winner01: If a million people got converted, it wouldnt matter to skeptics. They would all be liars.
God be praised forever.
true. Exactly what Mathew 13:15 talked about. "For this people’s heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them."
martineinstein: did u read comments from top tech side when hololens was demoed?... Did u watch Microsoft demo on hololens at E3? Microsoft just patented an IP that allows hololens display that can be adjusted to produce vr display. Don't also forget that vr is more expensive to set up compared to ar
ya. I watched their demo at E3 last year. That was nothing but AR. You should watch oculus videos as well. Because currently hololens ain't close at all to even vibe when it comes to vr(if you call what it does VR). Also where is a link about their patent of vr
martineinstein: they are different things.. But, vr is a stop gap to ar...sulon q is hybrid, just as future hololens... Watch out! Once AR gets commercialized,vr will plummet..
hmmm, i don't think so. Because it depends on the type of experience you want. If you want an experience that brings you to a different world, you'd go for vr while if you want an experience that superimposes abstract on real world you'd go for ar. I don't see ar crushing vr. Rather they'd move together.
martineinstein: hololens is ahead of oculus and HTC vive.
you don't get my point. Hololens is augmented reality. It could be compared with Google glass and meta headset. While oculus is virtual reality, which could be compared with vive, Playstation vr and sulon Q. No doubt hololens is ahead in AR, but it should be noted that AR and VR are different things.
SETI666: BREAKING NEWS:JEHOVAH,JESUS AND HOLY SPIRIT LOVES SLAVERY. U are very stupid for saying that.aint jewsus should be caring .how is slavery caring.
slavery caring? I quoted someone to state the difference between how the slavery in those days were and how the slavery known is. I suggest you read it. But i don't know where you saw slavery is caring. Seriously, i don't know what you mean by "aint jewsus should be caring .how is slavery caring." btw keep creating your "truth about christianity" threads. Deceiving yourself you are changing anyone. and "homie you can hate me but you ain't gettin no hate back you get no hate back Cause all the hatin in the world won't make me a hater" (bizzle-no hate) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtSQmHqBemw
TrajansKong: What you've posted in known as an apology.
It is not OK to enslave foreigners, debtors and young women. Never.
It is never right to follow commands to enslave, commit genocide or mass rape (as your magic book instructs).
All the examples you've given are terrible
Your quote: Foreigners The Old Testament Law gave the procedure for taking foreigners (Deuteronomy 20:10-11). When making war against a city, Israel was to first extend an offer of peace, in which the city's inhabitants could voluntarily bind themselves over as slaves to Israel. This was more like serfdom than slavery. Foreign women and children could be taken in war, but the women could also be taken as wives (Deuteronomy 21:10-13; Rahab—Matthew 1:5).
Does that make sense to you? Does the following quote make slavery any more moral??
- An ox who killed a free man (vs. 28) or a slave (vs. 32) was to be stoned—the punishment of a murderer.
If you need to explain or excuse enslavement of our fellow human beings, for whatever reason, you just might be a slave already.
reread the intro and conclusion. Then have a good day.
Many people thought macs weren't vulnerable to viruses, not knowing that before, not many people used a mac. It was geeks that used a mac. and therefore many viruses were made for pc's. But now many people use a mac.
TrajansKong: You must be joking. We are children of Africa. Slavery - the ownership of others lives that your magic book condones - was wrong yesterday, is wrong today and shall he wrong as long as humans draw breath in this world.
NO EXCEPTIONS.
Please tell you are joking or that you've just never read the bible. Nothing else makes sense...
i just asked for a definition. Btw, have you ever been a slave?
Slavery in the Bible is a difficult topic to broach because our paradigm is both horrific and largely unrelated to slavery in the Bible. Slaves in our time and in recent centuries are "chattel" slaves. They were tricked into or forced to work. They received no pay and had no right to refuse to work. Their humanity was owned by another person.
Slavery in the Old Testament was very different and involved a variety of methods, situations, and restrictions. But the Old Testament is clear about capturing people and selling them as chattel: kidnapping was a crime punishable by death (Exodus 21:16).
The Purpose of Slavery In an ideal world, slavery would neither be an option nor a necessity. Because of the socioeconomic situation of Old Testament Israel, God did allow slavery, but He allowed it for a simple purpose: to help the poor survive. A person could sell himself into slavery (akin to indentured servitude) in order to pay off debt or provide a basic subsistence. God did not intend for Israel to have poverty (Deuteronomy 15:4), but sin made it inevitable (Deuteronomy 15:5), and God allowed slavery to deal with that reality.
