FrLukas:


The concept of right and wrong is not arbitrary.

Good is not subjective. Something is either good or bad.

You do see what is happening right?

Some centuries ago, homosexuality was totally outlawed in most civilizations. In fact, as late as the 80s and 90s, it was still a criminal offence in the US.

Now it is legal in most states and even African countries are beginning to legalize it.

Ditto for incest. Right now, it is a crime in every country of the world. But people's attitude towards it are beginning to be relaxed as you can see from your epistle. Soon it will be acceptable, then it will be legal and father and daughter can Bleep without inhibitions.

Man instinctively knows that some things are wrong. There was never a time when man had to indulge in incest to populate the earth. Please don't take the Biblical narration of Adam and Eve literally. After all, even Cain had to go far from his family to go and find a spouse.

Noah's daughter lay with him when he was drunk and the reason it was narrated in the Bible was because it is strange.

Absalom raped his half sister and was punished for it.

So, no. There was never a time it was OK for a mother to sleep with her son, or a father to sleep with his daughter.

The closest to incest the human race ever came to was marrying close cousins like the Jews and Chinese.

Do people commit incest? Absolutely. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people engage in homosexuality? Yup. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people engage in bestiality? Yes. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people Bleep dead bodies? Yeah. Is it right? NO.


The demarcation between right and wring is clear. We can't wish it away.

The idea of sleeping with your own mom or sister should evoke a disgust in any normal human being.

You said an "unexplainable" disgust.

Your spirit abhors it, but the flesh desires it. Most humans think they are just flesh and must seek pleasure, any pleasure whatever the cost. No sense of self discipline. Nothing.

How can you see your daughter's unclothedness and get aroused to the point of wanting to sleep with her?

It is wrong.

Isn't really upto you to decide what's wrong or right, the post you replied merely said societies could have a different view or disgust to these things, you should know there are places that approve incest or even beastiality to them isn't a big deal, while other places will frown at it

LordAdam16:


On an intellectual level, I'd want to discuss this with you.

But it's hard to do so when you can't be factual.

Incest is legal in Brazil where Neymar is from. It's also legal in Argentina, Australia, France, Belgium and many parts of Europe and Latin America. Here's a list of legality by jurisdictions -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_incest

So when you say incest is a "crime in every country of the world"; you're just talking out of your a$$.

Furthermore, the extent of classification of prohibited consanguinamory differs wildly. For example, in some parts of the world where relations between parents-full siblings and between full siblings is prohibited, relations between step-siblings isn't.

And don't come at me with religious hogwash. Religious interpretations are traditionally illogical and I avoid them in their totality when I can.

I'm not in favor of forcing binary rules on people. People should be made to understand the 'why' and come to their own conclusions.

-Lord

And it'd be difficult to discuss this intelligently with you since you want to drag it down to gutter Kevel.

So, since I'm "just talking out of my ass", I'll take myself off now.

LordAdam16:


Well maybe, and I'm going out on a limb here, a good number of Nigerian families also have these borderline-uncomfortable consanguineous interactions.

Of course, they aren't going to announce it in the streets, but you'd be very naive to believe that behind close doors; all 200m Nigerians behave in a culturally-accepted fashion with their family members.

That said, Latin American cultures are far more welcoming to these sort of interactions than many African cultures. So much so that even the Caucasians--US, Canada, and several European nationalities--find it questionable. Within a nuclear family unit, they kiss on the lips, touch intimate parts, discuss taboo subjects that'd make individuals from most other cultures flush red in embarrassment. It's normal... for them.

Those voicing support are part of the minority here who agree with those parts of the Latin America culture at least ideologically. It's like hitting a child as part of discipline. Our culture accepts it, the Westerners don't. Those on this side of the pond who don't accept it voice their support when the Westerners rail on the practice.

Personally, I think early on (I mean farther back in our evolutionary path) the genetic expressions for being agreeable with incestuous interactions was an advantage. We needed to multiply quickly. But as time went on, communities that had less incest had a more diverse gene pool; which as we know increased their survivability. This explains why most cultures came to frown on sexual interactions between closely-related individuals, and more people generally developed unexplainable disgust for the practice.

Now the uncomfortable fact which most people do not want to wrap their heads around is that the genetic component for incestuous rendezvous is suppressed in the wider population; not eliminated. We tend to downplay it with terms like Oedipus and Electra Complexes or Fantasies. But it's there and most wouldn't admit it.

