tartar9:
Well,nothing wrong with this,everyone has to be equally represented.Lets not forget that here in the South(the South East especially) cheating is involved in almost all centers such examinations are conducted.

So there is no cheating in examination centres in the northern part of Nigeria?

tartar9:
Well,nothing wrong with this,everyone has to be equally represented. Lets not forget that here in the South(the South East especially) cheating is involved in almost all centers such examinations are conducted.

Ok....you support this and for the reason you just gave- balanced representation and unity.

Do you support the dominance of the security apparatus of this country by persons from a single region to the exclusion of others by this Buhari regime?

[quote author=raumdeuter post=86757636]

Schools funded by Federal govt is assumed that the income comes from all states, So why shouldn't indigenes from all states have a chance at it not only those with superior academic backgrounds

Ironically, the money only comes from the southern states.

You don't have to attend a Federal secondary school, there are over a million non-federal secondary school. There are state schools etc

Unity schools are the best-funded public secondary schools in Nigeria, hence, it is a first-choice institution for most parents that can't afford the expensive private schools

[quote]You know in America If an Asian(Chinese and Indian) scores the same marks as a Hispanic in the SAT. The Hispanic student has a better chance of admission because of Affirmative action a law that seeks to have equal representation of educationally disadvantaged groups

But precedence is given to merit while minorities are reserved some position (which is always very small) to have diversity in their institutions but in our case, we are talking about almost half of the population given a path in the back for their failure and encouraged to fail more.

nameo:


Ok....you support this and for the reason you just gave- balanced representation and unity.

Do you support the dominance of the security apparatus of this country by persons from a single region to the exclusion of others by this Buhari regime?

Who are the head of the security apparatus under Buhari? What is the name and region of Chief of Army staff, Naval Staff Defence staff and Airforces

Why are you not complaining that most of the key ministries are under Southerners

Power, Transport, Petroleum, Works

Moreover in the ministerial list, every state nominates someone and they all get portfolios. WHether its a state of 20M or a state of 1million

myobjective:
But precedence is given to merit while minorities are reserved some position (which is always very small) to have diversity in their institutions but in our case, we are talking about almost half of the population is given a path on the back for their failure and encourage to fail more.

There are more Hispanic in America than Asian Americans. yet the one with the bigger number gets the pat on their back while the one with smaller numbers are made to go through a higher hurdle

If FG is funding a program, its for all states to get benefit

Do you think its fair that Kano with 10Million people get the same number of Senators as Bayelsa with say 2million people? But they do get the same. When its Federal opportunities must be given to everyone

Not just one section because they have some advantage

raumdeuter:
The purpose of the creation of Unity schools is to have equal representation from all states in Nigeria. The admission is not solely based on the highest marks its to have every part of the country represented in the class to foster Unity. That is the purpose for creating Unity Scholls
So cutoffs are set to ensure that happens

What is the point of a Unity school if all the students are from Anambra and Ogun state, what is the Unity in that

I understand your stand about fostering unity and having equal representatives of students amogst various states. But be inasmuch thats the rational what stop from allocating lets say 20 state per each state and still give them admission based on their score using the same measurement, instead of giving a state as low as 9marks to gain admission.. E no make sense

Tonymegabush1:


I understand your stand about fostering unity and having equal representatives of students amogst various states. But be inasmuch thats the rational what stop from allocating lets say 20 state per each state and still give them admission based on their score using the same measurement, instead of giving a state as low as 9marks to gain admission.. E no make sense

have you gone to a real Unity school and seen the demographics of the class? Its still Southerners who dominate

The top 20 per state in Yobe will still score way lower than that top 20 in Anambra

If Anambra top 20 scores 140 minimum, top 20 in Yobe will probably score 10

raumdeuter:


have you gone to a real Unity school and seen the demographics of the class? Its still Southerners who dominate

The top 20 per state in Yobe will still score way lower than that top 20 in Anambra

If Anambra top 20 scores 140 minimum, top 20 in Yobe will probably score 10

Ok... Nicely stated but to be frank there is no oneness in it. If Nigeria is truely considered one entity the idea of state of origin in our citadel of knowledge should be discarded. If they say cutoff mark is 10 let it be 10 for all tribe...

