₦airaland Forum

naijababe:
In an open and somewhat just society, anyone can be anything.

In Germany people have more important things to do than discussing the difference between equality and equity, it is common sense that you cannot have the one without the other.

Hero10001:
You post to trash Naija Men, are you for real?!
If you ain't kidding then i'm sorry for you cos you need help, fast.
FYI, Nobody holy pass, na west bad pass.
It's recorded, it's in the news, we dey watch am for t.v self, shit happens in the west daily with those mofos too.

Ehen, tell me something. So that your black and white tv still dey work . You don't mean it.

SirShymex:
Lol, each one, teach one. And perhaps, you'll be a catalyst to change this angry black woman syndrome that's rife everywhere now.

The black man never changes nor complains - he just adapts to whatever life throws at him.

That's why he's still out here surviving and breaking new grounds. And Nigeria has the highest population of black men on the planet.


https://cdn.pigeonsandplanes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/jay-electronica-o.gif

Couldn't have said it better. Poor, unappreciated men.

SirShymex:
Lol, each one, teach one. And perhaps, you'll be a catalyst to change this angry black woman syndrome that's rife everywhere now.

The black man never changes nor complains - he just adapts to whatever life throws at him.

That's why he's still out here surviving and breaking new grounds. And Nigeria has the highest population of black men on the planet.


https://cdn.pigeonsandplanes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/jay-electronica-o.gif

So the black woman is extinct and docile? Not blazing any trail and doesn't endure the quagmire she finds herself a times? And the plethora of derogatory remarks hurled at her by her male counterparts. Nigerian women don't also make up the largest of black women on earth's surface? Go on...

naijababe:
In an open and somewhat just society, anyone can be anything.

How is a patriarchal society just?

Naij men full prison according to our Chaplain

carefreewannabe:
In Germany people have more important things to do than discussing the difference between equality and equity, it is common sense that you cannot have the one without the other.

Are you sure about that? Germany is one of the most conservative socities in Europe if not the most.

BananaBender:
How is a [b]patriarchal [/b]society just?

That patriarchy didn't stop Angela.

For a woman to be strong is a good quality, but humility is preferable for a woman to be bcs to be humble, is a unique virtue that can lift u to any level.

naijababe:
Mr naijababe: naijababe, jump right now!

Me: As my lord husband, how high should I jump.

But to be honest I truly don't know alot of people (and I rolled with alot of guys) who really wants that kinda wife.

I do know however that in marriage not everything has to be always slugged out and overanalysed like its potrayed on NL (and this is for both genders).

I personally don't (personally) don't think all this strong man strong woman ish is necessary when you marry someone who understands and complements you.

naijababe:
Are you sure about that? Germany is one of the most conservative socities in Europe if not the most.



That patriarchy didn't stop Angela.

I live in Germany.

And Germany is definitely not the most conservative society in Europe.

And German men are not obsessed with headship and leadership.
They are 100 years ahead of Nigerians and 50 years ahead of some other European countries.

This is a great nation.

[deleted]

naijababe:
That patriarchy didn't stop Angela.

LMAO! The fact that the patriarchal society didn't stop Angela does not dismiss the fact that the society is unjust and biased towards a gender.

Your response is as silly as saying, racism didn't stop WEB Du Bois; so it is pointless to fight against racism. The fact that one or few black persons made it does not undermine the fact that America is a racist society.

Neither does the fact that "patriarchy didn't stop Angela" does not take away from the fact that a patriarchal society is unjust, and males have an unfair privilege.

Women want to be like men,but are alarmed that men are becoming like women. Nature abhors a vacuum.

@ Bananabender and Bukatyne, the post below is from some page on the internet and perhaps does a better job of explaining my position than I have been doing.

Distinguish between Equity and Equality
The terms equity and equality are sometimes used interchangeably, which can lead to confusion because while these concepts are related, there are also important distinctions between them.

