Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / NewStats: 3,165,327 members, 7,860,795 topics. Date: Friday, 14 June 2024 at 04:30 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source (1768 Views)
Is Listening To Secular Music or Watching Movie Bad For A Christian? / The Experience Lagos 2017 "Jesus Our King" (Live Thread) / Why Do Jehovah's Witnesses Prefer Secular Music To Gospel Music? (2) (3) (4)
Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by OLAADEGBU(m): 1:13pm On Mar 16, 2017 |
Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source 1 Share
|
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by OLAADEGBU(m): 11:39am On Mar 31, 2017 |
Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by akintom(m): 11:54am On Mar 31, 2017 |
Yoruba historian, prof adebayo mentioned obatala: our best secular source. 3 Likes |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 1:50pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Josephus, Tacitus and Pliny the young wrote about Jesus long after he died. They relied on word of mouth. We all know how unreliable word of mouth accounts are. Josephus' records have even been called a fraud by some scholars. There were other historians who lived around the same time as Jesus and they never wrote about him. There are 5 different tombs claiming to be where Jesus was buried, including one in Japan. It gets more absurd when you start analyzing the stories. 2 Likes |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Richirich713: 3:04pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
atheists need to stop with this "Jesus never existed" 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 3:19pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Richirich713:Prove it beyond every reasonable doubt, you'll win me over. I was of the opinion that Jesus existed as an atheist, til I started researching on the topic. If you read about the gospels that didn't make it into the Bible, you'll realize that it's a work of fiction. In one of the Gospels, Jesus was the commander of a school of dragons. Can you beat that? 1 Like 2 Shares |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 3:46pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
OLAADEGBU: |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 3:51pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Jesus Sapien doesn't exist. The one who existed was Faulkin(Zeusus Krista) millions of years ago in the period of the hominids and neanderthals/homo erectus. That particular one didn't even do as much as Eusebius wrote the fictitious Jesus Sapien to do in the period of the homo sapiens. Here are the accounts of Zeusus Erectus aka Faulkin in the periods of the Neanderthals. These are written by one of his followers whom he used for false miracles: DOCTUFOS: 2 Likes |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 3:56pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
otemdomino:Puff and pass bro, really 3 Likes
|
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 4:01pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
CatfishBilly:In life, only those who are seeing know what they are seeing. The rest see them as mad. Such is life. Here is BATIMEUS chapter 1:1-20 DOCTUFOS: |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Richirich713: 5:35pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: Don't need to, his existence is historically certain, hell even his crucifixion is historically certain. So I'm not sure how much research u have done. CatfishBilly: Those gospels didn't make it cuz they were written too late. CatfishBilly: Why would I want to beat that when I don't see any reason to believe its true. 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 5:53pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Richirich713:His existence is not historically certain. CNN did a program this month to prove his existence, it still didn't completely convince. His crucifixion was accepted based on the fact that Christians won't invent an embarrassing death for their God. Read up on the criteria of embarrassment. Those gospels didn't make it cuz they were written too late.Read the gospel of Pseudo Matthew Chapter 18 for the dragon story. 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Nobody: 5:58pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by bolkay47(m): 5:59pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
CatfishBilly:Im sorry but i failed to catch what you are really driving at. What proof do you have to sustain your argument? |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Nobody: 6:02pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
bolkay47:Visit the link below. https://www.nairaland.com/3710302/some-biblical-myths... When done, ensure to read the books attached |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Richirich713: 6:15pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: There will always be people who won't be convinced. Mostly becuz they don't want to be convinced. CatfishBilly: And becuz other ancient sources mention his death by crucifixion. CatfishBilly: Guy, I don't believe in that gospel. 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by bolkay47(m): 6:22pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
adepeter26:Following are according to Tim O'Neill. "There are no contemporary accounts or mentions of Jesus. There should be, so clearly no Jesus existed." This seems a good argument to many, since modern people tend to leave behind them a lot of evidence they existed (birth certificates, financial documents, school records, etc.) and prominent modern people have their lives documented by the media almost daily. So it sounds suspicious to people that there are no contemporary records at all detailing or even mentioning Jesus. But our sources for anyone in the ancient world are scarce and rarely are they contemporaneous—they are usually written decades or even centuries after the fact. Worse still, the more obscure and humble in origin the person is, the less likely that there will be any documentation about them or even a fleeting reference to them at all. For example, few people in the ancient world were as prominent, influential, significant and famous as the Carthaginian general Hannibal. He came close to crushing the Roman Republic, was one of the greatest generals of all time and was famed throughout the ancient world for centuries after his death down to today. Yet how many contemporary mentions of Hannibal do we have? Zero. We have none. So if someone as famous and significant as Hannibal has no surviving contemporary references to him in our sources, does it really make sense to base an argument about the existence or non-existence of a Galilean peasant preacher on the lack of contemporary references to him? Clearly it does not. So while this seems like a good argument, a better knowledge of the ancient world and the nature of our evidence and sources shows that it's actually extremely weak. NB: I posted the above stance because of your words in the link you provided. "Jesus didn't exist at all because there is no record and it is very unusual for Romans not to keep a record of something that almost destroyed their empire; they recorded national embarrassments like Nordic invasion, Hannibal and even Spartacus. Just like Moses, the tales of Jesus were made out of nowhere." |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 7:37pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
