TheArranger:
Two evangelicals came to my door and told me that if evolution were real, they would be able to evolve hats atop their heads on a hot day instead of needing to purchase them. Like bruh....

I was so amused that I decided to see what else they would say, and we ended up talking for a good 20 minutes, starting with a ground-level explanation of evolutionary theory. They didn't get more insane than the hat-evolution remark though. Just seemed like ignorant, deeply misled kids doing what they were told to do.

As the conversation moved forward, I started applying my values-based communications training to the encounter with the goal of making them like me, then whipped it all around on the fellas at the end of our chat by revealing that I'm an atheist. They were astonished and said they thought atheists were all self-centered, unkind people. Then I gave the younger one of the two men, who looked no older than like 21 or 22, a copy of "The God Delusion" and said I didn't expect him to read it until he had questions of his own that his theology could not answer. He thanked me, and the older man complimented me on my attitude toward people with differing views.

In all, it felt like I made a tiny bit of difference.

TheArranger:
Two evangelicals came to my door and told me that if evolution were real, they would be able to evolve hats atop their heads on a hot day instead of needing to purchase them. Like bruh....

I was so amused that I decided to see what else they would say, and we ended up talking for a good 20 minutes, starting with a ground-level explanation of evolutionary theory. They didn't get more insane than the hat-evolution remark though. Just seemed like ignorant, deeply misled kids doing what they were told to do.

As the conversation moved forward, I started applying my values-based communications training to the encounter with the goal of making them like me, then whipped it all around on the fellas at the end of our chat by revealing that I'm an atheist. They were astonished and said they thought atheists were all self-centered, unkind people. Then I gave the younger one of the two men, who looked no older than like 21 or 22, a copy of "The God Delusion" and said I didn't expect him to read it until he had questions of his own that his theology could not answer. He thanked me, and the older man complimented me on my attitude toward people with differing views.

In all, it felt like I made a tiny bit of difference.

TheArranger:
Two evangelicals came to my door and told me that if evolution were real, they would be able to evolve hats atop their heads on a hot day instead of needing to purchase them. Like bruh....

I was so amused that I decided to see what else they would say, and we ended up talking for a good 20 minutes, starting with a ground-level explanation of evolutionary theory. They didn't get more insane than the hat-evolution remark though. Just seemed like ignorant, deeply misled kids doing what they were told to do.

As the conversation moved forward, I started applying my values-based communications training to the encounter with the goal of making them like me, then whipped it all around on the fellas at the end of our chat by revealing that I'm an atheist. They were astonished and said they thought atheists were all self-centered, unkind people. Then I gave the younger one of the two men, who looked no older than like 21 or 22, a copy of "The God Delusion" and said I didn't expect him to read it until he had questions of his own that his theology could not answer.
He thanked me, and the older man complimented me on my attitude toward people with differing views.
In all, it felt like I made a tiny bit of difference.

Ihedinobi3:
What's "evangelicals"?

MuttleyLaff:
Evangelicals somewhat or not, are Christians

Ihedinobi3:
I know that. I was wondering why he identified those two specific individuals as evangelicals. I wouldn't be surprised if he met Mormons and called them evangelicals just because he wants to make a point against biblical Christianity.

TheArranger:
Two evangelicals came to my door and told me that if evolution were real, they would be able to evolve hats atop their heads on a hot day instead of needing to purchase them. Like bruh....

OpenYourEyes1:
According to darwin, complex creatures evolve from more simplistic ancestors naturally over time."

If the above is true, apes should be the most advanced life form after humans . Questions is why are apes not builders instead we have builders from "less advanced" life form like birds, termites, bees, squirrels, grasscutters, etc.

Learn to think for yourselves and stop relying on myths.

Zither:


When I read where he gave the guys a copy of The God Delusion with the irony surrounding it this really cracked me up.

IAmSabrina:

What irony?

TVSA:
I never liked the idea of evangelism even when I was still a believer. It has this arrogant tone, going to people's house to tell them your belief and proclaim judgement on them if they did not agree with you. The worst part was persuading people to follow you to church

Zither:


Not speaking in defense of anything but I believe they seek your permission first before speaking to you about their belief which I know it lies in your power to decline. You make it sound like they foist their belief down the throat of anyone and everyone they approach which is rather unfair to them especially now you deem yourself no longer associated with their belief system.

Zither:


The irony that the "delusion" in question is a reflection staring back at its "owner" who tries to "give" it to someone else in the hope of curing them of their delusion.

Ihedinobi3:

Excuse my intrusion, but I thought to use the opportunity to point out a thing or two.

You have a point. I doubt that many evangelists foist their beliefs on anyone. The biblical position is really that the Gospel should only ever be offered to those who want it. So, it does make sense and is to be expected that good evangelists would not throw their faith in other people's faces. It is too precious, after all, to offer to people who have no sense of value for it. In fact, I believe that the gift of evangelist gives believers who possess it and are spiritually mature and tested for ministry a special ability to identify evangelical opportunities.

Personally, I have very little sense of evangelical opportunity. When I was much younger, I was not even aware of such a thing as evangelical opportunity. I'd just walk up to people and start berating them with what I thought they needed to hear. It was what we were taught we should do. As I grew up, I did it less and less. When I eventually began to learn the Bible seriously, I accepted completely for the first time that while, like every other believer, I am responsible to share the gospel with unbelievers willing to hear it, I am not by a long shot any kind of evangelist. It is very hard for me to even find a way in to speak to an unbeliever about the Lord, so I almost never do. My own gift is far more abrasive. If anyone comes to the Lord Jesus as a result of interacting with me, they would be really humble people because I am far more of a protector than a scout. I do lace everything I say with the Gospel but I don't really go out of my way to "preach to the lost".

