@tpia, where there is God's spirit, there's freedom
Where non christain family husband rules his family with hard fist, being authoritarian and domineering, a christain man recognises his wife as been responsible to God for her actions.christain man is under obligation not to demand respect, but works towards earning it from his wife.
The word please is common in christain home, but practically absent from non christain family
A christain husband who feels that it is his given right to act tyrannically towards his wife, his heading towards unfavourable rebuke from God.
Deteriorating family life can be improved
https://jw.org

Because God is imaginary. The bible was written by primitive men and not God! Simple. Example, God said all christians should sell there riches and after all that they should follow him. That christians should not store up riches for themselves on earth but in heaven. But let me ask you, who is doing that? Pastors with private jets etc. They all know that bible was not written by a devine all knowing God.

indigene: @tpia, where there is God's spirit, there's freedom

this freedom is often misconstrued to mean lack of discipline.

Where non christain family husband rules his family with hard fist, being authoritarian and domineering, a christain man recognises his wife as been responsible to God for her actions.christain man is under obligation not to demand respect, but works towards earning it from his wife.

this is actually not quite correct because a non-christian man can still exhibit all these qualities you say are only found in christian husbands, and a christian man can act in the most ungodly way, to his wife.

a spirit filled man is the one you're trying to describe- one who will ensure his behavior is Christ-like.

The word please is common in christain home, but practically absent from non christain family

my dear, you're dreaming, no offence.

A christain husband who feels that it is his given right to act tyrannically towards his wife, his heading towards unfavourable rebuke from God.

no argument there, but many christians have passed the point of fearing God.

bukatyne:


Hi Softy,

We are discussing about Christian men and not women however, I will answer your questions.

1. Yes
2. No
3. I don't know what you mean by gender-equality mindset as the genders are equal. Most people would unconsciously submit to leaders who show them love.

There are exceptions however.

when you get married then your views will be substantiated. Right now its like a bricklayer giving a pilot flying instructions.

bukatyne: I have noticed that so many men are quick to say that women should submit to their husbands. Some even claim that women and men are not equal. However, I want to address the christian men since they should understand the concept of Biblical submission.

1. Why don't they practice the kind of love God expects from them? 1Cor13:1 - 13 i.e. Love is kind, patient, polite, not boastful, endures all things, never loses hope, is never happy with injustice, always happy when the truth wins out etc?
2. Why do they always want their wives to submit before loving them even though Christ commanded them to love their eives as He loved the Church?
3. Why do they think submission of their wives makes her inferior considering the fact that God told us to submit to one another? Eph 5:21?
4. Why do they think hunmility, gentleness etc are qualities to be developed by women even though they are clearly the fruits of the Holy Spirit (i.e. Love, joy, peace, faith, gentleness, longsuffering, hope, tolerance and self control) which is the characteristics of a believer either male or female?
5. Why do they allow their families to treat their wives like a household slave even though the Bible says a man will leave his mother and father and cleave to his wife?
6. Why do some of them still support adultery even when the Bible clearly condemns it?

I would appreciate if christian men can answer.

Other men can but please no bashing allowed.

If you don't understand the concepts, please just read.

Thanks.

Your under-tone reeks of rebellion and "stronghead" and it sure is a thousand miles from the depiction of your selfless effort in attempting to salvage the presumed dysfunctoinality. Your piece is one-sided and altruistic. You are simply disgusted knowing these men are sexist, egotistic and in your strong view, imperious ; neglecting the call for women to submit to me.. Do not misconstrue love and modernity for haphazard living. Even in heaven there is orderliness, even in the animal kingdom there is serious orderliness- a striking example is the lion pride. Love in this context as understood and practised by me is provision - provision of care, security, financial e.t.c.... You as a woman should submit offcourse in reference to christain ideals. Sadly, most men do not hamper the provisional arm upon a woman's rebellion but a sizeable number of women quickly see it as a daunting or almost impossible task to submit once the tide turns against em. Women submit even if he is jerk. Men provide and love even if she's jezebel. These are my principles.

pro01:

You're on a VERY long thing. Any Nigerian woman with this your combative, oversabi, and 'do-me-I-do-you' mindset is bound to languish in spinsterhood/single-motherhood, or get divorced sooner than later, or worse still, endure a marriage characterised by strife. Two people cannot be 'claiming right' (as the saying goes in Naija) at the same time and expect peace to reign. Peace can only reign when one party plays the role of pacifier, that's the whole truth.

