₦airaland Forum

rdokoye:
China isn't building entire cities to house their own nationals in foreign countries. Do you even listen to yourself? Is that even possible? Could USA build a city in Nigeria to house American nationals? It's not possible unless you have control over the immigration policy of that specific nation. One million Chinese people couldn't just up and move to Nigeria, because they'd need the Nigerian governments permission to do so.

That said, the city building myth, was originally built on the supposed ghost city in Angola. However, that city has since been filled up, with ANGOLANS.

When it comes to debt. The West is in no position to talk about that. Didn't the Western World indebt every single country in Africa? How old are you? Haven't you ever heard of the Third World Debt? Western financial institutions (Word Bank & IMF), indebted every country in Africa, to the tune of billions, and they did so, through the use of their ECONOMIC HITMEN.

If the Chinese were as malicious and myopic as the West, they would have indebted Africa a long time ago. I mean, what's the point in cancelling African debts, every single year, if your sole intentions is to indebt the continent? NO, China's sole motivations are to create an Eastern Bloc, encompassing China and the African continent, in opposition to the West.

They have no colonial desires - which is pretty much impossible today, anyway. Nor do they want to up and leave China for Africa.

You are just a dreamer lost in his hatred for the west.

I hope you know that there are over 2million Chinese in Africa and they are still growing
On the issue of cities been built by the Chinese it is obvious you don't know or understand what economic exclusive zone means.

You are quick to blame the west for African debts and undevelopment , but that is naive for one to think that Africa is undeveloped because of western debt.

The truth is Africa is were it is because of its inherent corruption and stupidity not debt.

Go and read about Singapore, Taiwan,South Korea all this nations borrowed from the same Western sources that the African nations borrowed from, and even at higher interest rate but look at them today they invested the money borrowed properly and repaid the loan when due from the proceeds from the investment while African nations were busy loot both loan,interest and capital.
Is there any country without debt?
US the World largest economy owes trillions in debt.
Dubai the mega city is majority built through debt financing of properties and infrastructure.

Africa will remain were they are irrespective of who they partner all less they get there acts right.

babasolution:
if u dnt how its beneficial to Africa then you dnt knw anything

I would take you serious when you can give facts.

rdokoye:
China isn't building entire cities to house their own nationals in foreign countries. Do you even listen to yourself? Is that even possible? Could USA build a city in Nigeria to house American nationals? It's not possible unless you have control over the immigration policy of that specific nation. One million Chinese people couldn't just up and move to Nigeria, because they'd need the Nigerian governments permission to do so.

That said, the city building myth, was originally built on the supposed ghost city in Angola. However, that city has since been filled up, with ANGOLANS.

When it comes to debt. The West is in no position to talk about that. Didn't the Western World indebt every single country in Africa? How old are you? Haven't you ever heard of the Third World Debt? Western financial institutions (Word Bank & IMF), indebted every country in Africa, to the tune of billions, and they did so, through the use of their ECONOMIC HITMEN.

If the Chinese were as malicious and myopic as the West, they would have indebted Africa a long time ago. I mean, what's the point in cancelling African debts, every single year, if your sole intentions is to indebt the continent? NO, China's sole motivations are to create an Eastern Bloc, encompassing China and the African continent, in opposition to the West.

They have no colonial desires - which is pretty much impossible today, anyway. Nor do they want to up and leave China for Africa.

I hope you know that the Chinese are expanding there military might and resources in Africa e.g the new Chinese military base in Djibouti.
Have you ever looked at the quality of job the Chinese are constructing for Africa or you are busy chasing shadows(the West).

Barley 5yrs after construction In Nigeria, the much- applauded Abuja-Kaduna railway commissioned in 2016 has
already got stories of breakdown of trains. The
Chinese infrastructural development in Africa are
designed to keep her in control of these
infrastructures.

I hope you know that it was this same approach that the Chinese used to trap the Sri lanka.

https://www.axios.com/sri-lanka-rupee-debt-belt-and-road-initiative-china-india-11ebf8c1-d0bb-4524-9f05-a7d5cc3ac093.html.

blueAgent:
THE TAKEOVER: CHINA IS BUILDING ENORMOUS SELF-
SUSTAINING CHINESE CITIES ALL OVER THE AFRICAN
CONTINENT
When it comes to foreign policy, China is playing chess while
most of the western powers are playing checkers
Michael Snyder | End of the American Dream - DECEMBER 31,
2019 73 Comments
IMAGE CREDITS: WIKIMEDIA COMMONS .

During colonial times, European powers exploited Africa for
the vast resources that it possesses.
But what China is doing today is actually much worse.
Alex Jones is live right now covering China’s takeover of
cyberspace as well as our 3D universe.
Yes, the Chinese greatly desire African resources, but
ultimately what they want is Africa itself.
But instead of conquering Africa using military force, China is
using economics instead.
Today, more than 10,000 Chinese-owned firms are operating
in Africa, and virtually every major road, bridge, railway and
skyscraper is being built by the Chinese.
As a result, most African nations are very deeply indebted to
China at this point.
And as you will see below, when those debts go bad that gives
the Chinese a tremendous amount of leverage.
Many people believe that the endgame for China is to make a
whole lot more money and to gain control over a whole lot
more resources. And China is undoubtedly pursuing those
goals, but as Forbes has noted , ultimately what this is about is
turning Africa “into another Chinese continent”…

