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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven (1974 Views)
Does Allah Descend To The Lowest Heaven? If Yes, How And When? / Does Allah Also Fall Sick? / What Does Allah Mean By Calling Himself Al-Baari(The Evolver)? (2) (3) (4)
Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 4:46am On Jun 26, 2020 |
So I have known these two contradictory hadith about Allah permanent location. On says Allah lives on his throne in the seventh heaven The other says (indirectly that he lives in the lowest heaven (see below) Where is Allah location? 2 Likes 3 Shares
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Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 4:50am On Jun 26, 2020 |
It is obvious that Muhammad thought the earth was flat. In a spherical earth, for Allah to fulfil his mission in the above hadith, he would have to keep staying in the lowest heaven. Because at every point in time, a place on the earth will be in the night. Or perhaps, maybe Muhammad was only referring to the Saudi people in that hadith 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by AntiChristian: 6:46am On Jun 26, 2020 |
This is extreme misinterpretation! Allah does whatever He wills and He has absolute control over all things. How does rising over (i.e. istawa Arabic) the throne contradict descending as used in that Hadith? How does these mean living on the throne or living in the lowest heaven? No wonder you became an Xmuslim and an atheist! Xmuslim: 1 Like |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 6:49am On Jun 26, 2020 |
AntiChristian:you are obviously not a learned Muslim. I quoted that verse of the Qur'an because I didn't see the hadith on time. And it seems a good substitute Didn't I say two hadith contradictions? Also, you are ignorant of where Allah lives according to sunni Islam. Go back to madrasah brother and come back when you know Islam very well. 3 Likes |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 6:50am On Jun 26, 2020 |
I didn't see the hadith reference but I remember it's wordings. It claim Allah lives on his throne in the seventh heaven |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 6:51am On Jun 26, 2020 |
AntiChristian:now tell me if that hadith doesn't expose Muhammad and Allah ignorance of the shape of the earth? 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 7:02am On Jun 26, 2020 |
AntiChristian: For example living permanently on the lowest heaven and simultaneously on his throne above the seventh heaven. Allahu akbar . Maybe he dublicate himself. Or he clone himself. Nothing you will not hear from Muslim apologists. This is how far Islam can damage one's thinking ability. Even if we see undiniable evidence of evolution that could convince everyone today, Muslim apologists will still have a reason to believe in the Qur'an Even if we are able to preserve human mind after death and achieve immortality. Muslim apologists will still believe that the person soul has gone to the grave and undergoing punishment or blessing. Even if we find aliens today, and realised that they don't have a religion and they are conscious too. Muslim apologists will still claim that religion is only for human dwelling on earth Once someone has decided to blindly follow a religion, nothing can convince him 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by AntiChristian: 9:48am On Jun 26, 2020 |
Xmuslim: I agree with you I'm not learned and you are the learned Xmuslim Atheist. How does the Hadiths contradict one another? Xmuslim: Where is there any relation to the shape of the earth in anything you brought here? Are all atheist as foolish as these? Xmuslim: How are you affected by our blind-following? What do you call all this in logic "Maybes" "Ifs". Don't you see you are illogical? They haven't happened so wait till it happens if it ever happens before you die. Your cadaver can even be signed over for Covid 19 experiment sef! I only sent one response yet you mentioned me three times. Are you so insecure like your friend Taiwo too? Let's blind-follow Muhammad/Islam in peace as you blind follow your desires in dalaal. |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by IMAliyu(m): 11:21am On Jun 26, 2020 |
I would had argued that Allah was maybe omnipresent, but I've had a debate with a friend before and he proved to me that Allah wasn't omnipresent, but resides in the 7th heaven on his throne. On a spherical earth it's always midnight somewhere, so it doesn't really add up that Allah in person is both residing on his throne and in the 1st heaven simultaneously. Not unless someone would like argue that he has the ability to be present in person in two or more locations simultaneously. On a flat Earth on the other hand, this would easily make more sense. There is another question of what is the 1st-7th heaven? I had a video saved on my phone from the European space agency which was a zooming in on the image of distant Stars observed by the Hubble space telescope. A school friend was going through my phone and found the video and the first question he asked was "is this real, is this the 1st heaven?" Couldn't really answer him. But this brings the question of what are the 7 heavens or where are the 7 heavens? Is it the layers of Earth's atmosphere, is it the distance of the solar system, Galaxy or what, where does one layer begin and ends? Some Muslims on r/Izlam(Muslim memes subreddit) were even trying to explain it as the 7 heavens are higher dimensions and not literally heaven and space and that's why with all the astronomical detection and observation, haven't seen anything like the 7 heavens. |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by LabuleofNigeria: 1:51pm On Jun 26, 2020 |
