₦airaland Forum

pcoolioz:
Hello All, So I have a quick question.
I am not so experienced with inverters and all so my question might be basic to some of you.
From my research, I read deep cycle batteries get bad when you use below 50 percent of its power consistently and when you overcharge.
I have a solar panel so my inverter is hardly ever dead or I hardly get to 50%, but how about overcharging?
Does the solar panel constantly charging it everyday damage the battery still?
The inverter is hybrid so it stops charging when the battery is full. So my problem is will the everyday usage affect it somehow?

That is my question.

So long as your CC is able to stop charging when your battery is full. Normally lead acid are better charged at .1C so if your solar is charging at that rate or a little bit higher, you should be fine.

I don't know where else to ask so I'll put it here.

Does anyone know how much Busbar is for PHCN meter?

dapsyra:
PROs:

At more than 20,000 cycles, the LTO chemistry has the longest life of all the Lithium batteries.

It can be discharged to 0v without any serious consequence. Some manufactures actually ship them out at 0v state of charge. Some of mine were at 0v when I received them.

LTO does not combust due to overcharge or any other abuse. There are a lot of LTO abuse videos on YouTube.

It can be charged and discharged at a very high 'C" rate (10C or higher). You can fully charge a LTO battery in 6minutes if you have a capable charger.

I have used mine for over two years now and I have not noticed any loss of capacity. If I consume 300Ah, it will require less than 301Ah to recharge. The cycle efficiency of mine is 99.9%.

It does not heat up during charging of discharge. It stays at room temperature 24/7.

As at today, LTO is the best battery money can buy.

CONs:

It is much more expensive than other Lithium brands

It is heavy, So, it is not very suitable for mobile application

What system voltage are you running?

dapsyra:
PROs:

At more than 20,000 cycles, the LTO chemistry has the longest life of all the Lithium batteries.

It can be discharged to 0v without any serious consequence. Some manufactures actually ship them out at 0v state of charge. Some of mine were at 0v when I received them.

LTO does not combust due to overcharge or any other abuse. There are a lot of LTO abuse videos on YouTube.

It can be charged and discharged at a very high 'C" rate (10C or higher). You can fully charge a LTO battery in 6minutes if you have a capable charger.

I have used mine for over two years now and I have not noticed any loss of capacity. If I consume 300Ah, it will require less than 301Ah to recharge. The cycle efficiency of mine is 99.9%.

It does not heat up during charging of discharge. It stays at room temperature 24/7.

As at today, LTO is the best battery money can buy.

CONs:

It is much more expensive than other Lithium brands

It is heavy, So, it is not very suitable for mobile application

WOw..... I'm sure the shipping was crazy right? Can i see pix of your battery bank?

mctfopt:
What system voltage are you running?

I think he is in 48v

Trippledots:
I think he is in 48v

Cool. The LTO looks so good when connected

20,000 cycles!!! I am green with envy

Makes PylonTech look like a joke - I remember our back end conversations back then around the Tesla PowerWall - it was you that convinced me this Lithium thingy was viable in a residential use case.

I was lucky to get a few Lithium installs under my belt shortly after and no looking back since that time.

One day when I grow up, I will be able to afford a premium LTO bank. Hopefully, I will still have a few internal organs left to sell in exchange.

My Oga Dapsyra, well done!

dapsyra:
PROs:

At more than 20,000 cycles, the LTO chemistry has the longest life of all the Lithium batteries.

It can be discharged to 0v without any serious consequence. Some manufactures actually ship them out at 0v state of charge. Some of mine were at 0v when I received them.

LTO does not combust due to overcharge or any other abuse. There are a lot of LTO abuse videos on YouTube.

It can be charged and discharged at a very high 'C" rate (10C or higher). You can fully charge a LTO battery in 6minutes if you have a capable charger.

I have used mine for over two years now and I have not noticed any loss of capacity. If I consume 300Ah, it will require less than 301Ah to recharge. The cycle efficiency of mine is 99.9%.

It does not heat up during charging of discharge. It stays at room temperature 24/7.

As at today, LTO is the best battery money can buy.

CONs:

It is much more expensive than other Lithium brands

It is heavy, So, it is not very suitable for mobile application

mctfopt:
Cool. The LTO looks so good when connected

O'boy see the bus bars on those cells....chai!

ojeysky:
O'boy see the bus bars on those cells....chai!

So you can do a 5C discharge in peace

dapsyra:
PROs:

At more than 20,000 cycles, the LTO chemistry has the longest life of all the Lithium batteries.

It can be discharged to 0v without any serious consequence. Some manufactures actually ship them out at 0v state of charge. Some of mine were at 0v when I received them.

LTO does not combust due to overcharge or any other abuse. There are a lot of LTO abuse videos on YouTube.

It can be charged and discharged at a very high 'C" rate (10C or higher). You can fully charge a LTO battery in 6minutes if you have a capable charger.

