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Stats: 2,800,275 members, 6,693,040 topics. Date: Wednesday, 26 January 2022 at 12:35 PM
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by LordTheus(m): 6:11am On May 21, 2021|
Tamaratonye1:Not Enough Capitalization Of Words
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by Dtruthspeaker: 8:33am On May 21, 2021|
In other words you can not out-reason me for my reasoning is plain and out there for all to see and examine and challenge.
But because you can not Reasonably Proceed after a bit of contention and Neither can you Cheat nor make Unlawful Manoeuvres, you were shocked that Suddenly you ran out of Valid Bullets meanwhile you are lying fatally wounded on the floor, with me standing over you and ready to shoot some more.
Meanwhile, you have run out of valid Ammo!
You atheist upheld good and proper thinking against those who call themselves Christians and they fell to your swords, So You have no Valid Right to Complain, now that it is being done to you!
You thought you could make me fall because of what I said but now it is you who fell and I still remain standing and waiting to be Validly and Correctly Challenged.
In school, teachers teach in "plain English" and if a child did not understand, HE ASKED QUESTIONS!
QUESTIONS CLEAR AMBIGUITY AND GIVE ACCURACY TO ANSWERS!
if you do not reveal the particulars of failure to understand, how do I address.
No Teacher will be happy to Repeat his Lecture all over again, especially me, I would never say anything different from what I have said earlier, so I directed specific questions to specific issues contained in my lecture.
They are not vague, they are very clear but because you Nigerians are Accustomed to "Spoon Feeding Teaching approach", which is "Manipulation of Soul aka Brain Washing", you therefore complain when you are taught to think for yourselves and think feeely
My students do that and always do it year in year out, but after my first lecture, they are surprised and amazed how free they are and how free they should be and how they have been in "Bonds" and "enslaved" to the thinkings done by others, as if they too do not have a Right to think Also.
Or that they too do not have a Right to Think and Come up with a Brilliant Idea also.
Or that they do not have a Right to Query what they have been thought, Exactly as you said, "Most atheists are skeptics, we question everything and do not take anything just because.
And now you really do not have questions, which is what you are Shocked about my responses
My Answers are Always "Think about this" and if you have any question, Ask"!
You have the Right to Think, so think and think properly.
I Freely make my Point and you get it, that is the point of communication. The pain you suffer from my points is because of the destruction of your former solid ground which you Truly thought was indestructible.
And they are destroyed because They Are Not True, as you Already Know that, that which is True, is Indestructible.
But you thought your ground was True, but now I have come to destroy it, and you complain because it is Truly Destroyed!
Shall I who advocate for people to think freely and properly, not do so to myself?
I was hell to my parents and teachers because I would not accept anything that is not properly established and explained exactly as they confidently taught me Additions, Subtractions etc which I Saw is True Everywhere, which later taught me a thing is True if you see it in Nature and Nature is Everywhere.
And not like the Lies of "Square Root" and co which I have never seen anywhere and no one else has seen it.
Truth is in Nature and it is Proven by Nature itself and Nature does not allow Lies to Stand, So there is No Standing Lie in Nature. None at All!
My Strength is in the Great Knowledge of Laws and Lawyers here ought to back me up for they know where the things i say come from but they fled, which I know is because they did not know and neither were we taught that the Practice of Law is "Work Directly From God's Own Office under His Eyes" which they real-eyes from my Answers and Presentation of Law.
And they real-eyes that they really do not want to work Near God, so they have all generally fled from religions discussions or even showing here that they are Lawyers.
But I have only one, Truespeak, A Lawyer too, but people like to think that she is me and that it is my alternate account, even when our approach to an issue is different and we land on the same floor but from different directions.
This Always happens when you stand on a Lie and it is broken from under your feet.
And I need to knock you down for you and all to know that the ground you stand on is a Lie and and that Truth has come to Break The Lie Away, as it Usually Does when it Comes.
So the "Win" belongs to Truth and to you for now, you know that you were standing on a Lie, which you ought to be happy with, exactly as when you are shown that the vehicle you are travelling with is about to go up in flames and you see the smoke rising out!
That's all I ask, "Do you own thinking and not some other persons remote control". Do your own thinking and make your own mistakes SO THAT YOU SEE THAT WHICH IS TRUE!
I believe that those who call themselves Christians are Truly Examining their Christianity because of Truth, which is why they are not available to argue with you because they would have 2 groups of opponents to fight against,
1) Satan and his many offices eg, Satanists, Atheists, JWs, Occults etc
2).Christ Followers who are keeping their eyes on Truth.
