This might make you even happier:

http://www.php.net/ChangeLog-4.php
http://www.php.net/ChangeLog-5.php
http:///AfA3ul

delomos:

https://bugs.php.net/search.php?boolean=0&limit=30&order_by=id&direction=DESC&cmd=display&status=Open&bug_age=0&bug_updated=0&bug_type=Documentation+Problem

delomos:

This might make you even happier:

http://www.php.net/ChangeLog-4.php
http://www.php.net/ChangeLog-5.php
http:///AfA3ul

Mr Adedibu! Are these what you call design/technical specs?
Antelope go faint o!

@Beaf, this guy is going to die of oversabi/stupidity like his elder brother if he continues like this o.

*dhtml:

@Beaf, this guy is going to die of oversabi/stupidity like his elder brother if he continues like this o.

Lolz! Na wa o!
If I don't know something, I keep quiet or ask people. But some of di kain guys wen pesin de see nawadays na wa!
You would expect someone who doesn't know what a design spec is to use google at the very least, instead of insulting others.

Its like Judgement Day come early when a brother submits CakePHP and various bug reports as design specs. Lol! We cast and bind all demons! We cramp and paralyse Babylon!
Holy Ghost Fire! Holy Ghost Fire!! Holy Ghost Fire!!!

Beaf:

Lolz! Na wa o!
If I don't know something, I keep quiet or ask people. But some of di kain guys wen pesin de see nawadays na wa!
You would expect someone who doesn't know what a design spec is to use google at the very least, instead of insulting others.

Its like Judgement Day come early when a brother submits CakePHP and various bug reports as design specs. Lol! We cast and bind all demons! We cramp and paralyse Babylon!
Holy Ghost Fire! Holy Ghost Fire!! Holy Ghost Fire!!!

SMH , "Empty barrels and loud noises"

delomos:

Though @Beaf is a PHP novice as you rightly stated, I will slightly agree with him on this, Facebook actually does run on C++, and their many other services done with Erlang, Java, etc. HOWEVER, Facebook in-fact is compiling [legacy] PHP into Optimized C++ (code is written in PHP and compiled into C++) through a project they created called "HipHop for PHP" (https://github.com/facebook/hiphop-php).

I think the compiling part is where @Beaf got it wrong. Most of Facebook's code base is on the LAMP stack, web servicing on a large scale like FB, scaling is very difficult with dynamically-typed language, so they've developed a few of there own technologies to overcome the shortcoming (same argument holds for Google/Python).

I dont understand how you can justify the first bold part.
as far as i know facebook was developed with php. You can twist this anyhow you want to but wont change the fact that PHP is the primary language of facebook till date.

Case in point if you're browsing FB from a computer, you'd hardly notice any reference to php but on there mobile platform you'd notice their legacy .php?, littered everywhere.

thats not true, if you cant find the .php, then that is either a directory or apache's rewrite module at work
php litters everywhere.


What has a language being dynamically typed got to do with scaling up or out?
your application design in the early stage of development is all that matters.

I won't really argue on this one, I'd let you hear from the horse's mouth, this is a video of Mike Schroepfer (FB's VP of Engineering at MIT's EmTECH): https://www.technologyreview.com/emtech/videos/10/

And to understand the role PHP play's for FB, I'd let FB's lead engineer (Haiping Zhao), do the talking: http://terrychay.com/article/hiphop-for-faster-php.shtml

Hope that answers your questions.

delomos:

SMH ,    "Empty barrels and loud noises"

That would be you, sir.
Oga, Mr Barkin Zuwo; fools talk out of point, because they think loudness makes them look clever.

[size=14pt]Where are the PHP design docs or any standards for that matter?[/size]

Beaf:


[size=14pt]Where are the PHP design docs or any standards for that matter?[/size]

None. Happy? Now what's your point?

Now show me that of your favorite web programming language.

delomos:

None. Happy? Now what's your point?

Now show me that of your favorite web programming language.

[size=33pt]None?[/size]

No! Impossible!!

Choi! After writing volumes of "Adedibued BarkinZuwoisms?"
This will teach you not to argue like an id!ot next time.

Praise the Lord! Mr Adedibu finally agrees that PHP is cut and nail (just as he is). Wonderful!

Small pikin go wound wit laf o!

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

Here's specs for my favourite language.
You will understand many things you can't learn at Alaba market when you click on any of the links. In fact, it will be revealed to you why you and PHP are cut and nail. You will also understand why the mail classes in my "favourite web programming language" will never be phucked as is the case with what we are discussing with PHP's. My "favourite web programming language" is all planned right down to the last T.