Equity, as we have seen, involves trying to understand and give people what they need to enjoy full, healthy lives. Equality, in contrast, aims to ensure that everyone gets the same things in order to enjoy full, healthy lives. Like equity, equality aims to promote fairness and justice, but it can only work if everyone starts from the same place and needs the same things.

Let’s think for a moment about runners sprinting around an oval track during a competition.
The concept of equality would have us treat the runners in exactly the same way, ensuring that they all start at the same place on the track. On the surface, this seems fair.



But we know that runners in the inside lanes have a distinct advantage over runners in the outer lanes because the distance they have to travel is shorter. As a result, equality – starting at the same place – doesn’t result in fairness.

The concept of equity, in contrast, would lead us to stagger the starting positions of the runners in order to offset the disadvantages facing those in the outer lanes. In this case, different or tailored treatment is a surer path to fairness and justice than the same treatment.
The same distinction between equity and equality can be seen when it comes to health and care. For example, Canada’s publicly-funded health care system is based on the concept of equality. It is designed to ensure that everyone has the same access to health care providers and services regardless of their ability to pay for care. Again, this seems fair. But it only goes so far in promoting justice because it ignores other factors – such as language, place of residence, sexual orientation and gender – that can also act as barriers to care.

At the same time, ensuring the same access to care for everyone assumes that everyone has similar health status and similar health care needs. We know this is not the case. Some people, like the runners in the outside lanes of the track, live with social, political and economic disadvantages that contribute to poor health. For instance, women and men, boys and girls who live in poverty are frequently less healthy than those with more resources. As a result, they may need additional services and programs – rather than just the standard ones – to offset the impact of substandard housing, limited access to fresh, nutritious foods, and exposure to unsafe environments. This is equity: making sure that have what they need to achieve and maintain health and well-being.

Once everyone enjoys a similar level of health and well-being, we can focus on preserving fairness by giving everyone the same things: this is equality. As the Pan-American Health Organization puts it, equity is the means, equality is the outcome.

Understanding the differences between equity and equality helps us to recognize and respond to differences in health and well-being that are unfair, avoidable and changeable.

BananaBender:
LMAO! The fact that the patriarchal society didn't stop Angela does not remove the fact the society is unjust and biased towards a gender.

Your response is a silly as saying, racism didn't stop WEB Du Bois; so it is pointless to fight against racism. The fact that one or few black persons made it does no remove the fact the America is a racist society.

Neither does the fact that "patriarchy didn't stop Angela" does not take away from the fact that a patriarchal society is unjust, and males have an unfair privilege.

Germany is not a patriarchal society.
Apart from the fact that many married women take on their husbands' name, there is nothing patriarchal about Germany.

destante:
So the black woman is extinct and docile? Not blazing any trail and doesn't endure the quagmire she finds herself a times? And the plethora of derogatory remarks hurled at her by her male counterparts. Nigerian women don't also make up the largest of black women on earth's surface? Go on...

The black woman lost the nucleus of her blackness froma cultural perspective, when she decided to emulate an Eurocentric ideology that doesn't cater to people of colour. Hence the first group black women who got caught up in the matrix, had to fall back after a while cos they discovered that we as black are more family-oriented from a cultural perspective. And equality is a pipe-dream, since we all can never be equal. Heck, even all fingers aren't equal...and there's no perfect society out there where people are equal. A lot of things are still race/class based, and that's how it's always going to be. Black women have it good, trust me. They just need to continue to be a support system, and stop being rebellious.

You can create an utopian society in your head, but the real world is the real world. And supreme minds deal with the real world, not jejune tales. Now that you've got a situation whereby these women are leading their lives on pipe-dreams, you just have to adapt, to maintain control. And that's the crossroad we're at right now.

Black women stopped blazing any trail, after they decided to become anything but black. You can't be a trailblazer, if you're a follower, and not unique and creative. Heck, I'm trying to think of any black woman that has broken new grounds by achieving something ground-breaking in the last 20 years - can you please help me out cos I can't remember any?

