₦airaland Forum

De don come again o, in just a week we know how many have been kpai, U no complain about dat. Remove the lug of wood wey dey ur eye 1st.

donleo92:
And he is some people's Messiah. Because he is against the west

The worst democracy is way better than military rule

That's my opinion.

People of bukina faso are crying bitterly, but you no go know

more have been killed per head in Nigeria since May 2023

Propaganda article by the BBC. The 1800 killed are Terrorists, nicknamed "Tero tero" in Burkina Fasso. What BBC did is that they voluntary mistranslated and changed some informations from french media and replaced the word "Terrorists" by the word "Civilians" to mislead you. All for propaganda purposes. The BBC work in collaboration with french media

Ibrahim Traor is better than Tinubu

SeizeTheMemes:
You are still stuck in the "democracy vs. military" false binary. This isn't about the military, it's about the economic orientation of the state. Most of the "civilian" governments you are defending are just administrative offices for the IMF. They provide the illusion of choice while the country's gold and resources are siphoned off to Europe and America.

If you were correct, Nigeria should have become a developed country by 1999

(Didn't happen, lol).

Notice the timing of this report. As soon as Traore kicks out the French military, diversifies his security partners, and talks about actual sovereign control over Burkinabe resources, suddenly the BBC and french news find their voices. Where were these "reports" when Western-backed leaders were presiding over the slow death of their people through structural adjustment programs? The coups happened because the AES states were not satisfied with their crappy civilian governments and the the current leaders seem to actually be doing something about it. We should learn a thing or two from them.

Damm, if someone used this exact excuse for tinubu right now, people would be angry.

Traore is in power, he should face his duties. If he can't stand the heat , then either he should have resigned, or not seized power in the first place, for eff's sake

Please, I'm not saying democratic rule in NIgeria is good, I am saying quite simply that it is better because army rule doesn't even give you that illusion of choice you are talking about.

Also, we have had army and civillian rule in Africa since 1960 that have been pro- and anti-west, and up till today Africa is not developed.

Traore should face his duties. He made his bed, he lies down in it. He should stop blaming west, and so should you. Plus, Burkina had the same issues before he came in, are you saying that the pro-western governments were being shafted by the west they support...or is the problem the result of years of neglect and underdevelopment and bad leadership...pro-or anti-west?

donleo92:
And he is some people's Messiah. Because he is against the west

The worst democracy is way better than military rule

That's my opinion.

People of bukina faso are crying bitterly, but you no go know

you are saying the truth.

Leave them alone ..

HausaIgboYoruba:
more have been killed per head in Nigeria since May 2023

Notice the timing of this report. As soon as Traore kicks out the French military, diversifies his security partners, and talks about actual sovereign control over Burkinabe resources, suddenly the BBC and french news find their voices. Where were these "reports" when Western-backed leaders were presiding over the slow death of their people through structural adjustment programs? The coups happened because the AES states were not satisfied with their crappy civilian governments and the the current leaders seem to actually be doing something about it. We should learn a thing or two from them.

Horus:
Propaganda article by the BBC. The 1800 killed are Terrorists, nicknamed "Tero tero" in Burkina Fasso. What BBC did is that they voluntary mistranslated and changed some informations from french media and replaced the word "Terrorists" by the word "Civilians" to mislead you. All for propaganda purposes. The BBC work in collaboration with french media

Nwaokunkpara:
Oga how many people have been killed so far in your democratic country Nigeria?

See them


Using bad leadership in Nigeria to excuse bad leadership in Burkina faso.


Make una no give APC data boys ideas...to start ecxusing the death on a british-french-USA komplot against tinubu


Tinubu and Traore should face their duties. We are tired of hearing 'it is the west fault' all the time.

donleo92:
And he is some people's Messiah. Because he is against the west

The worst democracy is way better than military rule

That's my opinion.

People of bukina faso are crying bitterly, but you no go know

He is wiping out the bad eggs....so that they dont come back to continue the rot...just like we have APC demons here

More than 100k had been killed in 9ja

Bbc?

nairalanda1:
Oga, I am not disagreeing with you, but Burkina has issues. What is the government doing about them? Can't they even call in the russians to help?

Let's not excuse ineffiency abeg.

Or you go gree if someone came and excused the violence in Nigeria by saying tinubu is being hampered by evil foreign agents...or you go blame your government for not sitting up?

Whatever issues BF has is BF's problem.

This idea that the west should be a watchdog in other countries makes no sense. Deal with your issues, let others deal with theirs.