I have used mine for over two years now and I have not noticed any loss of capacity. If I consume 300Ah, it will require less than 301Ah to recharge. The cycle efficiency of mine is 99.9%.

It does not heat up during charging of discharge. It stays at room temperature 24/7.

As at today, LTO is the best battery money can buy.

CONs:

It is much more expensive than other Lithium brands

It is heavy, So, it is not very suitable for mobile application

Hmmmm.

I really didn't consider LTO when setting up my systems. With this your write its something to look up and possibly consider in the nearest future. Though in my research into Lithium I no see them praising it the way you praised unending here oo. But who am I?

Anyway, enjoy your batteries abeg.

mctfopt:
So you can do a 5C discharge in peace

My BMS won't even permit that. This is probably for heavy duty work/factory I don't think a household would need this much. For instance, how will one even pull 5C from a 24v inverter connected to a 200AH LTO/LFP. Most inverter will throw overload before it gets to 3C (and for 48v the Current pull will even be lower). I think it's an overkill jare

And why would anyone want to do 5C discharge in any stable application?

Call me old school or a scared old man but I use my own PylonTechs much like lead acid. Set 80% DoD cutoff on the inverter but rarely do more than 60-70% DoD because the bank is sized for some autonomy.

Only once has the BMS ever cut off or raised an alarm in like 8 months of use and that was in the early days when I was still hunting for the right settings and sweet spot.

I feel such gentle use guarantees the trouble free enjoyment of ones investment for the long term.

mctfopt:
So you can do a 5C discharge in peace

mctfopt:
What system voltage are you running?

I run 52.8v norminal (2.4v per cell, 22s)

Trippledots:
WOw..... I'm sure the shipping was crazy right? Can i see pix of your battery bank?

You can say that again. Shipping and Customs duty were responsible for half the cost.

The battery bank is located in a very tight area of my power room, so getting good snapshots is very difficult.

mctfopt:
Cool. The LTO looks so good when connected

I have the pouch cells. They are 55Ah, 2.4v nominal each. Those cylindrical cells are about 10Ah

NiyiOmoIyunade:
20,000 cycles!!! I am green with envy

Makes PylonTech look like a joke - I remember our back end conversations back then around the Tesla PowerWall - it was you that convinced me this Lithium thingy was viable in a residential use case.

I was lucky to get a few Lithium installs under my belt shortly after and no looking back since that time.

One day when I grow up, I will be able to afford a premium LTO bank. Hopefully, I will still have a few internal organs left to sell in exchange.

My Oga Dapsyra, well done!

Niyi, those PylonTech batteries are quite good. I took a brief look at them back then before settling for the LTO cells. I had a client that ordered large quantity of LTO cells (>120kwh). I seized the opportunity of the bulk purchase to grab some cells for myself at a very affordable price.

essegis:
Hmmmm.

I really didn't consider LTO when setting up my systems. With this your write its something to look up and possibly consider in the nearest future. Though in my research into Lithium I no see them praising it the way you praised unending here oo. But who am I?

Anyway, enjoy your batteries abeg.

One man's food is another man's poison.

All the "PRO" points I listed cannot be faulted in any objective review. The only complaint I have seen about them that I did not list in my "CONs" list is the claim that their cycle efficiency is lower that other Lithium flavours. My personal experience with LTO is contrary to that claim maybe because I am not running them at 10C.

For home solar storage, nobody need 10C. At 10C, the battery bank will be depleted in 6minutes! That will be a very poor design

NiyiOmoIyunade:
And why would anyone want to do 5C discharge in any stable application?

Call me old school or a scared old man but I use my own PylonTechs much like lead acid. Set 80% DoD cutoff on the inverter but rarely do more than 60-70% DoD because the bank is sized for some autonomy.

Only once has the BMS ever cut off or raised an alarm in like 8 months of use and that was in the early days when I was still hunting for the right settings and sweet spot.

I feel such gentle use guarantees the trouble free enjoyment of ones investment for the long term.

For peeps that love to walk on the wild side, that 5C is a prerequisite for having system such as these.

dapsyra:
One man's food is another man's poison.

All the "PRO" points I listed cannot be faulted in any objective review. The only complaint I have seen about them that I did not list in my "CONs" list is the claim that their cycle efficiency is lower that other Lithium flavours. My personal experience with LTO is contrary to that claim maybe because I am not running them at 10C.

For home solar storage, nobody need 10C. At 10C, the battery bank will be depleted in 6minutes! That will be a very poor design

I think the cycle efficiency is the major edge that lipo has over LTO. But all in all we cannot have it all. You win some you lose some. LTO is super cool battery. And anyone doing more than 1C in any of these batteries in a constant basis must really have a very deep pockets

mctfopt:
Used it for like a month. Decided no need stressing the SCC. This was due to the long distance (around 35m) the idea was then to reduce power loss and run smaller diameter wire. Had to upgrade wire and decided to run the smaller voltage with inherent higher current.