Xmuslim: OP, this your post is an ignorant display of slowpoke & Illiteracy. The Hadith clearly states that Allah "Decends" This alone should educate you that He comes to the first heaven to grant prayers (from the 7th heaven) according to the hadith. Else, tell us the meaning of "decend" ? Cos it seems you have only wasted your tuition in school
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Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 4:33pm On Jun 26, 2020 |
LabuleofNigeria:I don't reply people with low level of understanding. This is my last response to you 3 Likes |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 4:34pm On Jun 26, 2020 |
LabuleofNigeria:I don't reply people with low level of understanding. If you can't comprehend my message, you have low IQ This is my last response to you 4 Likes |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 5:55am On Jun 27, 2020 |
No Muslim has been able to answer the question of where Allah lives. They have been using tactics to escape from the question. The hadith shows that Allah is always in the lowest heaven listening to people's prayers. So God does not have a chance of living in the seventh heaven even for a seconds? |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by cezarman(m): 8:00am On Jun 27, 2020 |
This god must be high Asf!!! See display... |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by akure1stson: 10:16am On Jun 27, 2020 |
cezarman: Lolz...Op ask question, instead of answer. na curse and insult dem dem dey reply. i just dey wonder, how Mortals is defending immortal? |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 7:51pm On Jun 27, 2020 |
IMAliyu: Yes the hadith does not make sense. As a former sunni Muslim, I was thought that Allah stays above the seventh heaven and his arsh is on water. Although, he is present everywhere with his knowledge. However, the hadith claims that he comes to the 1st heaven physically. Concerning seven evens and seven earth. The interpretation of the early scholars before science is simple - 6 other skies similar to the one above us, but only the one above us contain stars. Infact, they believed the stars are attached to the sky because they thought the sky is a solid body. Also, they believed, there are 6 more earth below us. It's the advent of science that lead today's scholar to different rẹ-interpretation. Muhammad himself will be surprised to hear all these re-interpretation. 1 Like |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by sino(m): 10:46pm On Jun 27, 2020 |
Sigh! How do you guys always come up with this redundant questions based on parochial assumptions on what God should be and do?! You always claim to be a former Muslim at any given opportunity even when unnecessary to state, but the very basic things Islam teaches about God is always neglected/forgotten just to prove whatever preconceived misconceptions you hold on to. God is the creator of the heavens and earth, the universe, time and space, in fact, God mentions in the Qur'an how distinct our perception of time is from that of the divine, but here we are, asking to know how God can descend to all part of the world at different time zones... Really? Hello! We do not call upon a deity that is confined to the dictates of His creation, else why would such a deity be worthy of being God?! What we believe is God descends the way that befits His divine majesty and grandeur. God does whatever He Wills and that is why He is the creator, and no creation of His can confine Him and that includes time and space! |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 1:15am On Jun 28, 2020 |
sino: Bro, the matter is too simple for any sincere person to see the flaw in the hadith. Nothing like befit his majesty here. The obvious truth is this - Muhammad claim Allah descend to the lowest heaven and stay there till day break. What further explanation do you need to see that Muhammad thought the earth was flat. If anything could be interpreted to mean anything, then the whole thing is meaningless. We can as well agree with the Christian that Allah begot son the it befit his majesty. We can also agree that Allah requires intermidiary gods (such as sango, ogun etc) before he could connect with human and of course in the way it befit it majesty. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by sino(m): 10:44am On Jun 28, 2020 |
