What happened to innovation and what is happening to music - Naija scene and Nairaland music section specifically. Why the need to constantly engage or fan all of these so called Beefs and Disses?

It seems people can't disagree in a logical manner these days without resulting to a Diss song and some idiot who thinks they are friends from each sides fanning the trouble by creating further Song that are nothing but Diss!

Why is it some artist can only make a living or get a name for themselves by creating a controversy via dissing.

Why is it that if in the music industry in naija and here, there is a disagreement or criticism is given, one automatically becomes a hater?

Why is every rapper always talking about people who hate them and enemies, their riches, round bottom women and what not.

Seriously, what happened to real creativity? Sunny Ade and Obey existed side-by-side for years and I am not sure there was never any spat between them both. Fela never dissed any artist to make a living [Yes he may have raised concern about certain practices in Nigeria] but he let his Saxophone skills, his keyboard fluidity do the talking. Looking back now, it appears that music is perhaps getting dumber and more stupid. Looking at the history of music in Nigeria, there appears to be more intelligence in it way before the advent of Naija Hiphop - which is dominant lately - Are the fans and those buying the music guilty of been stupid as well? Well, looking around nairaland and the Naija music scene it appears so.

Speaking of how fans are guilty, take this as an example. Rugged man made a post that is idiotic at least and it appears no one is telling him straight up that his comments was wholly unnecessary instead, it appears we get people/fans getting excited at an"open diss" Jesus wept! Where is the intelligence? It is a good thing I do not follow him.

Perhaps if fan shuns all these artist who makes disses, perhaps we may hear something else other than Beaf this, diss that?

I have no problem with anyone, but jeez, all this diss this and beef that sucks. Perhaps people should focus on something else just for once.

I think people need to realise that this whole beef thing will get out of hand at some point and lives may be lost. Just look at America's Hiphop to learn a lesson a two - something we clearly ain't learning from. America started with the same Diss this, beef that, then it turned into Murder, Murder, Kill, Kill! And Guess what, lives were lost and live will still be lost. It will be sad if we allow this to happen in Nigeria.

Music is about making fun, money, doing it for the love, making a sub-culture of some kind, etc Please don't let this get out of hand.

Oh before I go, I am talking to you. Yes you, if you have nothing constructive to add to this thread, please just leave. It sucks when people are trying to make real contribution and people like you think everything is a joke.

True yarns El razur. . .

When someones speaks the truth. . .they say you getting angry over fun. . . that they having fun. . . I try as much as possible to avoid arguements with people like that who always think everything is a joke. . . They just wanna toys with members and think they smart. . .

And as per the artistes. . . I dont take sides anymore. . . if i like your song, i listen and vice versa. . .It'll get to a point where everyone's sick and tired of their beef. . . . Thing that amazes me is that rappers throwing punchlines through social networking and media. . . .i mean, are they that jobless?? If i RM spends his whole day tweeting/Fbing, prolly thats the reason he's been living off a song for the past 2years. .

I agree man, only that it is not always so. I.e you expect people to get tired of the beef, but this thing just keep going on and on. I am making a bold prediction that someone will get shot at some point if it is not curtailed now. After all, some cats in naija are already talking about their "Gangsta life" what is to stop them from living out that fantasy?

The Status update from RM is disappointing to be honest. It is even more disappointing that people seem to be thinking it is an okay thing to do. Where is the blooming common sense. While I am not a mad fan of any naija artist, I am like you, if the thing good I go listen to am, if na trash I no go listen again.


I really just wish we engage more in creativity. I checked him out a bit on twitter, but I am not really keen as I do not find him challenging. It would be nice if people learn from folks like Ryan Leslie. This dude engages with fan on twitter and facebook, but in a different way. For example, if he give a show he may asked for feed backs etc. When is about to give one, he may do competition to give away free tickets etc. I think the last one he did was for a lucky fan to see how he works in a studio for a day - all expenses paid.

This Ryan Leslie na Harvard graduate and since I have followed him, I never heard him use profanities, txt spk or silly status update. I think he's got over 25k or so people following him. From my point of view, people should learn from him. He talks about doing good in the community and lets his music do the talking. I am sure you probably heard of him or his works. RM in my opinion can learn from people like that.