Instead of 1, Satan and his many many offices.
Do you remember you said up "Apparently "winning" is the aim here"!
So in the light of what you have said up here, you reasonably expect that "winning", which is Complete and Proper Defence of God should not be on the table? Yes, cunny man die, cunny man kill am! You try!
Also, Not one of you is able to validly out manoeuvre me or beat me, which none of you can never do because NO MATTER HOW STRONG A LIE IS, TRUTH WILL ALWAYS DASH IT TO PIECES!
And here arrives the Normal and Regular Insults of A Loser!
And here is the Fleeing Gifted Insult of A Satan-son as I told you "All Atheists are Simply Satan's Employees and Agent"
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by GodHead85: 8:36am On May 21, 2021|
^^^Look at him sucking his own diick. SMH
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by Dtruthspeaker: 8:50am On May 21, 2021|
Yet Everyone man, Every where in the world from the generation to generation, century to century, country to country, up till tomorrow, disregard, scorn, and a put women away from among their members, EVEN YOU DID THE SAME AND DO THE SAME AND WILL STILL DO SO TODAY AND TOMORROW, UNTIL YOU DIE!
So, you are just speaking emptiness and used the opportunity to hurl insults because of the Loss You Suffered at my hands!
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by Dtruthspeaker: 9:10am On May 21, 2021|
Exactly what Losers say to A Winner!
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by Dtruthspeaker: 11:34am On May 21, 2021|
And this what you do not understand!
Red Highlight: when you leave your house and come out to say "Gods are merely an idea, a complex concept" you raise it up for examination, comments, queries and challenge as the Op did, which is why you could legitimately challenging her on her post and her thread.
If she loved the opinion so much, she should not bring it "outside". But she does, it is liable to be challenged. For when a person offers their thing to the public, it must be A Good and True Thing! And not a wicked thing or Lies!
That is what God has Done Through The Law!
Green Highlight is your Nature Given Right which of course I am not challenging!
Did you not attempt to Use the Bible Against me?
Because of The Law, "You have the Natural Right to remain Silent, For Whatever you say shall and will be used Against you, Anywhere"
Ok, I missed that because I did not think you would rely on this statement "... I’m no motorhead but if I were considering such a costly investment, yes I would want details on production differences."
Which is a Filthy Lie because No One Purchases a Corrolla or Camry asking for "Factory and the Creation Process"!
Cartalk Section and I will call you a Liar for saying this and thinking to rely on it to make your point. We all purchase the cars on the individual merits of each car themselves. We do not care how much creation time was expended in making the car neither did we ever ask, as long as we know that it is coming from the Creator called, Toyota!
Thank you for the understanding and it is the pure exercise of your Nature Given Right to Freely Accept or Reject Anything at all!
Yeah! And it's opposite is True Dichotomy! Which my assertion Falls Under! I told you in the past that I wrote the Book on Logic Too!
Too Late! It is not my fault that you were not aware that "You have the Natural Right to remain Silent, For Whatever you say shall and will be used Against you, Anywhere", As You Yourself Do!
Again I am not at fault if you did not know "You have the Natural Right to remain Silent, For Whatever you say shall and will be used Against you, Anywhere" , As you yourself do!
Thereby proving the Truth of my statement that we are not talking about "vegetation" as you have clearly admitted but about the origin of man.
So you did not stick to the Issue!
Relitigation and Re-argument! You passed over your opportunity to present your case.
Secondly since you did not Counter-claim, you can not suddenly do so and make yourself "the defendant" now that I have finished defending myself and you could not establish your challenge.
So sit back and wait until the next time an opportunity arises for you to enter the defendant's box!
What do you think you were doing when you were given the names and dates and persons and countries and times of the Return of Israel to their place in line with the Prophecies?
M'lady, you unwittingly supplied the Evidence and Truth that the Prophecy was indeed Fulfilled!
it is you who supplied the Proofs, I just re-inforced them
Now you see that all you supplied was actually against you, so now you cry and complain
You should not have spoken or keep your statements extremely short, maybe you would never had helped me make my case in destruction of yours!
Thank God, Inspite of your effort to save yourself, you still said the Truth in the highlighted!
Any Statements that is not directly connected to the issue of contention will be and must be ignored by me!
You and your kind are the ones who are strongly biased and exercising your right to hold a snake rather than a phone, as is your right, as is your right and I do not challenge it unless and until you bring it out for public consumption.
