tintingz:
Good.

Why then did he go ahead to create them when he knows what will happen which he doesn't like?

Or why can't he prevent it from happening?

If Allaah created mankind and put them in
His Hell, they would soon argue that He did not test
them or give them the chance to strive.
Allaah wanted to refute this argument, so He created them in this world and gave them reason, and revealed
His Books, and sent His Messengers; all of that is so
that they will have no argument against Allaah on
the Day of Resurrection.

abdulazeez1002:

If Allaah created mankind and put them in
His Hell, they would soon argue that He did not test
them or give them the chance to strive.
Allaah wanted to refute this argument, so He created them in this world and gave them reason, and revealed
His Books, and sent His Messengers; all of that is so
that they will have no argument against Allaah on
the Day of Resurrection.

You still don't see the flaws here.

Like you said Allah already know before creation this terrible cruel punishment will happen, he has the power to stop it from happening but he went ahead with his plan. No matter the messagers he sent or books he revealed these things will still happen, it has been destined except he doesn't know.

Or let me make it more clearer.

A mother knew putting her baby on the floor where there's a needle will be harmful for the baby but she went ahead to put the baby on the floor and the baby swallowed the needle. Who's to be blame here? Why didn't the mother pick the needle from the floor to avoid any harmful thing on her child or she just deliberately leave the needle and and also put the baby on the floor when she knows what will happen?

tintingz:
You still don't see the flaws here.

Like you said Allah already know before creation this terrible cruel punishment will happen, he has the power to stop it from happening but he went ahead with his plan. No matter the messagers he sent or books he revealed these things will still happen, it has been destined except he doesn't know.

Or let me make it more clearer.

A mother knew putting her baby on the floor where there's a needle will be harmful for the baby but she went ahead to put the baby on the floor and baby swallowed the needle. Who's to be blame here? Why didn't the mother pick the needle from the floor or she just deliberately leave the needle and and also leave the baby on the floor when she knows what will happen?

The example you are giving is not related with what we are saying.


Allaah clearly states in many aayahs that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the Messengers, for example He says (interpretation of
the meaning):

“Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will
ask: ‘Did no warner come to you?’

9. They will say: ‘Yes, indeed a warner did come to
us, but we belied him and said: “‘Allaah never sent
down anything (of Revelation)”’”
[al-Mulk 67:8]


We human were given the liberty to earn our paradise, some earned it while some didn't. So who will you blame for those who didn't earn it? Definitely not Allah

abdulazeez1002:

The example you are giving is not related with what we are saying.


Allaah clearly states in many aayahs that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the Messengers, for example He says (interpretation of
the meaning):

“Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will
ask: ‘Did no warner come to you?’

9. They will say: ‘Yes, indeed a warner did come to
us, but we belied him and said: “‘Allaah never sent
down anything (of Revelation)”’”
[al-Mulk 67:8]


We human were given the liberty to earn our paradise, some earned it while some didn't. So who will you blame for those who didn't earn it? Definitely not Allah

You're still dodging the main question, you're attacking straw.

Ok, let's do it like this.

Is Allah all good and all loving?

Does he want evil to exist?

He knows beforehand his creation are not perfect and will be punish for eternity, is this what he love to see?

tintingz:
You're still dodging the main question, you're attacking straw.

Ok, let's do it like this.

Is Allah all good and all loving?

Does he want evil to exist?

He knows beforehand his creation are not perfect and will be punish for eternity, is this what he love to see?

It's you instead that is trying to dodge.
The ones that are entering paradise, are they not Humans?

Allah gave you no excuse.
So what's other reason will stop you from entering inside paradise?

abdulazeez1002:
It's you instead that is trying to dodge.
The ones that are entering paradise, are they not Humans?

Allah gave you no excuse.
So what's other reason will stop you from entering inside paradise?

What other reasons that stop Allah from preventing evil from existing?

Allah knew long before creation these things will happen no matter the warning, he doesn't like evil but then he created it or allowed it to exist. Did he deliberately want people to do evil and punish them?

If freewill can make people do evil and Allah know of this, why then did he give humans freewill to do evil?

If Allah has destined everyone's fate, how is freewill working here?

What exactly does he wants to gain in it?

Allah is said to be is all good, evil can never exist in this case.

tintingz:
What other reasons that stop Allah from preventing evil from existing?

Allah knew long before creation these things will happen no matter the warning, he doesn't like evil but then he created it or allowed it to exist. Did he deliberately want people to do evil and punish them?

If freewill can make people do evil and Allah know of this, why then did he give humans freewill to do evil?

If Allah has destined everyone's fate, how is freewill working here?

What exactly does he wants to gain in it?

Allah is said to be is all good, evil can never exist in this case.