The reason Chinese corporations are in Africa is simple; to
exploit the people and take their resources. It’s the same
thing European colonists did during mercantile times,
except worse. The Chinese corporations are trying to turn
Africa into another Chinese continent . They are squeezing
Africa for everything it is worth.
Right now, approximately two million Chinese citizens already
live in Africa, and that number is steadily rising with each
passing month.
These days, it is difficult to find a major construction project
on the continent that is not being handled by the Chinese, and
this has enabled them to put their imprint on some of the
largest African cities. For example, just check out what is
happening in Nairobi, Kenya…

On the outskirts of Nairobi, Kenya, a small sign points to
“Beijing Road,” where a new housing development called
the Great Wall Apartments looks like the concrete towers
you’d find in a Chinese city.
Across Africa, Chinese developers are building highways,
light rail systems, apartment buildings, and entire cities .
Most of the “cities” that China is building are known as
“special economic zones”. These “special economic zones”
are essentially enormous self-sustaining Chinese cities that
have been dropped right into some of the most strategic parts
of Africa. For example, one of the biggest has been built right
next to Lagos, Nigeria …

Next to Lagos, Nigeria, Chinese developers have built a
walled-off “special economic zone”–basically a separate
city, with separate rules designed to attract investors –
based on a model they’ve used inside China for the last 30
years. After Shenzhen became a special economic zone in
the 1980s, it went from a small town of 20,000 to, by some
counts, 15 million today.
In these “special economic zones”, you will find Chinese
factories staffed with Chinese managers that are supervising
Chinese workers that are using Chinese equipment to make
their products.
And the size of some of these projects is absolutely
staggering. Just check out what has been planned for an area
along the coast of Tanzania …

Bagamoyo, if the project goes ahead as planned, will be
transformed into the largest port in Africa. That is looking
ever more likely: after years of delay, the Tanzanian
government says it is in the final stages of talks with state-
run China Merchants Holdings International.
The lagoon will be dredged, to allow access to the vast
cargo ships that will queue many miles out to sea. As for
the special economic zone, the original masterplan shows
factories in a fenced-off industrial area, and apartment
blocks to accommodate the estimated future population of
75,000. There is even talk of an international airport. Many
of the villagers have already accepted compensation for the
loss of their homes.
Of course Chinese development is definitely not limited to
these “special economic zones”. In Ethiopia, the capital city of
the entire nation is literally becoming known as “the city that
China built” …

Cars chug through the city on smooth Chinese roads,
Chinese cranes lift the skyline, sewing machines hum in
Chinese factories in Chinese-owned industrial parks,
tourists arrive at the Chinese-upgraded airport and
commuters ride modern Chinese trains to work.
Simply put, Addis Ababa is becoming the city that China
built — but at what diplomatic and economic cost?
Are you starting to get the picture?
As the western world sleeps, the Chinese are literally taking
over an entire continent.
And as they increasingly dominate the landscape
economically, they are bringing their culture with them as
well …

Chinese influence also goes beyond physical infrastructure.
Now it’s possible to pick up a copy of China Daily, China’s
state-run newspaper, in some African cities, and watch
CCTV, China’s state-run news channel. Some cities have
Chinese language schools, and some African students are
given grants to go study in China.
Apologists for China could point out that all of this
development has pulled millions of Africans out of poverty.
And that is true.
But all of this development also carries with it a very hefty
price tag …

China is now Africa’s biggest trade partner, with Sino-
African trade topping $200 billion per year. According to
McKinsey, over 10,000 Chinese-owned firms are currently
operating throughout the African continent, and the value of
Chinese business there since 2005 amounts to more than $
2 trillion, with $300 billion in investment currently on the
table. Africa has also eclipsed Asia as the largest market
for China’s overseas construction contracts. To keep this
momentum building, Beijing recently announced a $1 billion
Belt and Road Africa infrastructure development fund and,
in 2018, a whopping $60 billion African aid package, so
expect Africa to continuing swaying to the east as
economic ties with China become more numerous and
robust.
Needless to say, the Chinese are not doing all of this out of
the goodness of their hearts. African governments are going
very deep into debt in order to afford all of this infrastructure,
and several of them are now in way over their heads…

There have already been warning signs: the $4 Addis
Ababa-Djibouti Railway ended up costing Ethiopia nearly a
quarter of it’s total 2016 budget, Nigeria had to renegotiate
a deal with their Chinese contractor due to their failure to
pay, and Kenya’s 80% Chinese-financed railway from
Mombasa to Nairobi has already gone four times over
budget, costing the country upwards of 6% of it’s GDP.
This is the sort of predatory lending that western powers once
did so well, but now China has taken things to an entirely new
level.
And once China has an African government by the throat, they
can be absolutely ruthless …

There have been credible reports of talks between the
Zambian government and China on handing over the
country’s national electricity company, ZESCO to the
Chinese due to the inability of Zambia to meet its loan
repayment promises. This is expected as China is already
in control of the country’s broadcasting company, ZNBC.
There are also fears the main airport in Lusaka could be
the next target.
Obliviously, Zambia is in trouble. And for other African
beneficiaries of Chinese loans, they should prepare for the
same possibility in the eventuality that they aren’t able to
repay China.
Basically, Zambia is in the process of becoming totally owned
by China.
And this is going to happen in country after country until
someone stops them.
But who is going to stop them?
After all, the U.S. is about a trillion dollars in debt to the
Chinese at this point.
When it comes to foreign policy, China is playing chess while
most of the western powers are playing checkers.
They are literally running circles around us, and we are so
clueless that we don’t even understand what is happening.

https://www.infowars.com/the-takeover-china-is-building-enormous-self-sustaining-chinese-cities-all-over-the-african-continent/

Cheap propaganda:

If Chinese people dominate us in our own tuff, we are responsible for it period.

