₦airaland Forum

nairalanda1:
Subsidy is not coming back in 2027 when APC goes

Because the new government is going to have to borrow to fund the subsidy .

Oil revenues are too low to fund the budget meaning that borrowing is what funds most of the budget. Most of those loans are given with the idea that we would not jeopardise our credit rating by returning subsidy.

Plus many states can now pay their salaries regularly without borrowing . A return on subsidy would mean they cannot pay salaries.

And then there is the resulting debt .

I hope Tinubu loses;but I don't want to see a susbsidy. Obi is promising that he would use subsidy savings for targeted spending on the vulnerable which makes sense to me and has even been advised by economists

You are wrong about restoring fuel subsidy.
Other civilized countries also subside some basic commodities and they are doing well.

The problem with Nigeria is that corruption and criminalities of various shades have made it seem like fuel subsidy is the problem. Where as the actual problem is these politicians. Ask them what they did with the funds that was supposed to put in for fuel subsidy. The funds were embezzled. And the country has borrowed more funds than what his predecessor borrowed under the space of three years. Haba. This is wickedness na.

cutefy:
You are wrong about restoring fuel subsidy.
Other civilized countries also subside some basic commodities and they are doing well.

The problem with Nigeria is that corruption and criminalities of various shades have made it seem like fuel subsidy is the problem. Where as the actual problem is these politicians. Ask them what they did with the funds that was supposed to put in for fuel subsidy. The funds were embezzled. And the country has borrowed more funds than what his predecessor borrowed under the space of three years. Haba. This is wickedness na.

1. Other civilised countries also pay taxes are very high rates to maintain those subsidies and they do not apply to everyone, except the very poor.

2..Corruption always results when there is a consumption subsidy. As seen in Nigeria and the SNAP programme in the USA.

3. Best subsidy is a production subsidy. Also government can use pipelines to pipe fuel from Dangote to fuel depots nationwide. Reduces transport costs and the price of fuel by extension

nairalanda1:
So you want Dangote refinery to run at a loss because evil investors.

My good fellow. Subsidy is why NNPC lost four refineries . Subsidy forces a refinery to operate at a net loss, with bad consequences

You have a good point their. I need to also point out the fact that it was the mismanagement of the subsidy umbrella that really did drain the economy too. And of course, it was the same politicians that benefitted from it. If the current situation is well managed, with funds well invested in social safety nets that reaches the citizenry, I believe the current effect won't be overly felt like what it is currently.

yinkeys:
to pay for East African refinery
We’re in trouble
You wanna trust USD billionaires & politicians
Lol

[quote][/quote] Museveni is waiting for him to bring our money come build them one

The masses refused to handle the government Refinaries, they will definitely face the music from an old capitalist

omoredia:
Hehe is an economic bandit. These terrorists people are very smart

Upright750:
The man no dey try at all. Quick to increase then crude increase but slow or never reduce when crude fall . No sign of mercy at all.

Shebi they were shouting it was Russian and Ukraine war that caused the increase, when the lie became obvious,
They changed it to Iran and Israel war, it's no longer Iran war now it's just business,
Dangoteeee is stylishly dubious

nairalanda1:
Actually after the deductions, the money can not feed up to five people in the USA easily. Result many Americans grumble about suffering

That is why you have to vote out APC and vote a government that would enable Nigeria to be like the USA. not one that dashes you free money that has to be paid for by debt.

I like the fact that you know that the money can feed five families over, even if it's going be easy as you said. But same cannot be said of a minimum wage worker here in Nigeria who can't afford to feed themselves talk more of feeding another family.

A minimum wage earner over there still have more than enough to save and send decent cash to our people here in Nigeria.

Now compare that with a worker here in Nigeria who's earning a minimum wage of 70k. Let's say there's zero tax on income. Now remove cost of
Feeding
Transportation
Fuel for generator to provide constant light and water
Light bill (you still need to pay for darkness)
Cooking gas refill
Routine health check for the basic investigation
20k house rent (let's say house rent is 240k/12)... do you think any single kobo will be left for saving?

Let's be realistic
Don't let your government deceive brother.

buygala:
Election period is near, so politicians who invested, or have some other stake in the refinery need abundant returns to fuel their political machinery

How are we this low quality in thinking in this country!?

cutefy:
I like the fact that you know that the money can feed five families over, even if it's going be easy as you said. But same cannot be said of a minimum wage worker here in Nigeria who can't afford to feed themselves talk more of feeding another family.

A minimum wage earner over there still have more than enough to save and send decent cash to our people here in Nigeria.

