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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa6xadR6fkU?fs=1&hl=en[/flash]

@Frosbel

Keep up the good work!

I think we have posted enough articles to debunk the prosperity false gospel

Frosbel:

You, particularly, have done very well concerning this matter but its not as simple as that. Most of their customers are in "churches" simply because they hope for "solutions" - money, power, success over perceived/imagined enemies. This ensures they fall squarely into the "itchy ears" category and the prosperity pimps are just providing a service selling false hope and making fortunes from that!

Even here on NL, you will see the prosperity merchants have been shown to have almost no knowledge of scripture and the little they do, they misquote and manipulate for their own purposes. They have even been caught involved in 419, cheating, lying etc yet they remain shameless BECAUSE for them, it is business and they will NEVER give up - it is the lazy man's way to wealth to harness humans whist God asked us to harness nature.

Please do not think it is enough - the surface has been barely scratched.

It is not enough. I don't have much money, but maybe someone who has money might read this and do it, but I think that what is needed is an advertising campaign. I would love to see bill boards across Lagos and the entire country saying things like:

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

Second Peter 2.

And other such quotes provoking the people to wake up.

.

Interesting video
But some issue here
Why does he contradict himself
He can't be saying his whilst he is wearing a gold wristwatch, a gold ring, a flamboyant suit, preaching in a fully rugged auditorium that was built with some wonderful cash
I wonder where the money for all this came from

Frosbel, good job.

But what then can be said for the multitudes who will not willingly go to any place or church where they'll get the undiluted sound word of God? What if indeed, despite the fleecing, people still do want to flock to the congregations of these "prosperity pimps"? And have you noticed that if people in these times are not running after "prosperity pimps" then they are invariably running after "miracle pimps"?

Azibalua:

Interesting video
But some issue here
Why does he contradict himself
He can't be saying his whilst he is wearing a gold wristwatch, a gold ring, a flamboyant suit, preaching in a fully rugged auditorium that was built with some wonderful cash
I wonder where the money for all this came from

^^^^



You are right, I will not want to judge, but he is Jimmy Swagart's son and I think he has learned a few lessons from his Dad's escapades.

I only posted the message to drive home the point that Prosperity preachers are deceptively fleecing God's flock.


John 2:13-16"The Passover of the Jews was near, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. I[b]n the temple he found people selling cattle, sheep, and doves, and the money changers seated at their tables. Making a whip of cords, he drove all of them out of the temple, both the sheep and the cattle. He also poured out the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. He told those who were selling the doves, "Take these things out of here! Stop making my Father's house a marketplace!"[/b]

PLEASE WATCH THE CLIP Below

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JM3BWAmlXis?fs=1&hl=en[/flash]

Azibalua:

Interesting video
But some issue here
Why does he contradict himself
He can't be saying his whilst he is wearing a gold wristwatch, a gold ring, a flamboyant suit, preaching in a fully rugged auditorium that was built with some wonderful cash
I wonder where the money for all this came from

That was not even a gold wristwatch, it's a gold bracelet
Interestingly, it shows the level of hypocrisy. Someone rightly said in another thread that if you live in an air conditioned house or drive an air conditioned car,and you condemn prosperity, you are a hypocrite
That reminds me, you people say building a big church is bad but see the preacher preaching in an expensively and well equipped state of the art building of a huge size. And look at the weak hypocritical defense beneath

frosbel:

You are right, I will not want to judge, but he is Jimmy Swagart's son and I think he has learned a few lessons from his Dad's escapades.

I only posted the message to drive home the point that Prosperity preachers are deceptively fleecing God's flock.

That means he is a complete hypocrite! just like any other poverty preacher

^^^


What is important to you as a Christian?

[size=14pt]
MONEY or HOLINESS ?[/size]


"No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other; you will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money." Matthew 6:24

I think we have to be clear on what we call prosperity.  Those who criticise prosperity are looking at things from wrong perspective. I don't believe in materialism. Prosperity is different from materialism. That's why they always end up in hypocrisy . You say a man that wears silk suit is materialistic and you are wearing thesame.

There is a clear difference between prosperity and materialism. What you guys should condemn is materialism and not prosperity. God wants us to prosper. Prosperity is having more than enough to bless others. The focus of our prosperity is the need in the world and the need in the gospel. It is not about eating with gold plates, but by being empowered to bless your world. Even though we know that nothing is too expensive for God to give us. We don't use our faith for such things. A spiritual man is concerned about giving and giving, not eating and eating. But you cant give if you don't have. You must have to give.

frosbel:

^^^
What is important to you as a Christian?

[size=14pt]
MONEY or HOLINESS ?[/size]

"No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other; you will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money." Matthew 6:24

Pr 8:18 Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.
(KJV)
Both are important and God provided the two

frosbel:

What is important to you as a Christian?