If we're talking about human rights violations, Israel is top of the list. Why's no one talking about that? Hypocrisy with a touch of double standard.

This human rights nonsense is the hand work of America government

Pakute:
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgr639007zo

nairalanda1:
So, how about many African countries who ended up under army rule, are they better than they were before Army rule?

Brazil self, was already developing before army rule took over. Thailand and Indonesia still have high levels of poverty. Spain has developed far more under civillian rule than under the rule of Franco. South Korea, yeah, I'll give you that....but South Korea is developed because it woke up and realized they did not have enough natural resources.

The problem with you guys is that you do not even want to do what South Korea did to be developed. You want a army government that would dash you money well well. And if democracy no dey dash una money, na army you want.

You don't want to do what Park OF korea did...allowed rich families to set up domestic industries that would export in return for them paying limited taxes, and getting government favors. ...meanwhile most of you start screaming oppressor when dangote gets some grant from government or something. And it took ten years of hardship, before the benefits started trickling in. Japan self, Japan took decades before it reaped the benefits of industires. And both korea and japan had large numbers of their people japa when times were hard.

South Africa that has been a democracy self, is better than Nigeria. How do you explain that.

I want tinubu out. But I don't want army rule. Army rule took us from bad in 1983, to worse in 1999. ANd let's not talk about 1966..where in one year time we had a brutal civil war on our hand

As I mentioned above, it is what the leader do with power that matters and not the form. Many African leaders are selfish, clueless and lack foresight. UAE, Qatar, SAudi Arabia, Bahrain etc are all monarch and are doing pretty well. Leaders matter. Also, the quality of life for an average person in Indonesia or Thailand is better than in 98% African counties including South Africa.

I didn’t say democracy is bad, it is good for some countries and terrible for some. In many African countries, democracy hasn't been that great to say the least. This may be because, democracy itself depends on the fact that the people choosing their leaders are expected to be knowledgeable enough to know what is good for them, unfortunately that’s not the case for most people in Africa. Give them N1000 and they will vote for you. Also, democracy itself is varied and takes different form; Singapore is a one-party democracy which is different from those UK or Canada.

I don’t follow Nigerian politics and don’t care. Nigeria is a cesspit of corrupt, clueless and arrogant people. Most of the leaders, no matter what divide they belong, will not change the country in a meaningful way. The mindset in Nigeria is flawed and I don’t see a meaningful change in this generation.

nairalanda1:
If you were correct, Nigeria should have become a developed country by 1999

(Didn't happen, lol).

What? I never said that military would do better, I said what matters is economic orientation. The military leaders weren't interested in development either. The most obvious of which is Abacha. I was saying is that a government, civilian or military will not develop if that is not their goal or they have no incentive to develop the country.

nairalanda1:
Damm, if someone used this exact excuse for tinubu right now, people would be angry.

Traore is in power, he should face his duties. If he can't stand the heat , then either he should have resigned, or not seized power in the first place, for eff's sake

Please, I'm not saying democratic rule in NIgeria is good, I am saying quite simply that it is better because army rule doesn't even give you that illusion of choice you are talking about.

Also, we have had army and civillian rule in Africa since 1960 that have been pro- and anti-west, and up till today Africa is not developed.

Traore should face his duties. He made his bed, he lies down in it. He should stop blaming west, and so should you. Plus, Burkina had the same issues before he came in, are you saying that the pro-western governments were being shafted by the west they support...or is the problem the result of years of neglect and underdevelopment and bad leadership...pro-or anti-west?

Thing is he is facing his duties lol. He is heading manufacturing local weapons to combat insurgency, he is developing agricultural production in Burkina faso and Industrialization is a stated goal. He is actually putting these plans into practice while our own industries rot and the first lady launches a food programme without telling us where the food is coming from.

The difference is that Traore actually want's to develop his country, our elite do not. Him succeeding will force our leaders to do something reasonable for once.

https://en.sputniknews.africa/20251018/1079621978.html

https://businessday.ng/agriculture/article/lessons-from-traores-achievements-in-agriculture/


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG8IM_j9Qkg

SeizeTheMemes:
This is a middle-class luxury sentiment. Or to put it more accurately, it is the sentiment of someone who keeps repeating what they heard in government or civic education class without questioning the statement itself or if it's even true.

Tell that to the people in the Sahel who watched "democratic" governments sit idle while jihadist groups (armed by the fallout of NATO intervention in Libya) took over 40% of their territory.

