Hello friends,
Long time guys, I took a break from all the madness in this section because I realized that all the ranting back and forth, explanations back and forth did not really change anything as such. We mostly come in here with preconceived notions and with iron clad beliefs that hoping for a peaceful resolution to most issues would be like hoping that the Isreal-Palestine conflict would end anytime soon. I promised myself though that coming back here I would try and raise issues that affected everyone, issues that had religious backgrounds which we can all relate to regardless of being a Christian, hindu, muslim etc.

Recently I have had cause to rethink my stand on various issues, a personal tragedy waiting to happen has made me ask if we should all be involved in shaming these places of worship and intervening when our loved ones have been brainwashed by these so called ministries. If I were a con man for instance and I was about to take your loved one for all they had surely you would intervene and report me to the authorities. In fact I am pretty sure it is against the law to deceive someone in order to collect their money, these ministries lie to people on a daily basis and offer them treatment (prayers) that they know would not work. These gullible people believe anything because they are so desperate,they want a quick fix to the problem.

I am of the opinion that these people should not have to pay for this alone, these places of worship should be held responsible for deceiving people. They should be have enough dignity to inform their customers congregation about these ailments and the right thing to do, churches and mosques alike should force their ailing members to first seek medical help before coming for prayers. Today I might be losing someone dear to me who listened to a pastor instead of a doctor, I shrugged it off and said oh its her belief I cannot force it into her head, but I feel bad today because I feel I and the whole family should have intervened and not left her to the mercy of her God. Supposing the Government became really religious and bans all hospitals and doctors would you agree with it? I know it sounds outlandish but I think the point I am trying to make is that these religious places should champion these things. Breast cancer, cervical cancer drives should be started in churches, rural churches should have roll back malaria drives, heck I wonder is any of these churches have a mini sick bay were first aid is given.

I wish I could put all this in a better way, but I am distraught, annoyed and very bitter, first with myself and then with every single person who has done nothing to help that friend or brother or sister who needed some common sense. Today I hope we can all stand up as one and say yes these places of worship should be more involved in protecting that life which they proclaim is sacred. Instead of drives to raise more money let there be drives to raise awareness, let us have a Night of Bliss to shed light on the dangers of Malaria, let us have a Redeemed convention with the theme "What to do if you or a loved one has AIDS - free tests and drugs "

You have a wrong concept about churches. They are places of worship of God and helping people.It takes a spiritual man to know the church of christ. These misconceptions  didn't start today . The early church was labelled too. Jesus was called a dupe.

Churches pray for the sick, and many get healed .of course it is wrong to tell someone not to take his drug. It is left for the individuals conviction. It is not every minister that has gift of healing. Even if hey do , it is not every person that receives healing for whatever reason. The person that didn't receive should take medication.

You may say why don't they just take medication ? You should realised that many health problems are demonic. And for such , medicine can't handle them. Many people have died in the hand of doctors .they couldn't diagnose or detect the cause. Laboratory can see a demon! .

Mark 5:25-26
25 In the crowd was a woman who had been sick for twelve years with a hemorrhage. 26 She had suffered much from many doctors through the years and had become poor from paying them, and was no better but, in fact, was worse.

Some health problems have natural causes. And for such prayer can speed up the treatment. God heals through medicine also. The two have their places.

Long time my urhobo brother welcome back Whats the point in naming and shaming these places of worship when the masses who worship in them are not aware that they are being brainwashed? As long as the masses get thier weekly motivational (opium) sweet talk they will continue to go there. Especially when they are sick and don't have enough funds for hospital treatment, they'll just take the cheap option and pay pastor to put his hand on their forehead while vibrate violently and he prays for them. Nine out of ten of them eventually die but we never hear about the other nine because thats bad for business only the one who would be on stage giving his testimony in church.

To stop the masses from being brainwashed we need to teach them how to think for themselves (and discipline). Not accept anything that they are being told regarding christianity islam or evolution they should be encouraged to findout for themselves and make their own decisions. This should start from a very young age. Todays generation have been so inctrinated with religion that they all believe that prays or an imaginary man coming down from the sky is the only way our great nation will progress.

That we still have some daft people who believe sicknesses are caused by "demons" shows you how inherently stuupid majority of Africans are.

The only demons we have on this life are the criminal pastors who fleece the flock and those morons who spread superstition.