God enacted several laws to prevent the need for slavery in the first place. Many of these laws are found in Deuteronomy 24:
- Verse 6: a piece of equipment used in the survival of a family may not be taken in pledge for a loan.
- Verses 12, 17: if a poor man gives his cloak in pledge, it must be returned at night so he won't be cold; a widow's cloak must not be taken in pledge at all.
- Verses 14-15: a poor hired man must receive his wages daily.
- Verses 19-21: when harvesting wheat, olives, or grapes, some must be left over for the poor to take for themselves.
Slavery was to be a last resort. Israel was to "remember that you were a slave in Egypt and the LORD your God redeemed you from there" (Deuteronomy 24:18).
Sometimes, circumstances were such that the laws requiring care for the poor were not enough. In ancient agrarian societies, it was often extremely difficult to provide for oneself and one's family. Many slaves in Old Testament Israel had sold themselves to prevent starvation; others had been sold by their family so the family wouldn't starve.
Types of Slaves The Old Testament recognized different types of slaves depending on their circumstances. None of them correspond to modern chattel slaves.
Foreigners The Old Testament Law gave the procedure for taking foreigners (Deuteronomy 20:10-11). When making war against a city, Israel was to first extend an offer of peace, in which the city's inhabitants could voluntarily bind themselves over as slaves to Israel. This was more like serfdom than slavery. Foreign women and children could be taken in war, but the women could also be taken as wives (Deuteronomy 21:10-13; Rahab—Matthew 1:5).
Debtors A poor man could sell himself to a richer man if there was famine and the poor man had no way to provide for himself. Or a debtor could sell himself to the one he owed money to. If the debtor owed money to several people, he could sell himself to a rich man who agreed to pay off the debts. Similarly, the head of a household could sell a family member in exchange for any of the above. Other arrangements were possible; Jacob sold himself to Laban for fourteen years to pay the bridal prices of Leah and Rachel. Some debt slaves were foreigners and lived under slightly different regulations if they were not proselytes (converted Jews).
Girls When a girl was sold into slavery, it was usually to marry into the family when she came of age. A father might sell a daughter to benefit the family or to improve the girl's prospects—usually, the girl married into a higher socioeconomic class. Although abuses undoubtedly occurred, the intent was to improve the girl's future. Every girl in that culture faced an arranged marriage; if she was sold, she moved into her husband's house earlier than usual and was provided for long before her wedding.
Treatment of Slaves The treatment God prescribed for slaves reflects His concern for the foreigner and the poor. In the case of debt slaves, foreign women, and girls, slaves lived with the family. They did domestic chores and sometimes held responsible, trusted positions (Genesis 24:2-4). Laws that, at first glance, seem to be abusive actually mirror civil law regarding free men.
- If either a free man (Exodus 21:18-19) or a slave (Exodus 21:20-21) is injured, the one who caused injury must provide care for the victim.
- If a man harms his slave's face, the slave is free (Exodus 21:26-27), a fair comparison to the injury of a free man (vs. 24-25).
- An ox who killed a free man (vs. 28) or a slave (vs. 32) was to be stoned—the punishment of a murderer.
Slavery and Religious Rites Boxing Day was originally intended for servants of rich English land owners, so the servants, too, could celebrate Christmas. Slaves in Israel were not so segregated from the families they served; they celebrated with the family.
- Passover was to be celebrated by slaves if they were Jews or proselytes (Exodus 12:44).
- Observance of the Sabbath was for everyone—free, slave, hired, and foreigner. Everyone got a day of rest (Exodus 20:8-11).
- A slave privately owned by a priest could partake of the food given as an offering to the priest (Leviticus 22:11)—something a free hired man could not do.
- Servants were to celebrate the Feast of Weeks (Deuteronomy 16:11) and the Feast of Booths (Deuteronomy 16:14) with the family.
Opportunities for Freedom One of the biggest differences between modern chattel slavery and Old Testament slavery was that no Israelite had to be a lifetime slave. Debt slavery always came with an expiration date.
- A Hebrew slave was to go free after six years (Exodus 21:2) with generous support (Deuteronomy 15:14).
- A Hebrew slave was to go free at the year of Jubilee (Leviticus 25:40).
- Any foreign slave who escaped to Israel was to be sheltered and not returned to slavery (Deuteronomy 23:15-16).
- Note, there is nothing in the Old Testament Law that prohibits an Israelite slave from running away. Slavery was advantageous for the poor, and, apparently, if they thought they could do better elsewhere, they could leave. If, however, the debt was not fulfilled, the slave could be apprehended and sold like any other debtor.
- Foreign slaves were not automatically released after six years; foreigners were not allowed to own land in Israel, and it would have been next to impossible for them to earn a living on their own; to release such slaves against their will may have been cruel.
