Empiree:
it is waste of time trying to explain color to the blind.

You nothing to explain other than that your prophet was inconsistent.

Empiree:
keep deceiving yourself. Visitation to the graves is universally acceptable regardless of religious beliefs. Whoever worships the graves that's their problem. And what constitutes "worship of the graves" according to you?

I am not disputing this claim. My concern is some Muslims and Christians (especially Catholics) venerating the dead at the grave and even turning graveyards a place or worship. The shia hadith sees no problem with this practice.

Empiree:
I should waste my time with you?. Hell, no. Help yourself. I believe this is the link where he explains links between Kaaba and all God's prophets

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=480328262752637&id=1408022469436535&anchor_composer=false

Facebook page/post cannot be used as religious authority. Nowhere in christian or jewish theology is marwa and tarfa, kissing the idolatrous black stone, stoning an imaginary devil in mecca, etc is condoned. This practices are considered idolatrous, which the herbalist you made reference to rightly identified.

Rashduct4luv:
Abeg wetin be your problem? Why can't you do your Christianity in peace? Was Jesus in the Bible consistent? He save people in the OT by blood sacrifice but na human sacrifice fit do am for NT. How do you define paganism? Human sacrifice or Cattle Sacrifice? Jesus Christ of the Bible was never the same yesterday & today. He supported and permitted so many killings, rapes/ forceful marriages in the OT but he changed in the NT. Who is now switching on like Electric current. I can give you the verses for all these crimes if you need them.

What is this one saying? Why are you so bitter?

Rashduct4luv:
The shia, till date, till worship at the grave of the prophets; it is part of their religious beliefs. Catholics genuflects to the alter of Jesus & Mary and request Mary(Mother of God as they call her) and saints to pray for them but how does this affect MFM? Hypocrisy is worrying you. Does Shia represent Islam?

I have already condemned the shia and the catholics on this. While the catholics didnt practice grave 'worship' according to the sunnah of Jesus, the shia claim to do that by following the sunnah of mohammed.

Rashduct4luv:
One lie can be a Mistake but your lies is getting out of hands. You really need to repent

Point out my lies; i am ready to be corrected.

Rashduct4luv:
Visiting the Prophet’s Mosque is an act that is Sunnah; it is not an obligatory action and has nothing to do with Hajj, nor is it an action that is required in order for Hajj to be complete. All the ahaadeeth which say that it is connected to Hajj or that say that visiting the grave of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is connected to Hajj are fabricated and false. Whoever travels to Madeenah for the purpose of visiting the Mosque and praying therein, his intention is acceptable and his efforts will be rewarded. Whoever travels there only for the purpose of visiting the graves and seeking the help of their occupants, his intention is haraam and his actions are reprehensible. It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Do not travel to visit any mosques except three: al-Masjid al-Haraam [in Makkah], this Mosque of mine [in Madeenah] and al-Masjid al-Aqsa [in Jerusalem].” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 1189; Muslim, 1397.

It was narrated from Jaabir (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The best places to which a person may travel are this Mosque of mine, and the Ancient House (i.e., the Ka’bah).” Narrated by Ahmad, 3/350; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah, 1648.

Who are you to determine which hadith is authentic and which is fabricated? As for your information, both the so-called fabricated and the authentic hadith are in the same book, why pick and choose, from the hadith, as if you are picking tomotoes in a basket? Some islamic scholars see nothing wrong in 'grave worship' and your opinion, on this issue, does not represent the Muslim ummah's official doctrine.

Rashduct4luv:
The Hajj rites started from Ibrahim and his son Ismail. So the question is faulty in and of itself. Ibrahim and Ishmael were what? Jews/Christians/Muslims?

The hajj rite is a pre-Islamic idolatrous practice among the meccan polytheist. Almost what is done in hajj together is done by the meccan polytheist. The Saudis only invoke Ibrahim into this practice to give it a level of acceptance among the Jews and the Christians. 'All na washy washy!'

true2god:
What is this one saying? Why are you so bitter?

If you see any bitterness kindly ignore it.

true2god:

I have already condemned the shia and the catholics on this. While the catholics didnt practice grave 'worship' according to the sunnah of Jesus, the shia claim to do that by following the sunnah of mohammed.

I know you are aware Muslims worship one God Allah who created death! He is Eternal with no beginning nor end! Why claim Muslims worship graves when Allah is in the heavens?

What percentage of Shiites are Muslim? or what fractions of Muslims are shiites?

true2god:
Point out my lies; i am ready to be corrected.

I have pointed it out before and i keep doing that.

true2god:
Who are you to determine which hadith is authentic and which is fabricated? As for your information, both the so-called fabricated and the authentic hadith are in the same book, why pick and choose, from the hadith, as if you are picking tomotoes in a basket? Some islamic scholars see nothing wrong in 'grave worship' and your opinion, on this issue, does not represent the Muslim ummah's official doctrine.

