₦airaland Forum

Godarz:
No excuses for failure...but the fact is, when oil prices started falling down during GEJ's regime, Nigeria had to start taking loans to keep our nehad above water.

When the fall continued during Bubu's time, the loan taking continued.

Now that oil has gone up....the loans must be paid first.

As put by this article...Managing the dutch disease in Nigeria from 2004...



Thus, there is a critique of why GEJ and Buhari are both bad....they DID not diversify us from oil. Buhari in partiuclar had a lot of cheap tools he could have used eg removing suibsides, and ending insecurity, and widening the tax base....which so far he hasn't used. Instead...it has been go back to agric...like it is the 1960's when the UK was our guaranteed market.

Reference:
Can you furnish us peons what a typical loan was that we ALL have to pay for now that will make us not SEE any benefit of oil price rises.

Reference:
Excuses have started from government apologists to pound our minds into expecting nothing while they 'steal the silver'. Same ol, same ol propaganda. We all suffer and sacrifice but when benefits come they tell us another thing. Did we jointly agree to these loans, no. Have these bogus loans directly benefited us, no.

Godarz:
I have, but because you think wrongly of me, you don't want to see my answer.

So, read my post again, especially the long one. You will find the answers you seek...especially as your comment shows that you haven't read my post.

Godarz:
I am not a government propagandist...I am more of a 'Nigeria has to diversify away from oil' propagandist.

Agbegbaorogboye:
The only one I saw there that's relevant is the breakeven price. And even at that, there's no explanation of what it means or entails. As for the rest, you answered none of them. Lemme itemise them maybe you can do justice.

1. What exactly is a balanced budget?

2. How does it help us? What is break even price?

3. Do you mean if oil prices had not gone up we wouldn't have paid our debts and is there any law that says any excess crude money must be used to pay debt?

Godarz:
No excuses for failure...but the fact is, when oil prices started falling down during GEJ's regime, Nigeria had to start taking loans to keep our nehad above water.

When the fall continued during Bubu's time, the loan taking continued.

Now that oil has gone up....the loans must be paid first.

As put by this article...Managing the dutch disease in Nigeria from 2004...



Thus, there is a critique of why GEJ and Buhari are both bad....they DID not diversify us from oil. Buhari in partiuclar had a lot of cheap tools he could have used eg removing suibsides, and ending insecurity, and widening the tax base....which so far he hasn't used. Instead...it has been go back to agric...like it is the 1960's when the UK was our guaranteed market.

Agbegbaorogboye:
Here you go.
Buhari has removed subsidies and increased all the taxes in Nigeria. So what do you mean he hasn't used?

Besides, I don't see how ending insecurity is a strategy for diversification

Godarz:
No excuses for failure...but the fact is, when oil prices started falling down during GEJ's regime, Nigeria had to start taking loans to keep our nehad above water.

When the fall continued during Bubu's time, the loan taking continued.

Now that oil has gone up....the loans must be paid first.

As put by this article...Managing the dutch disease in Nigeria from 2004...



Thus, there is a critique of why GEJ and Buhari are both bad....they DID not diversify us from oil. Buhari in partiuclar had a lot of cheap tools he could have used eg removing suibsides, and ending insecurity, and widening the tax base....which so far he hasn't used. Instead...it has been go back to agric...like it is the 1960's when the UK was our guaranteed market.

Reference:
I understand and apologize for using such wording but this issue is serious and has been recurring over the years leading to the whole scale destruction of the standard of living of the typical Nigerian. No one expects the government to helicopter excess cash onto Nigerians, I do not expect or desire subsidies (I am a strong anti subsidy advocate, not just on energy but on the naira and other sources of waste) but I expect clear accountability and advocacy by the citizens on what or how excess income is deployed and the welfare of the citizens should be a top priority.

Godarz:
1.Budget that meets all our needs without having to take loans...

2.I amswered the breakeven price in earlier post.

3.That's why I said I don't support APC or PDP....no plan to diversify us from oil and its redundant shocks.

