olamy223:
u uni guys should come to agbara industrial estate, make your research. u will find out how HND cert holder are earning millions of dollar per month in their respective company as an engineer. I once had the perspective of switching to uni after my ND program, but seeing those HND engineers who they claim are third class uni graduate earning millions of naira.... can some one pls complete this?

Which agbara industrial estate is this one talking about. Must you even create lies to make your points.

How many people (HND or not) make millions of dollars per month in Nigeria. The Agbara industrial estate that I know is not very good for the HND guys as quite a lot of them are used more as labourers. Their pay is far less than what degree holders earn.


There is nothing like HND engineer. It is a crime for an HND guy to call himself an engineer, It is called impersonation. He could be arrested and jailed for impersonation

chapwiz:
Well, let them discriminate HND am a proud HND holder, and am using it to work in an oil company, those of you shouting B.Sc, B.Eng or B. Tech. what job have you gotten with it? It is not about your Cert. is about what you can offer. have seen many guys in this oil and gas sector with HND Cert. So who cares about their discrimination.

In the oil companies, Degree holders earn several times more than diploma guys.

NairaMaster1:


Really? So blowing grammar is better than regalities?
I was humbled by the poly graduates in our quality control Lab at strides pharmaceuticals. I felt bad.

Speak for yourself.

Where did you get your statistics from?

Wake me up if you are talking from experience or from hearsay?

Although am not a fan of this stupid and baseless arguments but when you use this point as a basis I will not support.

BSC OR HND na d employment wey go bring food to your table

author=haslaw post=65213192]


In the oil companies, Degree holders earn several times more than diploma guys.[/quote]

jossy404:
Where did you get your statistics from?

Wake me up if you are talking from experience or from hearsay?

Although am not a fan of this stupid and baseless arguments but when you use this point as a basis I will not support.

BSC OR HND na d employment wey go bring food to your table

author=haslaw post=65213192]


In the oil companies, Degree holders earn several times more than diploma guys.

I was a graduate intern in ExxonMobil from 2012 to 2013. The career path for diploma holders is completely different from the degree guys. The diploma guys are mostly contract workers who's appointments can easily be terminated while a lot of the degree guys are on permanent appointments.

One guy in my office with both HND and degree in mechanical engineering is always very sad and cranky because he entered ExxonMobil with his diploma because he was yet to complete his university degree at the time he was recruited. Now ExxonMobil refused to place him in the category of degree holders. This is because the company has policy of not upgrading HND to degree equivalent.

haslaw:



Which agbara industrial estate is this one talking about. Must you even create lies to make your points.

How many people (HND or not) make millions of dollars per month in Nigeria. The Agbara industrial estate that I know is not very good for the HND guys as quite a lot of them are used more as labourers. Their pay is far less than what degree holders earn.


There is nothing like HND engineer. It is a crime for an HND guy to call himself an engineer, It is called impersonation. He could be arrested and jailed for impersonation

your believes would make you know nothing, HND graduat,- PGD- NSE exam to be called an engineer- register for COREN to be a registered engineer R.Engr.

according to you, HND grad can never be an engineer until they read further, yes I agreed. also note that it is also called impersonation for a fresh uni grad to use the prefix Engr, not until after five years which he/she is eligible to take the NSE exam

12submarine:

That is a lie. In engineering family, poly graduates are technologists while uni graduates qualify for engineers (having duly registered with the regulating bodies) Engineering is not just about hands on the tools, theories are very important and that is the most difficult aspect of engineering. Good knowledge of the theory of electromagnetic waves is the backbone of all wireless communications and this is note treated extensively in polytechnics. Have you ever wondered why telecom firms prefer uni graduates to poly grad? Engineering is not just about spanner, screw drivers and testers, the most difficult part of engineering is the theory.

Your comment is one of the wisest comments here, you talk with absolute understanding. I totally agree with you.

Rangojack:

Your comment is one of the wisest comments here, you talk with absolute understanding. I totally agree with you.

Don't mind them. They think engineering is about wiring a house or repairing induction motors and generators. That is why you will see a roadside technician boasting how he is better than engineers working in well paying private coys. Is it that those private coys don't know what they are doing? An engineer can actually practise in an air conditioned office with just his laptop. The fact that an experienced nurse has become very proficient in handling syringes and needless doesn't suggest he/she has a better knowledge of medicine than a medical consultant who might not be proficient in using syringes.

