I just had my first gss coure on philosophy nd d lecturer was lyk 'wat makes u tink God exists?'. The guy rili contradicted our views. He told us dat we all agree dat we r made in d likeness of God, nd dat hw is it possible dat we r not perfect nd he is perfect. Though he gave us many contradictory reasons, i can only rememba this. Do u tink God rili exist or accordin to our lecturer 'God is a concept developed by d hopeless'
pls drop ur views on this

fooooooooooooooooooooooool

Vivly: I just had my first gss coure on philosophy nd d lecturer was lyk 'wat makes u tink God exists?'. The guy rili contradicted our views. He told us dat we all agree dat we r made in d likeness of God, nd dat hw is it possible dat we r not perfect nd he is perfect. Though he gave us many contradictory reasons, i can only rememba this. Do u tink God rili exist or accordin to our lecturer 'God is a concept developed by d hopeless'
pls drop ur views on this

It all starts with you. You have to ask yourself questions like

What or who is a god?
Why do I think or believe that there is a god?
How many gods do people believe in?
Why do I believe in my god?
Why don't I believe in other gods?
Why do I refer to some gods as mythological characters but mine is not even though they share the same characteristics?
Why don't we worship the old gods?
How did I come to believe in my god?
Do reality justify my beliefs or contradict them?
What is the history of my religion?

These should get you going.....

@Vivly,
do you really want to know why a free thinking agnostic like me rejected the idea of God propounded by religions (either Christianity or Islam)?

1. God (if he exists) hides himself from mankind. why is it that it is religions and holy books who has to describe him and defend him (in the case of Islam, fight and kill for him) every time. it shouldn't cost an almighty anything to manifest his existence to unbelievers in a convincing way to dispel honest doubts, believe me, all of us atheists and agnostics will switch camp quickly if he does this. the fact that he hides behind ancient religions and holy books is a valid reason to question his existence.

2. If god is all powerful as stated in the holy books, and he created the world all by himself as a perfect god, then why do earthquakes, tsunamis and tornados and other natural disasters kill and maim thousands yearly? An all powerful being would surely be able to harness the earth that he created and make it work perfectly like a good manufacturer would have done with his gadget. for me this a valid reason to question his existence

3. every religion claim they have the true God. Which of all their Gods does not exist? can you prove Allah or Jehovah or Vishnu or Obatala or Thor or Zeus is the fake or real. Numerous religions, numerous powerful beings but which is real? If god existed it is reasonable to believe that he would be the ONLY ONE we would worship. There would be no other religion or entity. an almighty should be able to prevent his identity theft and spare us the pain of trying to determine his existence.

4. The basis of any religion (thus the belief of God's existence) is that you must believe something someone else tells you is true, even though your mind tells you might be untrue and it makes no sense. it is only a brainwashed mind that will accept this form of knowledge, which is incidentally how we know that god exists

5. outside of the mind of religionists, i personally have not found god anywhere else, Allah only exists in the mind of muslims, Jehovah exists only in the mind of Christians etc etc

6. most of the phenomena we are attributing to god is now being explained rationally. e.g. our fore fathers believed diseases was caused by the gods, now we know that it just germs, so we can conclude that every strange phenomenon we attribute as god's works today will one day be explained rationally by man,

7. The bible and the quran contains so many internal contradictions and irrational claims that only a mind that has been brainwashed from childhood can believe these without questioning. i have studied both and i know very well what I'm saying. i will gladly show you the contradictions and irrational claims if you want to see.

8. i found out personnally that the major reasons religionists believe their holy book is due to the fear of eternal hell if they dare to question the holy books statement (e.g. christians MUST believe Jesus is the only Lord and Saviour or they go to hell forever; muslims MUST believe Mohammed is the messenger of God or they burn forever in hell fire etc etc). The simple truth is, if you remove eternal punishment from religions, nobody will believe their fairy tales and irrational claims. but as a free thinking agnostic and as well as other atheists, i have freed my mind from this fear of hell and afterlife, so i dont need to believe the holy books out of fear.

