₦airaland Forum

jln115:
Why the fvck do i care if it carries troops or not?

......because that's the reason you all think it's not an attack helicopter but a support aircraft like you claimed

jln115:
Rooivalk doesn't drop bombs because its note a bomber......its an AH.,if you have not noticed!!

Another added advantage.

This is a flying Tank bro.

A dedicated gunship

A multi-role attack helicopter

Very rugged and tested by many militaries with satisfactory records.

iblawi:
1,Is this a FLYING IFV?

2,Am sure you know most African countries don't even fly their aircrafts because they lack pilots to fly them to such areas.

Uganda have SU-30 but are scared of flying them in Somalia. Does that mean Su-30 is not capable of handling such treat?

3,Cost of flying and maintaining aircrafts is also a burden to many airforce in Africa.

4,Am sure the Rooivalk went their when the M23 had left because the video would have been everywhere. So Rooivalk haven't seen any treat yet.

1.What? when did i say it was an IFV?

2.We replaced the Ukrainian hinds, are you going to tell me the Ukrainians aren't experienced enough to fly the mi24?

3, and in today's news: Water is wet

4. when someone starts a sentence with Am sure.....hos not!

jln115:
Service ceiling:
Rooivalk: 6100m second highest of any AH
Mi35 : 5400m

Hover cieling
Rooivalk: 5540m highest by almost 2km from its nearest competitor the Apache
Mi35 : 3150m
Rooivalk literally hovers higher than the hind can fly

Climb rate:
Rooivalk: 13.3m/s highest of any AH
Mi35 : 12.5m/s

range(internal)
Rooivalk: 705km longest of any AH
mi35 : 460km

ferry range:
Rooivalk : 1260km second longest of any AH
Mi35 : 1000km

You listed 5 things but 3 are close and the remaining 2 will remain same for even the best attack helicopters in the world. So why do you think Rooivalk with obsolete Avionics is better than others.

iblawi:
Another added advantage.

This is a flying Tank bro.

A dedicated gunship

A multi-role attack helicopter

Very rugged and tested by many militaries with satisfactory records.

Jack of all trades....master of none, that's why South African doctrine differs.....look at the new Badger for example, the 30mm gun could be fitted with ATGMs like we did for the Malaysians but we don't , we have a dedicated ATGM variant....Why? so that it cannot be used in a role it wasn't designed for!

iblawi:
You listed 5 things but 3 are close and the remaining 2 will remain same for even the best attack helicopters in the world. So why do you think Rooivalk with obsolete Avionics is better than others.

None are close bro!! None! the only close thing was there max speeds which differs by 1km! and FYI the avionic suite of the Rooivalk was upgraded in 2012 to MK1F baseline

tdayof:
......because that's the reason you all think it's not an attack helicopter but a support aircraft like you claimed

When did i say that?

jln115:
Jack of all trades....master of none, that's why South African doctrine differs.....look at the new Badger for example, the 30mm gun could be fitted with ATGMs like we did for the Malaysians but we don't , we have a dedicated ATGM variant....Why? so that it cannot be used in a role it wasn't designed for!

now we r getting somwehere
does the non combination of gun & atgm reduce the badgers capability - hell no
this is the same with mi-35M -kill the enemy..carrying troops thus depend on doctrine/need
two birds kill with a stone

Odunayaw:
how trained were the pilots and how armed were the pilots

dude u r shedding

How well trained to you rate the Ukrainian pilots?

jln115:
Service ceiling:
Rooivalk: 6100m second highest of any AH
Mi35 : 5400m

Hover cieling
Rooivalk: 5540m highest by almost 2km from its nearest competitor the Apache
Mi35 : 3150m
Rooivalk literally hovers higher than the hind can fly

Climb rate:
Rooivalk: 13.3m/s highest of any AH
Mi35 : 12.5m/s

range(internal)
Rooivalk: 705km longest of any AH
mi35 : 460km

ferry range:
Rooivalk : 1260km second longest of any AH
Mi35 : 1000km

Ceiling
SU 27: 62,523 ft
SU30: 56,800 ft
Mitsibuishi F-2: 59,000 ft
Rafale:50,000 ft

Climb rate:
SU 27: 59,000 ft/min
SU 30: 45,275 ft/min
F-2: 48,000 FT/min
rafale:60,000ft/min
Range
Su27: 3,530 km
su 30: 3,000km
f2: 4,000km
rafale: 3,700km


If you can justify rooivalk to be the best AH in terms of performance with the above, then the SU27 is the king among the above aircrafts.

jln115:
How well trained to you rate the Ukrainian pilots?

in african conditions?
wretched!!!!

tdayof:
Ceiling
SU 27: 62,523 ft
SU30: 56,800 ft
Mitsibuishi F-2: 59,000 ft
Rafale:50,000 ft

Climb rate:
SU 27: 59,000 ft/min
SU 30: 45,275 ft/min
F-2: 48,000 FT/min
rafale:60,000ft/min
Range
Su27: 3,530 km
su 30: 3,000km
f2: 4,000km
rafale: 3,700km


If you can justify rooivalk to be the best AH in terms of performance with the above, then the SU27 is the king among the above aircrafts.

If he doesn't stay down after seeing this post, then he must be a Zombie. An actual walking dead!


Lmao!


South-Africans getting destroyed left, right and center. Including in-between.

Odunayaw:
now we r getting somwehere
does the non combination of gun & atgm reduce the badgers capability - hell no
this is the same with mi-35M -kill the enemy..carrying troops thus depend on doctrine/need
two birds kill with a stone

Its irrelevant to my argument if the Mi35 carries troops or not, What im arguing is that it doesn't come close in terms of a dedicated AH role to the Rooivalk.

