₦airaland Forum

seankafor:
Make dem carry the war go cyber warfare.. make we see who I'll triumph over each other

Chinese hackers I'll hack down the white house and pentagon in a day or two

The way you dey try hack banks and innocent people emails abi.

Griffon:
Jorginho lost possession on 10 occasions against Norwich last night and besides this, he was dribbled past by an opposition player three times, as per sofascore.

Is that your definition of "doing his job well?"
You're accusing Ibime of hating a unique player, and influencing other fans' views on Jorginho, tell me, how did he manage to reach out to the Twitter community with his hate?
After the Sheffield United's game, I screenshot and shared with y'all some reactions from some sections of our fan base on Twitter, they were all cussing Jorginho.
Below are few other reactions from Twitter after the scrappy win over Norwich. Does Ibime run Twitter bro?

From one of the tweets, you can clearly read where Frank Khalid was complaining of Jorginho making him feel nervous each time he receives the ball. This might just be one of our Iranian fans in his 50s being forced to develop High BP by your midfield god.

The fact is that right now, jorginho is intensely scrutinized, so everyone is just waiting for him to make any mistake to call him out. Just look at here yesterday, everybody will call him out the few times he lost the ball but nobody at all commended him the moments he passed the ball beautifully with his diagonal and long passes, moreso, other midfielders seem to have been spared the backlash whenever they also lost the ball. Kovacic also lost the ball numerously but not one word. RLC was invisible and ineffective for most part of the game but not one word, this is because they are not under the microscope the way jorginho is right now so that bias is bound to be there.

As for jorginho's weaknesses, I still point out that it is normal for many midfielders to have Certain deficiencies especially a regista, that's why their partners really need to be someone with high energy and stamina to cover for them. Look at a fine central midfielder like pogba, for long he has found it difficult to have a good partner and function effectively until Bruno came along.

Listen, griffon I'm not making a case for jorginho to be a steady fixture in our line up. At the end of the day, a midfield pairing of kante kovacic and Barkley or mount might be a good pairing with very fast direct football, I'm just pointing out that jorginho in a possession system like Barça or Mancity's will be deadly because that is what suits his attributes best and a part of me do wishes Chelsea could learn to play possession football.

Ibime:
Being a Regista doesn't mean you should be useless at all other aspects of DM play. Thank God they mentioned Veratti, so we can know our own Regista is shortchanging us.

And if you mention Pirlo, Alonso etc, you will see that our own is Aba made version.

Other players who even have escort tendencies like Busquets and Rodri at least have strength and cannot be bullied off the ball, they can all travel with the ball on the half-turn for a few metres to push the team up and are also very useful aerially to stop teams going long to beat the midfield.

Our own regista cannot hustle like Veratti, cannot ping through passes like Pirlo and Alonso, cannot hold opponents off physically like Busquets and Rodri and cannot compete in the air like them either.

When our own regista is not escorting, players are running through his back and shading him off the ball to run directly at our defence. Oya, satisfy us with some long through passes like Pirlo, he no gree.

If we wanted a Regista with the pace and physical weakness of a 12 year old boy, we would have just kept Josh McEachran than waste our time.

People like to throw names of Pirlo and co around, but there have been many less successful registas in football. That's like associating every DM with Makelele or every right-back with Cafu. The name Regista does not automatically imply excellence. Many Spanish and Italian teams have been relegated with Registas playing in their middle. Borja Valero relegated West Brom playing there. Those are the registas we should be associating Jorginho with, not Pirlo.

This is ridiculous. You will stop at nothing to rubbish a unique player. Jorginho is one hell of a good regista. He smashed passing records in both seria A and the EPL Incase you've forgotten.

The guy knows how to pass, this is unarguable, he is our best passer. The problem is the undefined system he finds himself and the attackers surrounding him.
Last I checked, all our attackers have been sub-par since last season bar hazard.
You cannot be blaming only him for our team woes. He has some weaknesses as do all registas and almost all midfielders, it's down to the other midfielders to complement and also play their role.
It's really unfortunate but it has to be said that kante has been regressing, sort of, since the end of last season and this one.