On a sociological level, it does stand to reason that society keeps it at the fringes. However, on a personal level, I'm indifferent to it; as long as it doesn't lead to a baby. I think having a baby from an incestuous relationship is logically as problematic as having more kids than one can realistically care for. Except unlike the former where environmental factors can improve; with the former, the kid is getting a genetic punishment.

In a nutshell, if a cataclysmic event occurred and only your family survived; your disgust about Neymar's behavior with his mom will magically fly out the window. The concept of right and wrong most times is arbitrary.

-Lord

Fact!

From what I have seen, Latin Americans are the most sexually free and loosed group of people on the planet.
People think Americans and Europeans are sexually loosed, but that of Latinos is just something else.

LordAdam16:


On an intellectual level, I'd want to discuss this with you.

But it's hard to do so when you can't be factual.

Incest is legal in Brazil where Neymar is from. It's also legal in Argentina, Australia, France, Belgium and many parts of Europe and Latin America. Here's a list of legality by jurisdictions -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_incest

So when you say incest is a "crime in every country of the world"; you're just talking out of your a$$.

Furthermore, the extent of classification of prohibited consanguinamory differs wildly. For example, in some parts of the world where relations between parents-full siblings and between full siblings is prohibited, relations between step-siblings isn't.

And don't come at me with religious hogwash. Religious interpretations are traditionally illogical and I avoid them in their totality when I can.

I'm not in favor of forcing binary rules on people. People should be made to understand the 'why' and come to their own conclusions.

-Lord

That's what I just told him, while expressing disgust people should understand lifestyles can be very different in many places, the culture is never same everywhere.

sanpipita:



Isn't really upto you to decide what's wrong or right, the post you replied merely said societies could have a different view or disgust to these things, you should know there are places that approve incest or even beastiality to them isn't a big deal, while other places will frown at it

Even genetically it isn't OK to marry close to home. Looks to me that nature has made provisions to deter that.

Daughter-father and son-mother attraction that most babies have are always outgrown later in life.

Some cultures are cannibalistic, some kill twins or kids from multiple births, some force widows to drink the water used to wash the corpse of their husband, some bury the wives and horse men of their departed king with him.

It might be cultural elsewhere, but it doesn't mean it is good.

Does it?

FrLukas:


The concept of right and wrong is not arbitrary.

Good is not subjective. Something is either good or bad.

You do see what is happening right?

Some centuries ago, homosexuality was totally outlawed in most civilizations. In fact, as late as the 80s and 90s, it was still a criminal offence in the US.

Now it is legal in most states and even African countries are beginning to legalize it.

Ditto for incest. Right now, it is a crime in every country of the world. But people's attitude towards it are beginning to be relaxed as you can see from your epistle. Soon it will be acceptable, then it will be legal and father and daughter can Bleep without inhibitions.

Man instinctively knows that some things are wrong. There was never a time when man had to indulge in incest to populate the earth. Please don't take the Biblical narration of Adam and Eve literally. After all, even Cain had to go far from his family to go and find a spouse.

Noah's daughter lay with him when he was drunk and the reason it was narrated in the Bible was because it is strange.

Absalom raped his half sister and was punished for it.

So, no. There was never a time it was OK for a mother to sleep with her son, or a father to sleep with his daughter.

The closest to incest the human race ever came to was marrying close cousins like the Jews and Chinese.

Do people commit incest? Absolutely. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people engage in homosexuality? Yup. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people engage in bestiality? Yes. Does it make it right? NO.

Do people Bleep dead bodies? Yeah. Is it right? NO.


The demarcation between right and wring is clear. We can't wish it away.

The idea of sleeping with your own mom or sister should evoke a disgust in any normal human being.

You said an "unexplainable" disgust.

Your spirit abhors it, but the flesh desires it. Most humans think they are just flesh and must seek pleasure, any pleasure whatever the cost. No sense of self discipline. Nothing.

How can you see your daughter's unclothedness and get aroused to the point of wanting to sleep with her?

It is wrong.

A lot of royal houses of many empires and cultures do encourage and practice incest in the past, in order to keep the bloodline pure.

And point of correction, Cain & Abel both married their sisters.

I sincerely believe that the earliest of humans must have been inbreeding if we are to go by evolution because Apes inbreed, don't they?

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This same neymar this is banging his sister

FrLukas:


Even genetically it isn't OK to marry close to home. Looks to me that nature has made provisions to deter that.