Bluffly:

What are you trying to say. Your own government is stupid but the governments that placed associate degree and Full (Hons) degree at different level are wise abi. The problem with you all is that you are not ready to respect the laws of your land. You did not cry that entry requirements be made equal, but you are crying that benefits should be equal. Even in UK, there were polytechnics, and most of them had to convert to a university by meeting all statutory requirements and not by what is obtainable in the labour market.

If you do not understand read up the history of UK which we directly emulated.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytechnic_(United_Kingdom)

https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/former-polytechnics-spread-their-wings/310328.article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1558896/Former-polytechnics-not-in-top-50-universities.html

A polytechnic is a poly while a university is a uni and are statutorily not the same, they were not established by no of years spent but rather the law and if you spend 4 years in poly it was your choice not the government because after your OND you graduated and you have the choice of progressing to university but instead you went for HND which is just a higher diploma but not a degree.

What a fcking dumb slowpoke!

Foooool, did you even read the article before you made this daft comment?

obawinner:
POLYTECHNIC students would be here to exercise their superiority based on practical experience. But I've been on both waters. The practical aspects is load of illusions. Most of their coursework are very outdated. They focus only on their departmental course for five years. I mean no borrowed course from other departments in same faculties. The majority of their lecturers are bachelor of science graduate even at lower cadre, NCe.
Even they would deny that inexperienced corper would teach them a core course in their first year.

You've been on both waters and you lie this much? Please can you tell us the name of the Polytechnic you attended that don't offer borrowed courses from other department and made Corps members/NCE holders lecture you?

Boscolo:
[/b]As a matter of fact, in the UK, the highest diploma awarded in a Polytechnic, a HND, will allow the recipient register for the 2nd year of a 3 year degree. This clearly states that the value is short of a degree.[b]


I hate it when pple just jump on the internet to write rubbish because they have access to data.
HND in the UK is a second level degree programme and you are allowed to apply and ll be admitted to 3rd year, the reason is that HND in the Uk is a two year program total of 240 credit load and when you are admitted into third year you ll have to take the remain 120 credit load which sums up to 360 credit load which is the total crdit load you are required to take before obtainig a degree in the UK.

Nigeria HND is higher than the British HND, because Nigeria HND takes a total of five years to complete (including I.T)and has over 360 credit load (if you sum up the total credit load from ND to HND). In Nigeria Universities the total credit load to obtain a degree is 120, of which you will agree that the Poly guys are being short changed.

Never you compare Nigeria HND to any HND programme in the world because it is higher and "unique " interms of content and credit loads.
Our ministry of education lack the vision to re-structure our HND programme to meet the mordern day system.

Don't get me wrong I'm not here to compare Poly to Uni,no that is no the issue.
It is time the law that established Poly is re-visited, countries like Ghana, Namibia etc have upgraded and started phasing out Poly gradually.

We have always reiterate this on this forum. Nigerian HND is unique, though it was ill-conceived. That is why there has been moves to scrap the award 'HND' and replace it with B.Tech. But like the OP rightly observed, this is not a sane society. It is only in Nigeria that a tertiary institution cannot award degrees if it doesn't carry the nomenclature 'University'. If MIT, CALTECH etc. were in Nigeria, you would have heard confused institutions like COREN saying their graduates are not registrable as 'engineers' because they didn't graduate from a 'University'. The hood doesn't make the monk. The same nomenclature nonsense is what is impeding Colleges of Education from awarding degrees. It is the content that matters. For factual analysis, take the course synopsis for say B.Sc. Electrical/Electronics Engineering in Unilag and compare to the synopsis of ND+HND of Yabatech. You will see the folly in the discrimination and realise why Nigeria will never progress technologically as long as the discrimination subsists. In saner climes lilke the USA and Canada, you can proceed directly for your master's degree with the Nigerian HND! Yes. There are living testimonies (https://www.dailytrust.com.ng/news/notes-from-atlanta/ibrahim-waziri-from-hnd-in-nigeria-to-phd-in-america/161195.html). Those are countries that have institutions like World Education Services, where credentials are evaluated on their merit and not their nomenclature.

Let's for a while agree that HND is inferior to bachelor's degree. The reasonable thing any government will do is to provide a path to bridge the gap. What are the paths available?

1. PGD: Isn't it ironic that a qualification adjuded as not equivalent to a bachelor's degree is now being accepted for admission to a postgraduate programme? No education policy in the world is as confusing as Nigeria's.