Now compare that with a worker here in Nigeria who's earning a minimum wage of 70k. Let's say there's zero tax on income. Now remove cost of
Feeding
Transportation
Fuel for generator to provide constant light and water
Light bill (you still need to pay for darkness)
Cooking gas refill
Routine health check for the basic investigation
20k house rent (let's say house rent is 240k/12)... do you think any single kobo will be left for saving?

Let's be realistic
Don't let your government deceive brother.

The realism you need to face is that your government has not developed the kind of economy that can pay a subsidy without getting into debt.

That's the reality most of you don't want to face.

Vote for this and reduce your suffering , if not, you go suffer for another 4 years. REMEMBER THIS

tnerro1:
Vote for this and reduce your suffering , if not, you go suffer for another 4 years. REMEMBER THIS

It would only worsen the debt.

ceejay80s:
Shebi they were shouting it was Russian and Ukraine war that caused the increase, when the lie became obvious,
They changed it to Iran and Israel war, it's no longer Iran war now it's just business,
Dangoteeee is stylishly dubious

What was the pre war crude price and what is it now?

Not in any way supporting anyone but simple common sense.

COMPAQ:
How are we this low quality in thinking in this country!?

The exact thinking of people presumed to be learned and educated.
More often than not, politics in Nigeria has shown that for whatever reason, people can be terrible in their thinking all for just political reasons. Examples abound of people who Nigerians even look up to.

Donald Duke
Odinkalu
Rufai OSENI
SSA to the President on Media.

nairalanda1:
1. Other civilised countries also pay taxes are very high rates to maintain those subsidies and they do not apply to everyone, except the very poor.

2..Corruption always results when there is a consumption subsidy. As seen in Nigeria and the SNAP programme in the USA.

3. Best subsidy is a production subsidy. Also government can use pipelines to pipe fuel from Dangote to fuel depots nationwide. Reduces transport costs and the price of fuel by extension

Maybe you are in America. The old pipelines that leads to depots ARE GONE.
Any government that attempts to resurrect them now just want to embezzle. Besides, if we go back to that old arrangements, then we are welcome back to the era of pipeline vandalism.

The problems of Nigeria are myriad.
The problems of Nigerian are Nigerians.
The situation of Nigeria is almost irredeemable.

nairalanda1:
It would only worsen the debt.

The ones the governors are mismanaging nko? The governor that eat 90 billion alone, do you know what 90 billion would have done for his state, and EFCC can’t hold him accountable cause he belongs to the ruling party.

tnerro1:
Vote for this and reduce your suffering , if not, you go suffer for another 4 years. REMEMBER THIS

It would only worsen the debt.

Any attempt to sell crude at lower prices to the refineries means a fall in expected revenue from that crude to the government. The result is that the shortfall would be filled by. borrowing

Also a rise in crude oil prices would lead to a rise in the cost of maintaining that subsidy which leads to even more falls in expected revenue, and more borrowing

And therefore more DEBT.

tnerro1:
The ones the governors are mismanaging nko? The governor that eat 90 billion alone, do you know what 90 billion would have done for his state, and EFCC can’t hold him accountable cause he belongs to the ruling party.

I've answered you as to why it won't work

My saying so does not mean I support looting , so get that straight.

maivd:
Importation should be highly encouraged. Dangote is a petrol bandit.

.. importation devalues the naira the more .for dollars will have to be seeked inorder to buy fuel abroad ..high demand for dollars

ufotunang:
.. importation devalues the naira the more .for dollars will have to be seeked inorder to buy fuel abroad ..high demand for dollars

We need a free market, Dangote can not strangle the masses all in the name of saving the naira.

I don't understand.
Crude price is going down why should refined products prices keep rising.
We've fallen into the hands of oil cartel

Oga dangote know that your monopoly days are numbered other sources of energy are leveling up to compete and defeat crude oil

Poske95:
Wrong
#1325 here
Drop pls

It depends on the state .

maivd:
We need a free market, Dangote can not strangle the masses all in the name of saving the naira.

..then tell the federal government to sell.out the government refineries to the private sector, private oil operators, entrepreneurs for them to rehabilitate, upgrade the refineries and make it to run and operate..then they will be competition with dangote refinery and the price of fuel and other petroleum products will reduce and be fair
. federal government cannot rehabilitate and upgrade their refineries because the rehabilitation money is used as a conduit pipe to loot and embezzle money by the NNPC officials and politicians

NewOrlleans:
Dangote doesn't love the masses neither is he coming to save us

Not at all, he is here to greatly take advantage of a free play market to gain massively from Nigeria. It's never his fault as our leaders created this artificial monopoly by mismanaging all existing refineries which could act as a check against monopoly in the industry.