BananaBender:
LMAO! The fact that the patriarchal society didn't stop Angela does not dismiss the fact that the society is unjust and biased towards a gender.

Your response is as silly as saying, racism didn't stop WEB Du Bois; so it is pointless to fight against racism. The fact that one or few black persons made it does not undermine the fact that America is a racist society.

Neither does the fact that "patriarchy didn't stop Angela" does not take away from the fact that a patriarchal society is unjust, and males have an unfair privilege.

Stop the madness!

If "a patriarchal society is unjust, and males have an unfair privilege" - can we also say Western Civilisation is also unjust because of white privilege?

BananaBender:
LMAO! The fact that the patriarchal society didn't stop Angela does not dismiss the fact that the society is unjust and biased towards a gender.
Your response is as silly as saying, racism didn't stop WEB Du Bois; so it is pointless to fight against racism. The fact that one or few black persons made it does not undermine the fact that America is a racist society.
Neither does the fact that "patriarchy didn't stop Angela" does not take away from the fact that a patriarchal society is unjust, and males have an unfair privilege.

I do not disagree that women have been at a disadvantage and perhaps even more so in some places even now but as we become more advanced socially, that disadvantage can only be addressed by an equitable society. You can create all the quota system and affirmative action you want, if fundamental differences aren't addressed, there won't be any equal treatment.

Why do you think affirmative action is criticised as much as it is?

naijababe:
I am not a fan of stereotypes, so in general I often avoid people who like to use labels. That particular trait has and I believe will continue to serve me well.

I love black men; in fact I love Nigerian men . When I was shipped to Britain at 18, I knew within a few years that nothing but a cocoa brown of the naija variety would cut it for me . Some of my friends were keen on white men because they wanted biracial kids and they supposedly make better husbands. I was having none of that, it had to be a nucca and a naija nucca for that matter, it didn’t matter if he descended from the east, west, south or sahel. All I wanted was a naija man with his usual special brand of swag and ‘toasting!’ Certain lines are particular to Nigerian men, I have not heard non-naija men use those lines

If I am interviewed today and asked what mould of men I consider Nigerian enough to be married to if I wasn't married to my true Naija hubby of course , my first answer would be King Sango of the old Oyo Empire, he may have been arrogated all sorts of mythical powers but any man who could marry women as strong as Oba, Osun and Oya was no weakling and certainly didn't need to demand respect from his wives. From contemporary times, I can only think of the Late Rev. Oludotun Kuti, husband of Mrs Olufunmilayo Kuti and father of Olikoye, Fela and Beko Kuti. Rev Kuti in particular is ultra-special because he made all his marks in education while his wife Mrs Kuti was all about politics, a mean feat for their times. The other man that comes to mind is Dr Ekpo, the husband of Margaret Ekpo; in fact the history of NCNC as a political party would not be complete if the names of these two women’s were omitted, what Mrs Kuti did in the West, Mrs Ekpo did in the East. Two strong Nigerian men married them and did not stop them from achieving dreams; the fear of their wives stealing their thunder apparently did not come into play.

The history of Babangida’s regime as terrible as it was will not be complete without mentioning Maryam’s mark. She is behind the creation of the ‘Office of the first lady’, maybe someone here can convince me that Babangida simply could not control his wife. We can't possibly have forgotten Stella and Turai so soon; strong women even if their strength was to our detriment. I have heard many oral accounts of the rifts between Awo and Akintola being largely fuelled by their wives, might have been hearsay but mama HID and late Mrs Faderera Akintola were no pushovers even if the office first lady was non existent.

The truth is that Nigerian women have always been strong and independent even if there are good and bad kinds. That some women are all about money is not new, many of our musicians sang about it, I remember the apt descriptions of some women as a kid as being 'Olorunsogo' women, but the men who coined the that term also described their opposites as 'Surulere' women.