Before China started investing heavenly in Africa by early 2000 the Economist magazine wrote off Africa as wasted & dark continent destined to die off from aids, wars, poverty, backwardness etc.

Today, after 20yrs of China in Africa (compared with 400yrs of Western involvement), Afica Profile is rising in all aspects, be it life expectancy, infrastructure, investment inflows, Rwanda, Afrobeat music (yes there's a connection to it), smart phones/internet penetration, the whole world having interest in Africa,... I can go on and on, while there are countries trying to counter these progress coming to Africa. We Africans are fools(especially we Nigerians) to the core and we will start dieing again in our millions without knowing why we will be dieing. The cheap propaganda of debt trap, the warning from the Nigerian government that France is the one sponsoring bokoharam, Sixty percentage of Western military hardwares in South China Sea right now, of which (100%) of China trade with Africa pass through this straight, trade war on China because some Powers are afraid of what will become of Africa by 2050......do you want me to keep going on and on about how foolish and backward we are here in Nigeria. Don't forget Eco, all of them are all tied into this geo-econmic-military-political puzzles most of you Yorubas unity beggers can't figure out.

blueAgent:
You are just a dreamer lost in his hatred for the west.

I hope you know that there are over 2million Chinese in Africa and they are still growing
On the issue of cities been built by the Chinese it is obvious you don't know or understand what economic exclusive zone means.

You are quick to blame the west for African debts and undevelopment , but that is naive for one to think that Africa is undeveloped because of western debt.

The truth is Africa is were it is because of its inherent corruption and stupidity not debt.

Go and read about Singapore, Taiwan,South Korea all this nations borrowed from the same Western sources that the African nations borrowed from, and even at higher interest rate but look at them today they invested the money borrowed properly and repaid the loan when due from the proceeds from the investment while African nations were busy loot both loan,interest and capital.
Is there any country without debt?
US the World largest economy owes trillions in debt.
Dubai the mega city is majority built through debt financing of properties and infrastructure.

Africa will remain were they are irrespective of who they partner all less they get there acts right.

Please my brother, I don't know who you are and how old. I command you to six months of intensive African history/Chinese history at least from 1500 on wards..in Jesus name Amen.

blueAgent:
You are just a dreamer lost in his hatred for the west.

I hope you know that there are over 2million Chinese in Africa and they are still growing
On the issue of cities been built by the Chinese it is obvious you don't know or understand what economic exclusive zone means.

You are quick to blame the west for African debts and undevelopment , but that is naive for one to think that Africa is undeveloped because of western debt.

The truth is Africa is were it is because of its inherent corruption and stupidity not debt.

Go and read about Singapore, Taiwan,South Korea all this nations borrowed from the same Western sources that the African nations borrowed from, and even at higher interest rate but look at them today they invested the money borrowed properly and repaid the loan when due from the proceeds from the investment while African nations were busy loot both loan,interest and capital.
Is there any country without debt?
US the World largest economy owes trillions in debt.
Dubai the mega city is majority built through debt financing of properties and infrastructure.

Africa will remain were they are irrespective of who they partner all less they get there acts right.

Well, I was born and raised in the West, so I am Western and I don't "hate" the West, nor its people. I'm just speaking (writing) the honest truth.

Where did you get that statistic from? There are 5 million Chinese people in America. A country of 300+ million people. Africa is a continent of 1.1 billion souls. 1 or 2 million Chinese immigrants is relatively small. But again, as I previously stated. It makes sense that there would be Chinese people migrating to Africa.

That aside, there are over 15 million Africans of European descent. So if you don't see any problem with white people living and migrating to Africa (Mozambique and Angola recorded over 80k Portuguese migrants, in a single year), then you shouldn't have a problem with the Chinese.

I didn't blame the West for anything. I brought up the Third World Debt. Again, how old are you? American Economic Hitman John Perkins came out and admitted that they intentionally indebted Africa, and various other countries around the world.

Africa is where it is, because of its history. If African people were stupid and inherently corrupt, by definition, they wouldn't exist. So your thinking is oxymoronic.

Well, go and tell John Perkins, that he's lying. This is a unique situation where you're hearing the words from the horse's mouth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWuAct1BxHU

Or are you going to say, this white man is lying? In your quest to side with European peoples, despite the horrendous treatment they've meted out to African people, for the past 500 years? What have Chinese people done to ever arouse your suspicion? You're thinking is totally illogical.

And your example nations are weak. I can't believe you mentioned Dubai. Dubai is not even a country. I think you mean UAE, and the UAE is one of, if not the most oil rich nation on earth. Nations like Singapore and South Korea, owe their development primarily to the politics of the time (communism).

blueAgent:
I hope you know that the Chinese are expanding there military might and resources in Africa e.g the new Chinese military base in Djibouti.
Have you ever looked at the quality of job the Chinese are constructing for Africa or you are busy chasing shadows(the West).

