johnydon22:


I do not claim to have knowledge of what happens in death but if anybody, person or book claims to know, they are both lying and fraudulent.

Because they do not know.

www.nairaland.com/3133542/christian-doctrine-salvation-worlds-religions/3#58154230

To be very honest with you from the very bottom of my heart this question i am about to ask you is not for the sake of argument as it is the culture here on this section which I stopped patronizing long ago (not active) because of the LUNACY and FANATISM exhibited here. People are not here to increase in knowledge so OBDURATE hearted.

So, what i seek is an ENLIGHTENMENT and which is, IF YOURSELF CLAIM NOT TO HAVE KNOWLEDGE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS IN DEATH, meaning that you are IGNORANT of what happens in death (after-life). Then is it based upon this IGNORANCE that you have charged persons or books who claim to know as LIARS and FRAUDULENT?!

Isn't that a mutually destructive assertion, your charge since yourself DONT KNOW WHAT HAPPENS IN DEATH, (actually after death as the topic suggest in the thread from which i copied your quote) hence, a mere SPECULATION that they are LIARS and FRAUDULENT? For if its from the stand point of your KNOWLEDGE "i know" what happens in death and not IGNORANCE then your evidence presented as to what you KNOW AS THE TRUTH which happens at death (after death) becomes a VALID charge as to these persons to declaring them as LIARS or these books being FRAUD.

Is it the fact that there are multiple conflicting tales about what happens in death that makes them all LIES and FRAUDULENT? My main point really is should DISQUALIFICATION come from the stand point of "I know" KNOWLEDGE Or "I dont know" IGNORANCE? If yourself dont know what happens in death then how do you know that they are all LYING or at least one of these tales is not the TRUTH which with the fleeting of time and advancement in Science and Technology could make CERTAINTY of their claims or actually prove them all wrong as ABSOLUTELY FALSE like so many claims in the realms of religion have been proven true and untrue based on EMPIRICAL KNOWLEDGE with the fleeting of time.

Please enlighten me on how you came to conclude, charging persons and books who claim to know as LIARS and FRAUDULENT while you yourself dont have the knowledge of what happens in DEATH (after-life) as to be able to counter their claims.

How did you come about this charge?

Hebrews 9:27-28King James Version (KJV)

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

You either end up in hell because of sin or in heaven because of a holy/righteous life.

Here you go...

Five Facts About Death
—Hebrews 9:27

In this lesson, we look at a single Bible verse "It is appointed for men once to die, and after this the judgment" (Hebrews 9:27) which tells us five facts about death... Knowing these facts helps us understand and prepare for death. We break this text up into five portions, each of which implies a certain fact about death.

1 "It is appointed..." —Death is Unavoidable

In the phrase "It is appointed for men once to die..." we find our first fact, that death is unavoidable.

When Hebrews 9:27 says, that death "is appointed", it might be stating the obvious, yet most people live as if death is unlikely!

We have birth control, but not death control. It is inevitable that "the silver cord is loosed and we fly away" (Ecclesiastes 12:6 Psalms 90:9-10). Such language as that, is usually reserved for funerals, yet it expresses a fact of everyday life: All of us, sooner or later, must keep a personal, unavoidable, appointment with death.

2 "For men..." —You Are No Exception

In the phrase "It is appointed for for men once to die..." we find our second fact, that you are no exception.

When Hebrews 9:27 says "it is appointed for men once to die...", it does so generically, with no sense of gender. In other words "men" here stands for all humankind —man, whether male or female.

You could replace the word "men" with your own name, because the scripture applies to you individually as well as to mankind in general.

Nevertheless, as we said before, most people live their lives as if they were exceptions to the rule of death!

Unless the second coming of Jesus Christ occurs in your lifetime, you personally cannot be excepted from death. In all of human history, the Bible tells of only two exceptions. One was Enoch (Genesis 5:23-24). The other was Elijah (2Kings 2:1,11). [Compare John 21:17-23]

Anyway, were you to escape death only to face judgment, the stale cliche might find fresh meaning: "out of the fryingpan into the fire".

3 "...once to die..." —You Only Die Once.

In the words "it is appointed for men once to die..." we have our third fact, that you only die once.

When Hebrews 9:27 says, "once" it brings home the fact that you don't get a second chance at life and death. It's a one-off.

When people say, "You only die once!" they usually mean that you might as well be reckless. But surely, since we live and die but once, we should make of our life what we were meant to make of it. Surely we should not waste our one life, but live it as pilgrims in this world (1Peter 2:11-12, James 4:13-17).

The words "once to die" contradict the theory of re-incarnation (that we live successive earthly lives). The statement, "You must be born again" is no support for re-incarnation. Jesus made it clear that the rebirth of which he spoke was spiritual not physical (John 3:1-21).