Good morning.

emmyN:
The monies paid for loans taken are constant irrespective of oil price. What are you saying?

Godarz:
For someone who does not beleive APC lies, you beleive this lie from the government.....okay

A little bit about myself...I became pro-subsidy removal in 2012....so when Bubu claimed he had removed subsidy in 2015...while still controlling the price , I knew what was going on, and refused to beleive...especially as the government was controlling the price

If Buhari wants to convince me that subsidy has gone....hand over price control to the marktets, and stop forcing price controls. Right now it costs N186 to bring in one liter of fuel...and it is being sold at N162....how is the difference made?

There always has been a subsidy.



Investors won't have to pay too much for security...plus who wants to invest in a country with insane people like Boko and bandits and so on

Agbegbaorogboye:
Buhari still controls the price because he's the sole importer of fuel. If the marketers want to control price, let them import themselves. A situation where distributors control price known as middlemen economy is bad and usually leads to hoarding as we're experiencing now. Pricing is the job of the producer who engaged the factor of production not the middleman. So your expectation that marketers should determine price is wrong and dangerous. Recharge cards is a good example. Who determines price between telcos and their marketers?

Godarz:
1,Hoarding happened this time because there was an expectaiton that they would increase prices of fuel....not because makreters are controlling the price.

2.Yes, prciing is the preserve of the producer...but under Buhari;'s subsidy regimen, makreters bring in fuel at N186 per liter, and sell at N162...and we pay the difference as subsidy, leaving no room for profit.?

Marketers not only buy fuel, but transport it to the end point....and if they aren't making enough money to make a profit to cover all their costs....

Then you say that we should let makreters import...which is what I want...but if you want maketers to import and make enough profit to buy dollars to import (and no CBN has no busienss giving them dollars...that's how we drained our reserves last time)..you have to let them set the price.

If we applied your logic to food prices, many traders in the market would be broke.

You criticse Buhari for paying subsidy, and then you want him to continue paying subsidy essentially. That is bad economics...

In brief, if marketers are not allowed to make profits, how would they then pay the prodcuers? This is the problem with subsidy payments...and price controls.

Agbegbaorogboye:
Expectation from who?... NNPC already came out to say there'll be no price increase this month. Only for marketers to come out asking for fuel price to be shifted to N230 for a product they did not import. The problem of our fuel supply has always been the marketers who want to make unholy profits. It has been so since the time of Jonathan who indulged their excesses and till now under Buhari who called their bluffs. Those marketers are the enemies of this country.

I have to correct you again. Marketers are not bringing in fuel under Buhari. Only NNPC does that since he refused to give marketers free dollars. They actually thought the system will crumble when they refused to bring in fuel if they are not getting dollars at official exchange rate. Baru killed them on that one. They're still licking the wounds till today and have been looking for a way to get at the system ever since.

Of course marketers should set the price of they can import without requiring dollars from CBN. It seems you're not well informed on this matter. Why don't you search round the internet for the reason why marketers stopped importing instead of assuming it's because government set price. Govt set price under Jonathan, yaradua and OBJ and yet marketers still imported. Go and find out what changed this time around bro. Stop assuming.

Interesting you brought up food price. Who brought us to where we are now with rice? Is it the farmers or the off-takers aka marketers? Bro, the whole increase in rice price is a machination of the greedy rice marketers!! A paddy of rice has changed less than 3000 in price while a bag has added over 10000. It's same evil greed the oil marketers want to perpetuate and you're supporting.

Note. I have never criticized Buhari for paying it removing subsidy. He did well by putting those marketers in their place. My grouse with him his is seeming cluelessness about getting us local refining capacity.

Of course marketers should set the price of they can import without requiring dollars from CBN. It seems you're not well informed on this matter. Why don't you search round the internet for the reason why marketers stopped importing instead of assuming it's because government set price. Govt set price under Jonathan, yaradua and OBJ and yet marketers still imported. Go and find out what changed this time around bro. Stop assuming.

