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Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 8:52am On Dec 07, 2014 |
The God in the Old Testament seems to have many personalities; cruel, unjust, kind, loving, etc." There are, however, two major areas which we humans have a difficult time reconciling - God's love vs. God's righteousness. God is loving, but God's love requires God's justice. As I discipline my three children when they disobey, God disciplines us if we don't meet His requirements. The problem for us is that we cannot keep all of God's laws because of our selfishness and self-centeredness. God would have been completely just and loving in destroying all of us for our disobedience to Him. It is only through His extraordinary love and grace that we are allowed into His presence. If you were to read atheist's websites, you will often find complaints that the God of the Bible arbitrarily ordered the destruction of entire cities, such as Jericho, just to allow the Jews to have a homeland in the Middle East. How could a loving God command the destruction of all those "innocent" people? The argument sounds good, but it is utterly false. The unstated assumption is that the people who God ordered destroyed were morally equivalent to the Jews, who replaced them. However, this is what the Bible says about the people who were destroyed: "It is not for your righteousness or for the uprightness of your heart that you are going to possess their land, but it is because of the wickedness of these nations that the LORD your God is driving them out before you, in order to confirm the oath which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. ( Deuteronomy 9:5) Okay, how "wicked" could those people have been? How about killing their own sons and daughters by burning them in sacrifices to their gods: "You shall not behave thus toward the LORD your God, for every abominable act which the LORD hates they have done for their gods; for they even burn their sons and daughters in the fire to their gods. ( Deuteronomy 12:31) The wickedness of these people is confirmed in other verses of the Bible. So we see that these people are not quite as innocent as the atheists would like you to believe. The fact that these people practiced child sacrifice is also confirmed in the secular writings of the Greeks. Then again, maybe those atheists believe that killing your children is not all bad. After all, killing viable pre-born babies is legal in this country (it's called a choice, a.k.a. abortion). For these reasons (and others), God ordered the destruction of the peoples whom the Israelites dispossessed. Did God kill any innocent people along with the evil ones? When God was about to destroy the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, Abraham asked God if He would destroy the cities if there were 50 righteous people in them. God said no. Then Abraham asked the same question if there were 45 righteous people. Every time he dropped the number and got the same answer. The fact is that God would not have destroyed those cities if there were any righteous people in them. The few righteous who were in those cities He warned ahead of time to get out. So, God does not destroy the righteous along with the evil. God's judgment of people groups found in the Old Testament actually pales in comparison to the judgment He will render at the end of time. According to the New Testament Book of Revelation, God will judge and kill billions of people who reject Him when Jesus returns, including 200 million killed in a single battle. Such large armies have never existed in the history of mankind until the last 100 years, suggesting the this judgment could come at any time. THE CHILDREN. In some instances, God ordered the killing of entire populations, presumably including the killing of babies and children. Isn't God unrighteous in killing these innocent little ones? First of all, the Bible indicates that all people are sinners, including babies, and worthy of judgment. However, the Bible also indicates that children are incapable of making moral choices, so that they are automatically rewarded with heaven. So, in having babies killed, God is actually doing them a favor, since, if they had grown up opposed to God, they would have gone to hell. If God were to have spared some of the children, it would have been difficult to determine the cutoff age. A one-year old is probably still relatively uncorrupted by his parents, but what about a two-year old? I have personally seen a number of spoiled two-year olds who had already been corrupted by their parents. In a society where moral corruption abounds, the corruption of the children would be early and severe. God was very clear that he did not want the sons and daughters of the corrupted peoples to marry the sons and daughters of the Israelites to lead them astray through false worship. Even so, there are many examples of the Israelites being polluted in their worship by the surrounding peoples. CONCLUSION; In order to maintain His righteousness, God must judge sin - everything that goes against His character. If God let everyone into heaven, then He would have to allow in people such as Stalin and Hitler. Obviously, heaven would not be a good place to be with the likes of those people there. Therefore, God's righteousness requires the judgment of all sin. Only those people who agree with God and are willing to allow themselves to be changed into sinless beings can enter into heaven. 3 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by holatin(m): 9:16am On Dec 07, 2014 |
let me phone a friend 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Ambrogio(m): 9:27am On Dec 07, 2014 |
Using your logic, i should go out and start judging people who have sinned against me. Since i judge myself a god and righteous, killing others is therefore something I'm entitled to do 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by herald9: 9:41am On Dec 07, 2014 |