[size=18pt]You are all guilty[/size] , including you , me and the posters above who think they are wise ,
let who is innocent cast the first stone.

el razur why dont u try talking to the artist themselves individually, u will find out that some of them are intellectually sound except for those with ego problems. In normal societies beef sells records if kept unwaxed , i dont know about ur own society though.

ofoxxxyyyyy i dey feel you jooooo, very true, Do you know the intelectual capacity of these Nigerian rappers or entertainers as a whole, them Ebenezer Obey and Sunny Ade didnt have things like Twitter,Facebook and Bebo to distract them, do you know how long nigerian entertainers tweet and retweet all sorts of nonsense, i get a mighty laugh some times seeing these status updates from so called intellectual emcees, look [size=20pt]theres only a handful of intelligent Nigerian entertainers and thier Lyrical content says it all[/size], please like oFoxxxy said Cast the first stone lets see,



WE DO IT FOR THE LOVE


#nowplaying-Swatroot-ITS Payback Time

tavarez:

ofoxxxyyyyy i dey feel you jooooo, very true, Do you know the intelectual capacity of these Nigerian rappers or entertainers as a whole, them Ebenezer Obey and Sunny Ade didnt have things like Twitter,Facebook and Bebo to distract them, do you know how long nigerian entertainers tweet and retweet all sorts of nonsense, i get a mighty laugh some times seeing these status updates from so called intellectual emcees, look [size=20pt]theres only a handful of intelligent Nigerian entertainers and thier Lyrical content says it all[/size], please like oFoxxxy said Cast the first stone lets see,



WE DO IT FOR THE LOVE


#nowplaying-Swatroot-ITS Payback Time

I am not sure I get your point here. But I can agree with you as per the handful comment.

As an Artist, your every move is scrutinised. Just ask anyone in the spot light. And as most will say, it is a price they will pay as long as they remain in the spotlight.

I dunno what your definition of intelligence is, but I find it hard to take anyone who make a status like RM did serious. I find it hard to take any artist who feels the need to drop a diss song every now and then serious. Honestly, it is not all what hiphop is about or the music industry is about.

While sunny ade and co do not have social media to distract them, I think you will find that there are Social outlets that could distract them, but they never let it did. They let their music did the speaking - something that is lacking in most of our new generation artist lately. In fact, Social media outlets have always been around, only that its medium or sources changed, but it is still the same thing.

How many times you heard Sunny passed a negative comment about Obey? If anything, they appear to have admiration for each other.

The market is big enough for creativity and the need to result to disses to sell record is a weakness in my opinion. The need to refer to your enemy and haters is just pure drivel. Sucks to be honest.

As for mentioning names, I am not about to get into drivel with people who make nothing but drivel post. I am sure you know those who my original post is talking about as an Artist etc.

This is totally beyond our control, whether u write from now to eternity , this things will still exist.
maybe RM feels insecured about the mode9 album , he has a right to put whatever he likes, my only issue is that he didnt reply death blow lyrically, all this facebook this fakebook that dont have any meaning. put it in a song. word.!

as per ur original post, whether u talk to them from now to forever they wont hear, these are fans that think mode is better than anyone else, and they wont change their thinking. have u asked them why they rep mode till infinity??

one mans point of view doesnt mean everyone is a fool, there are no fools anywhere belief me. and u cant force your opinion down anybodys throat. if they all like modenine good for mode, ! all this fb status ranting is meaningless to me.,

ofokaofoki:

This is totally beyond our control, whether u write from now to eternity , this things will still exist.
maybe RM feels insecured about the mode9 album , he has a right to put whatever he likes, my only issue is that he didnt reply death blow lyrically, all this facebook this fakebook that dont have any meaning. put it in a song. word.!

That is not always true. As they say, evil flourish when good men do nothing. The only reason this trend is carrying on is because the consumer are not doing enough. I.e, if we demand better from those who pay to hear their album, see their shows etc, they will make changes.

RM in my opinion have nothing to worry about, there comes a point in the career of every person that you just have to move aside for someone else. Something a lot of people just do not seem to get. You can claim to be the best this and pioneered this etc, but there comes a time in point that there will be always someone new and perhaps "better" or at least preferred on the block. RM have cemented his status as one of the Good things to come of Niaja rap, he need to destroy it with silly things like what he did in my opinion.

as per your original post, whether u talk to them from now to forever they wont hear, these are fans that think mode is better than anyone else, and they wont change their thinking. have u asked them why they rep mode till infinity??