If your pastor, mother, sisters, cousins, or friends have been deceiving you that you should misunderstand the Bible and claim nonsense "right" in order to 'show' your man how 'wise' you are, then you are on your own. The truly wise women know their roles as the 'neck' that swings the head in any direction it pleases. Such women are to be emulated, or at least envied. I don talk my own finish.

enemy of the truth.I hope you're not a christain anyway.because if you are,what you're doing is to openly make a mockery of whatever you stand for or believe in.anyway spinsterhood or single motherhood which you're so fast to classify as suffering is something I'd gladly suffer than end up spending the rest of my life with someone like you.God Forbid.the thought itself is higly disgusting.SPITS
And please don't misquote the OP because of your natural bias against women.she only asked why men will except women to live up to biblical standards while themselves hardly obey the bible's marital standards.now if you can't answer the question,carry your hypocritical self off to another thread.

davidylan:

lol thanks. Your baby is blessed!

I understand your point and i have often found myself asking the same question. I think part of it has to do with our culture... most of our men grew up in homes where daddy's word is law and thus do not understand why they should be any different. Many of us have no understanding of what "love" truly is... even here you see husbands of tomorrow mocking men who cook, clean and help their wives... calling them mugus. Last but not the least... do not be fooled, many so-called church elders are truly not regenerated in their hearts. I stand firm by this belief - any man who maltreats his wife truly does not have the love of Christ in his heart regardless of how many bible verses he has memorized.

God bless you

miredia: when you get married then your views will be substantiated. Right now its like a bricklayer giving a pilot flying instructions.

Sorry but I know the kind of life I want to live and work towards it by God's grace.

miredia: Your under-tone reeks of rebellion and "stronghead" and it sure is a thousand miles from the depiction of your selfless effort in attempting to salvage the presumed dysfunctoinality. Your piece is one-sided and altruistic. You are simply disgusted knowing these men are sexist, egotistic and in your strong view, imperious ; neglecting the call for women to submit to me.. Do not misconstrue love and modernity for haphazard living. Even in heaven there is orderliness, even in the animal kingdom there is serious orderliness- a striking example is the lion pride. Love in this context as understood and practised by me is provision - provision of care, security, financial e.t.c.... You as a woman should submit offcourse in reference to christain ideals. Sadly, most men do not hamper the provisional arm upon a woman's rebellion but a sizeable number of women quickly see it as a daunting or almost impossible task to submit once the tide turns against em. Women submit even if he is jerk. Men provide and love even if she's jezebel. These are my principles.

Miredia, I am sure you had another post in mind when you posted this.

I asked simple questions and require simple answers.

Thanks

bukatyne:

Miredia, I am sure you had another post in mind when you posted this.

I asked simple questions and require simple answers.

Thanks

The simple answer is submit whether the conditions are favourable or not and the men should love whether favourable or not. Forget all d equality do-me-i-do-you stuffs. Those are sequels from rebellion.

miredia: The simple answer is submit whether the conditions are favourable or not and the men should love whether favourable or not. Forget all d equality do-me-i-do-you stuffs. Those are sequels from rebellion.

In the OP, six questions were asked. The OP never stated that women should submit or not?

Just answer the six questions.

Thanks

P.S. You mean to say that husbands and wives are not equal?

Are you a lesbian by any chance?

Just asking.

freshera: Dear why bother yourself about some people? LET US SEE WHO WINS AT THE END. May we all win together.

Some men want women to submit to them but they do not submit to God. They are going to hell. God is no respecter of anyone.

How can anyone believe God is unfair to women and still serve Him? How?

It is better to focus on your own journey, decide that God is more than marriage or children or money and try and make it to heaven. Even Pastor Adeboye said he says "God ples rem me on the day you come". Is it an unsubmissive christian man that will make it?

This is a God that was not created, that has no birthday yet designed the flowers, fishes, birds, invented animals and man. he made this terrestial ball we are on, as hot as the sun is he made it.

He is a designer, a physician, a psychologist, a physicist, a comedian, a lover, a ruler, an advocate, an engineer, a friend, a father and a mother, He is more beautiful than pleasure, more lovely than life. Who created Him . . . HALLELUYAH!!!