Firstly...how would these people have known the God of the Jews when this same God forbids the Jews from interacting with them...calling them 'Gentiles' .Yet when these people did what seem right to them...he got angry and destroyed them with vengeance...What kind of a God is that? Secondly,why would a god who claimed to have created everyone in his own image,favour some and discriminate against others...if you were the one will you still worship a god who doesn't care about you? Wouldn't you find solace in another place? I don't know what kinda mentality the O.T god had...seems he was truly 'the most high' 7 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 9:48am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212:The GOD you refer to in the Old Testament is/was the God of Israel. He revealed himself to the Israelites through Abraham, and marked them as His. They were his responsibility, thus if he wanted all of them dead for such heinous acts like [url=http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus+35%3A2&version=ESV]working on the Sabbath[/url] or [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy%2025:11-12]hitting a man's privates while trying to protect your husband[/url], it was within his rights to do that. No one would care. The issue here is he didn't reveal himself to the other tribes. Just as he was a God to the Israelites, the Ammonites and other tribes had their own Gods whom they worshiped and served. I loved the parent-child analogy you used in the OP. How would you feel if your neighbor walked into your home, and smacked your kid and raped your daughters because they do not acknowledge him as their Father? As different fathers have different relationships and rules by which they guide their kids, so also the different Gods have their own rules and regulations. Wouldn't it be insane for a father to be jealous that other kids do not refer to him as Father? I also detect hypocrisy in one of the verses... malvisguy212: Isn't this the same God that sanctioned this? Exoduse 32: 27He said to them, ‘Thus says the Lord, the God of Israel, “Put your sword on your side, each of you! Go back and forth from gate to gate throughout the camp, and each of you kill your brother, your friend, and your neighbour.” ’ 28The sons of Levi did as Moses commanded, and about three thousand of the people fell on that day. 29Moses said, ‘Today you have ordained yourselves* for the service of the Lord, each one at the cost of a son or a brother, and so have brought a blessing on yourselves this day.’ Of course, all this was done..... malvisguy212: 6 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 9:54am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212:The Israelites also practiced cannibalism. Why didn't God wipe them off the face of the earth? 2 Kings:TBH, Yahweh even considered it appropriate punishment for not acknowledging Him. Deuteronomy 28: 33 And you shall eat the fruit of your womb, the flesh of your sons and daughters, whom the Lord your God has given you, in the siege and in the distress with which your enemies shall distress you. 54 The man who is the most tender and refined among you will begrudge food to his brother, to the wife he embraces,4 and to the last of the children whom he has left, 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 9:59am On Dec 07, 2014 |
herald9:they knows the God there forefathers worship yet they choose there own way because of freewill ,you choose to love God or Hate him,it your choice. God did not favour anybody ,we are told how the isrealite turn back on God on many occasion and God punish them ,infact they suffer more .I have had a number of skeptics complain that it is unfair for God to choose the Jews as His people over all others. Although it would be unfair for God to show partiality to one people group, this is not what was meant when the Bible said that God chose the Jewish people. The Bible indicates that God chose the Jewish people as the people through whom He would send the Messiah. Being chosen did not always bring great blessings, since the Jews were held to a higher level of accountability, and were judged for their failures. The Bible makes it clear that God does not show partiality, since He created all people. He commands His people to behave likewise. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Anomnity: 10:00am On Dec 07, 2014 |
@OP. Malvisguy212 God bless and reward you with wisdom and excellence.I've always seen these ungodly wicked atheists and even so called christians accusing God of wickedness and It pained me a lot that there's none among the faithful on this forum that can prove to them that those people and nations were extremely evil in their ways despite Gods warnings. You'll always see in the bible where God still gave them a lot of time while in their extreme wickedness and bloodshed saying their cup is not yet full or their time is not yet come.Yet the evil people on this forum are quick to label God as wicked. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 10:02am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212:All this depicts is a God in love with war, destruction and anarchy. This isn't about righteousness, this is about revenge. This isn't about judgment, it is about payback. This isn't about salvation, but about destruction. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. God's idea of love falls way short of the standards these verses define love to be. 1 Corinthians 13: 5 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 10:03am On Dec 07, 2014 |
at least atheists how belive that there is God. Thats a good start |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 10:08am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212:hahaha, so why are you against abortion? We would be doing the kids a favor afterall. malvisguy212:Christian guy rapes innocent Muslim girl to death. Muslim girl goes to hell because she didn't believe Jesus is the son of God. Christian guy ask for forgiveness. Makes heaven. Checkmate atheists. 13 Likes 3 Shares |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by johnydon22(m): 10:09am On Dec 07, 2014 |
all those stories are bleeping lies... jewish myth 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 10:17am On Dec 07, 2014 |
musKeeto:exodus 32 is about the wickedness of the people they turn against God who deliver them from bondage. You guys select verses from bible that pronouce judgment on sinner but fail to give the verse that talk about there evil deed. I Der you guys to. Quite every deed of this people. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by freeDR(m): 10:30am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 10:31am On Dec 07, 2014 |
musKeeto:all this is your own evil thinking.you just judge your self now. God know genue repentance. The reason why abortion is evil is not because of the baby but the evil INTENSION of the person that did it.every deed must have intension, what is your intension of aborting your babies, that intension is the sin. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 10:33am On Dec 07, 2014 |
Anomnity:BLESS YOU TO. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by freeDR(m): 10:44am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212:Listen to yourself. God was actually doing those kids a favour by killing them? Your so called religion is not only dangerous to mankind, you and anyone that shares your mind set is equally dangerous. Why would you even try defending what is not defensible? The same God helped Elisha to kill a group of kids. You read your so called holy book everyday and you see these evidences staring you in the face, yet, instead of coming to terms with the obvious truth, you have decided to defend the callousness of your deity. Too bad. Tell me, what manner of religion will kill, maim and shock the mind children? 6 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by dalaman: 11:42am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212 is trying to justify pure barbarism written by uncivilized men long ago because he happens to indoctrinated with their stories, the same man is always at the neck of the muslims and calling the Koran an evil book. The OT is worse than the Koran when it comes to violence and evil deeds. If he claims its God's judgement, why not accept that the injunctions in the Koran which are actually a milder are also judgement from Allah? 2 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 11:44am On Dec 07, 2014 |