Same is playing out in the cement industry as the players are greatly gaining from Nigeria excessively, no checks by total restrictions on importation which is bad for the well-being of Nigerians. The government needs to declare an emergency on housing insufficiency as this has gone beyond the reach of an average Nigerian. Rents are over the roof!

wildernessVoice:
I don't understand.
Crude price is going down why should refined products prices keep rising.
We've fallen into the hands of oil cartel

Because production costs of dangote are not limited to crude oil price alone and because your economy is not attracting enough forex to buffer the naira and make it stronger.

ufotunang:
..then tell the federal government to sell.out the government refineries to the private sector, private oil operators, entrepreneurs for them to rehabilitate, upgrade the refineries and make it to run and operate..then they will be competition with dangote refinery and the price of fuel and other petroleum products will reduce and be fair
. federal government cannot rehabilitate and upgrade their refineries because the rehabilitation money is used as a conduit pipe to loot and embezzle money by the NNPC officials and politicians

Leave the refinery, let fg battle it....dangote should not choke importation, we want healthy competition. Dangote is a fuel bandit.

kenmaro:
Not at all, he is here to greatly take advantage of a free play market to gain massively from Nigeria. It's never his fault as our leaders created this artificial monopoly by mismanaging all existing refineries which could act as a check against monopoly in the industry.

Actually, the leaders created the artifical monopoly by keeping subsidy

Subsidy made our NNPC refineries unprofitable, and it also made it difficult for government to pay for their maintenance and upkeep aND KEEP fuel prices low enough. IN 1993, government chose keeping fuel prices low, and the result is the wreckage of the refineries. Refining capacity went down from 400000 bpd in 1990 to 92000 bpd in 2012 and 6000 bpd in 2019.(Venezuela had the same issue, kept subsidy, refining capacity went down from 900000 bpd in the 1970s to 100000 bpd in 2008. And that was before any sanctions. ).

It also meant that anyone wanting to do private refinery could not attract investment or loans because no one wanted to invest in a refinery that under subsidy would sell fuel at a loss, and they won't see ROI. Also, refinery owners wont be able to pay the type of salaries to attract and keep workers. Your average oil company in NIgeria is competing with foreign workers...so any refinery worker has to be paid very vewry well. Only Dangote could do so....because he had the type of collateral that could guarantee the loan. His other lucrative companies and investment and personal fortune.

Same is playing out in the cement industry as the players are greatly gaining from Nigeria excessively as no check by restrictions on importation which is bad for the well-being of Nigerians. The government needs to declare an emergency on housing insufficiency as this has gone beyond the reach of an average Nigerian. Rents are over the roof!

First cement manufacturing in NIgeria is expensive because no electricity. And electiricty is kept from making a profit to improve things by government price controls...and the subsidy supposed to cover the resulting losses are not only not paid on time, but government even owes a lot of money on the subsides.

Then the road network is bad and there has not been investment in rail transport.

Then diesel is not subsidised.

Result, cement costs improve.

You are accusing them of robbery, when they have to make a profit to pay workers, pay maintenance costs which are high because those machines you see them using are imported, and so forth.

Also imported cement may not be suitable for our needs, come what may. Also, bro....any improtation means loss of forex. That impacts the value of the naira, and inflation self, meaning that cement prices would still rise anyway.

adenigga:
Source: https://punchng.com/dangote-hikes-petrol-price-three-times-in-eight-days/#google_vignette

this man dey Job Nigerians..

ppogba:
What was the pre war crude price and what is it now?

Not in any way supporting anyone but simple common sense.

So u are saying my sense isn't common?

nairalanda1:
Again , subsidy would have to adequately cover production costs and profit margins effectively and it would have to be adjusted as time goes on, otherwise scarcity and degradation of our refineries woild.result.

And borrowing would commence to pay for the thing. Because there is no way you can do that in the real world.

And we are not Saudi or libya

Thank God u mentioned Libya...we can out do Libya and even meet Saudi standards

Upright750:
The man no dey try at all. Quick to increase then crude increase but slow or never reduce when crude fall . No sign of mercy at all.

go and build your own refinery then be doing mercy upandan

1vandragon:
Nigeria is a very interesting country...

Using Naira rates, a litre of PMS in US is about #1450... on the average

In Nigeria, a litre of PMS is about #1300 on the average.

But in US, the minimum wage is about #1.7m p/m.

In Nigeria, minimum wage is #70k...

Yet, some people think it is OK to leave the masses to the vagaries and economics of the international market...

so how much do you want fuel to be
Out will fall from heaven abi
You like fuel scarcity I see