Barley 5yrs after construction In Nigeria, the much- applauded Abuja-Kaduna railway commissioned in 2016 has
already got stories of breakdown of trains. The
Chinese infrastructural development in Africa are
designed to keep her in control of these
infrastructures.

I hope you know that it was this same approach that the Chinese used to trap the Sri lanka.

https://www.axios.com/sri-lanka-rupee-debt-belt-and-road-initiative-china-india-11ebf8c1-d0bb-4524-9f05-a7d5cc3ac093.html.

Djibouti currently houses military bases from the following nations: United States of America, France, Italy, Japan and China.

You say I'm bias, but you're the only one with the bias talking points. Why is it okay for USA to have a base in Djibouti, but not China?

This Djibouti situation is all about the Red Sea. Which is a vital shipping route, for all of those nations. Given the level of insecurity, it made sense for Djibouti to leavege off it, and they did. By allowing those nations to secure that trade route, in exchange for money. Djibouti is a small, insignificant nation, at the tip of East Africa.

Again, if China wanted to debt trap Africa, which it does not. It could have done it in 2003. You're only hip to this situation because of Western media outlets. But China has been doing heavy business in Africa for more than 20 years. Giving out loans for the entirety of that time. During the past two decades, they have slashed and cancelled tons of loan payments. So again, there's no evidence to support what you're saying. Why would China seek to indebt Africa? It stands to gain, far more, by helping Africa develop. Which is what it's doing, to create it's much desired Eastern Bloc.

Lots of snakes are looming about the Nigerian eagle as we are like the elephant with the biggest tusks. If the poachers could throw us down, they know the booty is going to be hefty! We are being targeted by many.... others come as straight off enemies while others disguise as helpful givers (but we all know nothing is free in this cold world run by corporations).

Naija should wake up to its surroundings and environs... we are still sleeping till one poacher manages to land a deadly blow wether by hook or crook and we just seem like we don't know whats up... we are literally just idle watching as the warnings and signs keep goign up but we ain't acting on it.

knowledgeable:
Please my brother, I don't know who you are and how old. I command you to six months of intensive African history/Chinese history at least from 1500 on wards..in Jesus name Amen.

Stop been Naive.
What is there that is usefull or reasonable to learn about Africa and Chinese history?

knowledgeable:
Cheap propaganda:

If Chinese people dominate us in our own tuff, we are responsible for it period.

Before China started investing heavenly in Africa by early 2000 the Economist magazine wrote off Africa as wasted & dark continent destined to die off from aids, wars, poverty, backwardness etc.

Today, after 20yrs of China in Africa (compared with 400yrs of Western involvement), Afica Profile is rising in all aspects, be it life expectancy, infrastructure, investment inflows, Rwanda, Afrobeat music (yes there's a connection to it), smart phones/internet penetration, the whole world having interest in Africa,... I can go on and on, while there are countries trying to counter these progress coming to Africa. We Africans are fools(especially we Nigerians) to the core and we will start dieing again in our millions without knowing why we will be dieing. The cheap propaganda of debt trap, the warning from the Nigerian government that France is the one sponsoring bokoharam, Sixty percentage of Western military hardwares in South China Sea right now, of which (100%) of China trade with Africa pass through this straight, trade war on China because some Powers are afraid of what will become of Africa by 2050......do you want me to keep going on and on about how foolish and backward we are here in Nigeria. Don't forget Eco, all of them are all tied into this geo-econmic-military-political puzzles most of you Yorubas unity beggers can't figure out.

This is just pure propangander.
Give facts.

Susu888:
Lots of snakes are looming about the Nigerian eagle as we are like the elephant with the biggest tusks. If the poachers could throw us down, they know the booty is going to be hefty! We are being targeted by many.... others come as straight off enemies while others disguise as helpful givers (but we all know nothing is free in this cold world run by corporations).

Naija should wake up to its surroundings and environs... we are still sleeping till one poacher manages to land a deadly blow wether by hook or crook and we just seem like we don't know whats up... we are literally just idle watching as the warnings and signs keep goign up but we ain't acting on it.

True.

We have ourselves to blame after 50yrs of oil production nothing to show.

rdokoye:
Djibouti currently houses military bases from the following nations: United States of America, France, Italy, Japan and China.

You say I'm bias, but you're the only one with the bias talking points. Why is it okay for USA to have a base in Djibouti, but not China?

This Djibouti situation is all about the Red Sea. Which is a vital shipping route, for all of those nations. Given the level of insecurity, it made sense for Djibouti to leavege off it, and they did. By allowing those nations to secure that trade route, in exchange for money. Djibouti is a small, insignificant nation, at the tip of East Africa.

Again, if China wanted to debt trap Africa, which it does not. It could have done it in 2003. You're only hip to this situation because of Western media outlets. But China has been doing heavy business in Africa for more than 20 years. Giving out loans for the entirety of that time. During the past two decades, they have slashed and cancelled tons of loan payments. So again, there's no evidence to support what you're saying. Why would China seek to indebt Africa? It stands to gain, far more, by helping Africa develop. Which is what it's doing, to create it's much desired Eastern Bloc.

