have actually used different titles in the past, but the Olofin simply mean “one who resides in the dark”


Once an Olofin is chosen, he never sees the light of day till his death. The position is reverend as one who communicates between man and god.

Today, it was changed to Ooni. But then, it was known as Olofin, among many others.


Now, there are about 13 original rulers in the empire. But later on, 3 were added.


Some of the primary rulers have a family title.

Some family titles are Obalufon, Obamakin, Obatala, etc.

Notice they all have Oba in their name. Those names are not the name of a person, but the title of a family.

So, their descendants bear the titles for generations.

So, if history talks about Oduduwa fighting with Obatala, it’s only referring to a descendant of Obatala, not the first Obatala. Obatala is an acient being, that’s why he is widely worshiped as a god.

The history of Oduduwa is a very recent history.


In the earliest existence of Ife empire, Oduduwa was not born. Oduduwa was born in the very recent year. Oduduwa came into power around the same time Aladikun, the first born of the last Obatala heir founded Ifon Orolu.



So, as against popular belief, Oduduwa is not the progenitor of all yorubas. In fact, Oduduwa is not a Yoruba.

Also, the talks of Oduduwa and Obatala falling from the sky is fable. Africans are known for telling fables and even if as a child you believe in such fables, you should be old enough to know that no human falls from the sky, expect of course, if we are to believe that Obatala and co are star farers (similar to the Anunaki believes of the Sumerians)


Now, let me first talk about how Oyo came about.

In the last few hundred years, the Ife empire has dwindled considerably, mostly arising from internal tussles.

The current day Ife is not the original headquarter. It was shifted there.


In addition to internal tussles, the Ife people also faces fights from external forces. Remember, it’s a great empire and most western African counties traces their root here.



I am still trying to understand the direct descendant of Oduduwa, so I won’t say who his father is really.

However, Oduduwa came to power through fights. I think he fought with Obatala children to ascend the Olofin/Ooni throne.

After he came to power, the empire was greatly unstable.

So, before his death, he called some other kings in the empire to request for their help in case he died. He specifically asked them to support his son.


His son/grandson Oranyan, was also a warrior like his father. Because of the tussles at home, he left and was staying with the ruler of the most powerful kingdom at that time (Owu)

Yes, Otu Ife has disintegrated and new kingdoms have arised and dominated most other kingdoms at that time.

Olowu of Owu kingdom was using him and his army as a mercenary. So, Oranyan primarily base in Owu.

There is a detail here I don’t remember.

It’s either he was sent to Benin before he left for Owu or it was during his stay at Owu that he was called to go to Benin. But, it was during this time that he went to Benin and gave them an heir before returning.

He asked Olowu to give him a land when he returned and that was the first settlement. It wasn’t called Oyo at that time.

Soon after, he left for Ife to fight for the throne again, and he won.

(Someone should tell Wike’s aid that when Oranyam left for Ife. Oyo wasn’t an empire. In fact, Oyo wasn’t Oyo then.)


When he left. He left his son to oversee the kingdom.

I remember, the kingdom was known as Ajaka, after his first son

When Ajaka became king. He stopped paying taxes to the Olowu.

His argument, Owu is under Ife. And his father is the Olofin. So, he cannot pay tribute to Olowu.

Olowu captured him.

Sango was called to rescue them and he was installed as the new king.

After his death, Ajaka resumed his position again.

Note that Ajaka was not a weak man. The name Ajaka is not his birth name. It was a name given to a man that loves conquest. So for Ajaka to be called Ajaka, he is a known warrior.

Sango however, was the son of a family that descended from Oranfe. Oranfe is an acient being that plays with fire and thunder, so his mother people took him to their shrine and gave him the power.

However, Sango was able to use that power because he is a special being himself. He is intelligent and was credited to bringing some civilization to the old kingdom, which was then known as Ajaka.

For example, Sango cross bred plants to produce the bitter cola.

So, the power working for him was because he himself is special.

That’s that about the early days of the kingdom.



Now, the empire.

As times went on, the people that Oduduwa made covenant with (I can only remember Aresa for now, but they are major rulers then)

They all came together to form another confederation since the old Ife empire (a confederation also) has dwindled.

Then, they wanted to choose a leader, and they remember the covenant with Oduduwa, so they choose Oduduwa children to be the leader.

However, since this is a confederation, power must be balanced, and that gave birth to the Oyo Mesi.