Xmuslim: Because the Prophet (SAW) said Allah descends to the lower heaven every last part of the night till day break, then automatically, Prophet Muhammad (SAW) thought that the earth is flat?! Wow, see reasoning! You even claim it is the obvious truth! The facts of the matter here is that you ignored the salient point that time and space are concepts that do not apply to God the same way they apply to humans on earth! So any form of conclusion you bring is flawed! This much has been established from the Qur’an! Allah (SWT) Says: "And they urge you to hasten the punishment. But Allah will never fail in His promise. And indeed, a day with your Lord is like a thousand years of those which you count." (Qur'an 22:47) This verse alone renders all your submissions null! What is most obvious is that day and night is only peculiar to us humans, here on earth, and thus any reference to this in the hadith (the Qur'an also establishes this fact) in question was and is specific to us humans (Muslims) and how best to use our time and not Allah (SWT). The descent is said to be in heaven, well, except you have further information on the time zones in the heavens.... You would see that my arguments are not based on interpreting anything to mean anything, that is not what Islam teaches, I made reference and brought evidence from the Qur’an! So interpreting anything to mean anything is alien to Islam. |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 2:09pm On Jun 28, 2020 |
sino:you are entitled to your opinion. Allah use our 24hrs to calculate fasting and many other thing, but when hadith fails, he doesn't use our 24hrs So which time is he using when descending to lower earth in the last part of the night. Muhammad even said Allah leaves by fajr. So which time is he using . I'm sure you would observe nawafil and prayer during those time thinking Allah is listening to you at the lowest heaven. Common, this is too simple sir. Now the flat earth argument I brought. The hadith would not have any problem if the earth is flat, because Allah would come and go by fajr as indicated in the hadith. But now that the earth is spherical, Allah will have to go to another country's lowest heaven once he finish with Nigeria, and this will repeat itself till eternity. Thus, Allah would be living in the lowest heaven forever. From Nigeria to Canada to USA to Jamaica to Italy and so on. If you still don't get it, I'm sorry I can't explain more than this. I would gladly accept defeat if I were you. But the difference between us is that you have accepted that every sahih hadith are from Muhammad and Muhammad can never make mistakes because he receives guidance from Allah. So I understand why you are fighting so hard to defend the undefendable error in the hadith. I wish you good luck sir If I sound insultive forgive me pls. I don't mean it 2 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by sino(m): 9:24am On Jun 29, 2020 |
Xmuslim:As I said earlier, you guys are parochial in your assumptions about God and how God should be or do. I brought a verse to show you that time as we know it is different on earth to what can be applied to God. Not only that, God is the creator of time! For a fact, time on earth is different from that in other planets in our solar system... But you are fixated on what you want to prove and hence you would always ignore these facts... Be open-minded, it doesn't mean you should accept Islam or God! I have not asked you to believe anything, of course you are entitled to your opinion, as it is what it is, just your opinion. But when it comes to facts about my religion, I'll present them and keep presenting them whenever I feel like it in response to you. Again, your conclusion on flat earth from the hadith is flawed based on the fact that you are simply equating how humans perceive time and travel with that of the divine! (false equivalence) It is that simple! Your submission on how God would have to be going from one country to another simply means you do not have a proper understanding /information about God, and that is no surprise here, else why would you be an atheist. Isn't it farfetched and ironic that just from a single hadith you conclude that the Prophet Muhammad (Saw) thought the earth was flat when Muslims from the 11th century and even beyond had concluded that the earth was round based on the Qur'an and mathematics and used this knowledge to calculate the Qibla for the 5 daily prayers?! Well, this shows that Muslims aren't parochial in their thought processes and do not make assumptions about people's thoughts based on a single information that isn't explicit! Well, it is what it is, as they say, 'Nemo dat quod non habet' 1 Like |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by tintingz(m): 11:15am On Jun 29, 2020 |
Xmuslim: Allah even created the world in 6 days like he was following a measured time. But Yeah he doesn't use time and not in a space. I don't know how muslims don't see the absurdity and contradictions in their argument. |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by tintingz(m): 11:37am On Jun 29, 2020 |
Xmuslim: Of course Muhammad and his people then thoughts the earth was flat with the way they narrated the world, many religions and cultures believed the earth was flat only some few people like the early Greek philosophers someone like Aristotle discovered it was spherical but most people don't believe them. Even Galileo was imprisoned by the church for saying the earth was not flat but move round the sun. Muhammad(in Qur'an) said the heaven and Earth were together and separated. They actually believed there were no galaxies, planets, other solar systems. 3 Likes |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by Xmuslim: 11:43am On Jun 29, 2020 |
sino: Like I said sir, I can't explain more than I had done if you didn't notice the error in the hadith. I wish you good luck and more knowledge. 1 Like |
Re: Where Does Allah Lives - Seventh Heaven Or Lowest Heaven by ANTIlSLAM(m): 4:05pm On Aug 29, 2020 |
The thing dey kaaba enjoying his life with virgins |
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