He invented time and space, vacumm and matter, love and sex, laughter and even satan was his product. What are we talking about?

IF YOU KNOW A MAN IS NOT DOING GOD'S WILL, DON'T MARRY HIM. Life is for maximum 130 years. A day in eternity is like a small bird sipping form the pacific ocean every 1000 years, the day the bird finishes drinking the ocean is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT up to ONE DAY IN ETERNITY.Stick with the truth. The woman is not the man's neighbour, she is his body. he is meant to love her as himself.

God will ask every husband why the wife under them did not fulfill her destiny FULLY, use her talents to HIS GLORY, make money for the gospel. God gave every Christian woman special talents (the kind that Adam and Eve had), brains, destiny, souls to preach to, people to help and deliver etc. Their blood is on her head. No way is she making heaven without finishing her assignment.

Souls are waiting for the money to be made and for it to reach them. God will ask why those souls were not reached because one Naija man somewhere refused to allow his wife stamp her signature (I was ere) on planet earth all because of demonic ego that was maybe nurtured by another woman (his mother) who did it to compensate for her husband's failings. na wa !

What is the point of being a mother on earth and you and your kids go to hell?


People are in hell as we 'speak'. So please leave the trad bros alone. They are distractions, deal ruthlesly with them. DO CHRISTIAN MARRIAGE NOT AFRICAN MARRIAGE AND BE BLESSED.

I went to a 9hr non-stop praise program recently and this guy Darae Palmer was saying God told him "The pedestal you put you son(he worships his son), that is the point you start for me".

http://dovevision.tv/blog/blog.php

In the link above, Gbile Akanni(popular christian man) was saying how God cursed the woman and said the man will rule over her. IT WAS A CURSE. THE BIBL CALLED IT A A CURSE. They are meant to rule together.

Women sacrifice God's will because of worldy stigma, marriage and children. Let us see what happens at the end. In the time of Noah, only his family was righteous so it is possible to have few good men. Most women know the men are bad yet they manage and manage and then produce sons just like their fathers so the ugly cycle continues.

I agree on smetns bt I disagree on the curse. God might have annoyingly placd a curse but really is there a curse on women? If there is then women are suppose to be the one chasing men up and down.lol.
God created a system and felt that the system needs to be structured and he did that from the beginning by creating the man first and giving him an assignment bfore he tot of the need of a companion. He further establisd the structure in Nbrs 30:1-16. Even when Jesus came he said in Matt 5:17-20 that he has not come to changed the law...please read further. Every other thing said was a light on how to fulfill Gods word.
We all need to understand the scripture. May his grace abound for us

indigene: @tpia, where there is God's spirit, there's freedom
Where non christain family husband rules his family with hard fist, being authoritarian and domineering, a christain man recognises his wife as been responsible to God for her actions.christain man is under obligation not to demand respect, but works towards earning it from his wife.
The word please is common in christain home, but practically absent from non christain family
A christain husband who feels that it is his given right to act tyrannically towards his wife, his heading towards unfavourable rebuke from God.
Deteriorating family life can be improved
https://jw.org

Did I hear you say earn? Is that what is written in the bible. Husband love and care, wife submit and reverence. Please where is the word earn emanating from

I hate to hear people blaming tradition. Life is about the good and the bad. In those days we have families that without been coerced the husband knows his role and play likewise the wife and the union was so peaceful even when the husband loose it the wife keeps calm rather than shouting and before you knw it she wins. Inspite of this we still have those who abused it. Back then we have both bad husbands and wife, no exclusion. So all this blablah tradition is a ruse to me. There are many issues today becos everyone is astray, women claiming equality, men trying to ascertain control, women not been humble, men been proclamatory.
Meeeen, I tired of talking self. Let's go back to the root. THE DEFAULT SYSTEM

Our God is a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrryy patient God. Women submission has been defined as a curse ? With the rate at which Bible is being re-written; a time would come when Abraham, Moses, Jacob, Joseph and others would be discovered to be women and God would be referred to as "SHE" because saying God is HE would be gender discrimination !!!

tpia@:
Are you a lesbian by any chance?

Just asking.

Excuse me?