I am not too bothered about raising my views and concerns and people not listening. It is a free world and as such people have the right to do what they want, same way I have the right to raise issues and give concern.

It will be a shame if this beef this, diss that crosses over to Murder, Murder, Kill, Kill. Just ask America.

one mans point of view doesnt mean everyone is a fool, there are no fools anywhere belief me. and u cant force your opinion down anybodys throat. if they all like modenine good for mode, ! all this fb status ranting is meaningless to me.,

I am not sure you understand my points. People can debate who is better from now till the end of time, however the fact remains - there is room for everyone. So it goes back to square one, is it worth diss and beef, when there is enough room for all?

True talk poster.
But Fans will be fans.
Diss will always exist in hiphop, whether authentic or fake.
As long as it's kept on wax and in the booth it kept professional its aiite.

But yea there r some naughty woman moves which personally nauseates me
especially when its sm1 i like. I like most of the artistes:im very open
and i dont confuse issues.
RM status is just a desperate attempt of sm1 that is attention starved.
Its so pathetic, same as the ~~was it encomium interview.
The headline was sth else blah blah blah is a naughty person and will die a pauper.
I was like wtf?
There r something u culd get away wit on wax, cos really it MAY NOT represent who really are.
culd be seen or heard as just a creative or entertainin thingy,
It's like a script, just like actors play different roles. But interviews? your profile status??,
it takes an intelligent mind to know when to shut up, and know how to edit your words.
Yet your intelligence shud show thru your materials and wat u put out.

Do not see anythin wrong especially in hiphop if u have a diss track, its good for the game.
As long as your whole album aint diss track, except u r a battle mc, pple might think u dissin
even when u not(that's wat got sm1 insecure in the 1st place and led to this whole thing)

Plus, dont get it twisted, them guyz, obey and co, and our local genre have beef and diss
too! As long as there's diverse opinions there'l be beef~~hence diss!

oNe

i see a lot of intellectual talk here. el razur you need to understand something about life,
people in this world are naturally jealous of each others achievements , even lions fight for pride, fishes fight in the water, its just natural, i just thank GOD THAT NAIJA HIPHOP IS NOT LIKE AMERICAN HIPHOP WHERE EVERY TOM prink and harry has a gun . nigerians dont like violence , hiphop rappers in nigeria are not that wicked, i think they all want to go to heaven , nigerians naturally do not have the heart to hurt people naturally . but i think dbr is right , hiphop will be hiphop,everyone wants to be number one , even a rapper that was born yesternight will tell u he is number one ,that he can rap better than people that have held the ground for over 30 years .
its just a natural phenomenon, to be honest wit u ,i would have preferred ruggedman to put all that into a diss song, this guy has the power to diss and reply modenine that hiphop way , i am a bit dissapointed he is emplying those chidlish gimmicks. if u know how many people see that status update on facebook and the impresiion that creates , but he doesnt care, he thinks he has enemy, modenine is not an enemy,
modenine is just doing hiphop the matured way . which is why i respect him till tomorrow. even tho i prefer certain rappers to him . ( u know which one ), simple.

this is some serious talk and shouldnt be taken as a joke. the beef is gettin out of hand , i expected the thing to end at death low 2 and rugged replying him ina song not saying pauper this pauper that ,
what has money got to do with good music ? and lastly like dbr said fans will always remains fans .

Hmmm. *singing* Jay-Z's What More Can I Say

There is nothing wrong with beef . . .it's good for the industry.

First of all it helps to keep artistes on their toes because they know their fellow artistes are judging them.
I don't know about you guys, but economists agree that competition is really good for industry.

Then we need to realise that some artistes . . . need anger to touch one creative side of their soul that nothing else can.
Even from the stage of subliminals that leave the audience wondering who exactly the artiste is referring to . . . it's smart and highly creative.

'When I diss-a-baba . . . it ain't Ethopia.' - Modenine

Now let's leave the creativity and check out the intrigue . . . afterall the point of releasing albums is to impress the consumer??
Beef songs like Hit Em Up and Ether have come to be accepted as glorious moments in music history, what's more fun than listening to those words . . . 'you claim to be a player but I f**ed your wife'.
What's more fun than knowing The Game's next album will have a track for Jay-Z??
Even as much as I don't wanna admit, Eminem has probably done more for the hiphop industry than any other rapper . . . through beef.
We all know that he's the most recognisable face in hiphop . . . bar none. . . half his career is beef-based.