Truth is exactly like the ground under feet, you do not support it, it is rather it that holds you up.
So I break the ground of lies you stand and we all see you fall and shout and curse while you fall!
I stand up and I stand out to be Tested and Verified BUT I must tested and verified ON THE ISSUE AND ON THE ISSUE ALONE.
CHANGE OF ISSUES AND RAISING NEW ISSUES AND DEPARTURES ARE NOT ALLOWED.
AND IF YOU BIASED GUYS STICK TO THE ISSUE AT HAND, YOU WILL ALL RUN OUT OF AMMO AND MUST SO RUN OUT, EXACTLY AS HAPPENED TO GODHEAD85 AND OTHERS WHO HAVE PROPERLY CONTENDED WITH ME, BECAUSEE YOU ARE LIARS AND BIASED.
YOU WILL SEE GOD IF YOU FOLLOWED THE ROAD OF TRUTH. BUT BECAUSE YOU DO NOT WANT TO SEE GOD, YOU GUYS MUST ALWAYS DEVIATE AND DEPART FROM THE ISSUE AT HAND OR RAISE FRESH ISSUES, SO THAT YOU CAN KEEP AWAY FROM ARRIVING AT THE PLACE WHERE TRUTH IS ESTABLISHED AND GOD IS SEEN!
THAT IS THE TRUE PROBLEM YOU HAVE WITH ME.
TRUTH, PURE UNDILUTED AND UNCORRUPTED TRUTH IS THE WAY TO GOD, IF YOU ARE TRULY SEEKING TO FIND GOD, WHICH YOU ARE NOT!
|Re: God Is Well-suited For A Rational Explanation For Creation by jamesid29(m): 1:36pm On May 21, 2021|
Tamaratonye1:For the life of me, I really can't tell what the joke is about or what was taken to be funny in my post. I'm genuinely lost.
Tamaratonye1:Firstly, I'll like to say none of us has complete knowledge. We all know in part.... The irony is, the more knowledge one gets, the more one gets to realise that there's so much more one doesn't know. At least that has been my experience and that of those I look up to.
So to the crust of the matter, I'm not sure if you mistook my mention of the Documentary Hypothesis to mean Deuteronomy(or that it's has something to do with it) because it's abit odd that you would switch from the crust of what I was pointing out to focus primarily on Deuteronomy.
Anyway I will work on the assumption that what you meant to ask on was the documentary hypothesis.
Sources for the hypothesis is really not hard to find online, as it was the leading hypothesis for the dating and authorship of the Pentateuch for over a century. A quick Google search should provide you with more than enough resources. Also you would hardly find any modern resource on the hypothesis which would not come with a section on its criticism and why its fallen out of favour in recent times.
Two quick resources that can help situate the field though are:
1) A Brief History of Old Testament Criticism: From Benedict Spinoza to Brevard Childs by Mark S. Gignilliat : The book is a quick overview of the major players and motif of higher criticism from pre Wellhausen and beyond without being overwhelming.
2)The Making of the Pentateuch
by R. N. Whybray: It's a pretty old book but it's still considered one of the exhaustive critique of the documentary hypothesis and it's application to the Pentateuch. Coupling this book with more modern resources would give you a more holistic understanding of higher criticism. It also would be a plus for you to read (I presume) since the author doesn't even take a scriptural or fundamental stand on the Pentateuch.
Anyway, regardless of whatever resources you use, I would like to still point out a couple of things.
Scholarly consensus doesn't mean much, especially when it comes to dating and source criticism.
There are very few smoking guns and most critical analysis are based on preconceived notions and assumptions. Like prof Rolf Rendtorff states
"We possess hardly any reliable criteria for dating pentateuchal literature. Every dating of the pentateuchal "sources" rests on purely hypothetical assumptions which only have any standing through the consensus of scholars.'"
So depending on the preconceived assumptions of the time, the same data can be interpreted one way or another and alot of times one chance archeological discovery can sweep away decades and even centuries of scholarly consensus(This has happened a couple of times even in recent memory).
Secondly, because of the fluidity of assumptions in critical studies, even sophisticated papers fall into what is called by some Pseudo-Historicism. You can read more on the ideas in Dr somers paper
Dating Pentateuchal Texts and the Perils of Pseudo-Historicism - Dr Benjamin Somer: https://www.academia.edu/attachments/25197929/download_file?s=portfolio
This should give you ideas on what to look out for when reading paper on for or against any particular position.
