₦airaland Forum

DeepSight:
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You added that the father is NOT that God of the old testament.

This even contradicts the trinity doctrine which you claim to believe in.

Take your time and go through the below, then let me know if you have questions

Jehovah describes Himself in the Old Testament in a very specific way. In Isaiah 44:6, He says, "I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God." He’s saying He is the beginning and the end of everything.

Now, look at the very end of the Bible in Revelation 22:13. Jesus is speaking and says, "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

You can’t have two different people both being "The First and the Last." If Jehovah is the First and Last, and Jesus is the First and Last, they are the same Being. Jesus is just the "Jehovah" that came down to earth.

The Old Testament is obsessed with calling God "The Rock." Psalm 18:2 says, "The Lord [Jehovah] is my rock, and my fortress." It was a title saved only for God because He was the steady foundation for the Israelites.

But check out what Paul says in the New Testament. He’s talking about the Israelites wandering in the desert for 40 years, and he says they "drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ" (1 Corinthians 10:4).

The simple version: Paul is saying that the person looking out for the Israelites in the desert, the one they called "The Rock" (Jehovah), was actually Jesus the whole time, long before He was even born in Bethlehem.

In the Old Testament, Jehovah is very clear that he is the only one who can save mankind. In Isaiah 43:11, He says: "I, even I, am the Lord [Jehovah]; and beside me there is no saviour." He’s claiming that "Savior" is His unique title.

Now, look at what the New Testament says about Jesus. In Acts 4:12, it says: "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

If Jehovah says He is the only Savior, and the Apostles say Jesus is the only Savior, they aren't arguing they’re talking about the same person. You can't have two "only" saviors unless they are the same Being.

One of the most famous chapters in the Bible is Psalm 23, which starts with: "The Lord [Jehovah] is my shepherd." The Israelites looked at Jehovah as the one who leads, feeds, and protects His "flock" (His people).

But in the New Testament, Jesus takes that exact title for Himself. In John 10:11, He says: "I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep."

Jesus wasn't just saying He was "a" nice guy who liked sheep. By calling Himself The Good Shepherd, He was claiming the specific role that every Israelite knew belonged to Jehovah. He was saying, "The Shepherd you’ve been singing about in the Psalms? That’s Me."

In Isaiah 40:28, the Bible asks: "Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God, the Lord [Jehovah], the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary?" It credits the creation of the entire universe to Jehovah.

Then, look at the very beginning of the Gospel of John. Talking about Jesus (the Word), it says in John 1:3: "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." Paul says the same thing in Colossians 1:16, that by Jesus "were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth."

If Jehovah created the world, and the Bible says Jesus created the world, then Jesus is the Creator. He is Jehovah. He is the one who actually formed the rocks, the trees, and the stars before He ever stepped foot on Earth as a baby.

When God (Jehovah) finished creating the world, He set apart the seventh day as a holy day for Him. In Exodus 31:13, Jehovah calls the Sabbath "my sabbaths." It was His day, and He made the rules for it.

But when the Pharisees tried to argue with Jesus about what was allowed on that day, Jesus made a massive claim in Matthew 12:8: "For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day."

If you own a house, you’re the "lord" of that house, and you make the rules. By calling Himself the "Lord of the Sabbath," Jesus was saying, "I’m the one who invented this day back in Genesis. I'm the Jehovah who told Moses to keep it holy."

The Old Testament clearly identifies Jehovah as the Great Judge who will decide the fate of all people. Psalm 96:13 says: "For he [Jehovah] cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness."

Yet, Jesus tells His followers that the Father has handed that specific job over to Him. In John 5:22, Jesus says: "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son."

If the Old Testament says Jehovah is the Judge, and the New Testament says Jesus is the Judge, it’s because they are the same person. Jesus is the Jehovah who saw everything from the beginning and will be the one we all talk to at the end.

The Old Testament Declaration (Isaiah 45:22–23)
In this passage, Jehovah is speaking. He is making it clear that He is the only God and that eventually, the entire world will have to acknowledge Him.

"Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. I have sworn by myself... That unto me [Jehovah] every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear."

Jehovah says this honor belongs to Him alone. In the Jewish mind, bowing the knee was the ultimate sign of worshiping the one true God.

The New Testament Application (Philippians 2:10–11)
Now, look at what Paul writes about Jesus. He uses the exact same wording, but he puts Jesus’ name in the center of it.

"That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord..."

The Old Testament Prophecy (Malachi 3:1)
In the very last book of the Old Testament, Jehovah is speaking about a future event. He says:

"Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me [Jehovah]: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple..."

Jehovah says the messenger is preparing the way for Himself. If you’re throwing a parade for a King, the person out front is clearing the road for the King who is right behind them.