2. Direct Entry: Apart from the the nomenclature nonsense, we also have the 'not less than 3years' clause in the laws establishing Universities, as the minimum period an undergraduate must spend in a University to be awarded a bachelor's degree. This is even a greater nonsense. In saner climes, credits are transferred freely from one institution to the other, as long as certain requirements are met. That is why it is possible for a British HND holder to spend just one year in a TOP-UP programme and acquire a bachelor's degree. Our 'wise' education policy formulators however believe that it is best for NCE and HND holders to study for at least 3years (it doens't matter whether new knowledge is being gained) in the University before getting a bachelor's degree, after study of 3 and 5years respectively in their previous institutions. Wonder why our education system is a joke?

Way forward:
1. Scrap HND. Polytechnics should award ND and bachelor's degree in their areas of expertise. Period.

Whether You Are A Polytechnic or University Graduate what matters most in the end is how successful you are, if you like get masters or PhD, the society will always respect ND graduate who is more successful than you are.
Moral of the story: Your capability is the key.

olamy223:
your believes would make you know nothing, HND graduat,- PGD- NSE exam to be called an engineer- register for COREN to be a registered engineer R.Engr.

according to you, HND grad can never be an engineer until they read further, yes I agreed. also note that it is also called impersonation for a fresh uni grad to use the prefix Engr, not until after five years which he/she is eligible to take the NSE exam

The problem with you HND people is your ignorance.

I addressed your point based on what you said not based on what you FAILED to say. Imagine your mumu self going back to your instructors that you have to make additions to your exam script after exams.

Sagamite:


What a fcking dumb slowpoke!

Foooool, did you even read the article before you made this daft comment?

Your entire family is a fo0ol. I knew you won't get the drift. That is how dumb and idiotic in nature you are.

Bluffly:

Your entire family is a fo0ol. I knew you won't get the drift. That is how dumb and idiotic in nature you are.

You are a cretinous fuuktard!

Did you read the article?

Product of a failed education system, how many times did your repeat SSCE before you successfully got 5 credits?

Baboon mooorons want to talk, instead of learning.

The fact that Nigerians allow polytechnic graduates to enroll in a course that will qualify them as a degree holder is the reason why the two are not at par. Some days back, I was at a College of Education in Akoka, near UNILAG, where there was an advert for HND holders, who want to upgrade their qualification.

Olaitqn:
That's crazy.

Polytechnics are equipped with less facilities and at such churn out less prepared graduates than the well equipped Universities

Which university and what equipment are you talking about? Site examples pls.

Sagamite:


You are a cretinous fuuktard!

Did you read the article?

Product of a failed education system, how many times did your repeat SSCE before you successfully got 5 credits?

Baboon mooorons want to talk, instead of learning.

E dey pain you. If you cannot read in between the lines, you can't get. Keep sucking. Summary of the article to help you a bit, As long as they are polythecnic, they remain different from a Uni. Moreover with the focus on UK, none of the Poly converts are in the top 50 in UK, which spells their difference largely after several years of conversion. Keep sucking.

Bluffly:

E dey pain you. If you cannot read in between the lines, you can't get. Keep sucking. Summary of the article to help you a bit, As long as they are polythecnic, they remain different from a Uni. Moreover with the focus on UK, none of the Poly converts are in the top 50 in UK, which spells their difference largely after several years of conversion. Keep sucking.

Oh, so moronic fuuktard, you just finally decided to read the article?

So your daft arse typed this crap without reading it before?

Bluffly:

What are you trying to say. Your own government is stupid but the governments that placed associate degree and Full (Hons) degree at different level are wise abi. The problem with you all is that you are not ready to respect the laws of your land. You did not cry that entry requirements be made equal, but you are crying that benefits should be equal. Even in UK, there were polytechnics, and most of them had to convert to a university by meeting all statutory requirements and not by what is obtainable in the labour market.

If you do not understand read up the history of UK which we directly emulated.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytechnic_(United_Kingdom)

https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/former-polytechnics-spread-their-wings/310328.article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1558896/Former-polytechnics-not-in-top-50-universities.html

A polytechnic is a poly while a university is a uni and are statutorily not the same, they were not established by no of years spent but rather the law and if you spend 4 years in poly it was your choice not the government because after your OND you graduated and you have the choice of progressing to university but instead you went for HND which is just a higher diploma but not a degree.

It is stupidity to compare, am surprise that even the Government is lending her voice on this issue. Polytechnics were set up for a reason not to be at par with University's degree, for instance in the engineering sector the ND and the HND holder were to support the engineers in terms of practical application and interpretation of designs. Any Government that tries to make both equal in any way or give same accordance to both is uninformed,retrogressive and needs its Education Minister fired!