Witty07: I hate to hear people blaming tradition. Life is about the good and the bad. In those days we have families that without been coerced the husband knows his role and play likewise the wife and the union was so peaceful even when the husband loose it the wife keeps calm rather than shouting and before you knw it she wins. Inspite of this we still have those who abused it. Back then we have both bad husbands and wife, no exclusion. So all this blablah tradition is a ruse to me. There are many issues today becos everyone is astray, women claiming equality, men trying to ascertain control, women not been humble, men been proclamatory.
Meeeen, I tired of talking self. Let's go back to the root. THE DEFAULT SYSTEM

And what is the default system?

Xavier1976: Our God is a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrryy patient God. Women submission has been defined as a curse ? With the rate at which Bible is being re-written; a time would come when Abraham, Moses, Jacob, Joseph and others would be discovered to be women and God would be referred to as "SHE" because saying God is HE would be gender discrimination !!!

What point are you trying to make?

The submission of women in the old Testament was a result of the sin of Adam and Eve ...

The submission in the New Testament is another kettle of fish altogether.

bukatyne:

What point are you trying to make?

The submission of women in the old Testament was a result of the sin of Adam and Eve ...

The submission in the New Testament is another kettle of fish altogether.

You have just lied. Which submission was as a result of sin. I beg, please do not say that again. Before God created a woman he has created all and created Adam and gave him an assignment and an instruction as well as warning. Remember that God Has placed the authority of man over everything before he created woman. The creation of woman came when God saw that Adam was lonely and he never created Eve the way he created Adam but in a different way by taking the rib out of Adam. Even at the end of the creation, God did not name her, Adam did. Yes, male and female he created them, but equal in the eyes of God with different responsibilities God knew he created a system and the system must have a pattern. Read Numbers 30 you will know that Submission was not as a result of sin. And do not mock God by trying to say that submission in the bible have different interpretation from both testaments. Do you think God is human that he will be talking from both sides of his mouth. Whatever is said in the New testament was a light to the old testament and admonishments.
Remember God is everything except evil. He is a diplomat, an authoritarian, He decides who is and who is not.

Witty07:

You have just lied. Which submission was as a result of sin. I beg, please do not say that again. Before God created a woman he has created all and created Adam and gave him an assignment and an instruction as well as warning. Remember that God Has placed the authority of man over everything before he created woman. The creation of woman came when God saw that Adam was lonely and he never created Eve the way he created Adam but in a different way by taking the rib out of Adam. Even at the end of the creation, God did not name her, Adam did. Yes, male and female he created them, but equal in the eyes of God with different responsibilities God knew he created a system and the system must have a pattern. Read Numbers 30 you will know that Submission was not as a result of sin. And do not mock God by trying to say that submission in the bible have different interpretation from both testaments. Do you think God is human that he will be talking from both sides of his mouth. Whatever is said in the New testament was a light to the old testament and admonishments.
Remember God is everything except evil. He is a diplomat, an authoritarian, He decides who is and who is not.

Do you want to really compare the life women had in the OT and in the NT?

Read Gen 1: 26 - 31. Going by what you said, Adam was probably to submit to the animals because God created them first. Did you note that Adam named Eve after the fall??

Does this even answer the question in the opening post?

bukatyne:

Do you want to really compare the life women had in the OT and in the NT?

Read Gen 1: 26 - 31. Going by what you said, Adam was probably to submit to the animals because God created them first. Did you note that Adam named Eve after the fall??

Does this even answer the question in the opening post?

Don't derail me to the opening post. I am questioning the part I quoted from you. Also, I never said the order in creation brought about the authority. please read in between lines and also read Gen 2:1--25.

Xavier1976: Our God is a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrryy patient God. Women submission has been defined as a curse ? With the rate at which Bible is being re-written; a time would come when Abraham, Moses, Jacob, Joseph and others would be discovered to be women and God would be referred to as "SHE" because saying God is HE would be gender discrimination !!!

bukatyne:

What point are you trying to make?

The submission of women in the old Testament was a result of the sin of Adam and Eve ...

The submission in the New Testament is another kettle of fish altogether.

Not truee. Read the story of Eve's creation again.

bukatyne:

Do you want to really compare the life women had in the OT and in the NT?

Read Gen 1: 26 - 31. Going by what you said, Adam was probably to submit to the animals because God created them first. Did you note that Adam named Eve after the fall??

