afam4eva:
You mean you'll prepare for ten years for a war? Even though you know that you're not a life regional premier. You'll probably be outsted in a few years. Meanwhile, while you're preparing, your people will keep being massacred, left, right and center but you'll still be preparing. I bow for you oga.

Note that it has never been Ojukwu's decision to secede from the beginning. All this was brought to the fore Post Aguiyi-Ironsi and the events that came thereafter.

The same thing we accuse Ojukwu for doing is the same thing that no one has the balls to do today despite the fact that things are worse of than they were pre-biafra.

Katsumoto:

Mr Achebe

Who told you that the Igbos were the dominant group in Nigeria? Why do Igbo sons ascribe to themselves labels such as dominant, most successful, most traveled, responsible for most growth, etc? This is not any different from Ojukwu's 'we possess the largest army in Black Africa' and then proceeded to serve his ass on a plate for some whooping.

Empty barrels make the most noise.

I guess dominance comes from joining another in a coalition against a third group.

Soon you will tell us that you were not awarded a Nobel prize because your group is 'dominant'.

Ile-Ife:


usually? if these other regions are poverty stricken, why do igbos insist on living there while they are being slaughtered like domestic animals. What is it about the other regions of Nigeria that is so attractive to the igbos?
Igbos are so arrogant and myopic that they've misconstrued the meaning of success. being successful does not mean, selling fake drugs, drug trafficking, kidnapping, scamming, armed robbery, gun running or any other social vice igbos are known for, world wide. lets just wait for a few minutes/hours, i know some of your kinsmen are committing/planning a crime as i type this comment, they will soon make you proud. As for the war, you lost it, deal with it or go to hell. even the foreign media back then could see your people's arrogance and naivety.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=yZZlAAAAIBAJ&sjid=24oNAAAAIBAJ&pg=1076,4664468&dq=biafra&hl=en

ekt_bear:
Your response wasn't good enough, is my point. Do you not get that? The answer to my question is, "there is no way to ensure that the food you give to the civilians doesn't end up feeding military.



Why would I name the book, when I mentioned its author? He only has one book on the Nigerian civil war (though it was republished again under a different name).

Should I also mention the color of my book, the font used to print the title, etc?

Anyway......more to the point, name these villages and towns you and @realchange claim that Gowon was killing and genociding on the Biafra border before your declaration of independence.....

ACM10:

Actually I read about carpet-crossing as an excerpt from a book written by Mathew Mbu, a prominent member of the NCNC and Zik's companion. I lost someone who would have shed more light on that event two years ago. But I'm hoping to put the question across to any of the participants in the politics of AG vs NCNC whenever I have an audience with them. So you have to exercise patience.

ekt_bear:

Then doesn't it follow that ANY blockade which also blocks the flow of food is a war crime?

Yet, there have been many total blockades over the past 50 years in history. Is your claim then that all of those blockades were war crimes?

If so, then Nigeria is in good company.

Bliss4Lyfe: It's time to revisit the Biafran Genocide and perpetuators persecuted for crimes against humanity. Compensation a must. Awolowo is now dead and buried, justice for Biafran victim is the anthem.

Great idea but don't hold your breath.

Justice for my uncle who died in that gratuitous war!!!

ekt_bear: Hold on a second, my confused friend ACM10.

You are citing a law associated with the International Criminal Court, an organization that did not exist until after 2000.

So, even assuming that your interpretation is correct, are you really judging a war in the late 1960s using laws from 2000+?

This is why I asked you to cite your reference well...I was pretty sure that you'd be full of crap.

ekt_bear: Err. Any responses to the posts from page 7? In particular, why you are using a law and court from the year 2000+ to condemn actions that occurred in the 1960s?

Katsumoto:

[s]
To add to that, why did they not surrender when they knew they couldn't feed their citizens?

A biafra officer told St. Jorre that if offered milk for starving kids and arms, they would choose arms. So if the Biafrans who were seeing innocent kids dying daily from starvation, didn't care about them, how were they expecting their enemies who were hundreds of miles away to be moved by the deaths?

An unemployed man feeds fat from donations from friendly neighbours while his kids starve to death. He collects toll fees from the neighbours who bring food for his kids. He uses the funds to fight his landlord in court because he doesnt want to pay rent. When his kids die, he accuses his landlord of starvation. Who should have provided for the kids? The father or the landlord?[/s]

Prof Corruption:

[s]
This is the most ridiculous garbage I have read on Nigerian-Biafran civil war. So Awolowo should be in Gowon's government and be fighting for the interests of Biafra? What would he gain, what would his people gain, what would Nigeria gain by promoting Biafra interests in Gowon administration? Had Biafra succeeded in breaking away, would this same professor not making mockery of Awolowo today that despite his intellectual tallness, Nigeria could not defeat Biafra? Whose interests exactly should Awolowo have fought for in Gowon's administration?