Finally . . . come the eff on, seriously, who didn't like how Eminem ended Ja Rule's career??

As long as it's creative and musically flawless . . . I say, if you get liver bring the beef out of the meatrack and stop being a chicken.

@poster~ there wil always b beef in hiphop,nuffin can change dat.i knw u setup this thread cuz of dat rugged status,u hav 2 knw dat rappers r emotional nd rugged is only human.datz wat was in his mind at dat point in time nd he updated his status wit it,there is no need setting up a thread,taking sides by expressin ya dissapointment @ rugged witout knowing dat mode said sum trash abt rugged in an interview lately wch made him (rugged) to do dat.plus modey has said alot of horrible things abt rugged datz nt d first time on radio wch u r ignorant of nd nw u blame rugged 4 updating his own fb status wit dat?this seems biased 2 me though im nt saying wat rugged did was rite but dat was his emotional state of mind.alot of matured peeps do dat at times when they r pissed off by sum1 so rugged cnt b an xception.i bet u aint in his shoes datz y u r saying all these.his nxt album wil b his last nd he isnt dissin any1 in it.am out

Legendaire:

There is nothing wrong with beef . . .it's good for the industry.

First of all it helps to keep artistes on their toes because they know their fellow artistes are judging them.
I don't know about you guys, but economists agree that competition is really good for industry.

How is beef good for the industry? No offence, but the music industry is about making money and the big record label are in it for the money, not for these "street cred" most rappers seek lately. Street cred do not pay bills.

No beef do no make Artist keep on their toes. If you know the history of hiphop, you should know that mc that do freestyle battle, do it for this reason - i.e keep them on their toes, but it is not the same as beef. In other words, battle rapping is not the same as beefing.

Then we need to realise that some artistes . . . need anger to touch one creative side of their soul that nothing else can.
Even from the stage of subliminals that leave the audience wondering who exactly the artiste is referring to . . . it's smart and highly creative.

If you need anger to touch your creative side - anger from something as pathetic as beef, then perhaps you should not be in the music industry? Like I said, careers based on beef are short lived and beef is not what pays the bill or make the record label stick with an artist.

'When I diss-a-baba . . . it ain't Ethopia.' - Modenine

Elementary word play at best.

Now let's leave the creativity and check out the intrigue . . . afterall the point of releasing albums is to impress the consumer??.

No the point of an album is to showcase what one can do as an artist. A good album musically and in every other sense may not impress consumer you see.

Beef songs like Hit Em Up and Ether have come to be accepted as glorious moments in music history, what's more fun than listening to those words . . . 'you claim to be a player but I f**ed your wife'.

How is it a glorious moment. I feel like asking you how old you are to be honest. The song had many backlash and what was the out come? How many people died as a result of unnecessary songs like that? Where are they today?

What's more fun than knowing The Game's next album will have a track for Jay-Z??

May be to you, but some of us look beyond a diss track. Clearly not your kind.

Even as much as I don't wanna admit, Eminem has probably done more for the hiphop industry than any other rapper . . . through beef

We all know that he's the most recognisable face in hiphop . . . bar none. . . half his career is beef-based.

I think we are moving away from the point I am trying to address. I am talking about Nigeria music scene and Nairaland [refer back to my original post] Can we keep it at that please.

ElRazur:

What happened to innovation and what is happening to music - Naija scene and Nairaland music section specifically.  Why the need to constantly engage or fan all of these so called Beefs and Disses?

It seems people can't disagree in a logical manner these days without resulting to a Diss song and some idiot who thinks they are friends from each sides fanning the trouble by creating further Song that are nothing but Diss!

Why is it some artist can only make a living or get a name for themselves by creating a controversy via dissing.

Why is it that if in the music industry in naija and here, there is a disagreement or criticism is given, one automatically becomes a hater?

Why is every rapper always talking about people who hate them and enemies, their riches, round bottom women and what not.