I am a Muslim. Can i as a Muslim determines how you interpret your ideology? Our Hadiths are Classified and authenticated to separate the tradition of Islam from falsehood something that does not exist in Christian-hood. Even if Paul talks, it is the word of God. Even if Onan spill sperm and God killed him for that it is still the word of God. Lot's daughters made him drunk and slept with him by night in turns. God blessed them with kids from this. And it was from this filthy genealogy Christ came. This is the word of God.
The hadiths has been checked and the transmitters double checked. When their is fault(s) with an hadith depending on the severity of the fault(s) then the hadiths is classified Fabricated, weak, Hassan or Saheeh.

Can you tell me statistically what %age of Muslims worship graves? This is not cherry picking as is found in your books! It is sanity plus authentication!

true2god:
The hajj rite is a pre-Islamic idolatrous practice among the meccan polytheist. Almost what is done in hajj together is done by the meccan polytheist. The Saudis only invoke Ibrahim into this practice to give it a level of acceptance among the Jews and the Christians. 'All na washy washy!'

Who Started the Islamic Hajj rights? Ibrahim and Ismaeel. Were they Jews, Chriatians or Muslims or Idol worshipers?

In the end you will dodge the questions asked and bring out another slate and the argument never ends. The truth stares at you in the face but you keep evading it.

true2god:
.

Facebook page/post cannot be used as religious authority. Nowhere in christian or jewish theology is marwa and tarfa, kissing the idolatrous black stone, stoning an imaginary devil in mecca, etc is condoned. This practices are considered idolatrous, which the herbalist you made reference to rightly identified.

You will never understand. How would you understand when clearly you have diluted versions of historic prophets?. The fb page is actually a video explaining your bible verses with respect to the first house of worship which is Baca/Mecca (Psalms 84:6 as well as The Holy Quran in verse 3:96.) mentioned in both OT and Quran. But i understand why you don't get. If you dont understand all prophets were muslims and prayed as muslims pray, obviously you can not understand all prophet did tawaf.

Rashduct4luv:
If you see any bitterness kindly ignore it.

I will ignore any bitterness from you. My advise for you though; dont kill yourself over an Arabian ideology. It doesn't worth it.

Rashduct4luv:
I know you are aware Muslims worship one God Allah who created death! He is Eternal with no beginning nor end! Why claim Muslims worship graves when Allah is in the heavens?

If muslims worship one God I am not sure as a result of the special relationship between Allah and Mohammed. While an average Muslim claim to worship one God, they mention the name of Mohammed than Allah, and mention Mohammed's name in every of their prayer. The Islamic concept of monotheism is unique in the sense that Muslims subconsciously hold Mohammed in a high esteem like Allah. And in the quran, it is always 'Allah and his messenger'

Rashduct4luv:
What percentage of Shiites are Muslim? or what fractions of Muslims are shiites?

About 15% of muslims are shia, that's about 230 million people. They are huge!

Rashduct4luv:
I have pointed it out before and i keep doing that.

Ok, your opinion.

Rashduct4luv:
I am a Muslim. Can i as a Muslim determines how you interpret your ideology? Our Hadiths are Classified and authenticated to separate the tradition of Islam from falsehood something that does not exist in Christian-hood. Even if Paul talks, it is the word of God. Even if Onan spill sperm and God killed him for that it is still the word of God. Lot's daughters made him drunk and slept with him by night in turns. God blessed them with kids from this. And it was from this filthy genealogy Christ came. This is the word of God.
The hadiths has been checked and the transmitters double checked. When their is fault(s) with an hadith depending on the severity of the fault(s) then the hadiths is classified Fabricated, weak, Hassan or Saheeh.

Islam is not a rocket science bro. All Islamic books can be bought and read privately and are also available on the internet. So 'kini' big deal. As par the issues you raised against the Bible, they are incident that happened and are recorded so that we don't make the same mistake. Both good and bad incidents are recorded for us to take corrections and guide.

Rashduct4luv:
Can you tell me statistically what %age of Muslims worship graves? This is not cherry picking as is found in your books! It is sanity plus authentication!

I dont know because I don't have the data. However, it is a valid religious practice among the shia and the sunnis, while doing hajj, also offer prayers at the grave side of your prophet.

Rashduct4luv:
Who Started the Islamic Hajj rights? Ibrahim and Ismaeel. Were they Jews, Chriatians or Muslims or Idol worshipers? In the end you will dodge the questions asked and bring out another slate and the argument never ends. The truth stares at you in the face but you keep evading it.

Associating Abraham and Ishmael with hajj is haram bro. Except what you are fed in your mosque and madrassas, no any record existed that Abraham built the kaaba. Where is Jacob in this kaaba drama? So only Abraham and Ishmael built and worshiped at the kaaba while Isaac (Ishmael's brother) stayed away playing football. Islamic stories and plagiarism didnt jive and didnt make sense.

Empiree:
You will never understand. How would you understand when clearly you have diluted versions of historic prophets?. The fb page is actually a video explaining your bible verses with respect to the first house of worship which is Baca/Mecca (Psalms 84:6 as well as The Holy Quran in verse 3:96.) mentioned in both OT and Quran. But i understand why you don't get. If you dont understand all prophets were muslims and prayed as muslims pray, obviously you can not understand all prophet did tawaf.