Traore is being targeted because he represents a "threat of a good example." If Burkina Faso successfully manages its own security and economy without begging for crumbs from Paris, the entire colonial architecture in West Africa collapses. That is why they are building a narrative against him. They couldn't kill him with assassins and counter coups, so now they will try to kill his reputation with "human rights" reports. We’ve seen this movie before with Thomas Sankara and Patrice Lumumba. We aren't falling for it again.

Burkinabes should stand firm with their government

Those criminals are just pasting propaganda so that they can kill TRAORE the way they killed Gaddaffi

Africa is not independent yet because we refuse to develop our military, TRAORE should meet Iran military for preparation against evil people claiming democracy

ponziponzi:
As I mentioned above, it is what the leader do with power that matters and not the form. Many African leaders are selfish, clueless and lack foresight. UAE, Qatar, SAudi Arabia, Bahrain etc are all monarch and are doing pretty well. Leaders matter. Also, the quality of life for an average person in Indonesia or Thailand is better than in 98% African counties including South Africa.

UAE, Qatar and Saudi arabia are oil producing countries with relatively high populaitons. If the oil runs out tomorrow, they would be broker than Nigeria.

Indonesia and thailand have high levels of poverty as does SA. Quality of life being better is a function of relative industrialization.

I didn’t say democracy is bad, it is good for some countries and terrible for some. In many African countries, democracy hasn't been that great to say the least. This may be because, democracy itself depends on the fact that the people choosing their leaders are expected to be knowledgeable enough to know what is good for them, unfortunately that’s not the case for most people in Africa. Give them N1000 and they will vote for you. Also, democracy itself is varied and takes different form; Singapore is a one-party democracy which is different from those UK or Canada.

The reason why you think democracy is bad is because you want your country to be like the Saudis...not like the developed countries. You want the good life of the first world without the sacrifices and the ideals that got them there.

Nigeria cannot be like the Saudis. But trying to be like the Saudis is why we are broke and poor. Trying to pay for subsides for everything since independence is why we seem never to have enough money.

What Nigeria should have done, regardless of who was in charge, is to use our natural resources to make manufactured goods and services.

And since your experience of government HAS been mostly democracy, you think it is bad. Yet, the same issues we have now, we had them under army rule.

Same thing in every subsaharan african country. Ghana exports cocoa as does Ivory coast. Ethopia exports coffee..yet none of them have chosen to process their cocoa and coffee into exportable goods.

You want the government to equitably share money to you. You don't want to pay tax, or do the hard work of ensuring your government rules you well, and uses your money well, and you want your side to be in power, and if not army rule.

If army rule worked, most african countries should be developed. LOL..it has not happened.

FInd out what the sane nations are doing and replicate it here, is my mantra

Plus army rule is harsh. Today I can call tinubu all sorts of names, and dem no go arrest me. Army rule? Forget it.

I don’t follow Nigerian politics and don’t care. Nigeria is a cesspit of corrupt, clueless and arrogant people. Most of the leaders, no matter what divide they belong, will not change the country in a meaningful way. The mindset in Nigeria is flawed and I don’t see a meaningful change in this generation.

And the same cesspit of corrupt and clueless and arrougant people are the same people that would provide members for the Nigerian army who you hope will make things better?

Ye gods!

SeizeTheMemes:
What? I never said that military would do better, I said what matters is economic orientation. The military leaders weren't interested in development either. The most obvious of which is Abacha. I was saying is that a government, civilian or military will not development is the their goal or they have no incentive to develop the country.

Yet when people suggest things like better taxation or even removal of subsides for electricity so that investment would pour in, and when people also say hold government to account..most of you will call them tinubu supporters.

Thing is he is facing his duties lol. He is heading manufacturing local weapons to combat insurgency, he is developing agricultural production in Burkina faso and Industrialization is a stated goal. He is actually putting these plans into practice while our own industries rot and the first lady launches a food programme without telling us where the food is coming from.

The difference is that Traore actually want's to develop his country, our elite do not. Him succeeding will force our leaders to do something reasonable for once.

https://en.sputniknews.africa/20251018/1079621978.html

https://businessday.ng/agriculture/article/lessons-from-traores-achievements-in-agriculture/


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG8IM_j9Qkg

Nigerian leaders since 1999 have also done the same things...heck even Buhari had NISRAL give loans to small scale farmers self (one of my ex-secondary school mates got loan without knowing anyone via NSRAL for his farm, lol). We also manufacture weapons domestically

The problem with both burkina and nigeria is that they do not make anything exportable, and they both have lazy ass leaders who are not doing enough about security. Make we stop pretending abeg.

erad:
Whatever issues BF has is BF's problem.