Seriously, what happened to real creativity? Sunny Ade and Obey existed side-by-side for years and I am not sure there was never any spat between them both. Fela never dissed any artist to make a living [Yes he may have raised concern about certain practices in Nigeria] but he let his Saxophone skills, his keyboard fluidity do the talking.  Looking back now, it appears that music is perhaps getting dumber and more silly. Looking at the history of music in Nigeria, there appears to be more intelligence in it way before the advent of Naija Hiphop - which is dominant lately - Are the fans and those buying the music guilty of been silly as well? Well, looking around nairaland and the Naija music scene it appears so.

Speaking of how fans are guilty, take this as an example. Rugged man made a post that is idiotic at least and it appears no one is telling him straight up that his comments was wholly unnecessary instead, it appears we get people/fans getting excited at an"open diss" Jesus wept! Where is the intelligence?  It is a good thing I do not follow him.

Perhaps if fan shuns all these artist who makes disses, perhaps we may hear something else other than Beaf this, diss that?

I have no problem with anyone, but jeez, all this diss this and beef that sucks. Perhaps people should focus on something else just for once.

I think people need to realise that this whole beef thing will get out of hand at some point and lives may be lost. Just look at America's Hiphop to learn a lesson a two - something we clearly ain't learning from. America started with the same Diss this, beef that, then it turned into Murder, Murder, Kill, Kill! And Guess what, lives were lost and live will still be lost. It will be sad if we allow this to happen in Nigeria.

Music is about making fun, money, doing it for the love, making a sub-culture of some kind, etc Please don't let this get out of hand.

Oh before I go, I am talking to you. Yes you, if you have nothing constructive to add to this thread, please just leave. It sucks when people are trying to make real contribution and people like you think everything is a joke.

I get your point, but ehrrrrm that's what the music industry is all about.

Thatz what people want to hear, do you think if demand is not high, the supply wouldnt be high?

Let's be real with ourselves, who wants all the rappers to get alone? Who wants to listen to lovey-dovey's on the radio?

Without fights, hater this and beef that, we wouldnt have as much artist as we do in the Industry as we do now.

And yes, it does get out of hand. like eldee said :

Rappers are so predictable these days, first album is about 'I'm hustling', second album is 'now I'm rich, they hate me' . . . then third album they run out of stories.
I don't get the whole thing about ''haters'' . . . even my sixteen year old sister thinks she has haters . .

Well, once they get boring and out, new artist comes in.

How many people can truthfully say they didnt enjoy the friction between Mariah and Em

And the game between Lil Wayne and Jay z

Hey even Keri Hilson [skip to time 1:51] knew that to up her game, she had to diss Beyonce and Ciara

It's all bout what ppl want to listen to. If there are more ppl like you, Music wouldnt so much indebted on Dissing and Hating lol


_{*click on the links to get what I'm saying}

El razur, your points are too idealistic. These are people with emotions; they are not robots. Rap is and will always be competitive. Everybody is gunning for the throne so a few egos are definitely gonna be tampered with. Fans are only being fans and want their favorite artists to outshine others, not as if they wish them bad in real life. And please take your own advice, stop comparing Naija Music Industry and Nairaland to Yankee's own. Cos I noticed you rebuked Legend when he did the same

Genuflect:

El razur, your points are too idealistic. These are people with emotions; they are not robots. Rap is and will always be competitive. Everybody is gunning for the throne so a few egos are definitely gonna be tampered with. Fans are only being fans and want their favorite artists to outshine others, not as if they wish them bad in real life. And please take your own advice, stop comparing Naija Music Industry and Nairaland to Yankee's own. Cos I noticed you rebuked Legend when he did the same

Rap can be competitive without beefs. I thought I made that clear.

What is the throne people are gunning for? Awards? Or selling records? I think EMI is concerned about your record sales and not how many beefs or street cred one takes. I have a feeling Sony signs an artist as a form of investment and to make profit. Not to be making diss tracks that hardly gets air play etc. No?

If it is all about selling records, then I am of the belief that it can be done without beefs and diss.


I have stayed away from comparing US with naija as much as I can.

You are still comparing both industries subconsciously. The record label point you are tryna make doesn't affect the Naija Music Industry. Our industry is not record label controlled. It's almost a case of each man to his own. Making diss tracks is more like a shortcut here in Naija. Tony Tetuila did it with Omode Meta, Rugged did it with Ehen and believe it or not, it worked out in their favour. And please, you should know that the throne has little to do with money but more about the critical acclaim that you're the best or at least top 5. It's not all about money

A beef-less music industry,and to a great extent tussle-free human communities is Utopian as humans by nature,are competitive.What is it they say about eyin and ahon(teeth and tongue) having their own form of disagreement. . . .