Baca is not only Mecca but Barcelona. The same supposedly corrupt book Muslims will be scanning to find Mohammed and Mecca in it; this is pure comedy and confusion. Psalm 84:1-end has nothing to do with the head office of idol worship, Mecca. Stop following Zakir Naik in his ignorance who also 'discovered' Mohammed in the song of solomon.

true2god:
Baca is not only Mecca but Barcelona. The same supposedly corrupt book Muslims will be scanning to find Mohammed and Mecca in it; this is pure comedy and confusion. Psalm 84:1-end has nothing to do with the head office of idol worship, Mecca. Stop following Zakir Naik in his ignorance who also 'discovered' Mohammed in the song of solomon.

Barcelona kó. Bartholomew ni

Empiree:
Barcelona kó. Bartholomew ni

Why are you calling the biblical Baca Mecca? You are being intellectually dishonest by making this wrong equivalence.

true2god:
Why are you calling the biblical Baca Mecca? You are being intellectually dishonest by making this wrong equivalence.

Study your old testament that you have abandoned. I gave you video to watch which explained this subject in details using your Bible but you ignored.

Empiree:
Study your old testament that you have abandoned. I gave you video to watch which explained this subject in details using your Bible but you ignored.

This guy is talking like Wasiu Ayinde who, while singing, will tell us stories of how he eat indomie in ontario, then travel to ottawa, from then move to montreal. He is typical local Yoruba man complaining of how much he spent on roaming, complain about IMO, complain about inability of watsapp call, and how he went from dubai to saudi. You are not serious for referring me to this link to waste my data. He is even speaking like a polished NURTW Yoruba thug. FYA, we have millions of educated and polished Yoruba people that I respect but this guy is a tout in the name of Islam.

true2god:
This guy is talking like Wasiu Ayinde who, while singing, will tell us stories of how he eat indomie in ontario, then travel to ottawa, from then move to montreal. He is typical local Yoruba man complaining of how much he spent on roaming, complain about IMO, complain about inability of watsapp call, and how he went from dubai to saudi. You are not serious for referring me to this link to waste my data. He is even speaking like a polished NURTW Yoruba thug. FYA, we have millions of educated and polished Yoruba people that I respect but this guy is a tout in the name of Islam.

leave the messanger and learn from his message. I'm sure you watched and heard what he said about hajj and all God's prophets. That's the most important part. Whatever beef you have with him for calling him a tout is btw you and him

Empiree:
leave the messanger and learn from his message. I'm sure you watched and heard what he said about hajj and all God's prophets. That's the most important part. Whatever beef you have with him for calling him a tout is btw you and him

I don't even know the dude, but of course he is not polished enough to be a religious ambassador for Islam. All I see is a hustler who try to make a name for himself since religious marketing is one of the most profitable enterprise, and especially when a Muslim makes attacking the bible a trade. The story, in the mouth of Muslim apologist, is always sweet especially when attacking the beliefs of the Christians. My thinking was that he did a comprehensive teaching on the history of kaabba, traceable to Abrahim and Ishmael, using Islamic, secular and anthropological evidences to buttress his point. This is what he never did hence I can only take him as a charlatan. Besides, I don't know whether the facebook video is a lecture or a 'showmanship' to advertise himself and his travel experience to his gullible audience because the whole stuff was poorly organized and at the end of the day cannot be said to achieve any objective as side from fans 'hallowing' him along. If this is the best Yoruba muslims can produce then it shows the level of our intellectual capability as a people.

CAVEAT: DO NOT FORWARD A STUPID VIDEO AGAIN.

You don't know him yet you criticized him?. See how you contradicted yourself?.

This video was brief and not specifically devoted for Hajj topic I know what he said about all prophets performing Hajj hurts your nerves. You cant stand it. He gave that lecture in Saudi. He didn't plan the trip. It was a good Samaritan who suddenly called him and sponsored his Hajj. So he gave that lecture in Medina. Truth hurts. You don't know him yet you are so judgemental of him. What did your Bible say about judging fellow human beings?.


Obviously you aren't following your Bible. Don't crucify the messanger.

true2god:
I don't even know the dude, but of course he is not polished enough to be a religious ambassador for Islam. All I see is a hustler who try to make a name for himself since religious marketing is one of the most profitable enterprise, and especially when a Muslim makes attacking the bible a trade. The story, in the mouth of Muslim apologist, is always sweet especially when attacking the beliefs of the Christians. My thinking was that he did a comprehensive teaching on the history of kaabba, traceable to Abrahim and Ishmael, using Islamic, secular and anthropological evidences to buttress his point. This is what he never did hence I can only take him as a charlatan. Besides, I don't know whether the facebook video is a lecture or a 'showmanship' to advertise himself and his travel experience to his gullible audience because the whole stuff was poorly organized and at the end of the day cannot be said to achieve any objective as side from fans 'hallowing' him along. If this is the best Yoruba muslims can produce then it shows the level of our intellectual capability as a people.

CAVEAT: DO NOT FORWARD A STUPID VIDEO AGAIN.