₦airaland Forum

Ubenedictus:
oh keep using your Babylon bible.

Okay. Say hello to your idols for me.

bayelsaowei:
dont depict ,just show me..at least someone just put up pictures of your colleagues out rightly bowing down to images which you were not instructed by God to venerate...

Then Joshua tore his clothes and fell
to the earth on his face before the
ark of the LORD- Joshua 7

oya read it up.

Splinz:
Okay. Say hello to your idols for me.

I'll all remember to tell Joshua my co image prostrator you said hi.

doyinbaby:
Why do Catholics pray to Mary and other dead saints ...also why do Catholics pray to God through Mary and through dead saints...........many protestants including me find it difficult to understand this aspect of the life of Catholics

Why do you ask your pastor to pray to God for you? And why did Gid requested that job should pray for him to forgive his friends?

Amberon:
Even a statue of Jesus that you bow down to is an idol.

for real?

JuneOctober:
Op, Nice write up even though I'm not a catholic. You said Jesus never had siblings? Ithought he did and is Mary still a virgin, cos people still say "Virgin Mary" around me. Enlighten me please.
Thanks

Jesus was the only child of Mary as I've explained in my writeup in Q5, pls read it. The English bible was translated from the Greeks. The Greek grammar (also in Hebrew) does not have a word for cousins or other relatives, once they are related the word "adelphios" is used literally meaning "brothers" just like in Yoruba language, the word "aburo" or "egbon" can be used for any of one's sibling or relative.

Mary's perpetual virginity: Mary is a virgin before, during and after the birth of Jesus. St Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica, III.28.3 (13th century):
"Without any hesitation we must abhor the error of Helvidius, who dared to assert that Christ's Mother, after His Birth, was carnally known by Joseph, and bore other children.
For, in the first place, this is derogatory to Christ's perfection: for as He is in His Godhead the Only-Begotten of the Father, being thus His Son in every respect perfect, so it was becoming that He should be the Only-begotten son of His Mother, as being her perfect offspring.
“Secondly, this error is an insult to the Holy Ghost, whose "shrine" was the virginal womb, wherein He had formed the flesh of Christ: wherefore it was unbecoming that it should be desecrated by intercourse with man.
“Thirdly, this is derogatory to the dignity and holiness of God's Mother: for thus she would seem to be most ungrateful, were she not content with such a Son; and were she, of her own accord, by carnal intercourse to forfeit that virginity which had been miraculously preserved in her.
“Fourthly, it would be tantamount to an imputation of extreme presumption in Joseph, to assume that he attempted to violate her whom by the angel's revelation he knew to have conceived by the Holy Ghost.
“We must therefore simply assert that the Mother of God, as she was a virgin in conceiving Him and a virgin in giving Him birth, did she remain a virgin ever afterwards."
Of course, most Christians today still believe in the perpetual virginity of Mary (think Catholics and Orthodox). The practice of most Protestants today of denying the perpetual virginity of Mary is a fairly recent innovation – a peculiar historical aberration, particularly since certain Protestants, such as evangelicals, would consider themselves to be conservative Christians – that can't even find historical precedent among the primary magisterial Reformers; for that, one can only look to a hand-full of 4th century teachers who were otherwise universally rejected as heretics.
Catholics, on the other hand, have maintained the 2000 year tradition that our blessed and holy mother Mary was indeed not only a virgin before Jesus' birth but also perpetually a virgin thereafter.
Some early Protestant reformers such as Martin Luther supported the doctrine, and founding figures of Anglicanism such as Hugh Latimer and Thomas Cranmer "followed the tradition that they had inherited by accepting Mary as 'ever virgin'". Reformed teaching, however, largely abandoned it. The doctrine of perpetual virginity is currently maintained by some Anglican and Lutheran theologians. In addition, John Wesley , the founder of the Methodist Church , affirmed the perpetual virginity of Mary.

kabasa77:
Stop jumping into assumptions, the Bible was not clear on how the got the prayers, but then never said the elders were intercessors so you have no point here.. The bible only said the had bowls containing the prayers of Saints. The Bible is not clear about alot of things

if jesus is the only one we give our prayers to then how did the elders get prayers of saints on earth? Them having prayers of saints implied that some of these saints had asked them to help them table their prayers before God! Stop these silly argument jesus is the only way to the Father that's why all prayers are still made in the name of jesus @italo @easymancfc it's as easy as that

Omoluabi16:
Sinners in hell can intercede?? Jesus is Lord!! Didn't you ever read the story of Lazarus and the rich man in the bible?