My aim was to point out to you that your Saint China also has Military  and political ambitions in Africa.
You just been ignoring fact, I told you before that China trapped Sri Lanka with the same loan and project concept of which I gave you are valid link.
It is also on record that by 1983 Angola was indebted to China to the tune of  5billion dollars, currently Angola debt to China is estimated at 22billion dollars.
https://www.africanews.com/2018/10/29/angola-sink-deeper-into-debt//

also mind you that China sold weapons to Angola and Mozambique governments during their civil war.
How is China helping Africa to grow?
Is it by building substandard infrastructure that has no salvage value in the long run?
Am sure you have not read about  the new Angola airport that China used to rip that country off, from estimated cost of  $300million to over $8billions and it is  yet to be completed.

https://m.theepochtimes.com/chinese-project-to-build-new-angola-airport-ridden-with-corruption_3078120.html

rdokoye:
Well, I was born and raised in the West, so I am Western and I don't "hate" the West, nor its people. I'm just speaking (writing) the honest truth.

Where did you get that statistic from? There are 5 million Chinese people in America. A country of 300+ million people. Africa is a continent of 1.1 billion souls. 1 or 2 million Chinese immigrants is relatively small. But again, as I previously stated. It makes sense that there would be Chinese people migrating to Africa.

That aside, there are over 15 million Africans of European descent. So if you don't see any problem with white people living and migrating to Africa (Mozambique and Angola recorded over 80k Portuguese migrants, in a single year), then you shouldn't have a problem with the Chinese.

I didn't blame the West for anything. I brought up the Third World Debt. Again, how old are you? American Economic Hitman John Perkins came out and admitted that they intentionally indebted Africa, and various other countries around the world.

Africa is where it is, because of its history. If African people were stupid and inherently corrupt, by definition, they wouldn't exist. So your thinking is oxymoronic.

Well, go and tell John Perkins, that he's lying. This is a unique situation where you're hearing the words from the horse's mouth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWuAct1BxHU

Or are you going to say, this white man is lying? In your quest to side with European peoples, despite the horrendous treatment they've meted out to African people, for the past 500 years? What have Chinese people done to ever arouse your suspicion? You're thinking is totally illogical.

And your example nations are weak. I can't believe you mentioned Dubai. Dubai is not even a country. I think you mean UAE, and the UAE is one of, if not the most oil rich nation on earth. Nations like Singapore and South Korea, owe their development primarily to the politics of the time (communism).

What's your obsession with how old i am of what relevance is it to this issue.
Your estimate of 15million Africans of European descent in Africa  is false.
Africa is were it is because of its history, if I should ask what history?

Is unfortunate you are quoting someone who does not understand his left from his right.(John Perkins).

Why did other nations borrow from the West and used it to become great and successful nations while Africa nations remains poor?

If you want to see oppression and racism go to China and give me feedback when you are back.

Of cos I know Dubai is part of UAE but it beholds me to observe that you do not know that UAE practice true federalism and that Dubai has less oil than Abu Dhabi and is not reliant on Abu Dhabi for its development.
You can google about Dubai debt crises which occurred during 2008economic recession.

Singapore and South Korea were never communist they were more of mixed economy with leaning  torwards  capitalism and the west.
South Korea success is a product of US capital and technology which US supplied to the South Korea as its ally after the Korean peninsula war.

I thought been older  as you claim you would have known that it was North Korea that practised communism even till date. So much for your age claim.

Am not the type that google facts today to win arguments. most of what I have written I have read and researched on them  and reached my conclusion over 15yrs ago.

rdokoye:
Well, I was born and raised in the West, so I am Western and I don't "hate" the West, nor its people. I'm just speaking (writing) the honest truth.

Where did you get that statistic from? There are 5 million Chinese people in America. A country of 300+ million people. Africa is a continent of 1.1 billion souls. 1 or 2 million Chinese immigrants is relatively small. But again, as I previously stated. It makes sense that there would be Chinese people migrating to Africa.

That aside, there are over 15 million Africans of European descent. So if you don't see any problem with white people living and migrating to Africa (Mozambique and Angola recorded over 80k Portuguese migrants, in a single year), then you shouldn't have a problem with the Chinese.

I didn't blame the West for anything. I brought up the Third World Debt. Again, how old are you? American Economic Hitman John Perkins came out and admitted that they intentionally indebted Africa, and various other countries around the world.

Africa is where it is, because of its history. If African people were stupid and inherently corrupt, by definition, they wouldn't exist. So your thinking is oxymoronic.

Well, go and tell John Perkins, that he's lying. This is a unique situation where you're hearing the words from the horse's mouth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWuAct1BxHU

Or are you going to say, this white man is lying? In your quest to side with European peoples, despite the horrendous treatment they've meted out to African people, for the past 500 years? What have Chinese people done to ever arouse your suspicion? You're thinking is totally illogical.

And your example nations are weak. I can't believe you mentioned Dubai. Dubai is not even a country. I think you mean UAE, and the UAE is one of, if not the most oil rich nation on earth. Nations like Singapore and South Korea, owe their development primarily to the politics of the time (communism).