You won't blame your leaders that brought war upon your head but found it convenient to blame someone who had nothing to do with your misery. If you were doing fine, the dominant group in Nigeria, getting the best in Nigeria, why did you instigate the first coup? You sons killed leaders of other regions sparing yours but you did not cry foul, you did not secede, you did not cry genocide. But what happened when the macabre music was played for Igbos to dance? When Ironsi was assassinated? The whole North was demonised-Hausa did this , Fulani did that but you found it entirely convenient to ignore who fomented the trouble, who precipitated the entire scenario, you would rather blame others than blame you sons who started it all. You will always hear them talk of pogrom in the North but never mention what caused the pogrom.

Even when your so much revered Ojukwu continued in his empty arrogance, the strongest army in Black Africa nonsense, leaders of thought, opinion moulders cautioned him against rushing to war. This same Awolowo that was said to be hungry for power was part of a mission to persuade Ojukwu to shelve any idea of war. Ojukwu ignored it. He ignored all voice of reason and went to a lost war before it even started. Instead of blaming your leaders, of course the man to blame was Awolowo who instituted the policy of starvation as weapon of war as if there was something wrong with that. I don't know and I am not aware of any law that says you should feed your enemy during a raging war but our brave brothers who are not cowards like the Yorubas would continue to demonise Awolowo for that as if he was a spy that should be advancing their interests in Gowon government. How ridiculous?

The question I ask you folks is if Awolowo deliberately instituted the policy so what? Did he declare secession for Igbo? Did Nigeria constitution permit secession? Who plunged Igbo into to an unplanned war- a war that was not winnable in probability and reality? If you were dominant and was his envy, why did you give yourselves to him to prey on on the platter of gold? Why did you present him the opportunity when the same devil even cautioned you against war? Don't blame Ojukwu, Awolowo-the evil one-is the one to blame.

Achebe is bitter because Awolowo was the brain behind the defeat of Biafra. It has nothing to do with tribalism. It has nothing to do with starvation nonsense he's ranting about. Are we not living in the same world where nuclear weapons was used to obliterate a whole city and somebody is talking of starvation? are we not living in a world where a country was invaded, millions killed and infrastructure destroyed on a patently false intelligence and the world is yet to end? Some of these our professors are jokes. By the way, is Achebe now claiming to be a nationalist or not also advancing the interest of Igbo people the very same concept he seems to be criticizing Awolowo for? Wonders they say shall never end. Rant on professor, we are all ears! What else did Awolowo do to destroy Igbo?[/s]

ACM10:
Nonsense! Why is this forum filled with ignorant fellows?

Bliss4Lyfe: It's time to revisit the Biafran Genocide and perpetuators persecuted for crimes against humanity. Compensation a must. Awolowo is now dead and buried, justice for Biafran victim is the anthem.

ACM10:

I'm tired of your hide-n-seek style of debate. You have been making ignorant assertions and you expect me to prove you wrong. I think the onus is on you to prove your assertion. You cannot tell me that starvation is not a war crime and expect me to prove that it is a war crime. If you continue in this fashion, I might be forced to ignore you.

Section B. Sieges that cause
starvation
I. Treaties
Geneva Convention IV
Article 23 of the 1949 Geneva Convention IV
provides:
Each High Contracting Party shall allow the
free passage of all consignments of medical
and hospital stores and objects necessary
for religious worship intended only for
civilians of another High Contracting Party,
even if the latter is its adversary. It shall
likewise permit the free passage of all
consignments of essential foodstuffs,
clothing and tonics intended for children
under fifteen, expectant mothers and
maternity cases.
The obligation of a High Contracting Party to
allow the free passage of the consignments
indicated in the preceding paragraph is
subject to the condition that this Party is
satisfied that there are no serious reasons
for fearing:
(a) that the consignments may be diverted
from their destination,
(b) that the control may not be effective, or
(c) that a definite advantage may accrue to
the military efforts or economy of the
enemy through the substitution of the
above-mentioned consignments for goods
which would otherwise be provided or
produced by the enemy or through the
release of such material, services or facilities
as would otherwise be required for the
production of such goods.
The Power which allows the passage of the
consignments indicated in the first
paragraph of this Article may make such
permission conditional on the distribution
to the persons benefited thereby being
made under the local supervision of the
Protecting Powers.
Such consignments shall be forwarded as
rapidly as possible, and the Power which
permits their free passage shall have the
right to prescribe the technical
arrangements under which such passage is
allowed.
Back to top
II. Other Instruments
Lieber Code
Article 18 of the 1863 Lieber Code provides:
When a commander of a besieged place
expels the noncombatants, in order to
lessen the number of those who consume
his stock of provisions, it is lawful, though
an extreme measure, to drive them back, so
as to hasten on the surrender.

www.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul_rule53

ACM10:
I'm tired of your hide-n-seek style of debate. You have been making ignorant assertions and you expect me to prove you wrong. I think the onus is on you to prove your assertion. You cannot tell me that starvation is not a war crime and expect me to prove that it is a war crime. If you continue in this fashion, I might be forced to ignore you.