We once experienced such a situation and the family had no option than to do a forced intervention. This is the only way else you'll watch your loved ones die and do nothing.

I for one will never let a pastor deceive my loved ones at the expense of their life. I'll rather take out the pastor and believe me, I will not think twice about wiping out the scum pastor from the face of the earth.

Chris my friend, I am sorry for the pain you're going through and I know most people would sympathize strongly with what you're going through.

Should these 'places of worship' be held responsible? . . . how do you hold person A responsible for persons B's choices? People will always be deceived and taken advantage of, but no one can deceive or take advantage of you without your permission. As much as I share your disdain towards these charlatans, the blame falls on us.

I do however vehemently concur, it is our moral responsibility to save those around us we see falling if we can, especially our loved ones whom we can influence. I believe God will hold us accountable on that front. And as a collective group, the best we can do is continue to speak against these 'men of god' and hope that those who have ears will hear.

[q]Long time my urhobo brother welcome back Smiley Whats the point in naming and shaming these places of worship when the masses who worship in them are not aware that they are being brainwashed? As long as the masses get thier weekly motivational (opium) sweet talk they will continue to go there. Especially when they are sick and don't have enough funds for hospital treatment, they'll just take the cheap option and pay pastor to put his hand on their forehead while vibrate violently and he prays for them. Nine out of ten of them eventually die but we never hear about the other nine because thats bad for business only the one who would be on stage giving his testimony in church.

To stop the masses from being brainwashed we need to teach them how to think for themselves (and discipline). Not accept anything that they are being told regarding christianity islam or evolution they should be encouraged to findout for themselves and make their own decisions. This should start from a very young age. Todays generation have been so inctrinated with religion that they all believe that prays or an imaginary man coming down from the sky is the only way our great nation will progress.[/q]
How is the family and young manmustwac junior
Well how do we teach people to think for themselves? What appalls me is that the big places of worship cannot stand up and declare 8 days of malaria awareness ? If they cannot do then the law should force them to, just like fake miracles were banned on tv because of the chicanery of these places of worship, I wish Nigeria was developed enough for civil suits to be brought against these churches.

[q]That we still have some daft people who believe sicknesses are caused by "demons" shows you how inherently stuupid majority of Africans are.

The only demons we have on this life are the criminal pastors who fleece the flock and those morons who spread superstition.

We once experienced such a situation and the family had no option than to do a forced intervention. This is the only way else you'll watch your loved ones die and do nothing.

I for one will never let a pastor deceive my loved ones at the expense of their life. I'll rather take out the pastor and believe me, I will not think twice about wiping out the scum pastor from the face of the earth.[/q]

We (well just a few people) tried but the person in question ran away to pastor's house, prayed and fasted 24 7, there will always be daft people and I think these people should be protected against themselves. If not lift the ban on indian hemp and on crack cocaine!

@Jesoul,
My dear, its so sad. Yes these places of worship just like any con man should be held responsible. Why do you hold someone responsible if they collect money under false pretense? In this case people's lives are at stake, and these people are vulnerable. I mean the law does not say hey you were stupid to give the con man money, I mean what is wrong for these big churches to have convention where they give away drugs and medical advice to a population who would be willing to listen?
Its sad, really sad.

Chrisbenogor:
@Jesoul,
My dear, its so sad. Yes these places of worship just like any con man should be held responsible. Why do you hold someone responsible if they collect money under false pretense? In this case people's lives are at stake, and these people are vulnerable. I mean the law does not say hey you were silly to give the con man money,

  The problem with that is that these 'pastors' are not breaking any laws. They promise spiritual gains in exchange for physical 'offerings' and people willingly (key word being willingly) submit to them. I do believe that morally they are accessories to murder. However, under the criminal/judicial system, you cannot prosecute morality. It's one thing if a person went to the doctor and the doctor lied or misdiagnosed - its quite another to go to a babalawo or "pastor" - we are not afforded the same legal protections under "spiritual institutions" versus secular, state-recognized and licensed ones. Religion is open for free practice, unfortunately, too many practice it to their own detriment instead of benefit.

I mean what is wrong for these big churches to have convention where they give away drugs and medical advice to a population who would be willing to listen?
Its sad, really sad.

I am with you - and many christians are with you too. There are churches out there doing such for their congregations. Its just too bad that the vast majority are only after money.