I have said this countless times

Allaah clearly states in many aayahs
that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after
leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the
Messengers

Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will
ask: ‘Did no warner come to you?’
9. They will say: ‘Yes, indeed a warner did come to
us, but we belied him and said: “‘Allaah never sent
down anything (of Revelation)”’”

[al-Mulk 67:8]

abdulazeez1002:
I have said this countless times

Allaah clearly states in many aayahs
that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after
leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the
Messengers

Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Every time a group is cast therein, its keeper will
ask: ‘Did no warner come to you?’
9. They will say: ‘Yes, indeed a warner did come to
us, but we belied him and said: “‘Allaah never sent
down anything (of Revelation)”’”

[al-Mulk 67:8]

Did Allah sent messengers to the Chinese?

Did Allah knew beforehand I will go to hell?

tintingz:
Did Allah sent messengers to the Chinese?

Yeah

Did Allah knew beforehand I will go to hell?

tintingz:

It's depends on your doing

abdulazeez1002:
Yeah

What's the name of this Chinese messenger of Allah and why are Chinese people not Muslims or don't worship Allah?

It's depends on your doing

Does Allah wait for me to do an action before he knows what to do next?

tintingz:
What's the name of this Chinese messenger of Allah and why are Chinese people not Muslims or don't worship Allah?

Allah, may He be exalted, sent Messengers to every
nation and He stated that they came one after
another, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Then We sent Our Messengers in succession, every
time there came to a nation their Messenger, they
denied him, so We made them follow one another
(to destruction), and We made them as Ahadeeth
(the true stories for mankind to learn a lesson from
them). So away with a people who believe not”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:44]


“Verily! We have sent you with the truth, a bearer of
glad tidings, and a warner. And there never was a
nation but a warner had passed among them”

[Faatir 35:24].

Allah has named some of those Messengers and
told us the stories of some of them, but not of many
others.

tintingz:
Does Allah wait for me to do an action before he knows what to do next?

He knows the unseen. Read this below

lest you (pagan Arabs) should say: “If only
the Book had been sent down to us, we would
surely, have been better guided than they (Jews and
Christians).” So now has come unto you a clear
proof (the Qur’aan) from your Lord, and a guidance
and a mercy”
[al-An’aam 6:155-157]

It is clear from these and other aayahs of the
Qur’aan that Allaah does not punish anyone except
after warning and leaving no excuse on the lips of
the Messengers (peace and blessings of Allaah be
upon them). Allaah clearly states in many aayahs
that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after
leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the
Messengers

abdulazeez1002:

Allah, may He be exalted, sent Messengers to every
nation and He stated that they came one after
another, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Then We sent Our Messengers in succession, every
time there came to a nation their Messenger, they
denied him, so We made them follow one another
(to destruction), and We made them as Ahadeeth
(the true stories for mankind to learn a lesson from
them). So away with a people who believe not”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:44]


“Verily! We have sent you with the truth, a bearer of
glad tidings, and a warner. And there never was a
nation but a warner had passed among them”

[Faatir 35:24].

Allah has named some of those Messengers and
told us the stories of some of them, but not of many
others.

He knows the unseen. Read this below

lest you (pagan Arabs) should say: “If only
the Book had been sent down to us, we would
surely, have been better guided than they (Jews and
Christians).” So now has come unto you a clear
proof (the Qur’aan) from your Lord, and a guidance
and a mercy”
[al-An’aam 6:155-157]

It is clear from these and other aayahs of the
Qur’aan that Allaah does not punish anyone except
after warning and leaving no excuse on the lips of
the Messengers (peace and blessings of Allaah be
upon them). Allaah clearly states in many aayahs
that he does not admit anyone to Hell except after
leaving no excuse and warning on the lips of the
Messengers

Mention the name of the Chinese messenger Allah sent to the Chinese people or the Quran is just making empty claims. Why are Chinese not Muslims?

It seems you don't see the flaws written in that fairy book of yours.

You said it depends on my doing before Allah could judge, does this mean he doesn't know all my actions and end before I was born?

@abdulazeez1002, it is better you use your time for better things. Free advice

tintingz:
You still don't see the flaws here.

Like you said Allah already know before creation this terrible cruel punishment will happen, he has the power to stop it from happening but he went ahead with his plan. No matter the messagers he sent or books he revealed these things will still happen, it has been destined except he doesn't know.

The point is you just wanna argue and argue and argue your head out. You are not ready to reason with answers that people give you. You already know the answer in your mind and had a preconceived notions about a subject before. So no matter proofs, sound analogies people give you, you will certainly twist it/turn blind eye to suit your whims. You are not worthy the time and energy. It is not about projecting about you, seriously you are not sincere with yourself and it would be very hard to convince someone who's not sincere with himself.