The New Testament Fulfillment (Matthew 11:10–11)
Fast forward 400 years. John the Baptist is in the desert preaching, and Jesus starts talking to the crowds about who John really is. Jesus quotes that exact verse from Malachi:

"For this is he [John the Baptist], of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee."

Notice the tiny change in the pronoun. In Malachi, Jehovah says "before me." In Matthew, Jesus says the messenger prepares the way for "thee" (referring to Himself).

The most widely considered evidence in the Bible. It’s a moment where Jehovah describes exactly how He will be physically treated by people, and then the New Testament shows that exact thing happening to Jesus.

Here is how you can explain the "Pierced" connection to your friend:

The Old Testament Statement (Zechariah 12:10)
In this prophecy, Jehovah is the one speaking. He is describing a future time when the people will recognize Him.

"And I [Jehovah] will pour upon the house of David... the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon ME whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him..."

Jehovah is the speaker here. He doesn't say "they will pierce a man I sent." He says they will look upon "ME" (Jehovah) whom they have pierced.

The New Testament Fulfillment (John 19:34–37)
Now, look at what happens at the end of the Crucifixion. Jesus has already died, and a Roman soldier wants to make sure He is gone.

"But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water... For these things were done, that the scripture should be fulfilled... And again another scripture saith, They shall look on him whom they pierced."


This is very lengthy, so take your time, but make sure you read before responding. Note, I did not only provide bible verses, but I also explained and connected them to other revelations and clearly showed who Jesus Christ is.

You said so much here but I would ask you to provide evidence that US is using their bases in the gulf states.
Please don't come here and be spreading fake news.
The gulf states refused the US from using their bases.
Let's debate, argue or even quarrel but no lies please.

tctrills:
You said so much here but I would ask you to provide evidence that US is using their bases in the gulf states.
Please don't come here and be spreading fake news.
The gulf states refused the US from using their bases.
Let's debate, argue or even quarrel but no lies please.

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Test post. I am being banned no matter what I post. Let me see if this gets banned.

tctrills:
Repentance is not a problem, it is simply not tied to the ritual murder of anyone.
That in itself is an absurd and barbaric concept.
Again your opinion and no one has any good reason to believe you. You are not a prophet, God doesn't speak to you and you have zero spiritual authority. So in this case, your opinion is not important. You can call God's plan absurd and barbaric if that is how you feel but you haven't presented any evidence to prove your point.

Haba. That you will only be forgiven when one [b]innocent man is murdered in a gruesome torturous manner and you buy into it? Think about it for heavens sake, stop and think! What sort of antediluvian caveman ritualistic teaching is that? ? ? ?
If the wages of sin is death then there is no escaping. For the demands of justice, it must be fulfilled. Is it painful, scary and maybe unbelievable to you but that's the clear definition of justice, every crime must be paid for before forgiveness is granted. Using words like antediluvian caveman ritualistic only express your disgust and opinion, still you don't seem to be able to clearly explain what wrong with it.

it is God's position actually....see Ezekiel 18.

tctrills:
You seen yo have forgotten, I did not ignore them, I explained them and gave you verses to increase your understanding. By the way no verse in the bible shows that Jesus Christ is not God.

Did the bible call Jesus Christ God? Yes
Did the bible ever say or imply that Jesus Christ is not God? No

But let me start strong, Jesus Christ is clearly the Jehovah of the old testament

see Numbers 23:19. God is not a man or a son of man. Jesus can't be God (if he existed) .man is man and God is God....there is no process where one becomes the other. The virgin birth even tells you the story is a myth.

sonmvayina:
see Numbers 23:19. God is not a man or a son of man. Jesus can't be God (if he existed) .man is man and God is God....there is no process where one becomes the other. The virgin birth even tells you the story is a myth.

Oga you have been saying this since I have known you but never with evidence. I have no reason to believe since you don't know what a myth is

I am really happy I left Christianity. it's teaching are very absurd. No wonder, when a certain German invented the printing press, cardinal Worsley is on record to have said "If we don't destroy this invention now, this invention will one day destroy us".....They never wanted the Bible to be translated into other languages....
The doctrines are all paganism. It is built on what God actually hates. Human sacrifice, trinity, confessing to priest, praying to Mary,angels and saints.....etc.
God gave us the solution to the problem of sin in 2nd chronicles 7:14. confess and forsake, I will forgive and restore. When he sent Jonah to Nineveh, there was no human sacrifice before he forgave them..... several times he calls human sacrifice an abomination and punished the Israelites for passing their children through the fire of Moloch. ...why would he turn around to allow it?
if Jesus actually existed which I am 10000% sure he did not, people only saw him die, nobody saw him dying for the sins of the world. God had already designated a place in the temple for animal sacrifice and it must be done by a priest/Levite. Not Roman soldiers...and the animal must be blemish and the person bringing it must be there while it is slaughtered and burnt. ...No vicarious atonement....doesn't work with man, certainly won't work with God.