No other race or people would have been better to Africans than Europeans that's a fact.
The highest cry you will cry now is that of Slavery.
But the truth is that slave trade was already established in Africa before the Europeans came.
Tell me what would have been the fate of Africa without Colonization?
When it comes to gain, Africa has gained more from Europeans than Asians.
How many Africans are resident in Asia, what is the amount or level of remittance from China to Africa compared to that of Europe?
How many Africans have excelled in politics, business,sports or any other endeavour in China compared to Europe?

Like I said before and not an advocate for the west, No
My concern is that we should be careful while dealing with the Chinese.

blueAgent:
My aim was to point out to you that your Saint China also has Military  and political ambitions in Africa.
You just been ignoring fact, I told you before that China trapped Sri Lanka with the same loan and project concept of which I gave you are valid link.
It is also on record that by 1983 Angola was indebted to China to the tune of  5billion dollars, currently Angola debt to China is estimated at 22billion dollars.
https://www.africanews.com/2018/10/29/angola-sink-deeper-into-debt//

also mind you that China sold weapons to Angola and Mozambique governments during their civil war.
How is China helping Africa to grow?
Is it by building substandard infrastructure that has no salvage value in the long run?
Am sure you have not read about  the new Angola airport that China used to rip that country off, from estimated cost of  $300million to over $8billions and it is  yet to be completed.

https://m.theepochtimes.com/chinese-project-to-build-new-angola-airport-ridden-with-corruption_3078120.html

Well, your example isn't strong enough, because it's also proven that Italy has a military base in Djibouti as well. Would anyone believe that Italy, has military ambitions on the continent of Africa? Of course not. The base in Djibouti is all about securing the Red Sea, which is extremely important to Italy, given its location, and the various other countries operating in that country.

If it's substandard, which it is not, then don't go to them. No one is forcing anyone to do business with anyone. The facts are, that Angola originally went to the West after the Civil War ended, but they rejected them. So what are they supposed to do. Just sit back and do nothing. Angola is a middle-income nation today, thanks to China's efforts within the country.

blueAgent:
Stop been Naive.
What is there that is usefull or reasonable to learn about Africa and Chinese history?

Ok, let us forget about African and Chinese history.

Just type in your Google search: Deborah Broutigam. Ambassador Shinn blog(former US ambassador to Ethiopia). YouTube China Africa project (now this is more of a propaganda platform, but you will surely learn a lot from their discussions and questions). All Americans by the way.

"We Africans have died enough primarily because of our subhuman nature particularly hear in Nigeria".

blueAgent:
What's your obsession with how old i am of what relevance is it to this issue.
Your estimate of 15million Africans of European descent in Africa  is false.
Africa is were it is because of its history, if I should ask what history?

Is unfortunate you are quoting someone who does not understand his left from his right.(John Perkins).

Why did other nations borrow from the West and used it to become great and successful nations while Africa nations remains poor?

If you want to see oppression and racism go to China and give me feedback when you are back.

Of cos I know Dubai is part of UAE but it beholds me to observe that you do not know that UAE practice true federalism and that Dubai has less oil than Abu Dhabi and is not reliant on Abu Dhabi for its development.
You can google about Dubai debt crises which occurred during 2008economic recession.

Singapore and South Korea were never communist they were more of mixed economy with leaning  torwards  capitalism and the west.
South Korea success is a product of US capital and technology which US supplied to the South Korea as its ally after the Korean peninsula war.

I thought been older  as you claim you would have known that it was North Korea that practised communism even till date. So much for your age claim.

Am not the type that google facts today to win arguments. most of what I have written I have read and researched on them  and reached my conclusion over 15yrs ago.

My obsession with your age, is due to the fact that you're unaware of things that are common knowledge amongst African people. But I'm being presumptuous. You're probably not even African. I bet you're white.

Well, my numbers are based on guesstimations, much like yours, on the Chinese population. The facts remain, that a large portion of the Portuguese population is immigrating to Angola and Mozambique as I write this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0gLkWhBSfk

It's history with European peoples.

Most nations in the world are still relatively poor, by Western standards. That said, Africa is a continent, so if we're to talk about development, we should talk about it on a case by case, nation by nation basis.

Conveniently, I found a documentary, on the very same topic, and you're hypothesis is wrong. Most black people say Asia is better than the West, for black people:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o5HElKKK4Y

I don't care about UAE, the fact is, that it's a terrible example. Given it's abundance.

How could South Korea have been a communist nation? South Korea is PRODUCT of communism. As it was/is fractured between the Western-backed South (which is democratic) and the Communist-backed North.

spy24:
The Chinese do not generally have good intentions

who do trust to have good intentions to develop Africa without their National interest. Africans always waiting for manna to fall from heaven.

blueAgent:
This is just pure propangander.
Give facts.

Ok my brother listen carefully.

I am a Nigerian & I don't speak for the Chinese.

I have been following this China/Africa bilaterals as a hobby for 20 years now and whats my main takeaway?.

Although, Africa shouldn't have no permanent friends/enemies. I don't trust China and US is home to me.

China do not have colonising history, and therefore, there is nothing like China "exceptionalism and manifest destiny".

Bro, ready up the underlying guidance philosophy on belt and road initiative of president Xi.

rdokoye:
Well, your example isn't strong enough, because it's also proven that Italy has a military base in Djibouti as well. Would anyone believe that Italy, has military ambitions on the continent of Africa? Of course not. The base in Djibouti is all about securing the Red Sea, which is extremely important to Italy, given its location, and the various other countries operating in that country.