That's the reason I wrote that. Their intercession definitely did not work because they were not meant to. They had been cut off from grace of God. They are really dead. But his intercession was 'answered' nonetheless by Abraham, a saint as he told the rich man there are still preachers in the world...Hope somebody like you will not say Abraham has become God by receiving and answering prayer. One thing with you protestants is you carry on as if. you too love God, that catholics are makings saints God competitors. But how wrong can you people be! Just as the Jews 'were forming' loving God too much when they were against Christ for forgiving sin but Christ told them off, that they don't know the Son has power to forgive sin. The power he gave to the apostles/humans too. Power which has been transmitted unbroken down to catholic priests. For you guys, this is usurping of God's power! LAUGHTER. God is too big for that. When you guys are told apostles are judges in heaven and human was given the key to kingdom of God, heaven, you guys will scream BLASPHEMY! But they are there in the bible. You guys don't understand how God's kingdom works.

Ubenedictus:
I'll all remember to tell Joshua my co image prostrator you said hi.

I do not know of any Joshua that is an idolater like you. But then, just in case there's a so-called saint called "saint Joshua", pronounced as such by Babylon, then you may as well say HI to him.

chiomababy22:
for real?

Yes, for real. For He who said "You shall not make unto thee any craven image" also said "of any likeness of anything that is in heaven above (Jesus is in heaven) or on the earth beneath..."

[quote author=MZLady39 post=56421100][/quote]but the Bible says what you bind on earth is bind in heaven, the sins you forgive on earth is forgiven in heaven?. Please explain further

Splinz:
Another blackmail from a hypocrite! When you said I wasn't making sense, what were you implying? Oga, first of all remove the log of wood in your own eye!

Mr obstinate, have a nice day. At least you can now boast in your street that you have argued with Catholics. Congrats on your landslide achievement. Good bye.

EmpresFIDEL:
thank you. am a Catholic but I don't knw much of these

You are most welcome. This is one of the reasons I decided to write this article because I noticed that many Catholics do not have deep knowledge about the faith and how traceable these practices are in the holy scriptures. Catholics do not do anything different from what the bible teaches & the tradition of the Apostles.

LogicStatement:
Catholics do not pray to dead people but ask for the intercession of saints. There is nothing wrong to ask for the intercession of the saints. Abraham interceded for Sodom (Gen 18: 16-33). We see in the Old Testament, various figures are asked to intercede for those in spiritual and temporal need: Abraham, Moses, Job, Jeremiah. It seems to have been thought especially appropriate to those men of prayer, the prophets (Gen 18:24, Jb 42:8, Jr 42:2, 2Mc 12:38-45). After the last super, Jesus interceded for his followers (Jn 17).
It should be noted that the church does not regard a saint who is dead to the flesh (physical dead) as been dead rather, he is asleep but lives in the presence of God. When a righteous died, he rises and becomes like the angels in heaven. Jesus tells us in Mk 12: 24-26 that God is God not of the dead but of the living. In Ex 3:1-6 When God appeared in the burning bush to Moses, he introduced Himself as God of Abraham, God of Issac and God of Jacob. These people were known to be dead (physical death) when he appeared to Moses, yet God still associate Himself with them meaning that, these saints are living. Therefore, when Catholics call on saints for intercession is because these saints are living and in the presence of God. Just like we meet our priests or pastors for their intercession because of our believe that they are saints who live holy lives (only God knows the heart of man), same way Catholics ask for the intercession of saints who live in the presence of God (for these ones you are very sure they are clean and free from sin because they are in heaven already. Nothing unclean will enter heaven Rev 21:27)

Is there anywhere in the scripture where "dead saints" interceded for the living saints or they all did their intercession while alive?

blazer234:
Mr obstinate, have a nice day.