Kebbiprince:
Yet only the politicians will benefit leaving out the citizens.
Funny enough the budget was made with oil price at 40$°.just wait and see how the excess of 30$ will be stolen

Kebbiprince:
Yet only the politicians will benefit leaving out the citizens.
Funny enough the budget was made with oil price at 40$°.just wait and see how the excess of 30$ will be stolen

Racoon:
https://www.vanguardngr.com/2021/03/breaking-oil-price-hits-71-28-on-opec-decision/amp/

Godarz:
So, in essence , you support price controls.

Thanks. You should support price controls then on food, and so on, because the same logic you are using can be used for other products.

There is a reason why we don't have working refinereis, and a reason why out of 25 licences issued for refinereis, 5 are active....because producers don't want to refine fuel at a loss.(and by extension Dangote refinery would fail if Bubu continues price controls..because maketers selling fuel from that refienry won't be able to make enough of a profit to pay him for the fuel he produces.)

I'll leave you with this...we have a working IT system because Obasanjo refused to listen to people calling for price ontrols on GSM companies 'that were exploiting us'.




And in the process, government incurred high debts in form of unpaind subsidy money, which it paid by rasing fuel prices, and paying off the rest by 2018.

It seems you don't understand how a subsidy works, or how price controls are bad for any economy long term.

erico2k2:
Guy no vex but at this point you should stop talking, were you not among them ones cheering when this Fg said it would stop subsidy??what subsidy are you now talking about being owed?

ant you remember what led to petrol queues 3 months to the end of 2015 fg rigim when importers protested and stopped importation citing diff in dollars rate for full payment of their money? or were U not old enough to listen to the news then?

Look loads of you just play politics with own lives even when it affects you,Those politicians have their kids here living the good life and yah lot talking shyte, anyway I thank God I japa wen I could.No time 4 rubish

Godarz:
No, I wasn't cheering...especially as the subsidy was still there...(hint...government was still controlling the prices).

;



We had queues in 2015 for two reasons...

1.It was costing N132 to import one liter of fuel...which was being sold at N87 per liter...big loss

2.The subsidy payments that were supposed to cover for that loss..were not enough (and had been problematic since 2013..something which was foreseen by GEJ's government in 2011...which was why they wanted to remove subsidy in 2012)

3.The queues went when government raised prices to N145 per liter...however paying off the debts from previous subsidy claims took till 2018


So we should keep on incurring debt because subsidy? Okay....

And FYI...I don't back PDP or APC.

Kebbiprince:
Yet only the politicians will benefit leaving out the citizens.
Funny enough the budget was made with oil price at 40$°.just wait and see how the excess of 30$ will be stolen

erico2k2:
xx 1 litter of petrol was never ever imported at 132 if so at this point please tell me from what country?( I PUT IT TO YOU TO TEL ME WHAT COUNTRY)
xx Attempting to remove subsidy would be catastrophic at any point since we rely on petrol for our local energy needs
xx We have no option than to keep subsidy as petrol determines the price of everything in Nigeria if petrol goes to N400 the country will stand still as we physically cannot afford it, way 4ward FG should do the needful, build a new refinery or licence small scale refineries.the tech is there,

Godarz:
Good morning.

DonHummer:
I swear this buhari government is useless, oil price has been increasing, yet there is no significant positive effect on dollar exchange rate.

Godarz:
So, in essence , you support price controls.

Thanks. You should support price controls then on food, and so on, because the same logic you are using can be used for other products.

There is a reason why we don't have working refinereis, and a reason why out of 25 licences issued for refinereis, 5 are active....because producers don't want to refine fuel at a loss.(and by extension Dangote refinery would fail if Bubu continues price controls..because maketers selling fuel from that refienry won't be able to make enough of a profit to pay him for the fuel he produces.)

I'll leave you with this...we have a working IT system because Obasanjo refused to listen to people calling for price ontrols on GSM companies 'that were exploiting us'.




And in the process, government incurred high debts in form of unpaind subsidy money, which it paid by rasing fuel prices, and paying off the rest by 2018.

It seems you don't understand how a subsidy works, or how price controls are bad for any economy long term.