raumdeuter:


There are more Hispanic in America than Asian Americans. yet the one with the bigger number gets the pat on their back while the one with smaller numbers are made to go through a higher hurdle

If FG is funding a program, its for all states to get the benefit

Do you think it's fair that Kano with 10Million people gets the same number of Senators as Bayelsa with to say, 2million people? But they do get the same. When its Federal opportunities must be given to everyone

Not just one section because they have some advantage

The bolded is a classical example of cherry-picking data to make a point. Asians Americans are a model minority because the majority already better economy standing than most native (white Hispanic and blacks) hence, they are already over-represented in American higher institution of learning which then necessitated in having a quota in place for blacks and Hispanic that are already underrepresented.

Federation is not giving everyone equal opportunity but having power giving to federating units especially in a heterogeneous society like ours. What we practice is not federalism but a over centralized system where the central government is all-powerful. If we actually practice federalism, each state will keep whatever resources they have and no one will care about what happened in Abuja.

Coming back to your question, yes it doesn't make sense for Kano with allegedly 10m people to have only 3 senators a while a state like Bayelsa with only 2 m people has 3 senators. Let us assumed that Kano doesn't have more house of representative members than Kano, let us also assume that Bayelsa is not contributing more to the centre than kano.

Does representative in an ethnically diverse nation like Nigeria should be based on the population or the ethnic groups of the constitute units?

raumdeuter:


Despite the cut off of 4 and 7 how many people from those states still attend the schools. The cut off of 4 and 7 are what they deemed low enough to catch people from those areas

If there is a minimum cutoff and no one from these states still dont meet it, How do you meet the main goals for establishing those schools

Then we need to examine whether those schools are still needed or whether an exam is the best way to recruit


Why not draw lots?


I am in support of the idea behind these schools but I doubt that they are fit for purpose any longer

Tonymegabush1:

Ok... Nicely stated but to be frank there is no oneness in it. If Nigeria is truely considered one entity the idea of state of origin in our citadel of knowledge should be discarded. If they say cutoff mark is 10 let it be 10 for all tribe...

Its a nation we are not going to pretend we are one and ignore our differences.

America didnt just say we are blind to different races and background and decide to measure every applicant the same way,

If its going to be funded by the FGN it has to have Federal character representative of all the states in the country

Tonymegabush1:


Ok... Nicely stated but to be frank there is no oneness in it. If Nigeria is truely considered one entity the idea of state of origin in our citadel of knowledge should be discarded. If they say cutoff mark is 10 let it be 10 for all tribe...

It is not the FG's responsibility to provide secondary school education

The unity schools are a unique attempt to pursue a certain agenda.
If we no longer believe in that agenda the schools should be scrapped
The schools are not centres of excellence or merit. The agenda underlying the schools implies the use of quotas.
They were set up after the war so Nigerian children of diverse backgrounds could interact with each other and also school in unfamiliar locations

The real issue is that a person scoring 7 is probably not ready for secondary education

My view is that there should be a minimum score e.g 70 and every state have it's own quota . That should mean unfilled quotas rather than slots taken up by other states.
Unfilled quotas should be offered to states from the same zone

myobjective:
The bolded is a classical example of cherry-picking data to make a point. Asians Americans are a model minority because the majority already better economy standing than most native (white Hispanic and blacks) hence, they are already over-represented in American higher institution of learning which then necessitated in having a quota in place for blacks and Hispanic that are already underrepresented.

Federation is not giving everyone equal opportunity but having power giving to federating units especially in a heterogeneous society like ours. What we practice is not federalism but a over centralized system where the central government is all-powerful. If we actually practice federalism, each state will keep whatever resources they have and no one will care about what happened in Abuja.

Coming back to your question, yes it doesn't make sense for Kano with allegedly 10m people to have only 3 senators a while a state like Bayelsa with only 2 m people has 3 senators. Let us assumed that Kano doesn't have more house of representative members than Kano, let us also assume that Bayelsa is not contributing more to the centre than kano.