Mr hypocrite, bye.

Themandator:
Is there anywhere in the scripture where "dead saints" interceded for the living saints or they all did their intercession while alive?

Go and read the earlier posts on the this thread

Ajejeje:
1 timothy 2:5 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; I think the chapter of praying to saint is close now

Yes Jesus is the only mediator between God and man yet you ask your pastor to pray for you mediating on your behalf. Pls stop the hypocrisy! May be you do not understand the meaning of intercession.

Ubenedictus:
I just saw people kneeling in front of an image, I can also post pictures of Israelites kneeling in front of images and Protestants in front of bibles that doesn't make any of those thing idols.


I again maintain that I have never seen a catholic before images. hope you know that not every image is an idol.

You really think I care about your religious shits

My reason for postings these pictures is that you Christians call Traditionalists Idol worshippers but turn around and do exactly same thing they are doing

Bowing down before a sculpture or an image

Quit the hypocrisy! !

Splinz:
Yes, for real. For He who said "You shall not make unto thee any craven image" also said "of any likeness of anything that is in heaven above (Jesus is in heaven) or on the earth beneath..."

Cherubims are angelic beings in heaven yet an "idol" of them was built on the ark, (exo 25:18) and in the temple (1 kings 6)

easymancfc:
Cherubims are angelic beings in heaven yet an "idol" of them was built on the ark, (exo 25:18) and in the temple (1 kings 6)

By whose instruction and what purpose?

Splinz:
By whose instruction and what purpose?

You say don't make any images of things in heaven .. and I just showed you where something in heaven was made...

Okay I now have time. So falsehoos resides in the catholic church? Otobo vs Sulieman? Chris vs Rita? Remi vs whats that pastor's name? Chris vs Anita? Adeboye saying the next G.O. of RCCG is in the beer parlour, pastor caught wiht human head in Delta? Pastor caught with human skull in church? We do not donate offering to father, the money is in turn used to build other parishes. How many times will I say this, stop talking anyhow.
You said pray before it not pray to it, english na wahala. Jacob set a dedicated stone aside to use in the worship of God, your eye no read am abi na made in China Bible you dey use? Does that mean He is worshipping the stone? use sense and understand symbolism.About the apocrypha, you mean the same Jews that never recognised Christ as the messiah? your point exactly??
About the contradictions you mentioned, first off places were grouped by refion Biblically. So you don't know the compilation of the Bible was by mortals who debated which books should enter? Shame if you domnt know. Also, there was no calender in those days, so how will you expect an accurate time? THINK PLEASE!
Please review point 4, Jesus did but He only put his Fathers work first. Jesus even appointed someone to take care of her at the point of His death John 19:25-26. Also about the honour, Angel Gabriel even gave her honour and that was where we coined the first part of the Hail mary Luke 1:28...even God honored her by choosing her and honored her by revealing to Joseph in the dream that the child in her was of God. Am disappointed if you misunderstand the biblical translation of brothers. Did you read Jesus's reply when they said his 'siblings' were looking for Him? no you didn't. Mary married Joseph as a companion not a sex partner. Joseph was even a widower who was old. Like I said, made in China bible. New generation churches be claiming know it all. That is how muslims converted A WHOLE CHURCH in Kwara. Better tell God to direct your life instead of claiming the wisdom you still need.

Nigeriadondie:
Q1 You have answered it yourself that making an image is not wrong but worshiping it is. When u put image of Mary in your corner of the room and bow before it, pray before it with your rosary, what is that?
Read John 4:24, 1Corinthians10:14; 2Corinthians 5:7; 1John 5:21; Psalms 115:4-8
No record of the apostles or Jesus himself using image of Mary and bowing before it.
Remember in Revelation 19:10 when John wanted to bow before an angel d angel stopped him at once.