If it's substandard, which it is not, then don't go to them. No one is forcing anyone to do business with anyone. The facts are, that Angola originally went to the West after the Civil War ended, but they rejected them. So what are they supposed to do. Just sit back and do nothing. Angola is a middle-income nation today, thanks to China's efforts within the country.

You keep getting your facts wrong.
Angola is a middle- income country thanks to which China?
Angola's economy is dominated by oil and the last time I checked its production,exploration was dominated by western IOC, British Petroleum,Exxon Mobil,Shell, Anadarko.

rdokoye:
My obsession with your age, is due to the fact that you're unaware of things that are common knowledge amongst African people. But I'm being presumptuous. You're probably not even African. I bet you're white.

Well, my numbers are based on guesstimations, much like yours, on the Chinese population. The facts remain, that a large portion of the Portuguese population is immigrating to Angola and Mozambique as I write this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0gLkWhBSfk

It's history with European peoples.

Most nations in the world are still relatively poor, by Western standards. That said, Africa is a continent, so if we're to talk about development, we should talk about it on a case by case, nation by nation basis.

Conveniently, I found a documentary, on the very same topic, and you're hypothesis is wrong. Most black people say Asia is better than the West, for black people:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o5HElKKK4Y

I don't care about UAE, the fact is, that it's a terrible example. Given it's abundance.

How could South Korea have been a communist nation? South Korea is PRODUCT of communism. As it was/is fractured between the Western-backed South (which is democratic) and the Communists backed North.

The irony is that you claim my OP is mere propangander from the West, but you have failed to give me facts rather you give more propangander.

Anyone can do any YouTube video to promote whatever idea they are into.
My own argument is that we should look at remittance from Africans from the West and those in Asian.
Population of Africans resident in both the West and in China,
Achievements of Africans in the West and those in China.
That's is what is facts not some YouTube video. I can send you over a 100 videos of blacks been abused and mistreated in Asia, China to be precise.

knowledgeable:
Ok, let us forget about African and Chinese history.

Just type in your Google search: Deborah Broutigam. Ambassador Shinn blog(former US ambassador to Ethiopia). YouTube China Africa project (now this is more of a propaganda platform, but you will surely learn a lot from their discussions and questions). All Americans by the way.

"We Africans have died enough primarily because of our subhuman nature particularly hear in Nigeria".

All this are mere talk and propangander.

Look at Mozambique there Economy is growing fast thanks to investment from where? not China but the West.
It was western firms Anadarko and Agip that discovered one of the World largest gas reserves, which have projected Mozambique to be among the World top 8 nations that have the largest gas reserves.

Rio Tonto of Australia and Brazil's vale are investing billions in coal, and iron ore projects.
The investment in the oil and gas sector is put at over 10billion dollars. there are other examples which I cannot exhaust.

Guyana in South America is one of the poorest nations but today Exxon Mobil is transforming the economy of that small nation, thanks to over 2billion oil reserves discovered in that nation(Liza field).


This are facts not propangander.

rdokoye:
My obsession with your age, is due to the fact that you're unaware of things that are common knowledge amongst African people. But I'm being presumptuous. You're probably not even African. I bet you're white.

Well, my numbers are based on guesstimations, much like yours, on the Chinese population. The facts remain, that a large portion of the Portuguese population is immigrating to Angola and Mozambique as I write this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0gLkWhBSfk

It's history with European peoples.

Most nations in the world are still relatively poor, by Western standards. That said, Africa is a continent, so if we're to talk about development, we should talk about it on a case by case, nation by nation basis.

Conveniently, I found a documentary, on the very same topic, and you're hypothesis is wrong. Most black people say Asia is better than the West, for black people:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o5HElKKK4Y

I don't care about UAE, the fact is, that it's a terrible example. Given it's abundance.

How could South Korea have been a communist nation? South Korea is PRODUCT of communism. As it was/is fractured between the Western-backed South (which is democratic) and the Communist-backed North.

The Mozambique you mentioned are having economic growth thanks to large oil and gas reserves discovered by Western companies.
Do you know that by 1985 South Korea and Ghana had the same indices and economic level. both were receiving loans ,assistance from IMF and World bank.

Today you can see the difference between both Nations.

knowledgeable:
Ok my brother listen carefully.

I am a Nigerian & I don't speak for the Chinese.

I have been following this China/Africa bilaterals as a hobby for 20 years now and whats my main takeaway?.

Although, Africa shouldn't have no permanent friends/enemies. I don't trust China and US is home to me.

China do not have colonising history, and therefore, there is nothing like China "exceptionalism and manifest destiny".

Bro, ready up the underlying guidance philosophy on belt and road initiative of president Xi.

My argument is that Africans should take loans from China on more favorable terms and it should not be tied to projects that will be executed by the Chinese, simple.

blueAgent:
My argument is that Africans should take loans from China on more favorable terms and it should not be tied to projects that will be executed by the Chinese, simple.

Agreed 100%.

Nigeria is a peculiar Politics, Philosophy and Economics.