bolkay47:No contemporary accounts of Hannibal? I refuse to believe so. There were artifacts to prove he existed, coins and the likes which have been dated. His existence was never in doubt. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 7:45pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Richirich713:Which other sources apart from Tacitus, Pliny and Josephus? The Romans kept very good records, he lived in the AD dispensation, they should have captured him if he was as influential as he was painted in the bible. There was no record of the earthquake that supposedly happened after Jesus died. Shey you know say na humans like me and you sat down over drinks and decided which books should be in the Bible and shouldn't? It was purely their personal opinion and their discretion. 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Richirich713: 8:05pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: Any source which mentions his death, Talmud and the other gospels etc. All only speak of a crucifixion. CatfishBilly: What Roman records? Atheist historian Bart Ehrman says those records don't exist. So what are u talking about? CatfishBilly: Don't see how the earthquake is relevant to his existence. Why should we have records that a earthquake occurred before we can conclude he existed, hell I can disprove the existence of any ancient figure like that. CatfishBilly: Evens if that was the case (nd it isn't) it wouldn't really bother me as long as those people can give me good reasons to why certain books should be in while others shouldn't. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Nobody: 9:29pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
otemdomino: Bros abeg e don do |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by hopefulLandlord: 9:38pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
I’m partway thru Richard Carrier’s ‘On the Historicity of Jesus’. As a layman, I find it a fascinating peek inside of how a historian does history. I’m also finding out that much of what most of us think we know about Christianity differs from what is known by biblical scholars and historians. Here are some samples (page numbers are for the paperback edition). Most of the old testament is fiction or forgery (pp. 215). Moses, Abraham, Joseph, and Elijah are most likely mythical characters (pp. 220). A significant number of new testament Epistles are forgeries or have uncertain dates and reliability (pp. 260-264). None of the four Canonical Gospels were written by any known person, let alone the person they are named after (pp. 264). There is no eyewitness record that Jesus, as compared to Socrates for example, ever existed (pp. 280). There was a talmud-observant sect of Christians east of the Roman Empire, most likely founded by Peter, James or John, whose gospel taught that Jesus Christ, Son of God, born of the Virgin Mary, etc. lived and died a hundred years earlier than claimed by the Canonical Gospels (pp. 281-289). There is nothing in Roman and Jewish histories of the time about an empty tomb; grave robbing was a capital offense in both communities and a missing body would have instigated investigation that would have left historical footprints (pp. 368-371). Further, there was much editing of the bible and wholesale destruction of related documents by the Christian sect whose beliefs eventually won out. I look forward to finding more. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 9:42pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
Richirich713:No records? How did we get to know about Julius Ceaser and Augustus Ceaser? Don't see how the earthquake is relevant to his existence. Why should we have records that a earthquake occurred before we can conclude he existed, hell I can disprove the existence of any ancient figure like that.The earthquake is part and parcel of the crucifixion story, the Romans recorded earthquakes, Pliny the young wrote about the eruption of Mount Vesuvius and you think he wouldn't write about an earthquake? Evens if that was the case (nd it isn't) it wouldn't really bother me as long as those people can give me good reasons to why certain books should be in while others shouldn't.How was the Bible compiled then? And what were their good reasons for excluding some books? 2 Likes |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Arsewipemod: 10:12pm On Mar 31, 2017 |
otemdomino:Otelemuye can you please stop this crap already? Thanks. 1 Like |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by CatfishBilly: 8:51am On Apr 01, 2017 |
Richirich713 Let's continue naa. I've read up on the Talmund. It's an ever evolving book with things being added and removed. The Talmund first mentioned Jesus long after he died putting it's veracity in question. Even at that, it didn't paint Jesus in a positive light. One of the write up says that he would be sent to hell where he will burn with faeces for 12 months with no rest on the sabbath day. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Richirich713: 9:19am On Apr 01, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: I don't have time for debates at the moment, we also disagree over simplistic things like what is relevant to Jesus existence. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by NPComplete: 10:00am On Apr 01, 2017 |
Like play like play, this Otemdomino guy would have invented a religion o with complete scriptures to back it up even. And in a thousand years time, some gullible people will start claiming all that is written there in is truth and infallible. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 11:04am On Apr 01, 2017 |
Arsewipemod:Me? Crap? impossible. I don't bring up crap. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 11:07am On Apr 01, 2017 |
NPComplete:This is a mixed up. The DOCTUFOS OF TRUTH isn't a religion. It is the reality of life which makes us know that GOD THE UNIVERSE isn't into religion but science whereas Yahweh, Moloch, Allah and many of his other children are/were the ones into religion. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 11:10am On Apr 01, 2017 |
lordnicklaus:Can you shut up the mouth of truth? This is impossible. |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by Arsewipemod: 1:42pm On Apr 01, 2017 |
otemdomino:Oh yeah you do. OK tell me where you dig up those texts you try so hard to convince people that they are revelations given to you from? |
Re: Roman Historian Tacitus Mentions Jesus: Our Best Secular Source by otemdomino: 1:48pm On Apr 01, 2017 |
Arsewipemod:I see revelations shown to me by ATUM, the god of CIVILIZATION. Those who actually settled down to read them have seen the reason to believe that my testimony is true. |
Black Panther Is Definitely Witchrafty. / Adeboye Vs Oyedepo Vs Okonkwo Vs Adeyemi On Tithing / I Did Not Believe There Is Ghost Till My Brother Son Die At There School
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 103 |