Q2. The Apocrypha: It is very important to examine some points as there are overwhelming evidences against the Apocrypha
a. The Jews never recognized the books. In the words of famous Jewish historian " Our books are those of which were accredited are but two and twenty (22)"- Against Apion I pages,38,41
The groupings of d 22 books are stated below:
The Law
1.Genesis 2.Exodus 3.Leviticus 4.Numbers 5.Deuteronomy
The Prophets
6.Joshua 7.Judges & Ruth 8.1st & 2nd Samuel 9.1st &2nd Kings 10. Isaiah 11. Jeremiah & Lamentation 12.Ezekiel
13.The Twelve prophets (Hosea,Joel,Amos,Obadiah,Jonah,Micah,Nahum,Habakkuk,Zepheniah,Haggai,Zechariah,Malachi)
The Writings (Hagiographa)
14.Psalms 15.Proverbs 16.Job 17.Song of Solomon 18.Ezra & Nehemiah 19. 1st & 2nd Chronicles 20.Ecclesiastes 21.Daniel 22.Esther
At the Jewish Council of Jamnia in about 90CE, these Apocrypha book were never included .It is very important to take the stand of the Jews into consideration because of what Paul said in Romans 3:2(Please read). Also,read Ezra 7:1-11. Note thate the Jews are custodian of the word of God.
Also the closing of the Hebrew canon was in the 5th century following the writings of Malachi whereas d Apocryphal books were written many centuries after. No wonder the Jews never recognized them
Another reason never to believe the Apocryphal books is because Jesus and his apostles never for once quoted from these book unlike other books of the original Hebrew canon. Here are few examples
Matthew 4:4 ---- Deuteronomy 8:3
Matthew 4:7 ---- Deuteronomy 6:16
Matthew 4:10 ---- Deuteronomy 10:20
Luke 4:17-21 ---- Isaiah 61:1
Acts 2:3-35 ----- Psalms 110:1
Acts 2:17-21 ---- Joel 2:28,29
Acts 2:31 ---- Psalms 16:10
Romans 10:13 ---- Joel 2:32

Another point is that d Apocrypha books are full of myth and contains statements that contradicts other Bible verses. Here are few examples.
1.Judith1:1,7 calls Nebuchadnezzar d king of Assyria where he is the king of Babylon as the following verses confirm Daniel1:1; 2 Kings 24:1,10,11; 2 Chronicles 36:6;

2. Baruch 6:2 said the Jews wud be exiled in Babylon for 7 generations whereas in Jeremiah 25:11,12; Jeremiah 29:10 it said 70 years whereas 7 generations is more than 70 years

Q4 Jesus never showed any special consideration to Mary. Recall his statments in John 2:1-4; John 19:26. He even rebuked a woman for trying to make Mary so special Luke 11:27,28;. No record of the apostles giving Mary worshipful honour. Even Mary herself viewed herself as a mere slave girl. Luke 1:38

Q5. Mary had other children. It is logical to think so cos she was married to Joseph and obviously had sex repeatedly with Joseph her husband and had kids. Read Matthew 13:55,56; Luke 8:19-21; John 7:5

In addition the intercession by saints is wrong. Our only intercessor is Jesus as 2Timothy2:5,6, Hebrews 4:15; Hebrews 5:1 shows. We dont pray to saint but only to Jehovah the only hearer of prayers Psalms 65:2. Rather than pray for saints to intercede for us they even need out prayers. Read Ephesians 6:18
Also no way an imperfect human can intercede for us as all has sinned and fallen short of God's glory
If u are Catholic please examine the Bible closely and u will see the falsehood promoted by the Catholic church which is never d first church but the beginning of deviatiom from true christianity as handed down to us through the apostles Acts 20:28,29. Revelation 18:4 says we should flee from fals religion and that is what the Catholic church is. Any reliogion that promites lies serves the purpose of the Devil which is blind people from the truth of God's word
John 8:32,44; 2 Corinthians 4:4
Catholics represent the Devil's plan to mislead people. Please flee from it before it is too late. U can also examine the dirty history of the Catholic church filled with blood guilt as they took part in the murderous Spanish Inquisition, sought to suppress the translation of the Bible into other langauges by killing translators like William Tyndale whom they burnt to death. Also the indulgenced of the popes who mixed politics with religion and were responsible for the murderous wars if the past and even in our modern history.
For example it was in Rwanda a Cstgolic dominated country that then murderous genocide took place where Catholic Hutus slaughtered Catholic Tutsis
The only area I agree with u is the issue of wine. Read 1 Timothy 5:23. Even Christ turned water to wine and that is what he drank at the Last supper. Drunkness not drinking is condemned just as gluttony not eating is condemned