The history of the music industry in Nigeria(if it can be termed that) is replete with musical tussle and brinkmanship thus your "lately" assertion is a misnomer.
A quick run-down of what it used to be in other genre before the advent of Hip Hop and it's so called beefing.

Sunny Ade and Obey had a running battle.Though not a documented fact,the radio phone-in programme that gave Sunny Ade the juju music genre kingship did not go down well with Obey and his fans.Some of Sunny Ade's songs are classic death-blow too.

Sikiru Ayinde vs Kollington Ayinla(Jeeez Kollington even made a song to insinuate he slept with a certain lady singer first before Barrister did.(2pac can be said to have beaten the Faith Evans line from Kollington)

Ayinla Omowura,Yussuf Olatunji,Shina Peters/Segun Adewale et al ALL had songs laced with musical innuendos that will make this hip-hop beefs seem like child's play.So you can see it is not a recent development at all.

Within family members that share the same blood-line,we do have squabbles,so how possible is a music industry without beef?

In the midst of all these,there are still artiste like Asa,Nneka,Jeremiah Gyang,Cobhams et al whose musical efforts are top-notch so i think there is a balance.

And believe me,these beef sells music.FACT!

Personally, I think at this point, Rugged Man should just shut up and let his music do his talking instead. I am not a Rugged Man fan, I do listen to a few M9 tracks and I do not for one second believe RM and M9 are even on the same level.   At this point in RM's career, he should really consider switching his game up man cos even auto tune cantg save that nicca.

so wats ur point shotster? hw dis relates to the topic i still wonder ?

Hey I hear you guys. Pardon if I am not replying to everyone. I am busy doing a diss record. Seriously, I heard you guys, I just feel a few people have got the wrong end of the stick. While I am not forcing my views on anyone, I think there is nothing wrong with me having concerns over a trend that can possibly go out of hand. But anyway, time will tell.

Omo just woke up, so not in that debating mood yet.

EL i respect you for this.i guess it all started with tuface and got in gear with timaya.

ElRazur for someone who seems to know his music so well I'm surprised you know little aboiut the music business or rather it seems so when you imply that labels are in it for the money hence wont want to be side tracked by unnecessary beef.

Let me give you a real example. I once met a naija artiste, well known too, (sorry wont name names, apologies RM) through a good friend. I told him quite point blank i was disappointed he responded to a quite irrelevant diss. He told me straight off that even though he wont sit down and be insulted he himself did not belive the diss deserved a response so he just let it slide. Only to be repeatedly pressured by his MARKETERS (who run the industry by the way) to make a track. Eventually he gave in and made a good diss track I might say, well good enough to be nominated in our dear own Nairaland beef track of the year.

Now unto hiphop and rap. Rap asides music is a sport and a very competitive one too. When asked by Biggy, on the release of Somebody Wants to Die, what he thought of the beef situation with M9 and RM plus what SWTD was all about, having been released a few days after Iceberg Slim asked us to ask M.I. 'if he was better', he said its simply cos rap is a competitve sports refering how he was just an album into the industry and was only saying 'He aint saying he's the best but who's better?' H admitted that itself if is an invite to be attacked.

Now unto the legends that yoyu say didnt necessarily involve themselves in beef. Oh how wrong you are. Benson Idonije has talked well about how the under-g rancour bretween Obey and Sunny resulted in very good music because it pushed them to strive to be better than the competiton. Same goes for present day Juju and fuji musicians (although i have to conceede this ones have gotten violent) there are cliques and having a one-up aganst ur competiton music wise is even sweeter to savor than winning a street brawl.

Beef really is just another way of saying competiton only this time the competiton is real and not imagined and is more recgnised. It will always remain; the same way the polarity of ideas and opinions in supporting say football clubs will remain.


'Won n binu ori won n le kadara ofo kiri' Ebenezer Obey.,

I didn't like the Ruggedman thingy too, but you don't need to be overly sentimental about it.

Music first of all, is about expressing emotions to your listeners.
You don't like beef, cool . . . but to assume that other listeners don't like it is a misinformed conclusion.
Eminem's best selling albums are the beef albums, Tupac's best selling albums too . . . Ruggedman built one of the most successful Nigerian albums on Ehen, Peace or War and Big Bros, all beef song.