This idea that the west should be a watchdog in other countries makes no sense. Deal with your issues, let others deal with theirs.

If we're talking about human rights violations, Israel is top of the list. Why's no one talking about that? Hypocrisy with a touch of double standard.

And please stop using the fear of the west intervention to excuse the security and other issues in Burkina.

Burkina problems, in fairness, predate Traore. Most African leaders made the mistake of not supporting domestic industries to export (which is what korea and later china and before them Japan did)..from independence, instead they all sold raw materials and started sharing money and doing massive subsides so that people could live a good life.

The result was overimportation and loss of manufacturing. And a large mass of unemployed youth. Here we are.

But your african leaders, traore included, and whether pro-west or antiwest all put out slogans instead of being serious at all

Which is why traore is not serious. Na tinubu with guns.

And abeg, no tell us army rule better than democracy. People suffered under army rule in many african countries..not just Nigeria abeg.

I can see why people are defending Traore and sayng the west is after him

Traore took power with the slogan that he was going to chase away the terrorists, and make Burkina a self sufficent country. Today, the oppostie is happening, and all his supporters can say is that the West is the reason.

It's almost as if the West has become the go to excuse when things go wrong. Because our leaders don't want to admit they have failed. AM sure if not that the tinubu government is trying hard to suck up to trump, APC boys go blame our security and economic issues on the West.

Ultimately the problem is, African leaders are too scared to communicate with their people...because communication means vulnerability. If traore had sat down and told the people of Burkina after a few weeks in power that the economic and security problem needed a lot of solutions that meant some hard choices needed to be made, no one would complain. But they are scared the oppostion would run with it and disgrace them, so they chant slogans and people take the slogans at face value, and when problems are getting worse after two to three years, they then blame the West.

Same issues in Nigeria. If GEJ, Buhari or tinubu or any of our leaders had sat down to explain the problems we face economically and what needs to be done to sort them out, people would listen . But no, na slogans all of them used since independence..

And to be fair, Nigerians love slogannering..like most people around the world (Remember trump's drain the swamp slogan for example?). Also, the leadership does not want to appear incompetent, and vulnerable, so they take refuge in slogans. The result is a messy government and bad leadership, and people suffering, yet we are all expected to keep quiet or the West will take over....


When Nigerians and burkinabes and their leaders are all honest and realistic with each other, maybe we would see good leadership. But the way traore, tinubu and most african leaders are going, I am in doubt.

Give dog bad name
Then hang him

They are now planning to use his brother's to assassinate Toure the way they do to Gaddafi in Libya but it won't work for the European western

Cos Africa must be Liberated [color=#990000][/color]

nairalanda1:
Yet when people suggest things like better taxation or even removal of subsides for electricity so that investment would pour in, and when people also say hold government to account..most of you will call them tinubu supporters.

Because these things without a plan will not develop anything I've said this many times. Capital invests in places of high return. In Nigeria this is not in manufacturing but in fintech and banking in particular. To industrialize you need a long term plan you don't just leave it to investments or the markets. China developed because of the US outsourced it industries but even then this growth was state directed and was only possible because of the nixon deals and the sino-soviet split. Most developed countries were developed with aid from the US (The marshal plan, the economic intervention in japan and korea). The only reason the gulf states are wealthier is that they are more strategically important than Nigeria. They are oil rentiers too. What other country apart from western aligned countries have developed industry apart from china? We can't develop the same way china did because we don't have the condition for it. We need state led industrialization

nairalanda1:
Nigerian leaders since 1999 have also done the same things...heck even Buhari had NISRAL give loans to small scale farmers self (one of my ex-secondary school mates got loan without knowing anyone via NSRAL for his farm, lol). We also manufacture weapons domestically

The problem with both burkina and nigeria is that they do not make anything exportable, and they both have lazy ass leaders who are not doing enough about security. Make we stop pretending abeg.

The development is not comparable. Look at the sources i posted.

"With the provision of access to improved hybrid seedlings seedlings and several farm inputs millet production rose from 907,000 metric tonnes tonnes in 2022 to 1.1 million metric tonnes in 2024. Similarly, rice production increased from 280,000 metric tonnes in 2022 to 326,000 metric tonnes in 2024. Still, the economic indicators point to massive improvement in both agricultural production and that of industrialization. One reason responsible for these is the sustained support of the much-needed inputs by the Traore-led government."

