₦airaland Forum

Beaf: Interesting.
Oghene is Almighty God in Isoko and Urhobo.

Oghene is an ancient King/god. we in Benin acknowledged him too.

PhysicsQED: I don't think so. It seems pretty clear that it's Yoruba.

Not to me, do you know of any Oba that predates Eweka1

jason123: Thanks for the reply. Okay, forget the olokun stuff. What about the rest? "Iyoba"? What does it mean in Bini? Even the Olokun, what does it mean in Bini?
With my little Yoruba, I can tell that Iyoba means mother of the king and Olokun mean owner or dweller of the ocean. These are the literal meanings in Yoruba. Can I know the literal meaning in Bini?

The meaning are the same in benin, Iyobe= mother of the Oba, Iyewen= my mother.

jason123: PhysicsQED and Arosa, I have always been of the opinion that the Bini empire was great and Bini and Oyo were[b] independent but intertwined empires[/b]. Also, the Oba of Bini's story is more believable than the Oduduwa story. Nevertheless, I'll appreciate it if you can answer these questions:


1) If Oduduwa was Bini, how come the Oba of Binis' heads were buried in Ile-Ife?
2) If Oduduwa was Bini, how come the Bini's adopted Yoruba named gods like Ogun, Olokun etc and not the other way round? Even to the extent of calling the mother of the Oba, "Iyoba"?
3) How come the throne is now called Oba not Ogiso?!


Thanks in advance!

Plus the first Oba in the entire Benin/Yoruba history is Oba Eweka the first. Before him there was nobody with the title OBA.

jason123: PhysicsQED and Arosa, I have always been of the opinion that the Bini empire was great and Bini and Oyo were[b] independent but intertwined empires[/b]. Also, the Oba of Bini's story is more believable than the Oduduwa story. Nevertheless, I'll appreciate it if you can answer these questions:


1) If Oduduwa was Bini, how come the Oba of Binis' heads were buried in Ile-Ife?
2) If Oduduwa was Bini, how come the Bini's adopted Yoruba named gods like Ogun, Olokun etc and not the other way round? Even to the extent of calling the mother of the Oba, "Iyoba"?
3) How come the throne is now called Oba not Ogiso?!


Thanks in advance!

1)Oduduwa was already a king in Ile'ife and had established his own dynasty there. His Children ancestral home was Ile'ife. also the heads that you are talking about are not real head they are works of art by Benin crafts men.
2)I never knew those gods where/are Yoruba. So Olokun is a Yoruba name?
3)whenever there is a new dynasty the title of the king changes.

PhysicsQED: They were describing one of the turrets/towers of the roof of the palace that had a pyramidal kind of shape. Using pyramidal shapes is not exclusive to or somehow indicative of Egypianness.

Beaf: Thats a description of the Oba's palace the whites met (destroyed with the Benin massacre). It was a building with a tiled roof topped with a copper eagle. It also had a copper snake running down from the roof.

Ok noted. but my research is not finished yet, more to come.

PhysicsQED: You can't be serious.

The Edo are not any kind of Egyptian and the culture is not Egyptian.

I'am just doing my own research, I may be wrong, who knows.

When the Europeans came to Benin, in one of the descriptions they gave of Benin, they said they saw a mini pyramid with a snake on it. I am going to google it, to see if I can find the image.

The edo and Egyptian link,

God, Benin call their God Osa; There is an Egyptian God/pharaoh called Osiris

See the similarity between the Oba crown and Osiris crown.

shymmex: I personally believe the history of Ibini is filled with a lot of half-truths, and innuendos. I'd rather believe the assertion that Yorubas came from somewhere in the far east, than believe the Ibini version of history... If Ibini created the monarchy system in Ife - then, Ife should be the one paying tributaries to Ibini - and not the other way round (as Eko used to do). And the Oba of Lagos saying, he believes the Ibini story - shows why his Kingdom is only little Lagos Island, and probably other Aworilands in Lagos - we the Ijebus in Lagos, see Awujale as our King, and Ijebu Ode as our capital. The Obaship of Eko is just political - his control starts and ends on Lagos Island (no disrespect to the Oba).

The well respected professor emeritus, Prof. Ade Ajayi (arguably the greatest historian of Nigerian descent) already set the records straight - and the Oba of Benin should know better, rather than politicize everything.

I also think Ibini history is overrated!! How can you conquer Eko - yet went through Ijebu land, but never deem it right to conquer us along the way?? It shows that the story of Ibini conquering Eko has a lot of half-truths in the mix....

The exact nature of the political and military engagements among these states is unclear; oral histories collected from the courts of Owo, Ijebu, and Benin provide divergent commentaries on this subject. While Benin claims to have placed Ijebu under its dominion during the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, Ijebu's own traditions dispute this. By the seventeenth century, Benin controlled the coast from the southern Niger Delta to at least the eastern edge of Ijebu's territory, but it is unclear what political influence the Edo court had upon the Ijebu heartland in the interior. Owo, Benin's neighbor to the northwest, appears to have intermittently found itself under the suzerainty of the obas. Given the Edo origins of many aspects of Owo's courtly culture, it is clear that the diplomatic relationship between the two kingdoms was intimate, and not entirely equitable: royal Edo histories speak of Osogboye, the sixteenth-century ruler of Owo who visited the Benin court to adopt highly prestigious forms of Edo courtly culture. Not surprisingly, this version of events is contested by Owo historians, who assert that Osogboye traveled to Benin to learn military techniques that would better protect his kingdom from Edo aggression. Altogether, these conflicting historical perspectives suggest that the similarities which exist between the Yoruba states and their Edo counterpart can be attributed to a combination of factors: the forcible influence of Benin, the assertion of common origins at Ife, and the desire of less powerful kingdoms to strengthen themselves and enrich their status by incorporating the traditions of their adversary.

bayooooooo: Of course, if oral history claimed that Oduduwa children founded empires, I don't expect the empires to predate Oduduwa.
But my contention is that at a point in time, both empires existed side by side without documented hostilities or wars.