Kovacic seems to only know how to drive with the ball, nothing else, he can't tackle well, he can't pass well and he is clueless in front of goal. Our team has a lot of deficiencies but jorginho is actually playing his role well as evidenced by our control of games with him in it. If others played their role well, we would have a wonderful team. jorginho is currently one of the best registas in the game. its unfortunate that your bias wont let u see this.

https://www.elartedf.com/jorginho-regista-rainy-english-afternoon/
https://www.sportskeeda.com/football/jorginho-s-role-in-chelsea
https://ftbltalenthub./2018/08/16/player-analysis-jorginho-the-regista/

cole01:
Well we got different opinions then, I'll pick Klopps high press all day..... Conte's counter during his first season is all I can ask for not making 1000 passes per match......I'm more attracted to high pressing football,.. Not a fan of Madrid but I really enjoyed how they played during the run of that triple UCL....
You might enjoy tiki - taka but high pressing counter all day for me..... Didn't you enjoy Brazil vs Belgium at Russia, lol..... I understand you bro, we love different stuff which is really cool

Happy for the three points,cheers

I will be pedagogic with you on this. Read the below and be duly informed on jorginho's exact role. You are being biased when you say jorginho makes only back passes, clearly you were blind not to see the precise long passes he made when switching the game to both sides.

Ibime:
See Man City's Village people.

So Ed Woodward and Marina done turn to Tekashi 69?

Say no to snitching.

Chelsea has no business being in this group. For fucks_sake, we were the pioneers of billionaire owners in football. why we go join others come dey bully man city when people were looking at us in the exact same way when we started?

cole01:
Never fancied busquets, was just lucky to be a a very compact team, would fail woefully outside barca, and don't say Spain because he played with same squad. As for Rodri at least I see him taking shots, making tackles and all that not playing backward passes like Jorginho.
Even pep is leaving the failed system which has since been exposed and you want us to play that, do you really love this club bro.
Why do you think Klopp beats Pep almost all the time, even Ole did a triple over him, we even beat them at the bridge...... Look at what Juve looks like now...... Every football tactic must be figured out and I think that has been figured out already. Stop forcing us to play a failed system of football which has since gone extinct..... With such passes believe me we would never defeat that united side I watched yesterday even with the draw.... You just need press resistant defenders with a proper DM who can assist and high quality finishers to beat this system..... And Chelsea doesn't even press hard due to the help of Mr Jorginho the Italian maestro, no killer passes, no shots, only 2cm passes like a 2 year old kid and been runned over like a doormat.

Tiki-taka, gone extinct
It's either you're just emotionally ranting or you're just a young naive football fan.
I am one of those who believes that a lot of money spent have made guardiola successful but make no mistake about this, the man is a very good tactical coach.

I've always made a point to emphasize that you don't need to downgrade someone to elevate another.
Liverpool are currently the best team in terms of consistency and fitness but make no mistake guardiola's team carries the day in terms of game play.

Giving both choices on which you would like to play, many more will surely choose Mancity's tiki-taka.

There was this Aura of excitement when sarri just came in because we have long wished to play that kind of exciting brand of attacking football. That we didn't see the project through doesn't mean one cannot wish Lampard tries to implement that philosophy.

BlueAngel444:
some of the players that did well under Sarri, or lemme say were manageable no come dey do like say them play last season with us. Apart from Sarri's stubbornness I guess having a clear direction and instructions help players.

Would like to see old Odoi, RLC and co back

Indeed.
I do hope our academy boys get back their confidence. Odoi and rlc were soo good in the Europa league last season, they showed real talent, it will be a huge loss for us if Mason mount, Tammy, James Reece, rlc and Hudson don't become hey players for us in the future, they have shown very good potential to be great previously.

BlueMann:
Tammy has a lot to learn, and he needs to learn fast. He's still too raw.

Damn, I wish Giroud had pace, that would've been something!

Tammy really does need to bulk up and gain confidence.

The guy started soo well for us this season, it's painful seeing him struggle soo much. I do hope he comes good for us.

cole01:
Mind you Jorginho is obviously the best passer of the ball but only backwards though, even Zouma can actually throw in long passes more than J5, it's either he's passing backwards, or giving signs with his hands feeling like the hybrid of Xavi and Pirlo, or getting booked unnecessarily and the most annoying putting his temamates in trouble...... If you checked every threatening ball today it was always from his blunders.
Whats the use of a DM if he ain't sharp, strong, tracks back, helps the defense, no shots, no killer passes, high porous to pressure.....

To me that's not a DM, I think the best position for Jorginho is actually outside the pitch playing his 2m passes....Ffs look at Casemiro, Matic, Mctominay, Fernandinho, Ndidi, Alcântara, Witsel, even Romeu at soton. A DM is meant to be dirty my brother not Mr nice guy and been ran over like a door mat just like the bearded guy did b4 the Mousset miss, your supposed to cover people's blunders not been the one to be covered. I don't think any coach would want J5 tbh

Then obviously you know nothing about possession football. What is your opinion on Sergio busquet and rodri?
Not too long ago, many people here wished Chelsea began to play possession football like Barcelona or mancity.