Does this even answer the question in the opening post?

You seem to not understand the Adam and eve story. As far as i am concerned, a man who wishes to enjoy a good marriage should not marry a woman who does not understand the power behind a submissive praying wife.

Genesis 3 verses 16 "Unto the woman he said, i will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception, in the sorrow thou shalt bring forth children, AND THY DESIRE SHALL BE TO THY HUSBAND, AND HE SHALL RULE OVER THEE". Headship role activated.

Pls I need to understand what this whole submission business I keep hearing means. Its on NL, in my office and social gatherings. What is it really?
I'm not married lemme quickly put it out there but why are ppl so adamant about this business of a head and tail. What ever happened to patners and being a team because that's how I feel marriage shud be. Raising a family shud be a team efforts where views are aired and decisions are made jointly as one. Off course there's bound to be disagreements from time to time but that's just the dynamics of social interaction. And yes once in a while someone has to back down and let they other person shine. That's just how the team works. It must not always be one person dng the backing down.
A marriage is team effort so when one person falls the other can pick up the slacks. When you co-own a business with someone else both individuals are required to give inputs, make decisions jointly for the good and growth of the business. Both individuals have to pull their weight accordingly and when either of them falls or slacsk off the other person is around to pick up the pieces.
So I ask again what is with all this submission business?

Meddler: Pls I need to understand what this whole submission business I keep hearing means. Its on NL, in my office and social gatherings. What is it really?
I'm not married lemme quickly put it out there but why are ppl so adamant about this business of a head and tail. What ever happened to patners and being a team because that's how I feel marriage shud be. Raising a family shud be a team efforts where views are aired and decisions are made jointly as one. Off course there's bound to be disagreements from time to time but that's just the dynamics of social interaction. And yes once in a while someone has to back down and let they other person shine. That's just how the team works. It must not always be one person dng the backing down.
A marriage is team effort so when one person falls the other can pick up the slacks. When you co-own a business with someone else both individuals are required to give inputs, make decisions jointly for the good and growth of the business. Both individuals have to pull their weight accordingly and when either of them falls or slacsk off the other person is around to pick up the pieces.
So I ask again what is with all this submission business?

Too much 'exposure' dey worry you. You never ready. Better stay single or find an oyinbo man to marry.

Meddler: Pls I need to understand what this whole submission business I keep hearing means. Its on NL, in my office and social gatherings. What is it really?
I'm not married lemme quickly put it out there but why are ppl so adamant about this business of a head and tail. What ever happened to patners and being a team because that's how I feel marriage shud be. Raising a family shud be a team efforts where views are aired and decisions are made jointly as one. Off course there's bound to be disagreements from time to time but that's just the dynamics of social interaction. And yes once in a while someone has to back down and let they other person shine. That's just how the team works. It must not always be one person dng the backing down.
A marriage is team effort so when one person falls the other can pick up the slacks. When you co-own a business with someone else both individuals are required to give inputs, make decisions jointly for the good and growth of the business. Both individuals have to pull their weight accordingly and when either of them falls or slacsk off the other person is around to pick up the pieces.
So I ask again what is with all this submission business?

Yes team. But have you ever seen a team without a leader who ratifies decisions and ensure there is a direction. Football is a team with a captain and assistant captain on pitch. Coach and assistant coach. That is team. Obviously most women turn the team meaning upside down in marriage to justify their point. God help us.

^^^

Princess zoe: Genesis 3 verses 16 "Unto the woman he said, i will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception, in the sorrow thou shalt bring forth children, AND THY DESIRE SHALL BE TO THY HUSBAND, AND HE SHALL RULE OVER THEE". Headship role activated.

That wasn't the activation it started in Gen 2: 23. And this was the last assigment Adam carried out before the fall of man.

davidylan:

You seem to not understand the Adam and eve story. As far as i am concerned, a man who wishes to enjoy a good marriage should not marry a woman who does not understand the power behind a submissive praying wife.

In fact, submission came up in the NT where wives were told to submit and husbands told to love. The creation story shows oneness and unity in purpose. After the creation, God talked about oneness and not submission. Submission or should I say subordination came after the fall. It was a consequence of their actions. Remember God said ...'because you ...., I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your desire shall be for your husband...'

The OT subordination was NOT a blessing to the woman.