Does representative in an ethnically diverse nation like Nigeria should be based on the population or the ethnic groups of the constitute units?

If FG leaves Unity schools to merit alone we will find some states over-represented and some underrepresented like the Asian American vs Hispanic examples

Thus the Unity schools cutoff is giving a quota for the underrepresented

In the US, companies based in New York probably pay more taxes than Companies located in Idaho, New York has more population than Idaho yet both Idaho and New York have the same number of Senators

The motive for creating Unity schools was to provide an avenue for kids from every state to meet in school and bond. You can later contest it that FG should scrap Unity schools then and create a different one.

myobjective:


The bolded is a classical example of cherry-picking data to make a point. Asians Americans are a model minority because the majority already better economy standing than most native (white Hispanic and blacks) hence, they are already over-represented in American higher institution of learning which then necessitated in having a quota in place for blacks and Hispanic that are already underrepresented.

Federation is not giving everyone equal opportunity but having power giving to federating units especially in a heterogeneous society like ours. What we practice is not federalism but a over centralized system where the central government is all-powerful. If we actually practice federalism, each state will keep whatever resources they have and no one will care about what happened in Abuja.

Coming back to your question, yes it doesn't make sense for Kano with allegedly 10m people to have only 3 senators a while a state like Bayelsa with only 2 m people has 3 senators. Let us assumed that Kano doesn't have more house of representative members than Kano, let us also assume that Bayelsa is not contributing more to the centre than kano.

Does representative in an ethnically diverse nation like Nigeria should be based on the population or the ethnic groups of the constitute units?

As far as the senator thing is concerned population is one factor but not the only one.

Others may argue that it should be based on contribution to the common purse.
States should have a say proportionate to their financial contributions

By that reasoning Bayelsa should have many more senators than Kano

0m0nnakoda:

Then we need to examine whether those schools are still needed or whether an exam is the best way to recruit
Why not draw lots?
I am in support of the idea behind these schools but I doubt that they are fit for purpose any longer

Choosing a cutoff of 7 no matter how ridiculous still shows this kid is interested in going to Unity school which is why he took the exam

If you draw lots who would you put in the box to draw? The random kid on the street?

immhotep:

Helinues , afamed, metaphysical and other APC members can help us explain this.

cc lzaa sarrki gmbuharii

...because we need to get children of repentant bandits into school fast so idleness does not force them into next generation banditry.

raumdeuter:


If FG leaves Unity schools to merit alone we will find some states over-represented and some underrepresented like the Asian American vs Hispanic examples

Thus the Unity schools cutoff is giving a quota for the underrepresented

In the US, companies based in New York probably pay more taxes than Companies located in Idaho, New York has more population than Idaho yet both Idaho and New York have the same number of Senators

The motive for creating Unity schools was to provide an avenue for kids from every state to meet in school and bond. You can later contest it that FG should scrap Unity schools then and create a different one.

I agree but rather than admitting people with 7 government should work with consistently failing states rather than admitting kids that will predictably fail and then reinforce negative stereotypes

Now children of repentant bandits and repentant Igbos can attend same school and be productive....hopefully!



Cc
Immhotep
Lzaa
Adaibeku
Rosalynor

raumdeuter:


Choosing a cutoff of 7 no matter how ridiculous still shows this kid is interested in going to Unity school which is why he took the exam

If you draw lots who would you put in the box to draw? The random kid on the street?

Draw lots in lieu of the exam is what I mean. No exam just lots and an aptitude test.
The other thing is that the schools perhaps can be changed to comprehensives offering vocational training like animal husbandry

0m0nnakoda:

It is not the FG's responsibility to provide secondary school education

The unity schools are a unique attempt to pursue a certain agenda.
If we no longer believe in that agenda the schools should be scrapped
The schools are not centres of excellence or merit. The agenda underlying the schools implies the use of quotas.
They were set up after the war so Nigerian children of diverse backgrounds could interact with each other and also school in unfamiliar locations

I agree with this, Its like Okay we notice boys and girls need to know about each other more so we set up a school to select equal numbers of boys and girls