U guys shld stop trying to defend the Bible God. This is an argument you can never win. It has existed longer than you think. Not the best preachers can defend the actions taking by "God" in the bible. He hardened the heart of pharoah. He was said to have loved Jacob more than Esau before birth He help killed the people of Jerico cos some of His children wanted to pass through... Why cnt they just be teleported or something, he is God after all. He somehow allowed satan to get into the garden, and then purnish a man and a woman who doesn't know good or evil. How does someone who knows no good or evil commit a sin, aren't they suppose to be amoral? We can keep going... OP, pls don't try here, I don't hate the bible God. But u can't prove him to not be as he is said to have done in the bible. 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by herald9: 11:53am On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: Blah blah blah I would've loved you to explain to us how the Jews and amonites are related cause the entire bible focuses on the Jews ..but let me skip it.. But tell me...are you still worshipping the gods of your forefathers? Lolz You yourself is guilty of the same thing you're accusing these people of...You should be ashamed of yourself ...Hehehe If God had really wanted these people..he could've just tried to reachout to them...But he forgot them..when they fell apart..he got angry and attack them without provocation . It seems this O.T god was not only myopic...he acted too unintelligent for a god that created this vast universe..and the complex living things within. You don't spread religion by discrimination..you infect them by interacting with them...and he failed to know this simple fact... Fancy an omniscient God 3 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Nobody: 12:03pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
The story of the African man. His gods are evil, Abraham's gods were good. 7 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Weah96: 12:24pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
Superstitious nonsense. Anyone who falls for these stories deserves to enter heaven THIS YEAR. As a reward for believing them. 3 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 12:45pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
dalaman:the evil the men deed you overlooked it but when God judge them you are crying why God , well,50years to come when God kill the boko haram guys am very sure you will be crying God is evil,right? |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Weah96: 12:47pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: So God could potentially wipe out BH in 50 years? SMH. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by dalaman: 1:11pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: Is it God that will kill Boko Haram? Are the biblical prophets like Moses and the rest any different from Boko Haram? 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by wordcat(m): 2:11pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
The op is worst than the god he's trying to defend. So u will considered it "Completely JUST and LOVING if your neighbour Kill four of his children because they disobeyed him? The op is worst than the god he's trying to defend. So u will considered it "Completely JUST and LOVING if your neighbour Kill four of his children because they disobeyed him? The op is worst than the god he's trying to defend. So u will considered it "Completely JUST and LOVING if your neighbour Kill four of his children because they disobeyed him? 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 3:25pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
When you see atheist all over a thread screeming and complaining why the op is defending God,it mean they know the truth that God is good but don't want to admit it. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 3:26pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
Weah96:that was an example I made. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Weah96: 3:28pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: Which kain non sequitur is dis one again? A real God wouldn't commit fallacies in a language he created out of anger. 1 Like |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 3:28pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
musKeeto:the abraham God is sooo powerful that the african gods cannot defend it's people. |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by Weah96: 3:33pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
malvisguy212: Is it the same God who sent ONE angel to kill over 150 thousand armed men in less than 6 hours of darkness? Does it make sense to you that such a person will sit for fifty years watching as human beings get decapitated left and right? 4 Likes |
Re: Did God Realy Killed Innocent People As Claim By Atheist? by malvisguy212: 3:35pm On Dec 07, 2014 |
Weah96:this book of isaiah is for you guys. Isaiah 6 New International Version (NIV) 6 In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord, high and exalted, seated on a throne; and the train of his robe filled the temple. 2 Above him were seraphim, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying. 3 And they were calling to one another: “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty; the whole earth is full of his glory.” 4 At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook and the temple was filled with smoke. 5 “Woe to me!” I cried. “I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King, the Lord Almighty.” 6 Then one of the seraphim flew to me with a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with tongs from the altar. 7 With it he touched my mouth and said, “See, this has touched your lips; your guilt is taken away and your sin atoned for.” 8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?” And I said, “Here am I. Send me!” 9 He said, “Go and tell this people: “‘Be ever hearing, but never understanding; be ever seeing, but never perceiving.’ 10 Make the heart of this people calloused; make their ears dull and close their eyes.[ a] Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their heart |
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