[size=14pt]
MONEY or HOLINESS ?[/size]
"No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other; you will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money." Matthew 6:24

Take note of the highlight . Having money to give ,to serve God and help others is not "SERVING money" . But Inability to give is SERVING MONEY. Is there any scripture where God says he hates to proper his people. None! . Rather we have hundreds of scriptures that confirm Gods pleasure in blessing people. 

Psalms 35:27
27 . . .Let the Lord be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.


God does not against a man having riches , he does not want a man to put trust in riches.

1 Timothy 6:17
17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;

It's a man that has that can help others .a poor man cant help anybody, not even himself.

1 Timothy 6:18
18 That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;

mabell:

Pr 8:18 Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.
(KJV)
Both are important and God provided the two

In the covetous mind of many Christians, riches always pertains to money.

Riches is not all about money, but salvation, grace etc etc.

examples :

"Now if the fall of them [be] the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?" Romans 11:12

"To whom God would make known what [is] the[b] riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles[/b]; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:" - Colossians 1:27



While there is nothing wrong with having a good income or good job, please reflect on the wise words of Kind David, Solomon and Paul.


"Keep falsehood and lies far from me; [b]give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me only my daily bread[/b]." Proverbs 30:8

"But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that."  1 Timothy 6:8

"Give us today our daily bread." Matthew 6:11

"I'll say it again--it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!" Matthew 19:24

"He who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need" - Ephesians 4:28

@Frosbel:

I think what you wanted to say was "In the minds of covetous people, riches always pertains to money"

@Jo:

Can you name ONE person on NL who has EVER condemned prosperity? Just ONE, please!

What is the purpose of these lies? Just yesterday, I wrote that many of your perceived "opponents" here are multi-millionaires.

What people complain about is the difference between the lives of Jesus and His Apostles and that of the WOF/Prosperity "Pimps".

I work! 95% of my income is MY SWEAT. I deserve to eat what I worked for.

The Bible says the one who does not work ought not eat. And we all know the jobs of the Apostles (at least some of them) which were secular. What does your pastor do? What do the prosperity "pimps" do? They preach and when they preach, they preach what you call "principles" BUT which were NOT reflected in the lives of those who you follow.

Is the servant greater than the Master? You say Paul made a choice just like he did not marry. Did he also make the choice to have an affliction in his flesh? Was he the one who chose to have the serpent bite him or to be locked in Jail. Why did everyone we see in the NT decide to make that same choice Paul made? Why is it ONLY you that decides the Apostles choice is not good enough for you? Was it also Peter who chose to NOT collect tithes and build a giant church or was he following what he saw lived through Jesus in his presence? Did Peter not see anywhere he was as Church? If he had changed what Jesus did, would people have followed him as they did? Would the power of God have manifested as it did? Which is what everyone is asking but you always dodge - WHY IS YOUR OWN THEOLOGY DIFFERENT FROM CHRISTS OWN? WHY IS IT DIFFERENT FROM THE APOSTLES? Yet you say they are your models! Paul spoke of "Riches in Glory" - did he mean Naira and Kobo?

Who is being fooled?

Joagbaje:

Take note of the highlight . Having money to give ,to serve God and help others is not "SERVING money" . But Inability to give is SERVING MONEY. Is there any scripture where God says he hates to proper his people. None! . Rather we have hundreds of scriptures that confirm Gods pleasure in blessing people. 

Psalms 35:27
27 . . .Let the Lord be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.


God does not against a man having riches , he does not want a man to put trust in riches.

1 Timothy 6:17
17 Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;

It's a man that has that can help others .a poor man cant help anybody, not even himself.

1 Timothy 6:18
18 That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;

We seem to be on the same PAGE coincidentally. Now I know where you care coming from.

There is nothing wrong with a Christian having millions, but it is his attitude to the money that is important in the eyes of GOD,  A true Christian will see the money not as his , but as God's and just like you rightly said , he will be willing to distribute MONEY  for the work of God and needs of the saints.


Anyway, the problem many of us here have is not individual Christians having good jobs or business, I for one have a well paid Job.

The crux of the matter is Preachers fleecing the sheep of GOD to get rich while neglecting the welfare of the Sheep. These preachers are hirelings.  

"The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep." John10:13

Secondly Tithing is not valid in the new testament for God loves a cheerful giver.

Anything that has to do with Compulsion or guilt trips is not of GOD. It is totally not in the nature of GOD. This is a man made doctrine initiated from the Roman Catholic church.

Lastly if at all Tithing were valid, it was money for the poor, widows and orphans, not for paying huge mortgages for mega building and church projects.