9. there are many many more reasons but i think you should understand by now why some of us reject the God Hypothesis proposed by religions.

First of all which “God” was the subject of the discussion would be my first question. There are many personalities of that in which one calls “God” and if we are to attach much realness on a specific “God” what criteria is that based on?

It appears that the “God” under discussion was the one the bible alludes to due to certain references that was made i.e. perfect, likeness of God etc...
But then one may even argue that maybe this biblical “God” is a counterfeit, a ruse...or perhaps “God” isn’t even "perfect" etc...and if there was a one true “God” this entity may not even be the biblical one.

Also there is also another angle to this question...”Does God exist?...Well Vivly, the fact that we are even discussing the concept already renders “God” some existence if not literal.

However I think you shouldn’t worry about it too much just enjoy your classes lol. I think your lecturer only wanted to expand your minds as to what you’ve been introduced to and get you and your peers to start asking questions which isn’t a bad thing in itself.

As per the question...I think you shouldn’t allow another to answer that question for you...we are all going to give differing answers so how will that alleviate your confusion? I believe the conclusion is for you alone to make. Don’t grant another the ownership over what you should believe or don't believe in else you may end up dependent on the one who determines what your conclusion should be.

Tanks a million guys. Bt wait, is it dat there are no atheists in UK? They believe in God. They mention God in deir national anthem. Wat abt miracles. If u dnt blive in God, wat abt miracles?

Vivly: Tanks a million guys. Bt wait, is it dat there are no atheists in UK? They believe in God. They mention God in deir national anthem. Wat abt miracles. If u dnt blive in God, wat abt miracles?

There are atheists in the UK. Some believe in God, others don't.
That depends on what you would consider to be a miracle.

Aka God of Gaps.

Vivly: Tanks a million guys. Bt wait, is it dat there are no atheists in UK? They believe in God. They mention God in deir national anthem. Wat abt miracles. If u dnt blive in God, wat abt miracles?

sister Vivly, pls note that I'm not trying to change your belief system, i'm just trying to let you understand why some of us refuse to acknowledge god's existence.

Can you clarify what defines a miracle, or how to prove something is a miracle. In a way the sentence itself follows a false premise. Miracles, defined as an act of God or something that can only be explained by a higher power, can only exist for people who believe in God. For people who don't believe in God, a miracle is defined as something very unlikely to occur.

Miracles are a completely subjective concept, two people can witness the exact same thing and one can walk away calling it a 'divine' miracle while the other will walk away calling it an 'unlikely event' miracle. The most common arguments you hear in favor of 'divine' miracles are, "because I know/believe they exist, how else could something happen, just look around they are everywhere". Again, these are completely subjective opinions. The only way to prove anything is to scientifically test it. Miracles, God, and faith can never be proven per se, not in the empirical sense, they can only be true to those who believe in them.

Unfortunately for the religious, almost all miracles by popular pastors and other religious leaders have been shown to be either hoaxes or naturally occurring phenomona, and the ones that haven't are either based on very dubious claims, or are only "miracles' by the loosest definition.

There are no real miracles! This does not disprove god, in my opinion, but it does negate claims of evidence by religionists (Christians and Muslims).


Vivly, have you personally witnessed a miracle for yourself with your very own eyes.

I happen to live in port harcourt whr i get to hear all sorts of miracles happenin. Personally av xperienced just one. An acclaimed man of God came to our church for deliverance sessions, brought out a girl, said she has a demon inside her given to her by her grandma, prayed for her nd the miracle part of it is dat she gave birth to an egg ie d demon. It was so real. We all saw d egg come out of her private part.

Ps. D woman isnt our church member so maybe she is in collaboration wit.... I dont want to judge pls

Vivly: I happen to live in port harcourt whr i get to hear all sorts of miracles happenin. Personally av xperienced just one. An acclaimed man of God came to our church for deliverance sessions, brought out a girl, said she has a demon inside her given to her by her grandma, prayed for her nd the miracle part of it is dat she gave birth to an egg ie d demon. It was so real. We all saw d egg come out of her private part.

