Dear Brothers,
We remember God promised Abraham a son even before he had Ishmael and Isaac...but because of impatience he took matters into his own hands and with the consent of his wife he laid with Haggai...the story am about to tell you is simply how God has designed the world and how no one can fathom his ways because he is all knowing, his ways are mysterious he is Alpha and Omega...

“So now we have this story: Ishmael and Isaac. Ishmael is a fourteen year old boy. He’s kicked out into the desert but the Lord is faithful. He preserves him. He promises to make him into a great nation. So we read these things and they’re interesting Bible stories but what I’m asking you to do is to put yourself in the position and recognize the fact that in history, in real time, this was a real boy… with real emotions, with a real life. This happened to a little kid named Ishmael. And so what we need to understand is you have this little boy and… he had a dad. He had a mother. He had a family. He had a life. He had an inheritance. And in one day he loses all of these things. He loses his dad. He loses his inheritance. He’s out in the desert. He’s on his own. And that brokenness, that woundedness, that rejection that took place in this little child, today, has been passed on into the religion of Islam.

What do I mean? … Mohammed, the founder of Islam…is a direct descendant of Ishmael and Muslims, today, view themselves as both the physical and the spiritual descendants of Ishmael. And so here you have this story, this incredible event that took place in this child’s life. Two thousand six hundred years after these events took place, a direct descendant of Ishmael named Mohammed birthed forth a new religion into the world. And what does the religion teach? … It teaches God is not a father. God has no Son. And, thirdly, Ishmael, not Isaac, is the heir with regard to the promises of God to the earth. The very things that those issues of rejection and woundedness and brokenness that took place in Ishmael’s life were preserved in that line and two thousand six hundred years later, Mohammed goes into a cave, has an incredibly encounter with a spiritual being. It literally chokes the life out of him to where he feels as though he’s going to die, three times this presence comes over him and it demands of him to recite… On the third time, the words of the Qur’an begin to flow forth from his mouth.

Mohammed, himself, literally believed that he was possessed. He was suicidal. He was terrified.” 1

After this, he runs home to his wife who eventually convinced him he was a prophet of God. This is the origin of Islam.

“In a spiritual sense, Islam is the broken, bitter cry of Ishmael.” 2 but he also a descendant of Abraham ( we all know how God love him)

Did you notice the compassion in this definition of Islam? This is how we as the Church should approach Muslims who God also desires to be saved [1 Timothy 2:4]. These are people just as lost as you and I once were. I don’t want you to miss this because the implications of this original conflict in Genesis when played out through Scripture to the time of the end is shocking and may be considered by some as quite harsh especially in a day when we are taught that Christians and Muslims both worship the same God and a redefining of Christian love as powerless, non-judgmental tolerance is pervading the Church. We are to love Muslims but this doesn’t mean we don’t, also, let the truth be known. Rather, it is against this backdrop of compassion, of Christian love, that we must tell the truth and warn others. In other words, we must love people enough to tell them the truth about Islam.

“You have in Islam the greatest anti-Christianity religion that the world will ever know… And, in fact, the greatest spiritual challenge the Church will ever face particularly in the days ahead. The Church, today, is still in denial.”

I echo these last sentiments and, with the exception of Adam’s sin necessitating the death and resurrection of Christ for the salvation of all mankind, I don’t think there has been any one sin in the Bible that has been so felt around the world as Abraham’s. The consequences rage on to this very day between the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael and it will only be resolved upon Christ’s return.

Hmm, Oro shunukun!

@OP

Your pastors are busy buying private jets and building universities to educate people about science instead of exposing the goings on the world.

It's either the christian and Islamic god don't exist or he's such a colossal confusionist.

God forgive you...

Billiondoe:
Dear Brothers,
We remember God promised Abraham a son even before he had Ishmael and Isaac...but because of impatience he took matters into his own hands and with the consent of his wife he laid with Haggai...the story am about to tell you is simply how God has designed the world and how no one can fathom his ways because he is all knowing, his ways are mysterious he is Alpha and Omega...

“So now we have this story: Ishmael and Isaac. Ishmael is a fourteen year old boy. He’s kicked out into the desert but the Lord is faithful. He preserves him. He promises to make him into a great nation. So we read these things and they’re interesting Bible stories but what I’m asking you to do is to put yourself in the position and recognize the fact that in history, in real time, this was a real boy… with real emotions, with a real life. This happened to a little kid named Ishmael. And so what we need to understand is you have this little boy and… he had a dad. He had a mother. He had a family. He had a life. He had an inheritance. And in one day he loses all of these things. He loses his dad. He loses his inheritance. He’s out in the desert. He’s on his own. And that brokenness, that woundedness, that rejection that took place in this little child, today, has been passed on into the religion of Islam.