@ frosbel
Don't digress please
Whats your definition of prosperity according to bible standards

Hmmm

This word "Prosperity" seems to always turn up the heat whenever it is mentioned on the religion section of NL

My take is that there are numerous scriptures in the bible which testify that God wants us to prosper. However it will be narrow minded to relate "prosperity to money alone. Prosperity is encompassed by many things - physical, spiritual, mental, social and of course, financial.
It is also very important that we have to remember to not become greedy and to be contented with what is ours because we are always given what is due us by God.

It is also wise to acknowledge that God isn't ignorant to the fact that we live in this world and it takes money to survive on this earth (pay bills; buy food & clothing; pay for our children's education, help others, etc). The problems come when we crave after money believing that it will solve all of our problems and that it can buy genuine happiness which some mistake for pure joy.

frosbel:




We seem to be on the same PAGE coincidentally. Now I know where you care coming from.

There is nothing wrong with a Christian having millions, but it is his attitude to the money that is important in the eyes of GOD, A true Christian will see the money not as his , but as God's and just like you rightly said , he will be willing to distribute MONEY for the work of God and needs of the saints.


Anyway, the problem many of us here have is not individual Christians having good jobs or business, I for one have a well paid Job.

The crux of the matter is Preachers fleecing the sheep of GOD to get rich while neglecting the welfare of the Sheep. These preachers are hirelings.

"The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep." John10:13
Secondly Tithing is not valid in the new testament for God loves a cheerful giver.

Anything that has to do with Compulsion or guilt trips is not of GOD. It is totally not in the nature of GOD. This is a man made doctrine initiated from the Roman Catholic church.

Lastly if at all Tithing were valid, it was money for the poor, widows and orphans, not for paying huge mortgages for mega building and church projects.

A lot of Christians always quote Luke 18:24-25

When Jesus saw this, he said, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the Kingdom of God! In fact it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!

In the context of the quote above, what "riches" is Jesus refering to?

Luke 18:22
When Jesus heard his answer, he said,"There is still one thing you haven't done. SELL[/b] all your possessions and give the [b]MONEY to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, and follow me."

Answer = Possessions, Money.

The verses that follow is an area which most Christ do not include when quoting V24-25, sometimes leading to misinterpretation.

Luke 18:26- tell us that those who heard Jesus say Vs 24-25 said "THEN WHO IN THE WORLD CAN BE SAVED?" -- meaning everybody likes holding on to their possessions.

Luke 18:27
He(Jesus) replied, "What is impossible for people is possible with God,"

But just thinking about it, How many christians are ready to imitate St Peter who said in Luke 18:28: "We have left our homes to follow you."

That is the ulitmate scarfice.

Luke 18:29

"Yes," Jesus replied, "and I assure you that everyone who has given up HOUSE, WIFE, OR BROTHERS OR PARENTS OR CHILDREN, for the sake of the Kingdom of God, [color=#990000]will be repaid many times over in this life and will have eternal life in the world to come.[/color]

The reward will be both earthly and Heavenly. hmmm food of thought. (I have just noticed the earthly part )

@Yommyuk

The passage starting from 28 is :

28 Then Peter said, "We have given up our possessions and followed you."
29
He said to them, "Amen, I say to you, there is no one who has given up house or wife or brothers or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God
30
who will not receive (back) an overabundant return in this present age and eternal life in the age to come."

Jesus was not referring to material posessions when he said 'overabundant return'. If he was, the disciples will all have died billionaires, but they did not, did they ?

EarsWide:

@Yommyuk
The passage starting from 28 is :
28 Then Peter said, "We have given up our possessions and followed you."
29
He said to them, "Amen, I say to you, there is no one who has given up house or wife or brothers or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God
30
who will not receive (back) an overabundant return in this present age and eternal life in the age to come."
Jesus was not referring to material posessions when he said 'overabundant return'. If he was, the disciples will all have died billionaires, but they did not, did they ?

The interpretation of "Overabundant return" is not specific but broad. It is God who gives us our just reward. We sow what we reap. The returns can be Good health, Spiritual blessing, more wisdom, Financial, whatever.

If one decides that he/she wants to financially bless the Church, God may decide to bless such person in order to be a source of blessing for the gospel. Surely, not in all circumstances but it does happen.

I know of a man who had mental problems, and made a vow to God to re- build a church if he receives his healing. Back then in the early 80s, the church were he made that vow was built with bamboo sticks. That Church is in Odogbolu ,Ogun state . The man paid his vow by building a church made of marble. During the 1ST year anniversary of the church, the man paid for everything (menus, drinks, music). The man was and became more bless beyond measure.

The ways of the Lord, no one can comprehend.