Ps. D woman isnt our church member so maybe she is in collaboration wit.... I dont want to judge pls

Really? That's a miracle!! So he couldn't have paid the girl to hide a boiled egg in a v@gina?

An example of a miracle would have been a unicorn bursting forth out her v@gina singing, "Welcome to the Jungle"

Vivly: I just had my first gss coure on philosophy nd d lecturer was lyk 'wat makes u tink God exists?'. The guy rili contradicted our views. He told us dat we all agree dat we r made in d likeness of God, nd dat hw is it possible dat we r not perfect nd he is perfect. Though he gave us many contradictory reasons, i can only rememba this. Do u tink God rili exist or accordin to our lecturer[b][b/] 'God is a concept developed by d hopeless'[b][b/]
pls drop ur views on this

'
God is a concept developed by the hopeless' and then exploited by con-artists to dupe billions of people all over the world. They call it RELIGION.
I was almost a fanatic muslim. I tell ya. My fate would have been sealed if I had partook in a Dusk till dawn jihad I narrowly missed. How angry I was at myself.
Fast forward into medical school, I discovered all my 'miracles' were logically impossible. Into research, FAKE-ABLE. Well, plenty water don pass under bridge. There is nothing like an omni-everything God concerned about you. That God does NOT exist.

Vivly: I just had my first gss coure on philosophy nd d lecturer was lyk 'wat makes u tink God exists?'. The guy rili contradicted our views. He told us dat we all agree dat we r made in d likeness of God, nd dat hw is it possible dat we r not perfect nd he is perfect. Though he gave us many contradictory reasons, i can only rememba this. Do u tink God rili exist or accordin to our lecturer 'God is a concept developed by d hopeless'
pls drop ur views on this

All religious god are man made whose origin can be traced if you take your time to research history. Religion is meant for people that lack the will to think critically for themselves. There is not a single evidence that any of the gods out there exist except quotes from holy books written by man.

@ OP, so what's your own opinion?

It seems topics like this help atheist to further convince and remind themselves of "god's" non existence. This topic is still dead even as it started. Ok lets conclude atheist! There is no god! Satisfied now?

I comment my reserve...(***yawns nd takes a deep breath***)

mentorx4u: I comment my reserve...(***yawns nd takes a deep breath***)

seconded

hisblud: It seems topics like this help atheist to further convince and remind themselves of "god's" non existence. This topic is still dead even as it started. Ok lets conclude atheist! There is no god! Satisfied now?

Since you probably didn't read, the author has the same sky daddy as you. Don't worry, sky daddy wants you to ask questions.

Vivly: I happen to live in port harcourt whr i get to hear all sorts of miracles happenin. Personally av xperienced just one. An acclaimed man of God came to our church for deliverance sessions, brought out a girl, said she has a demon inside her given to her by her grandma, prayed for her nd the miracle part of it is dat she gave birth to an egg ie d demon. It was so real. We all saw d egg come out of her private part.

Ps. D woman isnt our church member so maybe she is in collaboration wit.... I dont want to judge pls

Satisfied now?

Martian:

An example of a miracle would have been a unicorn bursting forth out her v@gina singing, "Welcome to the Jungle"

No, this is an example of you offering most puerile caricatures of things.

An example of a miracle will be if it ever occurs to Martian to stop making caricatures of things. Now, that willindeed be a miracle.

Martian:

It all starts with you. You have to ask yourself questions like

What or who is a god?
Why do I think or believe that there is a god?
How many gods do people believe in?
Why do I believe in my god?
Why don't I believe in other gods?
Why do I refer to some gods as mythological characters but mine is not even though they share the same characteristics?
Why don't we worship the old gods?
How did I come to believe in my god?
Do reality justify my beliefs or contradict them?
What is the history of my religion?

These should get you going.....

These are excellent questions whch every person should undertake to ask himself and also meditate honestly on.

Deep Sight:
No, this is an example of you offering most puerile caricatures of things.

An example of a miracle will be if it ever occurs to Martian to stop making caricatures of things. Now, that willindeed be a miracle.