Unfortunately, not many believers take the Bible seriously enough to know both how these things work or how to handle people like the OP.

TVSA:
I agree with you Zither. But when you give them a chance out of courtesy, then they pass their boundary. A guy kept coming back to my place just to lure me to his church. I later realised it was their church mandate to win certain number of souls per person to the kingdom.

IAmSabrina:

Define delusion

Zither:


IAmSabrina, I am very familiar with this path. I know it might seem uncharacteristic but can we not argue for a change? Can we actually interact without recourse to verbal fisticuffs?

IAmSabrina:

IAmSabrina:


[img]https://media./images/1ce9f6abc85a38b08311542ea6dbef7a/tenor.gif[/img]

Martinez39:
He saw what was coming and ran for safety . He is a wise man.

Zither:


No intrusion committed. This, as every other thread in this section, is a discussion board so feel free to "intrude".

Your experience goes to show we learn. We make mistakes as Christians but we learn. It is God's gift of grace at work. No preacher, or evangelist should subject others to involuntary audience of their preaching in the sense of holding or detaining them at a spot till they are done preachingtill to them. This approach is infuriating and un-Christlike. Even Christ had to leave a city when the people of the city begged him to depart from there after news of his deliverance of a demon-possessed man had spread to the city.

If a person is not willing to listen to what one has to say about Christ then the wise reaponse is to let them be. They must be willing otherwise the preacher or the evangelist risks being adjudged a fanatic.

Truly, I commend your approach towards reaching out to the lost who are willing to hear. This should be our approach towards evangelism. Like you said, believers should be open to opportunities for evangelism, and not force their religious opinion on others.

But for the most part, I believe it is wiser to couch the Gospel in language that allows the hearer to completely ignore it if they please.

sufficient to keep them spiritually safe from such people.

Zither:
Ihedinobi3, you've made much sense in this post of yours. I am wowed.

When you linked aggressive opposition to the truth and Christian persecution by unbelievers with the unbelievers' need to defend their conviction of what is deemed "truth" to them I couldn't agree with you more. This calls to memory the book, Foxe's Book of Martyrs.



This sums it up nicely.

However, to be fair to unbelievers, not all house murderous tendencies in their minds in order to defend their conviction from the age-long threat of being exposed as the falsity it is, but since you also associated this possibility with the prophesied Tribulation phase this is a certainty. After all history always repeats itself.

The most important thing, I would add, is for the believer to learn how to abide in Christ. While reaching out to the lost this will guarantee a means that is

A remarkable exposition that underscores the theme of the irreconcilable difference between the notion of truth and its justification.

Ihedinobi3:

We're exactly of the same mind.

Regarding unbelievers, I did say,

"Of course, not all unbelievers head that way. Some do begin to take a more critical, objective look at the house of dreams they have built for themselves and ask if they might not truly be lies."

We were all unbelievers once, after all. Nobody was born a believer. That is a perspective worth hanging on to because once we lose it, we become unbearably arrogant.

In fact, during the Tribulation, not every unbeliever will throw in with Antichrist. Plenty enough of them will refuse to take his mark or join in the persecution of Christians. Not so plenty that it will make a difference though. In fact, such people will be comparatively very few indeed and possibly far between. It is possible to be an indifferent believer. The vast majority of unbelievers today are indifferent about spiritual matters. They don't care what the Truth is. They want to live life on their terms and worry about the consequences later, whenever that may be.

Unfortunately, however nice and non-threatening an unbeliever may be in their indifference, they are not friends to the Truth, so even after living under the perfect conditions of life in the Millennial Earth under the Rule of the Lord Jesus, they will rise up to try to overthrow Him. So, it will never be a good idea to expect much from an unbeliever. One may hope that some dear one may be saved because they are so nice, but unbelief is by definition implacable enmity against God. It is a refusal to give God His Due. The unbeliever accuses God of lying in one way or another even if they never admit such a thing. So, they are not people we should expect much from.

The most important thing to keep in mind about unbelievers, in my thinking, is that as long as they are alive, they may yet repent and believe... Or they may not. So, we ought not to treat them like they could never become part of our family or as though it is absolutely certain that they will be. This is another place where we must be gentle and harmless like doves and very shrewd like snakes.

Zither:


On point. I am of the same opinion as well. One most important reason I don't want to engage in argument with them anymore is that the only job of the Christian is to tell them the message, that is, if they're willing to hear. The job of convicting them of their sins belongs to the Holy Spirit. Argument, as you know, has done nothing but fan the flame of their unbelief.

Come to think of it, if they won't listen to Jesus knocking on their hearts will they listen to us imploring them to open their hearts to Jesus? I doubt it much.

As regards the Millennial Reign after which is the Armageddon, the unbelievers will wage war against Christ and His Redeemed because they would have come to terms with their fate as any unbeliever who is alive at that time must definitely have taken the mark of the Beast OR worshipped his image so they acknowledge that their condemnation is certain even if they get to taste a very very little of paradise on earth. This informs why they will readily take up arms against the King of kings and His people after the devil has been released from his 1000 years of torment in the Bottomless Pit.

The fact that they cannot all be saved is a truism. Only we pray that many be saved so they can be snatched from the fire. The believers too should tread very carefully when reaching out to them so that their actions do not result in the unbelievers drifting further away from Christ, neither should they let their guards down so that they are drawn into the perdition of the lost and be disqualified from the race.