Section B. Sieges that cause
starvation
I. Treaties
Geneva Convention IV
Article 23 of the 1949 Geneva Convention IV
provides:
Each High Contracting Party shall allow the
free passage of all consignments of medical
and hospital stores and objects necessary
for religious worship intended only for
civilians of another High Contracting Party,
even if the latter is its adversary. It shall
likewise permit the free passage of all
consignments of essential foodstuffs,
clothing and tonics intended for children
under fifteen, expectant mothers and
maternity cases.
The obligation of a High Contracting Party to
allow the free passage of the consignments
indicated in the preceding paragraph is
subject to the condition that this Party is
satisfied that there are no serious reasons
for fearing:
(a) that the consignments may be diverted
from their destination,
(b) that the control may not be effective, or
(c) that a definite advantage may accrue to
the military efforts or economy of the
enemy through the substitution of the
above-mentioned consignments for goods
which would otherwise be provided or
produced by the enemy or through the
release of such material, services or facilities
as would otherwise be required for the
production of such goods.
The Power which allows the passage of the
consignments indicated in the first
paragraph of this Article may make such
permission conditional on the distribution
to the persons benefited thereby being
made under the local supervision of the
Protecting Powers.
Such consignments shall be forwarded as
rapidly as possible, and the Power which
permits their free passage shall have the
right to prescribe the technical
arrangements under which such passage is
allowed.
Back to top
II. Other Instruments
Lieber Code
Article 18 of the 1863 Lieber Code provides:
When a commander of a besieged place
expels the noncombatants, in order to
lessen the number of those who consume
his stock of provisions, it is lawful, though
an extreme measure, to drive them back, so
as to hasten on the surrender.

www.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul_rule53

ACM10:

Mention the instances of total blockade that did not allow food, medicine and relief materials to seep in. The perpetrators in Bosnia-Herzegovia are cooling off in Hague.

ekt_bear: What I don't like about this ACM10 fellow is you ask him to provide dates for these supposed pre-war skirmishes/genocides in Nsukka and Gakem occured, he doesn't provide.

You ask him to show how the total blockade is a war crime, he first links to a court founded after 2000. Then his next reference contradicts what he even said.

He asked me for a reference backing up my claim that Ojukwu refused the conditions which Nigeria offered for aid shipments, I provided it and even took the time to type out of a book.

It is really annoying to discuss with people like this.

VoodooDoll: Chinua Achebe has fallen apart.

Andro Blaze:

This is why I hate idolising that generation of Africans, the saboteurs who brought us to where we are now. What I hate so much about that generation is how hypocritical they were, most of them wouldn't admit they were tribal supremacists and practically all of them were. What I still can't get is that, in my opinion they had less reason to be tribalist than we do.

I can't express how disappointed I am with him after reading that biased garbage.

Rossikk:


How are things worse now than pre Biafra?

Sorry I don't accept that urban myth.

In Pre-Biafra Nigeria, the sign that one had 'arrived' was ownership of a brand new bicycle, most Nigerians walked around barefoot and in rags, illiteracy rate stood at 92% courtesy of 70 years of British misrule. (27% today), and infant mortality rate was 259 per 1000 (88 per 1000 today). So spare us the nostalgia for the (imaginary) good ol' days of Pre-Biafra.

pazienza: Why is yorubaland and northern nigeria poverty stricken 42yrs after winning the war and ruling one nigeria,why is the supposedly conquered people/region fairing better?

Maybe the answer to this question would help us to understand why one nigeria have been a failure.

Andro Blaze:

This is why I hate idolising that generation of Africans, the saboteurs who brought us to where we are now. What I hate so much about that generation is how hypocritical they were, most of them wouldn't admit they were tribal supremacists and practically all of them were. What I still can't get is that, in my opinion they had less reason to be tribalist than we do.

I can't express how disappointed I am with him after reading that biased garbage.

Bliss4Lyfe: It's time to revisit the Biafran Genocide and perpetuators persecuted for crimes against humanity. Compensation a must. Awolowo is now dead and buried, justice for Biafran victim is the anthem.

Rossikk:

But what about the declaration of secession that led to the war? That wasn't done democratically. We seem to forget that none of these people acted in real consultation with the masses, or under any sort of political legitimacy. Ojukwu, Gowon, etc were military dictators. Thugs - aged 31 and 32 at the start of the war. Two small boys. What gave any of them the right to take the country to war? We often discuss them like they were Churchill and De Gaulle. They were thugs running around with more firepower than common sense. They weren't even supposed to be anywhere near the corridors of power. Who elected them? The barrel of the gun?

I'm surprised Achebe is defending any of them and their actions, or even taking sides.