I like my example better, so you can shove your opinion up your a$$. If a miracle occurs, it would involve a singing unicorn, a vagin@ and the oneness of infinity.

Vivly: I happen to live in port harcourt whr i get to hear all sorts of miracles happenin. Personally av xperienced just one. An acclaimed man of God came to our church for deliverance sessions, brought out a girl, said she has a demon inside her given to her by her grandma, prayed for her nd the miracle part of it is dat she gave birth to an egg ie d demon. It was so real. We all saw d egg come out of her private part.

Ps. D woman isnt our church member so maybe she is in collaboration wit.... I dont want to judge pls

If she is collaborating with the pastor or prophet or whatever the guy calls himself, don't you owe it to yourself to be skeptical about this so-called miracle?

Martian:

I like my example better, so you can shove your opinion up your a$$. If a miracle occurs, it would involve a singing unicorn, a vagin@ and the oneness of infinity.

Your example is id.iotic. I expected you to laugh it off as a joke. If you present it seriously as that which is expected of a miracle, then you are most unserious. Not to mention hollow-minded.

thehomer:
If she is collaborating with the pastor or prophet or whatever the guy calls himself, don't you owe it to yourself to be skeptical about this so-called miracle?

Sure!

BUT if she is NOT collaborating with the pastor or prophet or whatever the guy calls himself, and this happened as a result of supernatural forces, don't you owe it to yourself to be optimistic about this so-called miracle?

italo:

Sure!

BUT if she is NOT collaborating with the pastor or prophet or whatever the guy calls himself, and this happened as a result of supernatural forces, don't you owe it to yourself to be optimistic about this so-called miracle?

so what if a muslim imam perform this "miracle". will you believe his claims, which includes God have no son. do you owe it to yourself to be optimistic about this miracle

Deep Sight:
Your example is id.iotic. I expected you to laugh it off as a joke. If you present it seriously as that which is expected of a miracle, then you are most unserious. Not to mention hollow-minded.

Lol, awww. My example of miracles doesn't tally with your sensibilities. Unfortunately for you, there is no objective standard for judging a miracle so I'll stick with the singing unicorn coming out of a vagin@, with the oneness of infinity playing the banjo while ancient aliens dance. If you don't agree with my vagin@ unicorn, I know you agree with ancient aliens and your oneness of infinity.

One question, do you believe in miracles? And what in your esteemed deepness of thought is a miracle if you disagree with my unicorn? Lol

^^^^ Ride on. Jokes will get you everywhere. . . . . .

Deep Sight: ^^^^ Ride on. Jokes will get you everywhere. . . . . .

Lol, just because you're a superstitious person who thinks miracles exist doesn't mean I am. So i will joke about it and your silly rhetoric.

Maybe miracles involve "non physical things".

Martian:

Lol, just because you're a superstitious person who thinks miracles exist doesn't mean I am. So i will joke about it and your silly rhetoric.

Maybe miracles involve "non physical things".

As I recall it, you asked me for examples and it appeared that you acceded that some of those things I mentioned are indeed non-physical.

Will you deny this?

Besides, was there anything "miraculous" about the things I mentioned?

Deep Sight:

As I recall it, you asked me for examples and it appeared that you acceded that some of those things I mentioned are indeed non-physical.

Will you deny this?

Besides, was there anything "miraculous" about the things I mentioned?

I never agreed with your examples. You wrote your usual baseless assertions, then added the things that originate in the brain like ideas and emotions, then you left and never explained how they were the, " agglomeration of non physical things that make up reality" or how they explained the "spiritual". Your explanations won't make sense anyway, so don't bother.

There is nothing " miraculous" about anything. You just get sensitive over your ideas when no one agrees with you.

^^^^ Its simple ol boy. Just address those things that I listed and show me where they have scientifically defined properties of matter.

Mind you - the things themselves - and not that which we use to perceive them.

Otherwise tell me they dont exist at all.

Wrap your head around that and revert to me.

It depends on what miracles are seen as either impossibilities or rare odds.