Many mancity and Barça matches might look boring to you because of the excess passes, but it is a style that guarantees winnings if adapted correctly and it will always leave behind a legacy even when there is managerial change. The system will still be in place.

BlueMann:
After playing Man.u, we play Liverpool

Same sequence as our first two fixtures of the season.

The results must be different this time

Hopefully, it does improve, we have been quite poor since the restart, it's only in our match against mancity did I really feel happy and that's even because the whole team defended quite well and we utilized our chances. The rest of the matches haven't really been good. We had to come back against Aston Villa, barely scraped by Leicester, lost to Sheffield and West Ham.

The only good thing about this period is the emergence of pulisic. I do hope we win man-u in the semis. The shame go too much for me if we lose to them again.

popizaino:
Sarri never felt bad cus he had hazard

Go through this statement again and see if it makes any sense to you. Do you really think it is a coincidence that hazard has his best career stats to date under sarri?

cole01:
I feel teams love us keeping possessions, they just watch us pass and pass.
And why do we have to stop and wait for the opposition defense to reorganize before attacking, football is meant to be catching someone unaware ffs

there is something you are not recognizing, that passing and passing you are talking about is essentially the team controlling the match.
how else will a team control a match without the passing? and the fact remains that jorginho is the best passer we have in the team currently, none of our midfielders can pass better than him whether, lateral or diagonally.

the problem is that our attackers are too static for the passers. Other top attackers are constantly roaming and moving to create chances for themselves in front of or inside the opponents 18 yard box but our attackers constantly pull wide to receive the ball and cross, hence fewer direct chances.

The problem is not jorginho but those in front of him, if you open well, he will find you with a pass.

popizaino:
A sensible player will go for the cross mostly in this case .

And this is what he basically tries to do most of the time, hence his limited impacts n games.

Ibime:
If Jorginho start against Manure, the 4-0 will be repeated

of course, jorginho, your favorite scapegoat. Meanwhile I don't hear you complain about the impotent midfielders ahead of him who were constantly losing the ball and lacked good decision making but yes go on and pick out the few moments he lost the ball seeing as he is now your new scapegoat.

We won't blame the other players who don't know how to press the opponent very well or those who looked inept in front of goal but of course your scapegoat is there to take all the blame for the teams inadequacies. Mtchew.

BlueRayDick:
At what point was messi Carried along in his almost 15 years of first team football at Barca?

Are you telling me you have never heard people say Messi should leave Barça to prove that he is the best. That Barça's system helps him a lot and that he will barely survive in another league. Are you telling me you have never heard that line of argument from mostly Ronaldo fans?

We need to try and score early to secure this result. At this point it's useless hoping to improve our goal difference seeing as we're so far behind our opponents.

BikeMan:
Omo! Thank God we bought two direct attackers sha, all these side passers noh be am

I'm telling you. willian always plays better from the left, his undoing at Chelsea has always been being relegated to the right as a right footed player, he can hardly take shots from that position.

Our players are very poor in pressing the opponent to recover the ball when lost. They just seem to hope the opponent simply makes a mistake and lose the ball. Hmm.

Secondly, our attackers are not fluid and mobile enough. They only want to go wide to receive the ball and attempt to dribble & cross, and they lose the ball often doing this.

Top attackers will constantly be moving to destabilize the opponents organization and receive a defense splitting pass. they are not moving well enough or interchanging positions to destabilize their opponents.
I really hope we improve in this 2nd half.

hensben:
Why did you edit my post. Both players are systematic type. You mentioning them with Alonso and Pirlo is insulting. Yes I said that because of how Sarri used him. Sarri and pep are in same school of thought when it comes to tactics.

Correct @ the bolded. Is pep not a good manager? If pep recognizes that jorginho can be a very vital part of his team, does this not speak well for the player?

This is you;

hensben:
In other words, Bousquet and Jorginho are carry-along kind of player

The same you;

hensben:
Welcome Jorginho. One of my favorite player in the world!

People usually deride you as one of the least intelligent poster here.
I comment my reserve.

hensben:
Jorginho is a systematic player, same with Bousquet. Pirlo and Alonso add other attribute to their CDM play, this is why they will remain world class regardless the tactics and system. In other words, Bousquet and Jorginho are carry-along kind of player. With quality players in Barca then we all think Bousquet was the best thing after sliced bread.