So, if you have been wondering why the Oyo mesi’s, especially the Bashorun is so powerful, it’s because the Old Oyo empire is a confederation that shoots out of the old Ife empire. And the Oyo mesi’s are also important figures in founding the empire.


Now, some people are mentioning about Alaafin not having a crown.

Here is the story.


Alaafin have a crown.

They have the Sango crown and the Ajaka crown.

However, remember Oduduwa became an Olofin by fighting. I believe Oduduwa is not from the family that Origianlly form the Ife confederation.

I read an account of his descendants, but it’s the only account I have, so it’s not reliable.

The account says one of Oduduwa ancestors was a very close friend of Obatala (now, among the original founders of Ife, Obatala is very well revered, and is still worshipped till today)

The descendant was close to the then Obatala (remember Obatala is a family title).

Due to the closeness, Obatala gave him his daughter to marry. The marriage produce a son. The son did not live with his parent, he lives with Obatala, along with Obatala heir.


When the time comes for Obatala to assume the Olofin throne, that child from the female issue insists he is the rightful heir as he seniors Obatala heir.

There was a war between Obatala children and the ancestors of Oduduwa and eventually, Oduduwa ancestors won. And since then, they have been on the throne.

While I can’t verify the story, it lends credence to the special relationship that exists between Oduduwa children and Obatala children.

It’s also because of these relationships that Aladikun, the founder of the present day Ifon Orolu gave a crown to Alaafin.

Reports even have it that when Oduduwa was Olofin (Oduduwa and Aladikun where together), he gave special treatments to Aladikun and others where jealous of him, that’s why he left Ife to found Ifon Orolu kingdom.

Now, when Oduduwa died and his children are selected to be the leaders of the new confederation, they have not a mother crown.

Ife people have different type of crowns.

The mother crown, or “Ade isembaye” where those ones originally created and used by the first primitive leaders.

Obatala has his crown. Obalufon has. But, Oduduwa (according to report) is not descended from one of these settlers, so they don’t have.

That posses a problem because you cannot be the leader of the confederation without a crown to signify your legitimacy.

So, to help puts Oduduwa descendant on the throne, Aladikun gave them a crown.

So, that’s that about the song.

Alaafin have his own crown, but Aladikun gave him the mother crown, which is the Sefunfun crown.

I will attach a picture of the present Alaafin using the crown, which is adorned with Sango emblem.

Now, with anew confederation. The old Ife empire is gone. But, a law was made that the last of it must be protected.

Confederation is always form for protection. And even though the old empire is no more, the Alaafin must protect it. And the Alaafin still traces his roots to it.


Alaafin, along with his Oyo mesi’s work to expand the empire. While some other Ife kingdoms willingly join the new confederations, others were conquered and forced to pay tributes.

And that’s that about the Old Oyo empire.

It is a replication of the original Ife empire. And it’s made up of some of the original people from the old empire. And they protected the old empire.


Now, who are the Yorubas.

Every children of Ife have their languages. We are known as the children of “otu Ife”

Otu, meaning it’s well with us. So, we are generally regarded as the children of the land of Ife, that’s well with us.

So, who are the Yorubas?


Just like Ile Ife today has its settlers, the capital city of the new confederation (Old Oyo empire) also has its settlers. These are the people known as the Yorubas.

Oduduwa is not the father of every one that speaks the language that looks like Oyo language. Oduduwa is only the father of the Alaafins.

(That reminds me, the word Alaafin was originally Olofin, to follow the old Ife tradition, but Oyo people have a special way of speaking - The late Lamidi once said “only an Oyo understands what an Oyo says”)


So, the Yorubas are the people residing in the capital of the Old Oyo empire. Every one of us have our ancestry.


Now, regarding who is superior, should this even be a thing?


Is it not enough that Alaafin pays homage to his root?

I don’t see anything wrong in what Alaafin did. He is the new sheriff in town, and it’s his right to confer some traditional titles, especially if it’s linked to the Yoruba kingdoms or empire (whichever you choose to call it)

I also believe Alaafin Owoade is not in a power tussle with anyone. He is the son of his father, and he must protect his father legacy.


However, this is my opinion. To each his own.

I would have love to talk abut the present day Oyo. But, I don’t think it’s of use to this current topic.

Ignorance.

illicit:
There are characteristics of a state

One is territory, another is permanence

Ife has always been in ife

Oyo has lost territory, permanence and even recognition