What do I mean? … Mohammed, the founder of Islam…is a direct descendant of Ishmael and Muslims, today, view themselves as both the physical and the spiritual descendants of Ishmael. And so here you have this story, this incredible event that took place in this child’s life. Two thousand six hundred years after these events took place, a direct descendant of Ishmael named Mohammed birthed forth a new religion into the world. And what does the religion teach? … It teaches God is not a father. God has no Son. And, thirdly, Ishmael, not Isaac, is the heir with regard to the promises of God to the earth. The very things that those issues of rejection and woundedness and brokenness that took place in Ishmael’s life were preserved in that line and two thousand six hundred years later, Mohammed goes into a cave, has an incredibly encounter with a spiritual being. It literally chokes the life out of him to where he feels as though he’s going to die, three times this presence comes over him and it demands of him to recite… On the third time, the words of the Qur’an begin to flow forth from his mouth.

Mohammed, himself, literally believed that he was possessed. He was suicidal. He was terrified.” 1

After this, he runs home to his wife who eventually convinced him he was a prophet of God. This is the origin of Islam.

“In a spiritual sense, Islam is the broken, bitter cry of Ishmael.” 2 but he also a descendant of Abraham ( we all know how God love him)

Did you notice the compassion in this definition of Islam? This is how we as the Church should approach Muslims who God also desires to be saved [1 Timothy 2:4]. These are people just as lost as you and I once were. I don’t want you to miss this because the implications of this original conflict in Genesis when played out through Scripture to the time of the end is shocking and may be considered by some as quite harsh especially in a day when we are taught that Christians and Muslims both worship the same God and a redefining of Christian love as powerless, non-judgmental tolerance is pervading the Church. We are to love Muslims but this doesn’t mean we don’t, also, let the truth be known. Rather, it is against this backdrop of compassion, of Christian love, that we must tell the truth and warn others. In other words, we must love people enough to tell them the truth about Islam.

“You have in Islam the greatest anti-Christianity religion that the world will ever know… And, in fact, the greatest spiritual challenge the Church will ever face particularly in the days ahead. The Church, today, is still in denial.”

I echo these last sentiments and, with the exception of Adam’s sin necessitating the death and resurrection of Christ for the salvation of all mankind, I don’t think there has been any one sin in the Bible that has been so felt around the world as Abraham’s. The consequences rage on to this very day between the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael and it will only be resolved upon Christ’s return.

Exposition of ignorance!!!

Look at someone who claims to be a Christian believing a religion that says Jesus is not the Son of God. Pity you. What makes you a Christian in the first place? I am referring to your support for islam on the other thread.

[Quran 29:27] And We bestowed on him Isaac and Jacob, and We established the prophethood and the Scripture among his seed, and We gave him his reward in the world, and lo! in the Hereafter he verily is among the righteous

If the quran is reliable and prophethood and Scripture is established for Isaac and his seed (i.e his children), what business did Muhammad, a descendant of Ishmael have being a prophet and producing any Scripture?

The Bible also confirm that only Isaac had covenant of prophethood:


Genesis 17:19–21
19 God said, “No, but
Sarah your wife shall bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac. I will establish my covenant with him as an everlasting covenant for his offspring after him.

20 As for Ishmael, I have heard you; behold, I have blessed him and will make him fruitful and i will multiply him greatly. He shall father twelve princes, and I will make him into a great nation.

21 But I will establish my covenant with Isaac, whom Sarah shall bear to you at this time next year.”

According to that Bible passage, the covenant (prophethood) of Isaac and his descendant is everlasting, not subject to a change or transfer. No prophet of the true God has the right to emerge from any other family other than Isaac's.

The Devil only raised islam as a result of the rivalry between Sarah and Hagai. It was Sarah that first suggested that Hagai and Ishmael be sent out, which Abraham refused until God sanctioned it. This is why I wonder when muslims say Abraham and Ishmael built Kaaba in Mecca. How reasonable is it for Abraham to still follow Ishmael, whom God approved of his casting out? Would Abraham disobey God by following Hagai and Ishmael out of Israel?

truthman2012:


Exposition of ignorance!!!