Enjoy:

2002/2003
http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/files/ECMA-ST-WITHDRAWN/ECMA-334,%202nd%20edition,%20December%202002.pdf
www.techstreet.com/cgi-bin/pdf/free/378672/ISO+IEC+23270-2003.pdf">http://download.www.techstreet.com/cgi-bin/pdf/free/378672/ISO+IEC+23270-2003.pdf
http://download.microsoft.com/download/a/9/e/a9e229b9-fee5-4c3e-8476-917dee385062/CSharp%20Language%20Specification%20v1.0.doc
http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/e/5/5e58be0a-b02b-41ac-a4a3-7a22286214ff/csharp%20language%20specification%20v1.2.doc

2005/2006
http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/files/ECMA-ST/Ecma-334.pdf
http://standards.iso.org/ittf/PubliclyAvailableStandards/c042926_ISO_IEC_23270_2006(E).zip
http://download.microsoft.com/download/9/8/f/98fdf0c7-2bbd-40d3-9fd1-5a4159fa8044/csharp%202.0%20specification_sept_2005.doc

2007
http://download.microsoft.com/download/3/8/8/388e7205-bc10-4226-b2a8-75351c669b09/CSharp%20Language%20Specification.doc

2010
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=dfbf523c-f98c-4804-afbd-459e846b268e

Mr Barkin Zuwo:

Allow me to further rub it in your lil red eyes with the spec for Java:
http://java.sun.com/docs/books/jls/

. . .And the spec for Scala:
http://www.scala-lang.org/docu/files/ScalaReference.pdf

. . .And the spec for Ruby:
http://rubyspec.org/

. . .Sir, should I stop?

Where is the spec for PHP na?

Interesting name calling, now learn::

Beaf:


. . .And the spec for Ruby:
http://rubyspec.org/

. . .Sir, should I stop?

Where is the spec for PHP na?

No please don't, continuing digging your hole (I will especially like see the spec for Python and JavaScript) not that it matters to me

-- Ruby is not official spec'ed yet (as defined by ISO!) and most especially and there are strong sides of the argument why they should care less about getting that "blessing," follow the argument here: www.rubyinside.com/ruby-iso-spec-draft-2900.html

But I digress.

And another thing you want to understand is the politics of spec bodies, go research the chairs of those your spec bodies.

And why doesn't PHP have a spec, see this interesting stackOverflow thread: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4680119/php-language-specification

delomos:

Interesting name calling, now learn::

No please don't, continuing digging your hole (I will especially like see the spec for Python and JavaScript) not that it matters to me

-- Ruby is not official spec'ed yet (as defined by ISO!) and most especially and there are strong sides of the argument why they should care less about getting that "blessing," follow the argument here: www.rubyinside.com/ruby-iso-spec-draft-2900.html

But I digress.

And another thing you want to understand is the politics of spec bodies, go research the chairs of those your spec bodies.

And why doesn't PHP have a spec, see this interesting stackOverflow thread: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4680119/php-language-specification

You are damn stup!d indeed! Someone who thinks that arguing loudly like a pumped up rat catcher can cover rank id!ocy. Sir, such behaviour only qualifies you as an agbero (like Adedibu ).
I thought you claimed that PHP's spec was Symfony or Zend or Zend Community or CakePHP or PHP Build (for "serious developers who aren't whining on debugging a PHP Mailer, wtf?"). No? SPECK?

You are one highly entertaining mofo. Like one of those toys with a key at the back; you wind it up and it start limping pathetically and singing an unknown version of "ba ba black sheep."

Next time you don't have a clue. Do yourself a favour and SHUT THE PHUCK UP!

Every jack knows that JavaScript is governed by the design of EcmaScript. By the way, you will find the spec here:
http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/files/ECMA-ST/Ecma-262.pdf

The below is a great definition of what a spec is. You will find that it does not include shiit like Symfony or Zend or Zend Community or CakePHP or PHP Build (for "serious developers who aren't whining on debugging a PHP Mailer, wtf?")

Unu go take laugh broke small pikin waist o!

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

A specification (often abbreviated as spec) is an explicit set of requirements to be satisfied by a material, product, or service.[1][better source needed] Should a material, product or service fail to meet one or more of the applicable specifications, it may be referred to as being out of specification;[2] the abbreviation OOS may also be used.[3] Specs are a type of technical standard.

A technical specification may be developed by any of various kinds of organizations, both public and private. Example organization types include a corporation, a consortium (a small group of corporations), a trade association (an industry-wide group of corporations), a national government (including its military, regulatory agencies, and national laboratories and institutes), a professional association (society), or a purpose-made standards organization such as ISO. It is common for one organization to refer to (reference, call out, cite) the standards of another. Voluntary standards may become mandatory if adopted by a government or business contract.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specification_%28technical_standard%29

^
Why all the long talk, why sound like a farmer blagging about code na?