Well Oyo empire rose when the Benin empire was falling. that hits at something don't you think.

cogitoErgo: @Arosa, Izoduwa, according to the above article acquired the title of Ooni, meaning there was an Ooni b4 him, but the article said that Izoduwa is the same as Oduduwa! Which according to any known Yoruba oral history, known to all Yoruba kingdoms and even the Ooni himself, is not true! Oduduwa was not an 'Uho' could never have been one. Hence, the article above get 'K-leg'

It's clear now that Oduduwa/Izoduwa was never named Ooni. Rather it was the gate-man that became the first ooni.

O'boy

bokohalal: And who was that?

The only logical conclusion is that there was a usurper to the Ife throne who drove away the rightful heirs .

I thought the first Ooni is Oduduwa, when he died non of his children where around to take over from him. So the old tradition of the Yorubas and edo took effect: It requires that the oldest man in village be made king when there is no king, and the oldest man in the village at that time was the gate-man.

The reason why Africans are the most underdeveloped in the world today is because we are the most heterogeneous people on the planet. Africa needs to move towards being a more homogeneous society.
A major study was founded by Jewish Professor Robert Putnam from Harvard University, showing that heterogeneous societies are very stressful, and dysfunctional. People tend to disengage socially, huddle together, and avoid each other.
What is a homogeneous society? A homogeneous society is such a society where most of the people share the same types of cultural values, language, ethnicity and religious system.
Homogeneity comes to a society in a number of ways-ethnically (as is the case with the Japanese), religiously (many Arab nationals), culturally (Indians), politically (communism China) etc.
The question now is, what does Africa need to do to be a more homogeneous society?

This is what I wrote two years ago, maybe it's relevant here as well.

VALIDATOR: For us to really understand why Africa is backward, we may need to go back in time.Gradually we keep going until we reach a point when Africa was like other parts of the world. IMO That time was the 3rd Millenium BC. We should then start asking "What went wrong from then?" Do Nls agree with this scientific method?

I agree with your method, So tell us what you think went wrong.

cogitoErgo: If Izoduwa acquired the title of 'Ooni' then according to oral tradtions and even 'bokohala' above, there is a hole in the above article! It was either Izoduwa was captured and made to be a slave gateman in the house of Oranmiyan or he was simply employed to work as an 'expatriate' gateman!

There was an Ooni before the gate-man ooni.

Can you break up with some one you love just because he/she is "too nice"

Sure why not, too much niceness is no good for the devil.

honeric01: Look in the mirror, what do you see?

What has that got to do with you being a daft cuntt?

pssword: Quite a lot of posters here have covered, what I think, are the main reasons for our current state of comatose. It is impossible to erase centuries of slave trade, colonisation and forcing together diverse groups for divide and conquer tactics for economic exploitation in a lifetime. Many of our current leaders come from that environment, born pre-1960 and have continued to perpetuate this "culture" of economic slave trade, colonisation and divide and conquer because it is what they understand. I also believe that religion is tool used by our leaders to enforce this division. So to that extent we as a country are also culpable. I see that many people are have put Ghana as an example of progress. But are they really that ahead of Nigeria. I think not. Jerry Rawlings might have taken, quite drastic steps to say the least, to mitigate against the effects colonisation but this has not stopped an over-reliance on all things foreign and UN aid - so there are not a very good an example really because they still suffer that inferiority complex brought about by centuries of colonisation.

We have many so problems caused by the forcing together people with such diverse philosophy that it will take some doing to overcome the effects of divide and conquer and foster trust between the groups. That is the first thing we as a Nation need to deal with. As a nation we need something, a cause, to unite the ethnic groups then we will have a chance to solve our other problems.

I agree with you completely on this post.

honeric01: Sick people everywhere

Are you one of them?

Delafruita: @oiseworld
am trying so hard to refrain from bursting with laughter at your very childish post.you probably mistake this for the jokes section.so because oil flows in bayelsa,jonathan cant be corrupt?so in your opinion,ibori didnt steal,he only took his birthright?am really amazed at ur reasoning.

The reasoning there is: If you steal from your father, it's less evil than if a stranger steals from him. I'am not agreeing with that way of thinking though.

mike404: General Buhari is responsible for all the bombing in the northern naija I fit bet my nyash

I don't think it's him but he probably know who is.

I hope it works.

courage89: What exactly does this mean for the country?

It means more opportunity for new investors.

Sanusi Lamido Sanusi who suggested that people in his (Sanusi) age bracket who are in government need to build their legacy as leaders of Nigeria. Whilst the older ones need to retire

well said Mr Sanusi.

kingoflag: Looking at these replies and [size=18pt]I sincerely hope GEJ succeeds in his plans to become Life President.[/size] You bigots sicken me.

Amen to that.

Naija doctors!

It is said that the average Lagos state doctor sees up to 50 patients daily.

I can't help but laugh when I read this. they see the patients alright, but does that mean that this patient were treated? Even I can "See" 100 patients in a day.

texazzpete: May Native doctors treat you forever more!

May Nigerian doctors treat you forever more! amen.