LaClicKLaBenDin:
Uncle, please stop twisting the scriptures!
All the people you mentioned who made intercession according to you, were all living. No dead saint can help you, only Christ can!
For there is only one mediator between man and God, and He is Jesus Christ!
I repeat, no dead saint can help you!

I wanted to respond to your ignorance then I saw this answer who spoke just my intension. A perfect answer to your unbelieve.

modestdude:
You cannot claim an overall knowledge of the scriptures. So be humble and not obstinate in your search for the truth.

The rich man who neglected the poor Lazarus on earth interceded to Abraham from Hades for a finger drop of water to cool off his burning tongue. He requested again for Abraham to intercede for him that a prophet be sent to his brothers to warn them not to come to that place of everlasting torment. None of these request was interceded for on his behalf because he is unrighteous and a deep gulf exist between heaven and Hades.

Bro, read it up in Luke 16:19-31

LaClicKLaBenDin:
Uncle, please stop twisting the scriptures!
All the people you mentioned who made intercession according to you, were all living. No dead saint can help you, only Christ can!
For there is only one mediator between man and God, and He is Jesus Christ!
I repeat, no dead saint can help you!

I wanted to respond to your ignorance then I saw this answer below that spoke just my intension. A perfect answer to your unbelieve.

modestdude:
You cannot claim an overall knowledge of the scriptures. So be humble and not obstinate in your search for the truth.

The rich man who neglected the poor Lazarus on earth interceded to Abraham from Hades for a finger drop of water to cool off his burning tongue. He requested again for Abraham to intercede for him that a prophet be sent to his brothers to warn them not to come to that place of everlasting torment. None of these request was interceded for on his behalf because he is unrighteous and a deep gulf exist between heaven and Hades.

LaClicKLaBenDin, pls read it up in Luke 16:19-31

easymancfc:
I gave you a quote already.. you said only Jesus makes intercession, I have showed you the Holy Spirit does also..

The 24 elders in rev 5:8 are humans and since they are in heaven they are saints offering prayers of saints on Earth to God...

Here's a question for you.. what gives you the right to say which interpretation is implied on my own, the Church has had that belief...

Who made you the authority of scripture, to decide who is right and wrong in their interpretation, or which interpretation is personal

Brother, I tire for your matter o... seriously! What's all that you put up there? Simple, tell me who those elders are, and you're writing history.

Your problem is; you read the Bible and then give your own meaning to the things you read, meaning that will aid your erroneous beliefs.

Revelation 5:8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

Please highlight any part of the above scripture that even in the smallest of way, suggests or insinuates that these said elders interceded for the saints.

Please make it simple, no long talks.

LaClicKLaBenDin:
Brother, I tire for your matter o... seriously! What's all that you put up there? Simple, tell me who those elders are, and you're writing history.

Your problem is; you read the Bible and then give your own meaning to the things you read, meaning that will aid your erroneous beliefs.

Revelation 5:8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.

Please highlight any part of the above scripture that even in the smallest of way, suggests or insinuates that these said elders interceded for the saints.

Please make it simple, no long talks.

I have already answered you...
you say I interpret scripture with my own meaning.. with what right do you have to say that?

are you the infallible interpreter of scripture...

I already answered your elder question.. if you can't see the connection then you need lesson teacher

easymancfc:
I have already answered you...
you say I interpret scripture with my own meaning.. with what right do you have to say that?

are you the infallible interpreter of scripture...

I already answered your elder question.. if you can't see the connection then you need lesson teacher

Lol... I can't see any connection between the elders and intercession..please point it out maybe my brain is too small to connect the dots.

Just do this simple thing and I will give you your peace.