Tamaratonye1:A bit incorrect, but it's fine
Tamaratonye1:Actually quite alot of modern archaeological finds(the ones that make the papers and big screens) are usually accidental(luck basically)... Just wanted to point that out
Secondly, the narrative you wrote is very interesting(game of thrones type of interesting) but sadly it's largely incorrect and the geo-political landscape you posited is wrong.
Anyway it's fine.
Tamaratonye1:Ok so there's alot to unpack here and this is actually an interesting subject area.
First thing is, technically Asherah is a different deity from Ishtar. The cannanite equivalent to the mesopotamian Ishtar is technically Ashtoreth ... but then again, that's neither here nor there anyway.
As for the question of Yahweh and his Asherah in ancient Israelite worship, again things are a bit more complex. The brief gist is, of the 40 times Asherah is mentioned in the Bible, the overwhelming bulk of the time, the name appears with a definite article. Hebrew grammar works like English in the sense that personal names don't appear with the definite article in front of them.
This puts a question of whether Asherah is to be considered a who or a what (at least in ancient Israelite conception).
A very good book that dwells well into the ancient near Eastern understanding of God and gods is
"Dr Benjamin Somer- The Bodies of God and the World of Ancient Israel".... The book is not specifically about Ahshera but it gives the necessary background on how to understand the major motifs that deals with the arguments of how to understand the Yahweh and his Asherah debate.
Other authorities on the subject area are: Dr Erin Darby(her work is mainly on pillar figurines in ancient Israel) and Dr Judith Hadley( "the cult of Asherah in ancient Israel" ) .
You can find resources on both sides of the arguments easily online. I believe "Religion for breakfast" YouTube channel has a quick overview on the debate( Yahweh and his wife)... The channel is managed by an Agnostic scholar(I think) so it should be right up your wheelhouse I presume.
Finally, on the subject of Yahweh and his council, I'm guessing you are refering to the divine council and use of El in the Bible, specifically in Psalm 82 and Deuteronomy 32.
If you are not yet conversant with Dr Michael Heiser's work, I would like to suggest you check some of his works out. He's one of the leading figure on this particular subject area and he has written tons of material on it.
You can check https://drmsh.com/elohim-divine-council-psalm-82-ot-monotheism-archive/ for some of his material (both scholarly and for lay readers).
His book " The Unseen Realm" is also a highly acclaimed read that delves into the subject and how it fits into the larger biblical story.
Anyway, I think it's best to stop here. The idea(at least not mine) is not have drawn out conversation on the topic(wasn't even expecting it to be this long by now. Thought it was going to be a quick reply and all
Your narratives are pretty interesting but just that they are somewhat incorrect in critical areas or at the very least, interesting overspin what of the actual stories say.
Almost every one of us are guilty of this to varying degrees (both consciously and unconsciously) though so it's all good, I guess
In any case, it is well.
Asides from the other references above, I think you might find these more concrete resources useful.
1)The Face of Old Testament Studies: A Survey of Contemporary Approaches by David W. Baker.... it's an informed, well-balanced entry into the excitement of current studies."
2)Old Testament History – Dr. J. Robert Vannoy
https://biblicalelearning.org/old-testament/old-testament-history-vannoy/ .... University level introduction to the old testament history and historical criticism. The site also has many other good lecture series in biblical studies which might be worthwhile to check out.... Dr Walton's lecture series on Job might be worth your while
Both resources above come from Christian scholars but that doesn't affect their validity and balanced view IMHO.
Other interesting Notable Resources
1) Dr Heiser's podcast (" The Naked Bible Podcast" ) : Heiser interacts with alot of scholarly articles and materials on his podcast.It's a good place to get a feel of what the scholarly debates are on many of the fields in biblical studies and a place to find articles that would otherwise be hard to find or even know about except for someone in those circles. His book The Unseen Realm is also a good book to read as mentioned earlier
2) The Bible project YouTube videos (https://youtube.com/c/bibleproject ). A great resource to get condensed (very short 5-8minutes) videos of major biblical motifs and themes that are easy to watch but are well grounded in real biblical scholarship. The accompanying podcast series delve deeper into the videos and are very solid in my opinion (https://bibleproject.com/podcasts/the-bible-project-podcast/)
Another Notable Mention
1) Dominion - The making of the western mind by Tom Holland ... Tom is an Agnostic but is one of the best historians of classical and medieval history and his book is a great addition for anyone who wants to understand where our culture and values of today come from.
Anyway, for whatever it's worth, hope this helps.
Enjoy your weekend ma'am.
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