Look at someone who claims to be a Christian believing a religion that says Jesus is not the Son of God. Pity you. What makes you a Christian in the first place? I am referring to your support for islam on the other thread.

[Quran 29:27] And We bestowed on him Isaac and Jacob, and We established the prophethood and the Scripture among his seed, and We gave him his reward in the world, and lo! in the Hereafter he verily is among the righteous

If the quran is reliable and prophethood and Scripture is established for Isaac and his seed (i.e his children), what business did Muhammad, a descendant of Ishmael have being a prophet and producing any Scripture?

The Bible also confirm that only Isaac had covenant of prophethood:


Genesis 17:19–21
19 God said, “No, but
Sarah your wife shall bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac. I will establish my covenant with him as an everlasting covenant for his offspring after him.

20 As for Ishmael, I have heard you; behold, I have blessed him and will make him fruitful and i will multiply him greatly. He shall father twelve princes, and I will make him into a great nation.

21 But I will establish my covenant with Isaac, whom Sarah shall bear to you at this time next year.”

According to that Bible passage, the covenant (prophethood) of Isaac and his descendant is everlasting, not subject to a change or transfer. No prophet of the true God has the right to emerge from any other family other than Isaac's.

The Devil only raised islam as a result of the rivalry between Sarah and Hagai. It was Sarah that first suggested that Hagai and Ishmael be sent out, which Abraham refused until God sanctioned it. This is why I wonder when muslims say Abraham and Ishmael built Kaaba in Mecca. How reasonable is it for Abraham to still follow Ishmael, whom God approved of his casting him out? Would Abraham disobey God by following Hagai and Ishmael out of Israel?

I can't find were it was written that Abraham disagreed with Sarah about Ishmael and Haggai leaving...read your Bible from begining to end... you can't just pick chapters from the middle and think you can understand... I pray God bless you with wisdom and understanding cos you fall short... wisdom is needed in the proper understanding in the word of God, most people don't even see the role of a Woman in this passage...no body looks deeper to see the role Sarah (A woman) and Haggai ( A woman)changed history till dis day... Abraham's problem started the moment he consented to laying with Haggai.... I Pray God removes spritual cataract from your eyes when you read the Bible... bless your heart

Billiondoe:


I can't find were it was written that Abraham disagreed with Sarah about Ishmael and Haggai leaving...read your Bible from begining to end... you can't just pick chapters from the middle and think you can understand... I pray God bless you with wisdom and understanding cos you fall short... wisdom is needed in the proper understanding in the word of God, most people don't even see the role of a Woman in this passage...no body looks deeper to see the role Sarah (A woman) and Haggai ( A woman)changed history till dis day... Abraham's problem started the moment he consented to laying with Haggai.... I Pray God removes spritual cataract from your eyes when you read the Bible... bless your heart

Hummm !!!

Genesis 21:9-12
9 And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking.

10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac.

11 And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.

12 And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called

The red letters show that God has discountenanced with Ishmael as far as religious issues are concerned.

Billiondoe:


I can't find were it was written that Abraham disagreed with Sarah about Ishmael and Haggai leaving...read your Bible from begining to end... you can't just pick chapters from the middle and think you can understand... I pray God bless you with wisdom and understanding cos you fall short... wisdom is needed in the proper understanding in the word of God, most people don't even see the role of a Woman in this passage...no body looks deeper to see the role Sarah (A woman) and Haggai ( A woman)changed history till dis day... Abraham's problem started the moment he consented to laying with Haggai.... I Pray God removes spritual cataract from your eyes when you read the Bible... bless your heart

Hummm !!!

Genesis 21:9-12
9 And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking.

10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac.

11 And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.

12 And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called

The red letters show that God has discounternanced (discarded) with Ishmael as far as religious issues are concerned.

Billiondoe:


I can't find were it was written that Abraham disagreed with Sarah about Ishmael and Haggai leaving...read your Bible from begining to end... you can't just pick chapters from the middle and think you can understand... I pray God bless you with wisdom and understanding cos you fall short... wisdom is needed in the proper understanding in the word of God, most people don't even see the role of a Woman in this passage...no body looks deeper to see the role Sarah (A woman) and Haggai ( A woman)changed history till dis day... Abraham's problem started the moment he consented to laying with Haggai.... I Pray God removes spritual cataract from your eyes when you read the Bible... bless your heart

God did not recognize the bond woman as abraham wife, in fact it was God himself who advice abraham to send the bond woman away. Why did the bible address her as the bound woman ? Are you a catholic christian ?