Okay. I guess I'll try that out with the MakeSkyBlue I have around here.

dapsyra:
One man's food is another man's poison.

All the "PRO" points I listed cannot be faulted in any objective review. The only complaint I have seen about them that I did not list in my "CONs" list is the claim that their cycle efficiency is lower that other Lithium flavours. My personal experience with LTO is contrary to that claim maybe because I am not running them at 10C.

For home solar storage, nobody need 10C. At 10C, the battery bank will be depleted in 6minutes! That will be a very poor design

Yeah, I went searching last night after the post and saw the cycle efficiency default. Abeg that one no be big issue joo. Over size the bank if that's the case. Is it working? E dey bring light? E no dey die? Na wetin we dey find be that.

Enjoy bro, you've given me something to think about again and I love it.

dapsyra:
One man's food is another man's poison.

All the "PRO" points I listed cannot be faulted in any objective review. The only complaint I have seen about them that I did not list in my "CONs" list is the claim that their cycle efficiency is lower that other Lithium flavours. My personal experience with LTO is contrary to that claim maybe because I am not running them at 10C.

For home solar storage, nobody need 10C. At 10C, the battery bank will be depleted in 6minutes! That will be a very poor design

I saw you mentioned you have 300AH of the LTO do you even do 300AH instantaneous on it? For a large bank that is 200AH and above, I still wonder why a household will need to do more than 1C. Wetin we dey power sef....na factory

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generationz:
I don't know where else to ask so I'll put it here.

Does anyone know how much Busbar is for PHCN meter?

It depends on amps needed ! Ranges from 15k upwards .. It can also be improvised ! Cheers

essegis:
Yeah, I went searching last night after the post and saw the cycle efficiency default. Abeg that one no be big issue joo. Over size the bank if that's the case. Is it working? E dey bring light? E no dey die? Na wetin we dey find be that.

Enjoy bro, you've given me something to think about again and I love it.

From my personal experience running LTO batteries at very low "C" rates, the cycle efficiency is about 99.9%. For comparison, the cycle efficiency of Lead Acid battery is about 70%

My bank is 700Ah and the highest instantaneous load it has ever seen is 100Ah. That is 0.14C on a battery that is capable of 10C

Cost to capacity ratio was one of the biggest hurdles to me going Lithium. People could not understand why I felt I needed a 48v 800Ah Lithium bank - whenever I told friends and professionals that my measured overnight consumption could be up to 15kwh they would say impossible. And this was not counting evening use o.

See below graphic at 11:25pm.

41kwh consumed before midnight on a day that solar generated 47kwh. 35% of 40kwh battery already consumed as well.

dapsyra:
From my personal experience running LTO batteries at very low "C" rates, the cycle efficiency is about 99.9%. For comparison, the cycle efficiency of Lead Acid battery is about 70%

My bank is 700Ah and the highest instantaneous load it has ever seen is 100Ah. That is 0.14C on a battery that is capable of 10C

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Cost to capacity ratio was one of the biggest hurdles to me going Lithium. People could not understand why I felt I needed a 48v 800Ah Lithium bank - whenever I told friends and professionals that my measured overnight consumption could be up to 15kwh they would say impossible. And this was not counting evening use o.

See below graphic at 11:25pm.

41kwh consumed before midnight on a day that solar generated 47kwh. 35% of 40kwh battery already consumed as well.

Your battery bank should be designed for your need not what someone else think.

I am 100% off-grid and my system is designed to meet my needs with enough redundancy to cater for 2 days of bad weather.

dapsyra:
From my personal experience running LTO batteries at very low "C" rates, the cycle efficiency is about 99.9%. For comparison, the cycle efficiency of Lead Acid battery is about 70%

My bank is 700Ah and the highest instantaneous load it has ever seen is 100Ah. That is 0.14C on a battery that is capable of 10C

Oh this is even massive than I thought (think I saw 300AH in one of your post). You made my point about C rates, what's the essence of a high C rate then.... paying for high C rate in such scenario will be unnecessary

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Cost to capacity ratio was one of the biggest hurdles to me going Lithium. People could not understand why I felt I needed a 48v 800Ah Lithium bank - whenever I told friends and professionals that my measured overnight consumption could be up to 15kwh they would say impossible. And this was not counting evening use o.

See below graphic at 11:25pm.

41kwh consumed before midnight on a day that solar generated 47kwh. 35% of 40kwh battery already consumed as well.

Man, the consumption here is off the chart. Probably you put everything into one system. Remember that my design? Once I did all the plus and minus and balanced it as I can the battery never leaves float oo, & na ordinary 15kwh. To the extent my CC no dey gree overwork the panels to charge am.

Thats why I no dey post solar panel draw like Ojeysky here oo dey shout panel power. Me sef is shaming of my system

kiekie1:
It depends on amps needed ! Ranges from 15k upwards .. It can also be improvised ! Cheers

How do we calculate the also needed?