If, as you say record labels want sales . . . beef has delivered smoothly.

How can you say beef does not keep rappers on their toes?? Isn't it the Nas beef that made Jay-Z come out to admit that 'Ether made me stronger'??

If you know the history of hiphop, you'll know freestyling is not sumn everyone can do. . . it's just one section of hiphop, probably the most unimportant. . . how can a one-off memory test show who's better??
Pre-written beef is a chance for you showcase you ability to both your opponent and the audience and make money and streetcred at the same time.
That's killing five birds with one stone.

A good album is done for your target demographic. If they want beef, you give it to them.
In modern hiphop, the best battle-rappers are usually considered the best rappers.

Yeah, Tupac and B.I.G died . . . but that was people taking it too far, it was more to do with urban African American culture than just hiphop.
We have to separate those facts. . . you can't forcefully mix both incidents. . . now will Ruggedman shoot Modenine?? Or did KSA shoot Ebenezer Obey?? Dis Salawa Abeni stab anyone??
Let's stop making a mountain out of a molehill.

Beef has been in the Nigerian music scene for decades, not once have we heard of someone killing anyone, even in other genres of music . . . it has made careers, it has destroyed some . . . if the fans want it let it stay.

@topic and everyone
Instead of being sentimental, why don't we go into the science of causation??
Are we the ones begging for beef or are the artistes being autonomous with their choice of topics??

Jose Mourinho, a football manager got more press in about three years than Sir Bobby Charlton got in fifty years.
The fans loved him . . . his press conferences where more interesting than the football matches.
His pre-match press battles against other football coaches were famous. . . he left England and we were begging for him to come back.

Now that's not even music, but it begs the question, aren't we the ones creating the beef??

Honestly, Ruggedman and Modenine were friends till we, the fans created sumn between them. . . I witnessed it.
It starts from living room discussions about, 'hey Toyin, I think Drake is better than J. Cole'
It continues to, 'that's a controversial line, was he referring to Drake??' . . . these things spread till there's an all-out clamour for a reply, believe me, it's stronger than an encore at a rock concert.

King Sunny Ade said it in the song . . . 'Oro Mi Maje N'te'

'Bi Sonny Ade ban korin, woni Obe l'on bawi
Bi Obe mba ko tie, woni Sunny l'on bawi

Oro yi o sele, ko sele rara . . . oro jati o, awa o gbodo gbo mo'

We are naturally adversarial, it's been there since Australopithecus Africanus . . . there are so many artistes out there, marking your territory is really important.

I have read all replies and a few things I will just like to ask and state.

Please provide me a track where Sunny/Obey/Kollington went as far as dropping names? I think what we will find are songs laced with proverbs and fans end up saying "Oh it is directed at this and that"

Beef sells record? Really? I think Eminem's album was successful because he is good. I think Nas's album was good because he is one of the best and an album was much anticipated? Tupac's album - all eyez on me I believe is the most successful, this is down to about 24 or so tracks on it and to say it is successful as a result  of one track is perhaps far-fetched?

While I am shying away from discussing America's hiphop, I have to give a few instances as well. The Game got dropped because of beef, surely if it sells record, perhaps he may have been kept on? I think I remember Dre passing a comment that suggested that he is not happy with Beef this and beef that? I think he went as far as saying "I just want to make hit the studio in the morning, make music and go back home to my wife at night" or something along those lines.

Record labels also had meetings etc when the whole Naz and Jay Z thing was getting out of hand - they [nas and jayz] played it down that the were merely challenging themselves. This was after record labels voiced concerns if memory serves me right.


I respect the fact that some people will want to see Beef and Diss record, but then I am not one of those people and I am yet to say that my views are a representative of what people want. Just like any other person, I am merely voicing an opinion and giving my concerns.

Yes people will disagree with me, but then this is what makes this place a forum - an avenue to discuss/debate/interact. So please, let no one feel like I am proving like I know it al or my views is the ultimate one. Far from it.

Eldee,

I believe one can mark their territory without Beef records. Fela did without having "beef" with fellow musicians.

I am not sure if it was you who stated that Beef is just competition. Personally, I partially agree in the sense that it is a small and very minor form of competition, but it appears Artist may be going in this direction and forgetting about making music.