max, Isaiah 53 is about Israel..not Jesus.

tctrills:
Oga you have been saying this since I have known you but never with evidence. I have no reason to believe since you don't know what a myth is

Tell me one person who actually saw Jesus.
This is what Justin Martyre an apologetic has to say ....
"And when we say also that the Word, who is the first-birth of God, was produced without sexual union, and that He, Jesus Christ, our Teacher, was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, we propound nothing different from what you believe regarding those whom you esteem sons of Jupiter. For you know how many sons your esteemed writers ascribed to Jupiter: Mercury, the interpreting word and teacher of all;"........

tctrills:
Oga you have been saying this since I have known you but never with evidence. I have no reason to believe since you don't know what a myth is

myths are stories(not history) used to convey messages....Every culture has developed their stories based on elements of their culture. Every culture has a creation myth.the Jewish one is not unique,it is actually based on an earlier Babylonian myth...
I have a theory I am working on, I think Jesus might be Marduk.(The son of Enki) , the creator of the universe...I think he is also Arch angel Michael...(on account of the passage in the book of revelation)..I will share my finding as soon as I am done.
But he was never on earth as a man.

Jesus is not mentioned anywhere in the Jewish Tanakh.. just look at this passage in Isaiah...45 5 "I am the Lord, and there is no other; besides Me there is no God: I will strengthen you although you have not known Me(referring to the Jews)
6 In order that they know from the shining of the sun and from the west that there is no one besides Me; I am the Lord and there is no other.
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How can anybody read that and conclude that God is 3 in one....

sonmvayina:
myths are stories(not history) used to convey messages....Every culture has developed their stories based on elements of their culture. Every culture has a creation myth.the Jewish one is not unique,it is actually based on an earlier Babylonian myth...
I have a theory I am working on, I think Jesus might be Marduk.(The son of Enki) , the creator of the universe...I think he is also Arch angel Michael...(on account of the passage in the book of revelation)..I will share my finding as soon as I am done.
But he was never on earth as a man.

I once asked you if Alexander the great was a myth and you said you don't know. So you are in zero position to tell what is a myth or not. I hope you understand why no one should take you seriously when you bring up this your myth thing.
You are not equipped to identify a true historic event from myths

DeepSight:
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Test post. I am being banned no matter what I post. Let me see if this gets banned.

This video shows I am not the only one

https://youtube.com/shorts/B30XP3uuPgQ?si=z8svpuMVZ5szBKtK

tctrills:
I once asked you if Alexander the great was a myth and you said you don't know. So you are in zero position to tell what is a myth or not. I hope you understand why no one should take you seriously when you bring up this your myth thing.
You are not equipped to identify a true historic event from myths

This is what Gemini has to say.

Alexander the Great was a real historical figure, not a myth. As the King of Macedonia who created one of the largest empires in ancient history by age 25, his existence is documented by historical, archeological, and numismatic evidence. However, his life became heavily embellished with mythical tales and exaggerated legends, such as the "Alexander Romance".

it does not mean that Jesus is a real figure.....

Jesus never existed. Nobody heard him speak. His name was never mentioned through out the first 150-200 years of our common era...
At the council of Nicaea, some delegate said he was God and some said he was man. as the argument was heating up, Athanasius stood up and said he was both. ...to end the argument...and from thence henceforth, he became 100% man and 100% god.....
and Eusebius has to forge a human history for him.

sonmvayina:
This is what Gemini has to say.

Alexander the Great was a real historical figure, not a myth. As the King of Macedonia who created one of the largest empires in ancient history by age 25, his existence is documented by historical, archeological, and numismatic evidence. However, his life became heavily embellished with mythical tales and exaggerated legends, such as the "Alexander Romance".

it does not mean that Jesus is a real figure.....

I did not ask what Gemini said; I asked what you believe. But now, since you believe Alexander is not a myth, can you spot out why he is not a historical myth but Jesus Christ is? Please use Gemini.


About Jesus Christ, this is what Gemini said.

Whether you look at this through the lens of faith or through the lens of a secular historian, the consensus is that Jesus of Nazareth was a real, historical person.

While people debate his divinity (whether he was the Son of God), very few serious scholars today argue that he was "mythical" or made up. Here is the breakdown of the evidence:

tctrills:
This video shows I am not the only one

https://youtube.com/shorts/B30XP3uuPgQ?si=z8svpuMVZ5szBKtK

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Every reasonable person knows that the story of Ananais and Sapphira is a blight on the early church and disclosed nothing but dictatorial and extortionate murder.

Tctrills let me ask you a question and answer honestly.

If you were asked to kill one of your children for the sins of others today as a sacrifice to God will you do it.