"The next laudable move was that of prudence and instituting servant -leadership. He reduced the salaries of ministers and parliamentarians by 30% while increasing that of the long-suffering civil servants by 50%!"

Can or has Nigeria done this? random loans does not equal development. And yes we manufacture locally but they are expanding their manufacturing while ours remains the same.

This is the type of government some people are praising in Nigeria just to spite the government. The government that is suppressing dissenting views through killing.

The parasites and leeches have come out building up narratives against Ibrahim Traore just like it happened in Libya.

I think this post is just to ignite/build hatred among our self.
I don't see the reason behind this analist if no hiding agenda of promoting propaganda on brahim Toure shifting the focus from the soldier about to be slaughter making a lot of children fatherless,brothers brother less,wife's husbandless for trying to save this insane country.....

This is blatant lie from the west that controls the media, they just want this man out because he is not agreeing to there terms..And some Nairalanders will open their gutter to say crap.

There days are numbered

Dem don start.

donleo92:
And he is some people's Messiah. Because he is against the west

The worst democracy is way better than military rule

That's my opinion.

People of bukina faso are crying bitterly, but you no go know

/

Listen to yourself.

Damn! E no go better for who miseducated black people.

IBB and Abacha regimes were far better than Tinubu and Buhari's regimes. Infact Buhari's military junta was way better than his 8 years sham of Democracy. Abacha should be celebrated because he chased away these vultures that congregate after his demise to destroy Nigeria.

What exactly are you enjoying in Democracy? None of the so-termed ills of military rule have been fixed---bad roads, no electricity, no freedom of speech, dilapidated hospitals, dead refineries, high inflation, high unemployment, etc. So do tell...what difference has "Democracy" made since 1999? Your votes don't even count. So who did you elect in the real sense of it?

/

InvertedHammer:
/

Listen to yourself.

Damn! E no go better for who miseducated black people.

IBB and Abacha regimes were far better than Tinubu and Buhari's regimes. Infact Buhari's military junta was way better than his 8 years sham of Democracy. Abacha should be celebrated because he chased away these vultures that congregate after his demise to destroy Nigeria.

What exactly are you enjoying in Democracy? None of the so-termed ills of military rule have been fixed---bad roads, no electricity, no freedom of speech, dilapidated hospitals, dead refineries, high inflation, high unemployment, etc. So do tell...what difference has "Democracy" made since 1999? Your votes don't even count. So who did you elect in the real sense of it?

/

Oga them need re-educate you.


During military rule, Iran and north Korea go dey learn work for Nigerian military rulers

I say no more

SeizeTheMemes:
Because these things without a plan will not develop anything I've said this many times. Capital invests in places of high return. In Nigeria this is not in manufacturing but in fintech and banking in particular. To industrialize you need a long term plan you don't just leave it to investments or the markets. China developed because of the US outsourced it industries but even then this growth was state directed and was only possible because of the nixon deals and the sino-soviet split. Most developed countries were developed with aid from the US (The marshal plan, the economic intervention in japan and korea). The only reason the gulf states are wealthier is that they are more strategically important than Nigeria. They are oil rentiers too. What other country apart from western aligned countries have developed industry apart from china? We can't develop the same way china did because we don't have the condition for it. We need state led industrialization

State led industrialization has failed wherever it has been tried, or has long since gone private.

Plus, you are also arguing that private banking is better

Nigeria needs to industrialize...please don't use this to excuse bad leadership by the army in burkina.

The development is not comparable. Look at the sources i posted.

"With the provision of access to improved hybrid seedlings seedlings and several farm inputs millet production rose from 907,000 metric tonnes tonnes in 2022 to 1.1 million metric tonnes in 2024. Similarly, rice production increased from 280,000 metric tonnes in 2022 to 326,000 metric tonnes in 2024. Still, the economic indicators point to massive improvement in both agricultural production and that of industrialization. One reason responsible for these is the sustained support of the much-needed inputs by the Traore-led government."

"The next laudable move was that of prudence and instituting servant -leadership. He reduced the salaries of ministers and parliamentarians by 30% while increasing that of the long-suffering civil servants by 50%!"

Can or has Nigeria done this? random loans does not equal development. And yes we manufacture locally but they are expanding their manufacturing while ours remains the same.

I am old enough to have heard the same stories from Nigeria over and over again.

Traore should do his job. He isn't doing it well. Note that I did not call for his removal, I called for him to DO HIS JOB.

Stop being a propaganda bot for bad govenrment . Lord knows we have enough of them here in Nigeria and elsewhere.