It is like lending a blind man a pair of reading glasses, wallah it is useless.

tintingz:

Or let me make it more clearer.

A mother knew putting her baby on the floor where there's a needle will be harmful for the baby but she went ahead to put the baby on the floor and the baby swallowed the needle. Who's to be blame here? Why didn't the mother pick the needle from the floor to avoid any harmful thing on her child or she just deliberately leave the needle and and also put the baby on the floor when she knows what will happen?

Sino has answered a similar question to this (on this same thread), but you are not ready to read and understand. You are just ready to ridicule, mock, and claim to be intelligent and play blind games. Argue about things you have little knowledge about.
Read

sino:
The baby needs to be protected by you, cos the baby isn't equipped to make decisions yet! You on the other hand, knows better, but still went on to make a bad decision! Is God to be blamed for this?! Even at that, God still wants you to make the right decision and continues to give you respite, but do you care?!

https://www.nairaland.com/4928579/did-allah-know-what-happen/1#74622904

But Tintingz WILL NEVER see it, and if he does he will play blind game and still went ahead to use the same argument that has been debunked and explained to him on another thread. Very pathetic.

Sino asked you some questions that would have crumbled the foundations of your atheism (if you have answered sincerely) but pride and arrogance won't let you just as Sissie asserted.


He asked

sino:
The question is
Do you know your destiny? If it is hidden, but you sure know you are free to make your own choices, how does that contradict or conflict with your destiny which you do not know?!
I have asked you a couple of times:
Do you feel you are being forced to make your choices?!
Are your choices made consciously?!

Someone having knowledge of all your possible actions and choices, doesn't take away your ability to choose! That someone is not choosing for you, you are making choices for yourself on a daily basis! Except you know the future, your destiny would be dependent on your own actions and choices.

https://www.nairaland.com/4928579/did-allah-know-what-happen/1#74622904


But Boda Taiwo won't answer those questions sincerely because it won't destroy his beliefs and the thread would be rendered meaningless.


So you can continue with your mocking, ridiculing, blind games and be priding yourself in the mediocre knowledge you claim to possess. Wait, I am one of those who are waiting



Peace.

I have left any argument with tingting. I can't have any discussion with a shallow mind like his.

lanrexlan:
@abdulazeez1002, it is better you use your time for better things. Free advice

The point is you just wanna argue and argue and argue your head out. You are not ready to reason with answers that people give you. You already know the answer in your mind and had a preconceived notions about a subject before. So no matter proofs, sound analogies people give you, you will certainly twist it/turn blind eye to suit your whims. You are not worthy the time and energy. It is not about projecting about you, seriously you are not sincere with yourself and it would be very hard to convince someone who's not sincere with himself.

It is like lending a blind man a pair of reading glasses, wallah it is useless.

Red herring, projection fallacy.

We don't have to accept your answers in an argument, it's called a debate for a reason, we will keep refuting, dialogue as long as there are holes and flaws in your arguments.

Sino has answered a similar question to this (on this same thread), but you are not ready to read and understand. You are just ready to ridicule, mock, and claim to be intelligent and play blind games. Argue about things you have little knowledge about.
Read


https://www.nairaland.com/4928579/did-allah-know-what-happen/1#74622904

Strawman!

Please understand what my position is. I'm here to question your position as long as flaws keeps coming.

But Tintingz WILL NEVER see it, and if he does he will play blind game and still went ahead to use the same argument that has been debunked and explained to him on another thread. Very pathetic.

Strawman!

Sino asked you some questions that would have crumbled the foundations of your atheism (if you have answered sincerely) but pride and arrogance won't let you just as Sissie asserted.


He asked


https://www.nairaland.com/4928579/did-allah-know-what-happen/1#74622904

This is ridiculous!

We're trying to point out which is an illusion. Is it freewill or destiny?

Let me ask simple question to refute this nonsense.

Does God knows my end?

Does God knows every action, choices I make before I was born?

Can they be changed?

But Boda Taiwo won't answer those questions sincerely because it won't destroy his beliefs and the thread would be rendered meaningless.

Red herring.

So you can continue with your mocking, ridiculing, blind games and be priding yourself in the mediocre knowledge you claim to possess. Wait, I am one of those who are waiting



Peace.

Another red herring!

Your post here is full of fallacies. You're just like a cheer leader.

A red herring is something that misleads or distract from a relevant or important issue. It may be either a logical fallacy or a literary device that leads readers or audiences towards a false conclusion.

A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man."

abdulazeez1002:
I have left any argument with tingting. I can't have any discussion with a shallow mind like his.

LMAO!

I guess you can't deal with logic.

tintingz:
Red herring, projection fallacy.