In short if you were given the demonic command given to Abram to kill his son, would you obey.

tctrills:
I did not ask what Gemini said; I asked what you believe. But now, since you believe Alexander is not a myth, can you spot out why he is not a historical myth but Jesus Christ is? Please use Gemini.


About Jesus Christ, this is what Gemini said.

Whether you look at this through the lens of faith or through the lens of a secular historian, the consensus is that Jesus of Nazareth was a real, historical person.

While people debate his divinity (whether he was the Son of God), very few serious scholars today argue that he was "mythical" or made up. Here is the breakdown of the evidence:

ask Gemini to tell you who actually heard him speak,

you are comparing your god to Alexander the great. continue, you will soon realize that he was made up in Nicea

sonmvayina:
ask Gemini to tell you who actually heard him speak,

you are comparing your god to Alexander the great. continue, you will soon realize that he was made up in Nicea

No, no, no, first ask Gemini to tell you who heard Alexander the Great speak. I asked you to do something, but you have not done it. You are requesting something from me. Do what I asked earlier, then you can ask your questions.
Also, be prepared to answer the same questions for Alexander the Great

DeepSight:
Tctrills let me ask you a question and answer honestly.

If you were asked to kill one of your children for the sins of others today as a sacrifice to God will you do it.

In short if you were given the demonic command given to Abram to kill his son, would you obey.

I am not as obedient as Abraham, but obedience to God always brings blessings, as we saw in the case of Abraham.

DeepSight:
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Every reasonable person knows that the story of Ananais and Sapphira is a blight on the early church and disclosed nothing but dictatorial and extortionate murder.

Explain

tctrills:
Explain

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What is there to explain. Someone sells his property and brings part of the proceeds to the Church and you kill him and his wife for that?

tctrills:
I am not as obedient as Abraham, but obedience to God always brings blessings, as we saw in the case of Abraham.

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So you will not obey such a command. That simply means in your heart of hearts you know it is demonic.

DeepSight:
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So you will not obey such a command. That simply means in your heart of hearts you know it is demonic.

Moo, it simply shows that I am imperfect and my faith isn't strong enough. I hope to get to a point where I will be strong enough to do all God commands

DeepSight:
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What is there to explain. Someone sells his property and brings part of the proceeds to the Church and you kill him and his wife for that?

God took his life for dishonesty and disloyalty. Should God the giver of life have the right to do so? I think yes

tctrills:
Moo, it simply shows that I am imperfect and my faith isn't strong enough. I hope to get to a point where I will be strong enough to do all God commands

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You know the truth in your heart that you will never obey such a barbaric and absurd command.

In the first place think about it.

You will have to ask yourself whose voice you are hearing because God does not appear in front of anyone and even if it did, you will still question what you are seeing or hearing, you will ask yourself if you are going mental or if an evil spirit is speaking to you.

Because for it to say "kill your son" you will question it seriously and you will surely conclude that it is not of God but of the devil.

This gives you yo know not only is the OT barbaric and pagan, but the entire idea of murdering someone for sins of others is despicable, repugnant and barbaric and no decent person should subscribe to it.

DeepSight:
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What is there to explain. Someone sells his property and brings part of the proceeds to the Church and you kill him and his wife for that?

I think I have finally been able to decide your problem with Christianity and religion in general.

You know the truth in your heart that you will never obey such a barbaric and absurd command.
Now you are deciding what's on my heart

In the first place think about it.

You will have to ask yourself whose voice you are hearing because God does not appear in front of anyone and even if it did, you will still question what you are seeing or hearing, you will ask yourself if you are going mental or if an evil spirit is speaking to you.
If you hear the voice of your father, would you recognise it?. "My sheep know my voice."

Because for it to say "kill your son" you will question it seriously and you will surely conclude that it is not of God but if the devil.

Thank God Abraham was not that foolish and he was able to bless his generation.

This gives you yo know not only is the OT barbaric and pagan, but the entire idea of murdering someone for sins of others is despicable, repugnant and barbaric and no decent person should subscribe to it.
You haven't been able to demonstrate that the giver of life asking you to return what he has given you is barbaric and pagan. Please explain why God's commandment to Abraham was barbaric and pagan.

tctrills:
I think I have finally been able to decide your problem with Christianity and religion in general.

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Send me a DM so i email you my response on Iran. I keep getting banned when i post it.

tctrills:
Please explain why God's commandment to Abraham was barbaric and pagan.

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It is unnatural and goes against all natural protective and loving parental instinct.
If any voice comes and tells me to kill my parent, I will curse that voice first.

DeepSight:
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It is unnatural and goes against all natural protective and loving parental instinct.
If any voice comes and tells me to kill my parent, I will curse that voice first.

You might be right. Obedience to God means going beyond the natural desires and urges.
If God asks you to do anything, obedience would give you blessings.
As Zi said, I have finally been able to understand you.