LogicStatement:
Q1. Why do Catholics bow to images in the church?
A: Catholics do not bow to images in order to worship them. In fact, it is condemned by God. Ex 20: 1-5 "Then God spoke all these words: I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt,b out of the house of slavery.
You shall not have other gods beside me. You shall not make for yourself an idolc or a likeness of anything* in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth; you shall not bow down before them or serve them.d For I, the LORD, your God, am a jealous God, inflicting punishment for their ancestors’ wickedness on the children of those who hate me, down to the third and fourth generation."
But in Numbers 21: 4-9, God asked Moses to make a bronze image of a snake to save the people of Isreal. "They traveled from Mount Hor along the route to the Red Sea,[a] to go around Edom. But the people grew impatient on the way; 5 they spoke against God and against Moses, and said, “Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? There is no bread! There is no water! And we detest this miserable food!” 6 Then the Lord sent venomous snakes among them; they bit the people and many Israelites died. 7 The people came to Moses and said, “We sinned when we spoke against the Lord and against you. Pray that the Lord will take the snakes away from us.” So Moses prayed for the people. 8 The Lord said to Moses, “Make a snake and put it up on a pole; anyone who is bitten can look at it and live.” 9 So Moses made a bronze snake and put it up on a pole. Then when anyone was bitten by a snake and looked at the bronze snake, they lived."

Now, would you say that God who instructed us not to make images in Genesis is the one instructing Moses in Numbers to make an image of a serpent? Can God contradict Himself? Absolutely not! God did not say images should not be made, but He is against worshiping such images. Therefore, it is imperative to note that God is not against the making of image but against the act of worshiping them. We all have images (pictures or sculptures) in our homes and offices hung on our walls or placed in the house but do we worship them? I doubt! We put them there for beautification, honour and remembrance. Example is the statue of Herbert Macaulay on the Island in Lagos. That statue is not made there for worship but for remembrance and honour and also, it beautifies the area.
Therefore, making of an image is not a sin in itself but worshiping them and acknowledging them the status of God is a sin for God is a jealous God.

Q2: Why does the Catholic Bible have 73 books, while the Protestant Bible has only 66 books?
The Catholic is the church that compiled the bible in about 367 AD when St. Athanasius came up with a list of 73 books for the Bible that he believed to be divinely inspired. This list was finally approved by Pope Damasus I in 382 AD, and was formally approved by the Church Council of Rome in that same year. Later Councils at Hippo (393 AD) and Carthage (397 AD) ratified this list of 73 books. In 405 AD, Pope Innocent I wrote a letter to the Bishop of Toulouse reaffirming this canon of 73 books. In 419 AD, the Council of Carthage reaffirmed this list, which Pope Boniface agreed to. In 16th century, Martin Luther discarded with some books in the bible which he believed does not conform with his own view of theology. Initially, he disagreed with 7 books in the Old Testament which are Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, First Maccabees, and Second Maccabees, as well as additional verses of Daniel and Esther. These books are called the “deuterocanon”, or second canon, by Catholics, and the “apocrypha”, or hidden/obscure, by Protestants (Christians who protest against the Catholic Church) and also, some books in the New Testament which include James, Hebrews, Jude, and Revelation. He actually said that he wanted to “throw Jimmy into the fire”, and that the book of James was “an epistle of straw.” What is strange is that Luther eventually accepted all 27 books of the New Testament that the Catholic Pope Damasus I had approved of in 382 AD, but didn’t accept his Old Testament list. Hence, the 66 books in the Protestant's bible and the foremost of them is King James version which was first compiled by Martin Luther with the help of King Henry VIII in year 1081. Martin Luther was excommunicated by the church for his rebellious act against the body of Christ and for re-inventing his own bible.
This topic is well explained in this thread https://www.nairaland.com/3782829/why-catholic-church-bible-different

Q3: Why do Priests wear different colours of vestments for different occasions
A: The priest wears 5 different colours of vestment during the celebration of Holy Mass depending on the occasion or feast. These vestments are:
Red Vestment: This is worn to celebrate a saint who was killed or martyred.
White Vestment: This signifies purity. It is worn to celebrate Holy Mass during the feat of a saint who died natural death, for virgin Mary's day and also, to signify the holiness of Jesus Christ.
Purple Vestment: Purple signifies royalty and therefore, it is worn during advent (starting 4 weeks to Christmas) in preparation to coming of the King of kings- Jesus Christ.
Gold Vestment: This is worn during the celebration of the church e.g. Golden jubilee, anniversaries etc
Green Vestment: This is worn during ordinary time. Green signifies life.