Slaves and Family Exodus 21:4-6 is a hard passage. If a man went into debt-bondage with a wife, he could take her with him when he left after his commitment was fulfilled. If his master gave him a wife, though, she had to stay behind if the slave/husband left. There are three scenarios that would make this law sensible:
- The slave's wife was an adult debt-slave who still owed time on her commitment (Deuteronomy 15:12).
- The slave's wife was bought as a girl with the intention of being married. In this case, the master had the role of her father, and a newly freed slave would need to provide a bride-price to claim his wife. The bride-price was often used as a reserve in case the husband divorced the wife, and she needed independent support. In providing a bride-price, the husband proved he was able to support a wife.
- The slave's "wife" was actually a concubine, perhaps a foreigner. A concubine was similar to a wife, but her children were not eligible for inheritance. The master may have given her as a concubine to provide more children for his household.
In any of these situations, a slave could agree to stay permanently in the arrangement. This would ensure he had the support of a wealthy family as well as being able to stay with his wife and family.
Female Slaves A girl sold to a family for the eventual purpose of being married into that family had different rights (Exodus 21:7-11), although, to modern eyes, they look like restrictions. She was not to go free because working to freedom was never the intent. Once she was married to either the master or his son, she was no longer a slave, but a member of the family—a daughter (vs. 9) or a wife (vs. 10). If the master rejected or divorced her (vs. 8, 11), she and her birth-family were forgiven the whole debt.
Leviticus 19:20-22 is puzzling. If a man has sex with a female slave who is engaged to someone else, they will be punished, but not killed. She is not married—the text says "she was not free," which implies that, since she is still a slave of her master's house, she had not yet married her betrothed.
Israelites vs. Foreigners Leviticus 25:39-46 explains some of the differences between an Israelite slave and a foreign slave. An Israelite slave was to be treated as a cross between family and a hired man, not as a chattel slave. But Israel also had foreigners who had been taken in battle or who, like the Gibeonites, had chosen to become Israel's servants (Joshua 9). These slaves could be held permanently—could be, but it wasn't required. An Israelite who had to sell himself was to be treated respectfully and redeemed as quickly as possible (Leviticus 25:47-55).
Conclusion Some people categorically condemn the Bible because it does not call for the universal abolition of slavery. What they don't understand are the cultural conditions that made slavery a sad necessity. Even so, this was not chattel slavery—masters did not "own" their slaves' humanity; they leased their work. Like divorce and polygamy, slavery was never in God's perfect plan. But, because of sin, for a time and place, slavery was permitted by God, with certain restrictions.
Bitterleafsoup: I agree before I answer him I would like to hear your own take.
Verse 34. - This generation. Our Lord's assertion has given rise to sceptical observations, as if his prophecy had failed. Alford has endeavoured to remove objections by taking γενεὰ as equivalent to γένος, a race or family of people, and referring it to the continued existence of the Jews. He cites Jeremiah 8:3 (Septuagint); Matthew 12:45; Matthew 17:17; Matthew 23:36, etc., in confirmation of this signification. His examples, however, are not unassailable, though such use is certainly classical; but it the same time, it is unlikely that Christ should thus indefinitely postpone a period of infinite importance to his hearers. But there is no necessity for assuming any unusual meaning in the term "this generation." Its plain and obvious reference is to the contemporaries of the speaker, or those who shall live some thirty or forty years longer; this period would bring them to the siege of Jerusalem. And remembering that Christ has drawn no definite line between this crisis and the final consummation, we are justified in regarding all these things as meaning, primarily, the signs preceding or accompanying the downfall of the city. In a secondary sense, "this generation" may mean the spiritual Israel, the generation of them that seek the Lord (Psalm 24:6). "All these things shall surely come to pass," says Chrysostom, "and the generation of the faithful shall remain, cut off by none of the things that have been mentioned. For both Jerusalem shall perish, and the more part of the Jews shall be destroyed, but over this generation shall nothing prevail - not famine, not pestilence, not earthquake, not the tumults of wars, not false Christs, not false prophets, not deceivers, not traitors, not those that cause to offend, nor the false brethren, nor any other such-like temptations whatever." Some critics have combined the three meanings of "generation" given above, and have seen in Christ's words a threefold reference, first, to the contemporary people; secondly, to the Jewish nation; thirdly, to the Christian believers or dispensation. According to Lange, "this generation" means the generation of those who know and discern these signs.