This same BS line about everybody being a "carry along" in Barça. At one point or another, Messi, Pedro, Sanchez, xavi, fabregas, Iniesta, pique, mascherano, Sergio etc have all been called "carry along" players or players enabled by the system.
The question continues to be; if all these players are carry along players, then who constitutes the system being played?

If you can call Sergio busquets who has been a crucial and main stay player for Barça for more than 14 years a "carry along" player, then who did the so called carrying along?

ijedeikorodu:
Did Melania Trump graduated with an architectural degree or not and from which university, at least Michelle Obama certifications can be verified?

I could have sworn you were a trump supporter.

Emaprince:
This one go interest you, donjazet

https://www.nairaland.com/5991090/dead-man-forced-out-casket

As usual, gross stupidity and ignorance at display.
Ignorant people will always display their stupid beliefs.
If the headline is to be believed, so because the ambulances brought to transport the dead body developed fault, it automatically means the dead person is responsible.

Stupid displays like these can only be seen in Africa where ignorance reigns supreme and the masses are so gullible to believe rubbish.

Emaprince:
Since he doesn't fit into our system, then he should be sold out asap!!!

He is costing us matches so no need singing about how his attributes would suite barca or man city play style. After all, caudrado who flopped big time at Chelsea is doing well at a top team like juve and we don't regret shipping him off.

The koko be say, jorginho need to exit the door. With all the passes, I don't even see the assist. Just bunch of safe passes.

And no need com paring him to Xavi or buswuet. Those can even withstand massive pressing from opposition unlike Jorge who gets easily displace when an opponents jersey waves past him. Fabregas with all his escort service will still gautantee you loads of assists unlike that paper weight midfielder.
Any way, he is not my major problem. My own be say kepa should be kicked out. And Abraham benched forever or loaned

I think this is what myself and griffon are talking about.

None of us knows yet whether jorginho will eventually be necessary seeing as even Lampard is yet to form a fully defined philosophy.

Do not be hasty to forget that in the last two years, Chelsea has had very good attacking spells of which jorginho was at the center of.
Yes, there is a possibility that eventually we might not need him, but ask yourself, is it really advisable to hasten his exit when we don't even yet know if he will eventually be our fulcrum in midfield or who will even be better at replacing him?

We fans are always too quick to judge players once they hit a rough patch. We have made these mistakes before.
Ibime, you need to stop being a rabble rouser especially now that we don't even have a plan for the position.

BlueMann:
Spot on.

And I think he actually fits well in Lampard's 4-2-3-1 formation. I remember how he was balling earlier in the season when paired with Kova.

The reason why he wasn't so 'exposed' defensively at Napoli was cause Sardi's ideal style uses a systematic team press as it's defence - like offense is the best form of defence sorta thing. Basically it was a team effort.

But Chelsea under Sarri never really grasped that systematic team press to a satisfactory extent. Same as under Lampard.
So Jorginho playing as a lone DMF here is always going to spell disaster, off the ball especially.

But you're right - he has his qualities, and is good value for what he does when in the right system.

You are very correct @ your 2nd paragraph, a possession based system like guardiola's or sarri's rely on the whole team for the collective press when the ball is lost. I remember guardiola once stating that he has a 5 second rule; one where the ball must be recovered in less than 5 seconds once lost.
These men are obsessed with ball possession while other managers will train their team on how to absorb pressure comfortably without the ball.

Griffon:
Following the transformation from Sarri-ball to Lampard's ideals, ranging from the style of play, overall squad dynamics and to the tactical side of things, do you wish we stick with Jorginho?

Just a simple question.

It's not really a simple question because we are yet to even decipher Lampard's system of play. This season has been purely experimental for him with too much chopping and changing of personnel.

Before the restart nobody could predict his starting lineup, he has tried multiple formations this season, so it's earnestly difficult to state for a fact if jorginho would be needed or not for Lampard seeing as even he doesn't know it yet.
I guess only time will tell.

Ibime:
Go and preach that to someone else. For someone who spent years frustrated with Mikel and Fabregas for the same reason, despite their proficiency in possession (even better than Jorginho), you are barking up the wrong tree.

We have done the most to protect Jorginho. The only way to protect such a player is to play 2 DMs in front of him and we have done that last season with Kante and Kova. The ceiling of such strategy is where we finished last season. Dem no born me as a Chelsea fan to be hoping for top 4 every season. I'd rather have a robust midfield that can compete whichever way the game goes, whether offensively or defensively and not be Iike Griffon, fearing that if we play Liverpool and Wolves with Jorginho, we'll get hammered. What the fück is a defensive midfielder who can't create nor defend. Enjoying 70% possession and getting hammered 3-0 while our DM is being ragdolled on every counterattack. Save your preaching for listening ears.
Jorginho must go!