In Kaduna, The Chinese have a Bread Factory, called Palladin. The Chinese acquired The Factory Land from Kaduna State Government and paid for the Land, Capital Cost to the Chinese. The Chinese built The Factory to their Specifications at a cost, another Capital Cost to The Chinese. They Brought in various Plants, Machines, Fixtures, Specialized Tools and Gauges at a cost.

In the same Kaduna State, The Chinese repeats this same Feat for the Production of Tricycles and Motorbikes.
It's relevant to say that apart from the Employment of the MD and a few Technical Support Staff, every other cost such as
Flour, Bolts and Nuts and Panteka stuffs,
Workers, Labor, Marketers, Sales and their Customers are gotten in Kaduna.

The above explanation is very dissimilar to Fulanisation and Ruga Practice, which is Feudalism & Buharinomics.

blueAgent:
You keep getting your facts wrong.
Angola is a middle- income country thanks to which China?
Angola's economy is dominated by oil and the last time I checked its production,exploration was dominated by western IOC, British Petroleum,Exxon Mobil,Shell, Anadarko.

You contradict yourself. One minute you say Angola is indebted to China, the next you say Angola gets all its money from Western oil companies. Last time I checked, the oil industry was dominated by Group Sonangol, not any Western petroleum company. That said, it was Chinese loans that got the country off the ground, after the 30+ year civil war. It was and still is Chinese construction companies that have won contract after contract in the rebuilding process of the country.

blueAgent:
The Mozambique you mentioned are having economic growth thanks to large oil and gas reserves discovered by Western companies.
Do you know that by 1985 South Korea and Ghana had the same indices and economic level. both were receiving loans ,assistance from IMF and World bank.

Today you can see the difference between both Nations.

Mozambique's oil and gas industry is operated by Sasol, a SOUTH AFRICAN company, not a Western one. In fact, the West has had very little, if anything to do with the growth in that country. Mozambique was experiencing impressive growth, long before the first barrel of oil was ever pumped.

In 1985, South Korea was at least 100 years ahead of Ghana in terms of development. Ghana's indices didn't reflect the level of development on ground. That's the main drawback of human development indices, they can be easily manipulated. Just look at how India has manipulated them, over the past couple of decades.

blueAgent:
All this are mere talk and propangander.

Look at Mozambique there Economy is growing fast thanks to investment from where? not China but the West.
It was western firms Anadarko and Agip that discovered one of the World largest gas reserves, which have projected Mozambique to be among the World top 8 nations that have the largest gas reserves.

Rio Tonto of Australia and Brazil's vale are investing billions in coal, and iron ore projects.
The investment in the oil and gas sector is put at over 10billion dollars. there are other examples which I cannot exhaust.

Guyana in South America is one of the poorest nations but today Exxon Mobil is transforming the economy of that small nation, thanks to over 2billion oil reserves discovered in that nation(Liza field).


This are facts not propangander.

You make it seem like the West put the resources in those nations. Again, Mozambique was experiencing 8% economic growth, before oil was pumped. Moreover, those Western oil companies are only interested in what they can profit from it. They care very little for the country they discover the resources in. So stop pretending like it's driven by some desire to help others. You'd have to be the only person on earth to think oil companies where/are good.

Just look at the Niger Delta if you think otherwise.

Again, I know you're a white man. So it makes sense that you'd defend the West. But it doesn't matter. The reputation of the West has already been soiled.

blueAgent:
The irony is that you claim my OP is mere propangander from the West, but you have failed to give me facts rather you give more propangander.

Anyone can do any YouTube video to promote whatever idea they are into.
My own argument is that we should look at remittance from Africans from the West and those in Asian.
Population of Africans resident in both the West and in China,
Achievements of Africans in the West and those in China.
That's is what is facts not some YouTube video. I can send you over a 100 videos of blacks been abused and mistreated in Asia, China to be precise.

There are more Africans in the West, so it wouldn't be a fair comparison.

My video, which is not propaganda, is more reflective of the reality. Those are, Westerners, African Americans, who have lived amongst white people for 400 years. I think, when it comes to reflective treatment between the West and the East. African Americans are the experts, having more experience than any other African demographic, with white people.

No one is saying Chinese people are saints. Moreover, I could show you a million videos of blacks being abused by white folks. Being lynched, burnt alive, attacked, profiled, gunned down by police, etc.. etc..

China's Action is "Foreign Investment".
Fulanisation and Ruga is "Internal Disinvestment and Disorientation".

rdokoye:
You make it seem like the West put the resources in those nations. Again, Mozambique was experiencing 8% economic growth, before oil was pumped. Moreover, those Western oil companies are only interested in what they can profit from it. They care very little for the country they discover the resources in. So stop pretending like it's driven by some desire to help others. You'd have to be the only person on earth to think oil companies where/are good.

Just look at the Niger Delta if you think otherwise.

Again, I know you're a white man. So it makes sense that you'd defend the West. But it doesn't matter. The reputation of the West has already been soiled.

I never said it was the west that put those resources. you can agree with me that development of those resources would have more lasting and meaningful effect on the economy of those countries if properly managed.
Is there anywhere that resources are exploited for charity, of. is the Western companies are there to make money but the fact remains that the host nation stands to gain more if properly managed.

You say they care less for the country the are extracting the resources from, and my question is are they supposed to replace the government?
Is the problem in Niger Delta the fault of the West?

Am not a White man.