You said PHP is not cut and nail, and I have challenged you to prove it isn't a hack bundle by providing its standards. . . But mbanu! You have decided to apply the trick of chatting copious volumes of shiit instead.

By the way, concerning JavaScript, when you have finished telling lies to yourself and other unevolved, you can look up ECMA-262. LOLLLLLLLLZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!

Instead of trying to run away by chatting shiit about how "politics" can stop the inventors of a language from creating standards (that would stop simple things like mail functions in the core library phucking up); why not be a man and admit that you are a fuckwit who blags like a 419? Dude, only an id!ot would think they can get away with blagging about technical stuff.

Adedibu.

Beaf:

^
Why all the long talk, why sound like a farmer blagging about code na?

You said PHP is not cut and nail, and I have challenged you to prove it isn't a hack bundle by providing its standards. . . But mbanu! You have decided to apply the trick of chatting copious volumes of shiit instead.

By the way, concerning JavaScript, when you have finished telling lies to yourself and other unevolved, you can look up ECMA-262. LOLLLLLLLLZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!

Instead of trying to run away by chatting shiit about how "politics" can stop the inventors of a language from creating standards ,

Adedibu.

I'm actually a farmer, great job figuring that out and I weed out thorns like you -- no room for ignoramuses anywhere near my field, or my language of choice in fact.


There are a few influential language in the web today, Javascript, PHP, Python,  and  Ruby (if you're no. Clearly, a language that doesn't have a spec is cut and nail, OK. Apart from that being a demented logic, just like you are --

Applauds. You  produced RubySpec (which is not a standards yet, it's only a draft but I'd grant you that), [size=14pt]produce a link like you did Ruby,  for Javascript (No! I will not look-up ECMA-262, it's not spec'ing JS explicitly) and Python![/size].

Beaf:
In fact, it will be revealed to you why you and PHP are cut and nail. You will also understand why the mail classes in my "favourite web programming language" will never be phucked as is the case with what we are discussing with PHP's. My "favourite web programming language" is all planned right down to the last T.

Point of correction.
PHP's mail classes does not send emails, it only interfaces with whatever email server software you installed on your machine (linux or windows)
could be postfix, sendmail etc. this you will need to set in you php.ini file

if you dont have these email server softwares properly configured, regardless of the language you are coding with, no email will be sent.
Since php accounts for the largest of script generated emails, and email providers like hotmail, gmail and aol have taken strict measures against these kind of emails, hence the need to properly dot your Is and cross every Ts while setting headers before sending emails from PHP.


emails are never actually sent by php or perl or python except its an smtp server written in any of these langauges.

Fayimora:

OK so when is all this gonna stop? I am gonna have to lock this thread if it doesn't. C'mmon guys!!!

Me I just dey do jeje o, I generally wouldn't even respond at all, but @Beaf's ignorance in thinking that being loud, or name calling or anything is a logical approach to making an argument against a langauge.

If you don't understand a language's strength or idioms, it's ok. But don't go ahead saying everyone should ignore it.

That said, @webdezzi made an interesting point, (and it illustrates my point as above, understanding how a language approaches solving a problem is more important than ____ ) ,

webdezzi:

,
emails are never actually sent by php or perl or python except its an smtp server written in any of these languages.

webdezzi:

Point of correction.
PHP's mail classes does not send emails, it only interfaces with whatever email server software you installed on your machine (linux or windows)
could be postfix, sendmail etc. this you will need to set in you php.ini file

if you dont have these email server softwares properly configured, regardless of the language you are coding with, no email will be sent.
Since php accounts for the largest of script generated emails, and email providers like hotmail, gmail and aol have taken strict measures against these kind of emails, hence the need to properly dot your Is and cross every Ts while setting headers before sending emails from PHP.


emails are never actually sent by php or perl or python except its an smtp server written in any of these langauges.

Lol!
The way, the bolded is funny stuff indeed! What do you expect from cut and join?

Pointing out that the mail() function is a layer between your code and the SMTP server is an incredible dodge! lol!
Lbraries in other languages just happen to tell you what is happening in easily trappable errors and return values. But I guess these ones are SMTP servers, thats why they are better?
PHP's cut and join nature means you are likely to see hallucinations of Beelzebub just trying to send a simple email. That has absolutely nothing to do with whether it is an SMTP server, rather it is 100% due to rotten code, hacks and zero standards.