Good Topic Razur,

I agree with you. If you leave a non positive comment, your a hater/enemy.
Artists seem to make beef records now, for no reason other than to raise their profile or for money.
Correction to previous poster: 50cent not Eminiem ended Ja Rules career. And their beef went back a long way. From before 50 even blew up.
While beef/diss records are part of hiphop, there needs to be a background to it. Not just for the sake of it.
While eminem did a lot of diss style records, his biggest singles, the ones that won him all the awards and accolades were not. His talent was without question.

Hiphop is competitive, but if you base your career on short term diss records fame. You won't last long in the game. Have more to say, but my fingers are tired. As for the RM status, very disappointing. He had a chance to respond to DeathBlow on wax, but he blew it. Now it's like he's almost begging for a rematch, cause now, he's the one that needs it more.

Ibi ise eni ni ati mo ni l'ole. By what you profess shall you be judged.

How so is then that one calls himself a battle rapper and when he's got grudges cant use the platform with which he preaches to speak up?

Chris waddle called Walcott brainless as a journo in papers, Walcott went to the field (his own turf) and played his heart out, others took it from their and helped him signal a fU.c.K you to Waddle. Beef created, response given.

Now a person says he does battle rap and then has issues with someone else, its logical he addresses the issue on wax.

And by the way i guess it has been pointed out, Eminem's best sellers are not his beef tracks.

What however i think should be more addressed here is what eldee and audio have pointed out but which isnt really getting talked about is the role the fans play in this beef thing.

I think that issue was mentioned in my original post.

Personally, I feel fans have powers to do many things and many bad things. I can understand why some fans may want their favourite artist to do a diss record or response to one. I just feel, Artist need to use their head and realise that it is necessary at times not to bow to what the fans want. But then, it can be a difficult choice in practice.

ElRazur:

I have read all replies and a few things I will just like to ask and state.

Please provide me a track where Sunny/Obey/Kollington went as far as dropping names? I think what we will find are songs laced with proverbs and fans end up saying "Oh it is directed at this and that"

Beef sells record? Really? I think Eminem's album was successful because he is good. I think Nas's album was good because he is one of the best and an album was much anticipated? Tupac's album - all eyez on me I believe is the most successful, this is down to about 24 or so tracks on it and to say it is successful as a result  of one track is perhaps far-fetched?

While I am shying away from discussing America's hiphop, I have to give a few instances as well. The Game got dropped because of beef, surely if it sells record, perhaps he may have been kept on? I think I remember Dre passing a comment that suggest he is not happy with Beef this and beef that?

Record labels also had meetings etc when the whole Naz and Jay Z thing was getting out of hand - they [nas and jayz] played it down that the were merely challenging themselves. This was after record labels voiced concerns if memory serves me right.


I respect the fact that some people will want to see Beef and Diss record, but then I am not one of those people and I am yet to say that my views are a representative of what people want. Just like any other person, I am merely voicing an opinion and giving my concerns.

Yes people will disagree with me, but then this is what makes this place a forum - an avenue to discuss/debate/interact. So please, let no one feel like I am proving like I know it al or my views is the ultimate one. Far from it.

What Sunny Ade and Kollington used to do were subliminals and they're present in modern hiphop beef too.

That's how all modern hiphop beefs start too. . . the only difference is that, in hiphop, wordplay is really important.
The ability to say sumn as witty as 'I rock hoes, y'all rock fellas'() Rockafella records . . . is needed more in hiphop than in Juju or Fuji.
Hence the need for nameplay.

All those albums had beef songs as their promo singles . . . same way Ruggedman had many good songs after the three diss-songs.
Listen to I Am Rugged, From Dublin With Love and Koko's Song off Thy Album Come and see what I'm saying.
Saying it's down to the 22 tracks is like saying promo singles and music videos are not necessary.

Eminem is great, but there are other good rappers out there too, we all know talent is only halfway . . . other things count.
The biigest influence on the success of these beef albums is the controversy that precede them, of course you'll flop if you do a full big album, but one or two beef tracks especially after you've been dissed shifts units faster than anything else.

I'm not saying you're enforcing views, I just don't like the way you make it sound like the 75-85% of the consumers that want beef are just stupid teenagers. . . and implying that artistes that do it are not creative and street-dumb in business.