Ken4Christ: For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. Matthew 16:27-28[/i]
Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. Matthew 24:34-36.[i]
These two verses Matthew 16:28 and Matthew 24:34 has been tagged failed predictions and also used to attack Christianity. What kind of defense can we objectively put to this? First, Jesus did not write any book but those who witnessed his earthly ministry put together his teachings as far as their memories could carry them. Well even if he said so and it did not happen just the way he predicted, I do not have any iota of doubt that Jesus is the Christ and so many things he said are happening before our very eyes.
Well my defense is this. First, we believe that Jesus is the son of God and as such has the very nature of God such that we even refer to him as God. This is not an exaggerated claim. Goat gives birth to goat. Dog gives birth to dog. God gives birth to God. However, he is subject to the father who is his God also. This does not make him a lesser god in the same way you are not a lesser human being to your boss in the office.
Now Jesus in human flesh had some form of limitations to his full expression of his personality as God. As man on earth, he didn’t know everything. That was why he even had to be anointed by the Holy Spirit to do the miracles he did. Most of the things he knew supernaturally were by the gifts of the Spirit functioning in his life.
For instance, when he was hungry, he approached a fig tree expecting to eat from it. But when he got there he found no fruits but leaves. If he functioned fully in his divine nature as God, he would have known that the tree has no fruit.
Concerning his return, he even said no one knows the day of his return except the father who have kept that as a personal secret.
Now, how do we defend his seemingly false prediction in Matt 16:28? Jesus was obviously talking about his visible return and those he said will not taste death are all dead. What then went wrong? What happened was that there was a mystery that was not revealed to even our Lord Jesus by the Father until he rose from the dead. What was the mystery? It was the church age. Our Lord Jesus at that time did not see the church age. He saw his mission as only coming to save the Jews. So after his death, he expected that the faithful Jews will be raptured to heaven, then the great tribulation will follow immediately and the anti Christ will be revealed who will rule for a short time after which he (Jesus) will come back to take the kingdom away from the anti Christ and establish his forever. He never knew God was going to extend the opportunity of salvation to the Gentile nations. Look at some statement he made to buttress my point;
“These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” (Matthew 10:5-6). Here, he commanded his disciples not to go into the way of the gentiles but only to the lost sheep of the house of Isreal.
Another instance revealing that he thought his mission was for the Jews only was his conversation he had with the Cannanite woman, “ And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil. But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” (Matthew 15:22-24).[/i]
With this in mind, you will now understand why he gave the prediction. In his limitation as man, he did not see the Church Age.
Apostle paul mentioned this in his letter - he calls it a mystery that has been hidden from ages. “Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: 27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.” (Colossians 1:26-27)[i]
It is for this same reason that the Jews actually rejected Christ as the Messiah. The entire nation of the Jews also did not see the Church age. They expected Christ to assume the throne of his father David as foretold by the angels. But nothing of such happened and they conclude he cannot be the Messiah. So, they are still looking forward for their Messiah.
The Church age which is the period given to the Gentile world to be saved paused God’s dealing with the Jews. And God’s dealing with the Jews will only resume when he is through with the gentile nations. Hence Paul wrote; “ For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.” (Romans 11:25-27)[i][/i]
We all expect everything about our Lord Jesus to be 100% as we claim he is God. Yes he is but on earth, he took upon himself the form of a man which brought some forms of limitations. That was why he was hungry like you and me. God does not get hungry. There were times he was also tired.
This is also the same reason his predictions in Matthew 24:34 failed. Just the same reason. Our Lord Jesus did not see the Church age. It was after his resurrection that the Church age was revealed to him and the plan of God was fully unfolded. Hence he told his disciples to take the gospel to the uttermost part of the world.
The full revelation of future events that cannot be faulted is contained in the book of revelations which Jesus gave to John the disciple to write down. At this point, he had left the tabernacle of our human body that placed some forms of limitation to him. So, please, do not allow only these two scriptures which I think I have explained to make you doubt the events of the future. Jesus predicted his death and resurrection and it happened just the way he said it. No man till date has been able to refute the fact the Jesus rose from the death. So, no one could stop him from rising from the death, no one can also stop him from coming back. He says;
“Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown” (Rev 3:11)
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen (Rev 1:7)
joseph1832: On the contrary my good friend, I didn't agree, I only wanted to know, because that's the very nature of man.
Since before the coming of christ, evil has reign over this earth, God himself sent that evil here by casting Lucifer down to earth.
So, since you don't know or can not tell me when rapture will happen, I'll only believe all these are mere abstracts. You know, the kind of story you tell kids because you want them to behave well.
2 Peter 3:3-4 KJV Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, [4] And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
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btw keep creating your "truth about christianity" threads. Deceiving yourself you are changing anyone. and "homie you can hate me but you ain't gettin no hate back you get no hate back 