Q4: Why do Catholics honour Mary?
A: Catholics honour Mary because of the position she occupies in the life of Christ, Christians and importantly, the special grace and favour bestowed upon her by God himself. Jn 19: 25-27 tells us how Jesus on the cross handed over Mary to the disciple He loved to be his mother. The disciple at that moment represented Christians whom Christ loves and handed over his mother to be our mother also. It is logical that the mother of your mentor is your mother also and so, you accord her same respect and honour your mentor will accord her as well. Gen 3:16, Rev 12: 1-7 and Is 7:10 show how God acknowledges the importance of Mary to mankind and thus bestow upon her the highest favour given to any man before or after her. Lk 1: 26-38; 40-42 tells us how angel Gabriel conveyed the mind of God to Mary revealing to her how much favour God has bestowed upon her thus saying to her "hail Mary, full of grace..." and also the greetings of her cousin Elizabeth, "Of all women, you are the most blessed." This greeting was not from Elizabeth herself but inspired by the Spirit of God which through the confirmation she got when the baby in her womb leapt for joy on sighting Mary. These greetings gladdens Mary heart (Lk 2:19). It should be noted that act of honour should not be mistaken for worship. Catholics do not worship Mary because she is NOT God and will never be. The church honours her in a similar way we honour our biological mothers (though in a special way because of the special grace she carries). In Ex 20:12, God asks us to honour our father and mother.

Q5: Does Mary have other Children?
Mary had no other children apart from Jesus. If Mary had other children, Jesus would not have asked the disciple to take Mary home and care for her if not, other children of hers would have been able to do that. Would it not be a slap on the faces of other children that an outsider would take their mother home to take care when they are still alive? Also, Lk 2:41-49 tells us how Jesus was forgotten in the temple by his parents and later found him in the temple preaching after searching for him for 3 days. "Every year Jesus’ parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. 42 When he was twelve years old, they went up to the festival, according to the custom. 43 After the festival was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. 44 Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends. 45 When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. 48 When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, “Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you.” Jesus was 12 years old during this time, and if he had other siblings, would Joseph and Mary left them behind to go to Jerusalem only with Jesus since it is the custom to go with all members of the family? In Matt 12:46, it is written that Jesus's mother and brothers were waiting outside anxious to have a word with him. Does that mean Jesus had other siblings? The first recorded argument was between St. Jerome and another fourth-century theologian, Helvidius, who had written that after the virgin birth of Jesus, Mary had other children with her husband, Joseph. St. Jerome disagreed, indicating that by the fourth century at least some of the church community believed that Mary had stayed a virgin for the rest of her life. These children of Mary, Jerome said, were from Mary of Clopas, Jesus’ aunt and his mother’s sister, making them cousins. He claimed that the Greek word "adelphios" could refer to cousins, not just biological siblings. Same way in Yoruba language, "cousin" has no word instead "aburo" or "egbon" can be used for a biological sibling or relative. Also, if Jesus had sibling, they would have been present during his crucifixion with Mary. In John 19:25, where she is among the women present at the Crucifixion of Jesus: "Now there stood by the cross of Jesus His mother, Mary and His mother's sister, Mary [the wife] of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene." Note that Jesus' mother's sister is also called Mary in this passage but can two biological sisters called the same name within a nuclear family? That proves that Mary the wife of Clopas is not the biological sister of Mary mother of Jesus but a relative because in Greek from where English bible is translated from has no word for cousin or aunt or uncle but once they are related are called brothers or sisters.