Weather or not its an AH was someone else's debate not mine!!

tdayof:
Ceiling
SU 27: 62,523 ft
SU30: 56,800 ft
Mitsibuishi F-2: 59,000 ft
Rafale:50,000 ft

Climb rate:
SU 27: 59,000 ft/min
SU 30: 45,275 ft/min
F-2: 48,000 FT/min
rafale:60,000ft/min
Range
Su27: 3,530 km
su 30: 3,000km
f2: 4,000km
rafale: 3,700km


If you can justify rooivalk to be the best AH in terms of performance with the above, then the SU27 is the king among the above aircrafts.

Finishing move from sub-zero.

tdayof:
Ceiling
SU 27: 62,523 ft
SU30: 56,800 ft
Mitsibuishi F-2: 59,000 ft
Rafale:50,000 ft

Climb rate:
SU 27: 59,000 ft/min
SU 30: 45,275 ft/min
F-2: 48,000 FT/min
rafale:60,000ft/min
Range
Su27: 3,530 km
su 30: 3,000km
f2: 4,000km
rafale: 3,700km


If you can justify rooivalk to be the best AH in terms of performance with the above, then the SU27 is the king among the above aircrafts.

Yeah you kind of forgot wing loading, take of and landing distances, RCS, thrust to weight ect ect ect but i never doubted the RAW capability of the SU27!

jln115:
None are close bro!! None! the only close thing was there max speeds which differs by 1km! and FYI the avionic suite of the Rooivalk was upgraded in 2012 to MK1F baseline

As at 2007 the helicopter was using over 20 years old avionics and in 2012 it might be upgraded or 18 years old avionics.

jln115:
What im arguing is that it doesn't come close in terms of a dedicated AH role to the Rooivalk.

i'll let combat experience and weapons suite be the judge of that thank you

jln115:
Yeah you kind of forgot wing loading, take of and landing distances, RCS, thrust to weight ect ect ect but i never doubted the RAW capability of the SU27!

All the things you forgot to mention when comparing MI35M to Rooivalk. We can decide to be selective too.

jln115:
Yeah you kind of forgot wing loading, take of and landing distances, RCS, thrust to weight ect ect ect but i never doubted the RAW capability of the SU27!

I even forgot Introduction dates

SU 27
First flight: 20 May 1977
Introduction: 22 June 1985
Rafale
First flight: 4 July 1986
Introduction: 18 May 2001

The SU27 beast has also been in service before the almighty Rafale first flight.

i never doubted the RAW capability of the SU27!

I was just trying to let you know base on your reasons why Rooivalk is the best AH in performance.

Odunayaw:
in african conditions?
wretched!!!!

uhm lets see, they been flying hinds in Africa before NAF even had hinds....Which according to your logic makes them more experienced than NAF mi24 pilots.
Wretched!!!!!

tdayof:
I even forgot Introduction dates

SU 27
First flight: 20 May 1977
Introduction: 22 June 1985
Rafale
First flight: 4 July 1986
Introduction: 18 May 2001

The SU27 beast has also been in service before the almighty Rafale first flight.


I was just trying to let you know base on your reasons why Rooivalk is the best AH in performance.

Never once said the Rooivalk was the best! RAW flight performance yes, overall No

iblawi:
All the things you forgot to mention when comparing MI35M to Rooivalk. We can decide to be selective too.

Yeah because helicopters have wing loadings!! and take of and landing distances!! and need a low RCS!!

iblawi:
As at 2007 the helicopter was using over 20 years old avionics and in 2012 it might be upgraded or 18 years old avionics.

It was upgraded! would you like a source?

jln115:
uhm lets see, they been flying hinds in Africa before NAF even had hinds....Which according to your logic makes them more experienced than NAF mi24 pilots.
Wretched!!!!!

compare the terrain of the DRC and their other deployments and get back to me
Also compare the missions while u are it

jln115:
Never once said the Rooivalk was the best! RAW flight performance yes, overall No

Those were the reasons you gave for Rooivalk as a better attack helicopter than MI-35M.

It would have been better to leave it as patches suggested. Extreme technical information would pass better judgement.

Odunayaw:
i'll let combat experience and weapons suite be the judge of that thank you

Sorry but the Mi35 doesn't come close in terms of weapon suite, Mokopa ATGM, A-Darter AAM, FZ laser guided rocket!!

Combat experience....mmm are we talking pilots or the aircraft itself?

jln115:
It was upgraded! would you like a source?

18 years from 2012 is an upgrade to product of 20 years from 2007. Don't you think so?

iblawi:
Those were the reasons you gave for Rooivalk as a better attack helicopter than MI-35M.

It would have been better to leave it as patches suggested. Extreme technical information would pass better judgement.

Rooivalk had an avionic suite upgrade in 2012, and thus was integrated with the Mokopa,A-Darter and FZ lazer guided rockets! so yes its better than the Mi35

And if im not wrong it was YOUR countrymen claiming the Mi35 was better than the Rooivalk....not the other way around !!

iblawi:
18 years from 2012 is an upgrade to product of 20 years from 2007. Don't you think so?

The Rooivalk only came into service in 2011 bro!!

Odunayaw:
compare the terrain of the DRC and their other deployments and get back to me
Also compare the missions while u are it

They've been in Congo since the early 2000s mate! When did Nigeria receive its first Mi24....2001?

jln115:
The Rooivalk only came into service in 2011 bro!!

And avionics was upgraded in 2012 abi?

iblawi:
And avionics was upgraded in 2012 abi?

Yes the Rooivalks that came into service in 2011 weren't all upgraded to Mk1F baseline! most were upgraded by 2011 mk1F some only came into service in early 2012.