Has the world changed so much that some of our men only want ‘yes’ women as wives? So much so that strong women can only be described as rude and disrespectful. I can’t think of anywhere else where Nigerian women in particular are bashed as they are here on NL. Some of these men need to start taking responsibility for their behaviour. You are what you attract after all.

am here marry me now or never

naijababe:
I do not disagree that women have been at a disadvantage and perhaps even more so in some places even now but as we become more advanced socially, that disadvantage can only be addressed by an equitable society. You can create all the quota system and affirmative action you want, if fundamental differences aren't addressed, there won't be any equal treatment.

Why do you think affirmative action is criticised as much as it is?

Give me a concrete example of an equitable solution in terms of gender differences.

Are there to be different laws for men and women? I want concrete solutions. Too much theory here.

Mondisweets:
ochon they want to know where you are

I'm at Sambisa forest.

SirShymex:
The black woman lost the nucleus of her blackness froma cultural perspective, when she decided to emulate an Eurocentric ideology that doesn't cater to people of colour. Hence the first group black women who got caught up in the matrix, had to fall back after a while cos they discovered that we as black are more family-oriented from a cultural perspective. And equality is a pipe-dream, since we all can never be equal. Heck, even all fingers aren't equal...and there's no perfect society out there where people are equal. A lot of things are still race/class based, and that's how it's always going to be. Black women have it good, trust me. They just need to continue to be a support system, and stop being rebellious.

You can create an utopian society in your head, but the real world is the real world. And supreme minds deal with the real world, not jejune tales. Now that you've got a situation whereby these women are leading their lives on pipe-dreams, you just have to adapt, to maintain control. And that's the crossroad we're at right now.

Black women stopped blazing any trail, after they decided to become anything but black. You can't be a trailblazer, if you're a follower, and not unique and creative. Heck, I'm trying to think of any black woman that has broken new grounds by achieving something ground-breaking in the last 20 years - can you please help me out cos I can't remember any?

LOL. All these for black women? Dunno where to even start from.
See shymexx, it will be difficult for me to pick on any of your points as they are mostly generalized statements. The fundamental thing is not all women are belligerent. Not all women are insubordinate. Not all women are antagonists to the male folks. This still will not change the underlying fact that black women can be strong and supportive. Okay? Tenk.

carefreewannabe:
Give me a concrete example of an equitable solution in terms of gender differences.

Are there to be different laws for men and women? I want concrete solutions. Too much theory here.

I become pregnant, take maternity leave and was away from work for 9 months, I get the same job or something of equal pay grade on my return, I get the bonus given to other employees despite not being there and there's no detrimental effect on my appraisal.

Contrast with equality where I potentially miss out on all those perks because I was not there.

destante:
LOL. All these for black women? Dunno where to even start from.
See shymexx, it will be difficult for me to pick on any of your points as they are mostly generalized statements. The fundamental thing is not all women are belligerent. Not all women are insubordinate. Not all women are antagonists to the male folks. This still will not change the underlying fact that black women can be strong and supportive. Okay? Tenk.

I agree with the texts in bold. But we need see these women speak louder, and let their voices be heard.

All we hear everyday are the voices of feminazis who're hell bent on destroying the black family structure. From cyberspace, to TV, to radio, to newspapers. And most of these loutish folks don't even have a perfect understanding of what they're talking about cos they're mostly bandwagoners who're just riding the wave.

The other side needs to stand up be counted.

Chillisauce:
Ehen, tell me something. So that your black and white tv still dey work . You don't mean it.

Sure it is..
E dey show eeeverything.
You say something no good and you no gree leave am.
Not every black man in the west is Naija's

BABE3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Czb4rImsph0

Yes, the world has changed. Every one has started growing wings. ...........

Using the video i posted as an example; this is what we now considered as strong. Don't be surprised if the girl doesn't get charged with assault and the guy does.