4 "...and after this..." —Death is Not the End

In the words "...and after this comes judgment" we have our fourth fact, that death is not the end.

When Hebrews 9:27 says, "after this" it puts life and death into perspective, and supplies the wonderful hope in what otherwise would be a fatalistic and depressing statement.

An old wireless advertisement used to say, "Death is so permanent!" But in one sense death is not permanent at all. There is something after death. This is why Christians speak of death as a "sleep" because it is a temporary state (John 11:11 1Thessalonians 4:13-18).

For those who seek and follow Jesus, there lies beyond death "an inheritance imperishable... reserved in heaven" (1Peter 1:3-9).

5 "...the Judgment" —Death is Your Destiny’s Door

In the words "and after this the Judgment" we find our fifth fact, that death is your destiny’s door.

There is no second chance after death. Hebrews 9:27 is telling us precisely what there is after death -- "the judgment". But those "in Christ" need not fear. "There is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus" (Romans 8:1). How do you get "into Christ"? By faith and by baptism (Galatians 3:26-29).

Those who refuse or neglect that, are counted as ungodly, irreligious, and unprepared. They have everything to fear (John 5:28-29 Matthew 25:31-46).

Conclusion

It is appointed for men once to die and after this the judgment. Death is appointed, and you are no exception. You only die once, and death is not the end; it is your destiny’s door.

I am just right now seeing this thread, i will do my best to answer an clear my point

No afterlife, no soul. That the Bible or other human beings state otherwise does not make it true. No dead human being has come back to say there is an afterlife; if there is tell us.

johnydon22:
I am just right now seeing this thread, i will do my best to answer an clear my point

For all who may be CURIOUS to know how  my QUESTION to johnydon22 came about. And who also may be interested in the INFORMATION that comes along the line so as to increase in knowledge should PLEASE, take their time to firstly read the thread from which I quoted johnydon22 from so as to grasp the full context of what this is all about. Now, instead of going back up to click the already given link to the thread above. Here is the link again for your ease www.nairaland.com/3133542/christian-doctrine-salvation-worlds-religions/3#58154230

Your aim should be to read to understand that thread, read, study and digest. And most particularly every of Johnydon22's comments on that thread and those we await as his response serves perfectly as an INTRODUCTION to what will unfold on this thread, which aim is to make CLEAR without AMBIGUITY an ANSWER.

Incase if I do not respond to anybody's mentions please think not that I see your effort as worthless. My ignoring is definately because it serves no PURPOSE as to the CLARIFICATION that I seek and the information that is meant to be shared.

This is not a hurry, rush to type and post..kind thread. PLEASE THINK MANY TIMES, PROCESS THE INFORMATION YOU WISH TO ENLIGHTEN US WITH BEFORE SHARING THEM. EXHAUST ALL THE ALTERNATIVES, BE DIVERGENT IN YOUR APPROACH FOR, IT REQUIRES A HOLISTIC VIEW, A PERSPECTIVE.

Johnydon22 I urge you to also go back to the thread where I quoted you from. Incase you have short memory as to the content and your contributions.

NOW, KINDLY AND MOST IMPORTANTLY LET ME MAKE ONE THING VERY CLEAR MY POSITION IN TERMS OF MENTALITY. Johnydon22 take note.

I WORDWORLD do not derive any kind of pleasure in the sport called ARGUEMENT, moving back and forth aimlessly. No GENUINE TRUTH SEEKER participates in such childish display. I BELONG TO THE ENLIGHTENMENT, A SEEKER, AN EXPLORER. Am no wanderer at all.

What i enjoy doing is DECONSTRUCTING a CONCEPT and looking at the CRUX of the matter from all sides, stating with CLARITY, DESCRIPTIVELY, the TRUTH of what it is and not what it ought to be or a subjection due to preconception. I enjoy SINCERE EXAMINATION for the sake of LOGIC, JUSTICE, RATIONALITY,
SPIRITUALITY, UNDERSTANDING and most of all, profering SOLUTIONS to PROBLEMS and CHALLENGES faced by HUMANITY. I love HUMOUR too, alot of it sensible ones meant to provoke good thinking.

I work with a REALITY OF PRECISION in perfect perception and cognition. Its no competition of who is right but WHAT IS PRECISELY ACCURATE. Apart from what is precisely correct, anything elses is mere show of egocentricity, arrogance.

Hence, the question really is how from your claim of not knowing by your ownself what happens in death (after life) your charge of persons and books who and which claim to know as being LIARS and FRAUDULENT.

Please take your time. Its a very long journey DON'T at all rush yourself.


Thank you, and please johnydon22 do your POSSIBLE BEST!!!


All that I care about is HONESTY!! Which really only a disciplined mind possesses such virtue. NOT SENTIMENTS BUT ABSOLUTE TRUTH.

"WISDOM IS FOUND ONLY IN TRUTH". Goethe.