Daughter-father and son-mother attraction that most babies have are always outgrown later in life.

Some cultures are cannibalistic, some kill twins or kids from multiple births, some force widows to drink the water used to wash the corpse of their husband, some bury the wives and horse men of their departed king with him.

It might be cultural elsewhere, but it doesn't mean it is good.

Does it?

From you own view is bad but from theirs its good that's whole point I'm making, but again whatever is legal within a society good or bad can always be discarded like above things you mentioned no longer exists, while they existed there were reasons for it, only took I would say superior arguments for those things to change, there could be many reasons some places approve incest than just sex and there could be time they might decide to outlaw it too

sanpipita:


From you own view is bad but from theirs its good that's whole point I'm making, but again whatever is legal within a society good or bad can always be discarded like above things you mentioned no longer exists, while they existed there were reasons for it, only took I would say superior arguments for those things to change, there could be many reasons some places approve incest than just sex and there could be time they might decide to outlaw it too

So in other words, what you are saying is that good is subjective. Whatever works for you is good?

You yourself said SUPERIOR ARGUMENTS made them change. That means they operated under an inferior reason before.

I'm just trying to understand these things.

FrLukas:


So in other words, what you are saying is that good is subjective. Whatever works for you is good?

You yourself said SUPERIOR ARGUMENTS made them change. That means they operated under an inferior reason before.

I'm just trying to understand these things.

I called it superior arguments because these things were argued even fought against before they were dropped, and yes you could say reasons that allowed them were inferior.


And yes good can be subjective especially if it has to to come from an emotional influence, people can kill in retaliation and to them its justified and good.

Neymar na fuu

chaii

sanpipita:



I called it superior arguments because these things were argued even fought against before they were dropped, and yes you could say reasons that allowed them were inferior.


And yes good can be subjective especially if it has to to come from an emotional influence, people can kill in retaliation and to them its justified and good.

hmmm... that would mean that even a psychopathic serial killer can kill and it would be ok because he has a reason for it. Then the law should never have been formulated to deal with people like that, don't you think.

FrLukas:


hmmm... that would mean that even a psychopathic serial killer can kill and it would be ok because he has a reason for it. Then the law should never have been formulated to deal with people like that, don't you think.

I knew you will come to this pedestrian angle, you are probably discussing to win and not understand anything laws are never to deprive anyone reasons to do anything, a serial killer has his reasons but laws are formulated to protect people from his likes and more importantly punish these laws are approved especially with the consent of majority, if tomorrow humans say serial killing is OK let's legalize it then so be it, but right now humans say it's a no, I mean China still does death penalty while this is disagreed in other places.

sanpipita:


I knew you will come to this pedestrian angle, you are probably discussing to win and not understand any hindsight, laws are never to deprive anyone reasons to do anything, a serial killer has his reasons but laws are formulated to protect people from his likes and more importantly punish these laws are approved especially with the consent of majority, if tomorrow humans say serial killing is OK let's legalize it then so be it, but right now humans say it's a no, I mean China still does death penalty while this is disagreed in other places.

Yes, your point is clear enough and no, I'm not arguing to win anything. No one is coming to give anybody a prize here. I just like hearing others' opinions and testing them against mine. But I'll drop the mike here since you feel it's a pointless argument. Nice chat though.

FrLukas:


Yes, your point is clear enough and no, I'm not arguing to win anything. No one is coming to give anybody a prize here. I just like hearing others' opinions and testing them against mine. But I'll drop the mike here since you feel it's a pointless argument. Nice chat though.

Fair enough, maybe I was being too serious there but felt the discussion is pretty much dragging longer enough.

sanpipita:


Fair enough, maybe I was being too serious there but felt the discussion is pretty much dragging longer enough.

Sure. Maybe we'll pick it up on a similar future thread.

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kendrick93:
His mum, his business..
As long as they are not harming anyone then it's their right to practice incest

Lol... Guy abeg no start this movement, before someone would actually pick it up and become an activist

I always wonder how we got this much... if truly God created only two humans in the beginning.

I mean, there must have been some level of incest for the population to have increased.

Could be a cultural thing for all i know. What is frowned at in one part of the world could be normal in another. Do no big deal. People will always talk and read meaning into everything. Some will even over analyse the situation.

partnerbizn3:
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Even ikwere weed go clear...

hahahah, nothing is wrong, it depends on how close one is to his or her mum.

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family meeting is next

nawa