Even more alarming is the brand of "WUSSY" men that support the kind of crass, aggressive female behaviour in that video!
(Look in the video and you will see that it was "a man" with a hood over his head, that first attack his fellow man, after the fellow man has been subject to torrents of relentless provocation and attack, right in his presence!).

It is this kind of silly men that women want..... more like a lap-dog that you can smack and still cowers and lick your feet!
Even my "Bingo" will bare his teeth if you push it too hard, not minding l am his owner.

But meen, God bless that man in the video, for putting that stewpid, untrained gaarl, whe she belonged.
I guess she will think twice NEXT TIME, before "publicly harassing and assaulting" another man like that.

And men should "learn to document" such assault because "the system" will give the woman the benefit of doubt and demonize the man.... without evidence.
If "any lady" starts getting too nasty for your convenience, quietly put your phone in "record mode".... it might save you from jail-time!

As for the "real women" out there, you will receive "man's love" till you cant take no more.

Lastpage!

naijababe:
I become pregnant, take maternity leave and was away from work from 9 months, I get the same job or something of equal pay grade on my return, I get the bonus given to other employees despite not being there and there's no detrimental effect on my appraisal.

Contrast with equality where I potentially miss out on all those perks because I was not there.

Well, when you get pregnant, you do not take maternity leave for 9 months. You can work till almost the end of your pregnancy.
When the child is there, you decide how long you stay with the child and what role the father plays.
You can return to work one or two years later. As soon as you are back, you are treated equally. As long as you are at home, you are not.
This is fair enough. You cannot expect to be promoted in your absence, that would be nonsense.

Because you mentioned Merkel and Germany, let me inform you that Ursula von der Leyen, Germany's federal Minister of Defence has got seven children and an outstanding career. She used to be a doctor in the past, like her husband who is now a professor of medicine. Her career would not be possible if her husband had the mentality of some men on NL.

carefreewannabe:
Well, when you get pregnant, you do not take maternity leave for 9 months. You can work till almost the end of your pregnancy.
When the child is there, you decide how long you stay with the child and what role the father plays.
You can return to work one or two years later. As soon as you are back, you are treated equally. As long as you are at home, you are not.
This is fair enough. You cannot expect to be promoted in your absence, that would be nonsense.

Because you mentioned Merkel and Germany, let me inform you that Ursula von der Leyen, Germany's federal Minister of Defence has got seven children and an outstanding career. She used to be a doctor in the past, like her husband who is now a professor of medicine. Her career would not be possible if her husband had the mentality of some men on NL.

You didn't understand that post, read it again. By the way, that post is my personal experience, I took 12 months and left about 2 months to my EDD. I was still on my maternity leave when I was appraised and returned to the same job but with a pay rise. I will take equity everyday and all day long.

naijababe:
You didn't understand that post, read it again. By the way, that post is my personal experience, I took 12 months and left about 2 months to my EDD. I was still on my maternity leave when I was appraised and returned to the same job but with a pay rise. I will take equity everyday and all day long.

Really?

What did you get your pay raise for? For your absence?

What a question!
I could also ask, where are the true Nigerian women?

You see, it's when people get to understand that there's a method to the madness and direction this world is heading - only then will it be clear that a true Nigerian man can only be found beside a true Nigerian woman.

The moment a woman decides to put on western cloaks and ideologies, she has effectively disqualified herself from being called a true Nigerian/African woman - this kind of woman cannot handle a true Nigerian man, because in her mind he is a primitive man.

The strong women in the OP reached the highest pinnacles in their chosen endeavours, and still, they knew exactly where their place was in the family/marriage institution - they did not swallow western ideas/ideologies as an excuse to reach those heights, because they knew that they had all the power to be whatever they wanted to be without it.
These are the true Nigerian women who naturally attract and end up with true Nigerian men.

It goes both ways.