It is a breeze to send emails with total control from other languages, because they are thoroughly tested, structured and standardised and well written. Indeed functions in most languages are structured along strong inheritance routes that strongly enforse adherence to a pre-decided and well thought out set of contracts.

The cut and nail nature of PHP shows up where errors are trappable in some functions, yet in others like mail() you need to employ voodoo. The simple reason is a lack of standards and zero testing; there is is no standard way of writing functions to go into the main library and no standard way of vetting what goes into the library. Its anything goes (fuckry or not).

Cut and join.

@Barkin Zuwo
You are hilarious! JavaScript uses the ECMA-262 standard just like Mono C# and .NET C# use C#'s ECMA and ISO standards. Why argue about stuff you don't know?

Beaf:

Lol!
The way, the bolded is funny stuff indeed! What do you expect from cut and join?

Pointing out that the mail() function is a layer between your code and the SMTP server is an incredible dodge! lol!
Lbraries in other languages just happen to tell you what is happening in easily trappable errors and return values. But I guess these ones are SMTP servers, thats why they are better?
PHP's cut and join nature means you are likely to see hallucinations of Beelzebub just trying to send a simple email. That has absolutely nothing to do with whether it is an SMTP server, rather it is 100% due to rotten code, hacks and zero standards.

It is a breeze to send emails with total control from other languages, because they are thoroughly tested, structured and standardised and well written. Indeed functions in most languages are structured along strong inheritance routes that strongly enforse adherence to a pre-decided and well thought out set of contracts.

The cut and nail nature of PHP shows up where errors are trappable in some functions, yet in others like mail() you need to employ voodoo. The simple reason is a lack of standards and zero testing; there is is no standard way of writing functions to go into the main library and no standard way of vetting what goes into the library. Its anything goes (fuckry or not).

Cut and join.

@Barkin Zuwo
You are hilarious! JavaScript uses the ECMA-262 standard just like Mono C# and .NET C# use C#'s ECMA and ISO standards. Why argue about stuff you don't know?

so, does the winner of this argument get any cake?? Cos I have seen lotsa cakes mentioned in this thread

I wish I should just stop as promised by, but boy, I don't want people running into this thread and reading @beaf bu11sh3t  -- my god!!

You want to learn the right way to send mail in PHP: http://www.php.net/manual/en/book.mail.php. Simple. If that doesn't do it for you, go use your super sweet language or heck create yours (which is likely since you're all mouth).

And,

Beaf:

JavaScript uses the ECMA-262 standard just like Mono C# and .NET C# use C#'s ECMA and ISO standards.

[size=18pt]Not a problem, Provide me a link for JavaScript and Python's like you did for RubySpec. Otherwise revert your line of argument that a a language without official DS is cut and nail. And prevent me from ripping it apart.[/size]

This delomos guy is getting worse by the day - and these are PHP pros he is talking to like this.
@Beaf, i said it, he is going to die of ignorance and stoopidity - in this day and age of internet, really sad. Webdezzi, make we leave am alone
o jare - it is too late to save him.

*dhtml:

This delomos guy is getting worse by the day - and these are PHP pros he is talking to like this.
@Beaf, i said it, he is going to die of ignorance and stoopidity - in this day and age of internet, really sad. Webdezzi, make we leave am alone
o jare - it is too late to save him.

*chuckle, PHP pros indeed* :: On a slightly related note: http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/jayz/takeover.html (hint: last verse)

lordZOUGA:

so, does the winner of this argument get any cake?? Cos I have seen lotsa cakes mentioned in this thread

I think CakePHP is in order!

*dhtml:

This delomos guy is getting worse by the day - and these are PHP pros he is talking to like this.
@Beaf, i said it, he is going to die of ignorance and stoopidity - in this day and age of internet, really sad. Webdezzi, make we leave am alone
o jare - it is too late to save him.

Lol! Such entertainment is rare, seeing a grown man talk bullshiit with confidence. Imagine CakePHP as a design spec or standard?
He thinks he is with his shoemaker at Ojuelegba where he can talk abominable crap and be hailed for it.
As they say; "if monkey tink say im smart, na because tree near tree."

Fayimora:

OK so when is all this gonna stop? I am gonna have to lock this thread if it doesn't. C'mmon guys!!!

Abeg, no fex jare! We will tone it down.
There will be a lot of devs just starting out to whom discussions like this will be important.

Fayimora:

OK so when is all this gonna stop? I am gonna have to lock this thread if it doesn't. C'mmon guys!!!

Mister Moderator, threatening to close the thread - well, it is your call. As one of the kings of thread derailment on nairaland, i have one policy - make sure i have helped the poster first before derailment - and i did my best. The only one i cant help is delomos (because dat brother is already gone).