If we make the criteria, speed(run 100meters in 11 seconds flat), we know naturally boys are faster than girls so the school will be filled with boys and defeat the purpose,

if we make it height(6ft), we know male are usually taller than female so it benefits male more than females

The ideal thing in this scenario would be say Speed 11seconds for men, 13 seconds for women or Height 6ft for men 5ft5 for women

Something that represents the reality not just a blanket rule

The real issue is that a person scoring 7 is probably not ready for secondary education

My view is that there should be a minimum score e.g 70 and every state have it's own quota . That should mean unfilled quotas rather than slots taken up by other states.
Unfilled quotas should be offered to states from the same zone

The person who scored 7 is still the best Yobe has to offer and is interested in the school. if you put it at say 70 and no person from an entire region makes it, then what has been achieved? You can as well go to Loyola college Ibadan, St Johns Onitsha and have a class of Ibos and Yorubas

0m0nnakoda:
I agree but rather than admitting people with 7 government should work with consistently failing states rather than admitting kids that will predictably fail and then reinforce negative stereotypes

There are certain factors that make certain people interested in school and some not and this wont be changed in a generation. That is why they are trying to encourage at all means for them to go to school and meet other people.

These Unity schools have their success stories too. I had friends who went to Katsina, Jos, Minna Ikot Ekpene Okigw made friends from different groups

0m0nnakoda:
Draw lots in lieu of the exam is what I mean. No exam just lots and an aptitude test.
The other thing is that the schools perhaps can be changed to comprehensives offering vocational training like animal husbandry

if its animal husbandry it might interest the Northen kid but not the Southern kid, So you have a school of Northerners and defeats the purpose of integration and Unity

raumdeuter:


I agree with this, Its like Okay we notice boys and girls need to know about each other more so we set up a school to select equal numbers of boys and girls

If we make the criteria, speed(run 100meters in 11 seconds flat), we know naturally boys are faster than girls so the school will be filled with boys and defeat the purpose,

if we make it height(6ft), we know male are usually taller than female so it benefits male more than men

The ideal thing in this scenario would be say Speed 11seconds for men, 13 seconds for women or Height 6ft for men 5ft5 for women

Something that represents the reality not just a blanket rule


The person who scored 7 is still the best Yobe has to offer and is interested in the school. if you put it at say 70 and no person from an entire region makes it, then what has been achieved? You can as well go to Loyola college Ibadan, St Johns Onitsha and have a class of Ibos and Yorubas

At the university level there is plenty of research to predict dropping out from entry grades.

I do not believe that this is the case at this level but I would guess that a person with 7 likely would not thrive and their failure would only reinforce negative stereotypes.

I do not believe that it is necessarily the best Yobe can offer. There may be problems with interest
These unity schools are all in decay an I would not send my kids there even if they got scholarship.
When they were set up they were the best schools in the country and the scores difference was not as bad as this.
Perhaps the brightest Yobe kids go elsewhere

raumdeuter:

There are certain factors that make certain people interested in school and some not and this wont be changed in a generation. That is why they are trying to encourage at all means for them to go to school and meet other people.

These Unity schools have their success stories too. I had friends who went to Katsina, Jos, Minna Ikot Ekpene Okigw made friends from different groups



if its animal husbandry it might interest the Northen kid but not the Southern kid, So you have a school of Northerners and defeats the purpose of integration and Unity

Schools do Islamic knowledge, Bible knowledge, Fine arts, Technical drawing, Home Economics too .Not everyone is interested in those
That is why people have choices

Those subjects have not disadvantaged anyone

The schools are no longer well funded

raumdeuter:


Who are the head of the security apparatus under Buhari? What is the name and region of Chief of Army staff, Naval Staff Defence staff and Airforces

Why are you not complaining that most of the key ministries are under Southerners

Power, Transport, Petroleum, Works

Moreover in the ministerial list, every state nominates someone and they all get portfolios. WHether its a state of 20M or a state of 1million

The following are the members of the National Security Council and heads of security/parasecurity agancies in Nigeria:

Chiefs of Defence, Army, Naval, Air staffs, IGP, NSA, Minister of Defence, DG of SSS, DG of NIA, Comptroller General of Customs, Head of Prisons, Head of Immigration, Head of Civil Defence, etc etc.