Q6: Why do Catholics don't pray for the death of their enemy or curse them but rather, pray for their conversion?
A: In Matt 5: 43-45, Jesus instructs us to love our enemies and pray for those who hate us. 43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. Act 7:55-60, 1Pt 3:8 and 1Cor 3:17 state this fact as well for there is rejoice among the angels of God when a sinner repents (Lk: 15:10)

Q7: Is drinking a sin?
A: Drinking is not a sin, rather getting drunk is a sin (Ep 5:18). Jesus turned water to wine (Jn 2: 1-12). 1Tim 3:8 "In the same way, deacons[b] are to be worthy of respect, sincere, not indulging in much wine, and not pursuing dishonest gain." This shows that drinking of wine is not sin in itself but getting drunk by drinking much of it is sin. Jesus took wine when he was offered vinegar while on the cross (Matt 27: 48). If drinking was a sin, He wouldn't have accepted it. Vinegar wine contains 5-20% acetic acid; 5-8% alcohol. Wine is taken in heaven as well (Matt 26: 26-29).

Does it make sense to you that for thirty three of Jesus ministry Joseph never made love to Mary and even after his death ....Even when God through the angel referred to may as his wife.

Excerpt on the subject matter



Mary had four other sons, Joseph, James, Jude, and Simon. Because of the virgin birth, Joseph was not the father of Jesus so these were the half brothers of Jesus. The last three mentioned are not to be confused with those who were disciples of Jesus by the same name. Here are some passages where the other sons of Mary by Joseph are mentioned (Matt. 12:46; 13:55; Mark 6:3; John 2:12; 7:3, 5, 10; Acts 1:14; 1 Cor. 9:5; Gal. 1:19).

LaClicKLaBenDin:
Lol... I can't see any connection between the elders and intercession..please point it out maybe my brain is too small to connect the dots.

Just do this simple thing and I will give you your peace.

in case you didn't see my earlier response... here it is
The 24 elders are definitely not angels, nor are they Jesus or the Holy Spirit..So what could they be?the word elder comes from the Greek word " presbyteroi".. this word is used about 67 times in the new testament and in every case, representing a"HUMAN MAN" Just do a word search on your Bible or internet, I don't have the patience to go through all of them with you...Some apostles like Peter and John called themselves elders see 1 Peter 5:1,2 john 1:1, 3 john 1:1,Elders were part of the early church see acts 11:30, 14:23, 15:2, 15:4, 15:6, 15:22-23, 16:4, 20:17, 21:18,PAUL said that the Elders laying hands on people could pass power to them.. see 1 Tim 4:14..Paul also says that double honor shouldbe given to the elders who rule 1 Tim 5:17..Paul tells Timothy and Titus to appoint elders see Titus 1:5, 2 Tim 2:2,THE POINT IS, IN ALL THESE INSTANCES ELDERS ARE HUMAN BEINGS, BY DEDUCTION, ELDERS IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION SHOULD REPRESENT HUMANS NO MATTER THE LITERARY GENRE REVELATION WAS WRITTEN IN, IT HAS TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE REST OF THE BIBLE USAGE OF THE WORD

LogicStatement:
I wanted to respond to your ignorance then I saw this answer below that spoke just my intension. A perfect answer to your unbelieve.


Bro, read it up in Luke 16:19-31

Lol...this is laughable, really! A dead rich man in hell right, and being a soul, made a request to another dead saint- The dead talking to the dead!

Now, please tell me, how does this explain and validate the living asking the dead to intercede on their behalf? Please use another Bible passage to confirm your statement.

easymancfc:
You say don't make any images of things in heaven .. and I just showed you where something in heaven was made...

Smart, but not impressive. Point of correction: God said, not I. “Who is he that saith, and it cometh to pass, when the Lord commandeth it not?” (Lamentations 3:37).

Who is he that decreed the bowing down and worship of an idol of 'a' Mary or Jesus?

Splinz:
Smart, but not impressive. Point of correction: God said, not I. “Who is he that saith, and it cometh to pass, when the Lord commandeth it not?” (Lamentations 3:37).

Who is he that decreed the bowing down and worship of an idol of 'a' Mary or Jesus?

If making of Images is objectively Sinful then God would not have commanded them to be made..

AND GOD CANNOT COMMAND US TO DO SOMETHING SINFUL BECAUSE HE HATES SIN