Again, you surprise me with your unintellectual perspective on jorginho, Barcelona and mancity are two teams that use registas in Sergio busquet and rodri. These two players are neither known for goals and assists, they are simply there to recycle possession. Guardiola has famously said he doesn't train his team to tackle, his team is obsessed with always possessing the ball and their ability with it which is what makes a regista highly important in this philosophy. rather

These registas are usually paired with high stamina players and highly creative players like kdb, rakitic, the Silva's etc for the creation of chances. The whole team is tasked on retrieving the ball immediately after dispossession unlike some systems that would rely on the DM for interceptions, tackling and other defensive abilities.

So you can see how you lie when you say you have to protect a regista with 2 DM's for protection. Barça and mancity don't. They have a philosophy that works perfectly for them.

Ibime:
Insanity is repeating the same thing and expecting different results. Everybody you quoted there has seen the irredeemable weakness in the escort. We don't need long story to know we cannot compete at a top level with Jorginho. He is done at Chelsea.

Incase you couldn't decode my message there, it is very simple; jorginho is a good player whose attributes doesn't work in every system. Some players are like that. If busquet comes to Chelsea he too would flop. There are different types of midfielders with unique skills who need other midfielders to complement them.

Jorginho has previously shown how pivotal he is in a possession based system.
He has always been known for his control of the midfield via passing just like other registas.
I am pointing out that he is not useless like you would want others to believe.

Ibime:
Dem say Referee sprint past Jorginho

Ibime, enough with the jorginho slander.
It's difficult seeing you diss a player like an unseasoned pundit just because of your personal dislike for the player.

There are very few deep playing midfielders like Toni kroos or Xabi who are finely tuned both defensively and offensively.
Nobody here ever taught of jorginho as a box to box midfielder. Even when he was at Italy, he was known for his passing. He broke records for his passes. He is a player who is attuned to a particular system.

Jorginho's role in a team is as a regista of which there are very few like Sergio busquet, rodri, Pirlo etc.

When signing jorginho, we knew we would have to pair him with hard working box to box midfielders like kante and Barkley to complement his poor work rate.

Look at other regista's in football, Sergio busquet has been very vital to Barça in the last 10 years because he perfectly suits their pattern and philosophy, but if he was brought into a kloop team that is purely a high intensity and high energy football or even our team, watch how he would flop because the system doesn't match his attributes.
But if this same busquet went to mancity today, watch him easily slot in the way rodri has slotted in easily.

Don't forget that mancity were very close to signing him before we snatched the deal from them after signing sarri because we realized how important he was to "sarriball" which was the project the club had embarked upon at that time which we later broke away from.

Today, nobody in mancity expects rodri to be creative or defensive, his primary role is simply to recycle possession with lateral and diagonal passes, connecting the defense to the attack via passes and ensuring safe transitioning. This is simply his work.

Jorginho has simply become a victim of Chelsea's managerial instability. Sarriball was the only reason we signed him and now he is stuck with a manager that doesn't need his skill set since he subscribes to a different philosophy of football. This doesn't mean he is a rubbish player like you would like everyone to believe.

These were our immediate reactions here when he was signed.

Ibime:
Jorginho!
If only we had added Seri, midfield would be a ticked box.

hensben:
Welcome Jorginho. One of my favorite player in the world. Jorginho as CDM, Kante as B2B. Oshe!

Nihilstjnr:
I think Kante Jorginho Fab could work wella

airmark:
We don't know how fit Barkley is, now. Last season he didn't look ready to pick up the gauntlet in our midfield.
Jorginho's passes look great for our attackers to feast on.

Nihilstjnr:
If he doesn't have to track back as much, in theory he can focus on orchestrating the play and creating chances higher up the pitch, which is his forte anyway.
Jorginho to can keep things ticking over in deeper positions, and Kante shuffles up and down the pitch as a carillero.

Where the fuck_is afrodoc? where is that noisemaker always disturbing our thread.

TalabiAudu:
I like how Obafemi kept it late at 96th min.

If he had equalized earlier, Utd would have been given a late penalty to win it

I don't think so. Southampton dominated the midfield today. These were the same people who held mancity at bay for more than an hour. They have shown that they were very capable of absorbing pressure.

Empty barrels and chest beaters. Una well-done oo.