Out of these, only two came from the south. In fact, there is a region from the south that does not have a single rep within the security architecture of the country!!!

Following your initial comment and reason given in that comment, do you think this is a balanced arrangement geared to enhancing national security? Do you think it is fair?

nameo:


The following are the members of the National Security Council and heads of security/parasecurity agancies in Nigeria:

Chiefs of Defence, Army, Naval, Air staffs, IGP, NSA, Minister of Defence, DG of SSS, DG of NIA, Comptroller General of Customs, Head of Prisons, Head of Immigration, Head of Civil Defence, etc etc.

Out of these, only two came from the south. In fact, there is a region from the south that does not have a single rep within the security architecture of the country!!!

Following your initial comment and reason given in that comment, do you think this is a balanced arrangement geared to enhancing national security? Do you think it is fair?

have you considered the major ministries are headed by Southerners in this same regime? Works Power Transport Foreign affairs petroleum even Finance until Kemi Adeosun left

Do you think that is fair?

0m0nnakoda:


At the university level there is plenty of research to predict dropping out from entry grades.

I do not believe that this is the case at this level but I would guess that a person with 7 likely would not thrive and their failure would only reinforce negative stereotypes.

I do not believe that it is necessarily the best Yobe can offer. There may be problems with interest
These unity schools are all in decay an I would not send my kids there even if they got scholarship.
When they were set up they were the best schools in the country and the scores difference was not as bad as this.
Perhaps the brightest Yobe kids go elsewhere

The brightest kids in each state probably go to private schools or abroad. The kids of the commissioners and governors of Yobe probably do.

You are right, the Unity schools probably dont appeal to them that much
Probably not every parent is willing to let their 10yr old travel across the country to live alone in one hostel. Also you know Northern parents given the Islamic influence might not be open to sending 10yr old kids to live in secular Southern Unity schools

Right now, these Unity schools are even not so great again. As a parent in todays Nigeria, I will not send my 11yr old to Azare, Potiskum or Katsina

[quote author=SanusiGworo post=86755706][/quote]

Is there any reason for the huge disparity between the cut off marks for boys and girls in the north?

Don't the male and female students pass through the same primary education?

raumdeuter:


have you considered the major ministries are headed by Southerners in this same regime? Works Power Transport Foreign affairs petroleum even Finance until Kemi Adeosun left

Do you think that is fair?

This is dishonest

There is nothing like southerner in Nigeria
It is only so called northerners that use that term
We reject it.

At independence we had east and west.
That was the only negotiated basis for our coexistence.

0m0nnakoda:

This is dishonest

There is nothing like southerner in Nigeria
It is only so called northerners that use that term
We reject it.

At independence we had east and west.
That was the only negotiated basis for our coexistence.

If there is a North, there should be a South. You cannot claim the whole3 regions of the North are the same and try to differentiate the South

The difference between Kogi, Jos Borno and Sokoto is as wide as the difference between Ibadan, Onitsha, Calabar and Warri

raumdeuter:
The purpose of the creation of Unity schools is to have equal representation from all states in Nigeria. The admission is not solely based on the highest marks its to have every part of the country represented in the class to foster Unity. That is the purpose for creating Unity Scholls
So cutoffs are set to ensure that happens

What is the point of a Unity school if all the students are from Anambra and Ogun state, what is the Unity in that

Let me agree with you.

Why does the North have different quota numbers for their males and females?

Don't they go through the same primary education?

bukatyne:


Let me agree with you.

Why does the North have different quota numbers for their males and females?

Don't they go through the same primary education?

When I wrote the National Common entrance, there was a different cutoff for Male and Female in all states. In the SW the cutoff for male was higher than female

I don't know why there is a difference in the North maybe the girls are smarter than the boys and you need to bump up the girls cutoff to get the desired numbers

TheApologist:
Interestingly these ones with the ridiculous scores will end up ruling the smarter ones from southern states in years to come

Go and check the recent NNPC recruitment.