We don't have to accept your answers in an argument, it's called a debate for a reason, we will keep refuting, dialogue as long as there are holes and flaws in your arguments.

That's the problem, you just wanna refute and refute without direction. Religious dialogues are to arrive at the truth, not who's right nor wrong. Since you are not ready to accept answers, what is the purpose of asking the questions? To mock? To ridicule? It is a waste of time replying your threads.


And Mr man, you are not dialouing. You are just arguing blindly. You can't even answer the questions, you are just shouting "Red herring" upandan. That's the latest type of fallacies you just read It still dey shack you

I am not here to debate or dialogue with you. It is a waste of time. You are not worthy of the stress.

Bye bye

lanrexlan:
That's the problem, you just wanna refute and refute without direction. Religious dialogues are to arrive at the truth, not who's right nor wrong. Since you are not ready to accept answers, what is the purpose of asking the questions? To mock? To ridicule? It is a waste of time replying your threads.


And Mr man, you are not dialouing. You are just arguing blindly. You can't even answer the questions, you are just shouting "Red herring" upandan. That's the latest type of fallacies you just read It still dey shack you

I am not here to debate or dialogue with you. It is a waste of time. You are not worthy of the stress.

Bye bye

Sigh ok.

Does God does knows my end before I was born, if yes, can it be changed, if yes, does God knows it will be changed before I was born?

If God wait for me to make a choice before he could judge, does this depict an all knowing God?

Is it part of God's plan to allow evil to exist?

Muslims here confused destiny, freewill with determinism.

tintingz:
LMAO!

I guess you can't deal with logic.

Ok

aadoiza:

So for your mind now, I dey fear you. You people no go kill me with your sarcasm.

If you were half a scientist you think you are, by now, you'd see the telltale indolence in your approach to science.

I was actually doing you a world of good but you've exposed yourself of your own volition, again!! And no amount of damage limitation will spare you.

Lol, you are always attacking a straw man. You don't need to make me the argument. I maintain, that I don't need to discover anything before I can discuss science. If you are not lazy in thinking, or perhaps you don't think at all, does that statement mean I will not discover anything or I will not carry out experiments?

Leave my approach to science out of it and tackle the issue, the topic of debate. You are not in the position to comment on my approach to science. Don't make it an issue, you're already unscientific to assume the rights to judge or make comments on how people approach science.

Akin1212:


Lol, you are always attacking a straw man. You don't need to make me the argument. I maintain, that I don't need to discover anything before I can discuss science. If you are not lazy in thinking, or perhaps you don't think at all, does that statement mean I will not discover anything or I will not carry out experiments?

Leave my approach to science out of it and tackle the issue, the topic of debate. You are not in the position to comment on my approach to science. Don't make it an issue, you're already unscientific to assume the rights to judge or make comments on how people approach science.

I don hear you.

Akin1212:


Lol, you are always attacking a straw man. You don't need to make me the argument. I maintain, that I don't need to discover anything before I can discuss science. If you are not lazy in thinking, or perhaps you don't think at all, does that statement mean I will not discover anything or I will not carry out experiments?

Leave my approach to science out of it and tackle the issue, the topic of debate. You are not in the position to comment on my approach to science. Don't make it an issue, you're already unscientific to assume the rights to judge or make comments on how people approach science.

I don hear you.

Ahh...you have open you heart for shayton to place rumors there..
Truly, Allah knows it will happen but Allah don't stopped it from happen because if it doesn't happen and Allah told them that you may have among the loser if not for I had saved you.. Do you think they will believe..
Allah (Subuhanahu Was Tahala) want us to witness our acts and behavior..
Why do you think prophets are sent down..to warn us of course.. And I think the Second reason is that, Allah wants to separate those who are evil from us..
Apart from the work of iblis(angel-> Satan) some may be wicked among us..all hands are not equal..remember, we are here for test...
I used to call this world AN EXAMINATION HALL..

Tummite:
Ahh...you have open you heart for shayton to place rumors there..
Truly, Allah knows it will happen but Allah don't stopped it from happen because if it doesn't happen and Allah told them that you may have among the loser if not for I had saved you.. Do you think they will believe..
Allah (Subuhanahu Was Tahala) want us to witness our acts and behavior..
Why do you think prophets are sent down..to warn us of course.. And I think the Second reason is that, Allah wants to separate those who are evil from us..
Apart from the work of iblis(angel-> Satan) some may be wicked among us..all hands are not equal..remember, we are here for test...
I used to call this world AN EXAMINATION HALL..

What does Allah want to gain from people witnessing for themselves of their deeds when he already knows who's good and bad before he even created them?

The event(myth) of Sodom and Gomorrah can be avoided if Allah is actually all-good.