₦airaland Forum

Lordimpaq,

Good guy has already answered the question.

Of course I would add that it is not just the authorized KJV but also the MKJV and the NKJV that use the word evil. Others too.

Of course every true thing in the bible will be repeated in more than one place it is said in more than one verse also.

Job 2:10 But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.

Notice this man of God, says good and evil comes from the hand of God. And directly after this statement it is sais "Job did not sin with his lips".

So that certainly can not be a lie.

Go over to Jeremiah's book Lamentations:

Lam 3:32 But though he cause grief, yet will he have compassion according to the multitude of his mercies.

God causes the grief, but will have compassion.

Lam 3:33 For he doth not afflict willingly nor grieve the children of men.

God does not do it willingly but still it is undisputed in the prophets mind that it is god doing it.

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In fact I think it would be kinda of silly, to believe in a God, who is helpless to stop evil and just must sit idly by and watch satan do his thing.

Satan works for God, God tells you that also:

Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

Which makes complete sense:

Isa 54:17 No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD.

No weapon formed against thee shall prosper because in fact the Lord controlls the waster and destroyer.

The Lord's chasetisement leads to holiness, it's for your own good.

Seun,

Or more clearly as the bible says:

The Word of God, is a double edged sword.

Again: The wheat and tares grow up together.

Thus they must be eating the same things (the bible) but they have different reactions to them.

Seun,

This is why Peter warns us about Paul's writings.

2Pe 3:15-16  and the long-suffering of our Lord count ye salvation, according as also our beloved brother Paul--according to the wisdom given to him--did write to you, as also in all the epistles, speaking in them concerning these things, among which things are certain hard to be understood, which the untaught and unstable do wrest, as also the other Writings, unto their own destruction*.

* Notice that following the writings of Paul incorrectly can destroy you.

2Pe 3:17-18  Therefore, beloved, knowing beforehand, beware lest being led away with the error of the lawless,* you fall from your own steadfastness. But grow in grace and in knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

* The error of the lawless. They always believe they are above the law and the law does not apply to them.

So we know this is the error that twisting the writings of Paul will lead to, a people who will walk away thinking Christianity gives them the right to be a horrible jackass.

And remember Peter's warning that reading Pauls writings and taking them this way this  will destroy them.

Or remember that God says:

I give them their own delusions who would not love the truth.

Satan and Jesus both were sent by God to the earth.

It does not surprise me that one can be following Satan or Jesus with a bible in their hand.

I the Lord create the good and the evil. I, the Lord, do it all. Isaiah 45 verse 7

Seun,

That would be premature.

Religion (belief in something better than oneself and that one is getting rid of evil) is the only platform on which successful revolutions have been run.

If the world out grows the bible before Africa goes through it's rebirth, then we have a situtation where Africa is doomed to be the welfare mother of the world for eternity.

Africans must use religion first, as other areas have used it, to unify and put an end to backwardness.

Again which is back to my point, of why whites would want to get rid of the bible, at this time, before Africa uses religion to get on it's feet.

Actually there is another verse that one may throw into the mix:

I tell the end in the beginning.

Is Genesis 1, the end or the begining?

The begining after the world is totally destroyed from war and God's wrath in Revelations?

Havila,

I did not take the question that way. I expected that the person wanted to know why Christianity is losing favor with whites.

Christianity has always been secondary to "white culture", so when it is not as useful to white culture anymore, then of course it will be dropped.

I think the disavowing of Christianity is an purposeful attempt to keep Black people away from what the bible really says.

Ndipe,

No verse of the bible is meant to be read or understood by non-believers.

It is for our understanding that the bible teaches in Romans 1:20, that in reality, the invitation to God is extended to all folks and the proofs they require are there also, but they turn away from them and to their own foolishness. i.e. worship of created beings ___ what man says.

Ibexy,

Christianity was at one time useful for Europeans to rule the world, but now it is dangerous as other races get a hold of what the bible actually says.

So it is being dropped by Europeans.

There are precedents for this in history.

For instance in Kenya, Jomo Kenyatta was locked up for constantly quoting the bible, "that God had given to each nation it's own land."

Whites were more agitated by his continous reading of that verse, then they were by the Mumu with guns.

In America, Bible reading was outlawed for Blacks, when those who read the bible figured out that oppression was a biblical no-no.

In Haiti, they were told, they could only worship the number 2 God --the devil. This is why Voodoo or Juju remained so big in Haiti.

In South Africa, it was Christian students who began the boycotts that led to the soweto massacre and eventual freedom of South Africa.

Whites quickly try to withdraw from christianity when it seems that others are going to get a hold of what the bible really says.

America is a special case. Even though still in America it is shown over and over again.

African Americans attend church more.
African Americans believe in the bible more i.e. the Creation story.
African Americans are less likely to support abortion or gays.
African Americans give more to help churches and poor people.

Other groups in America are considered more or less "cultural christians", i.e. they attend church because their neighbors attend church and it is expected of them.

The bible and God really do not have much to do with church attendance.

On the other hand some white Americans are considered true believers and they are diligent about their religion but it may not be related exactly to the gospel but more or less to prosperity gospel.

Nferyn,

What has been confirmed by you, is simply that ants are much more rational then these killing murderous big foot pesticide making humans who are trying to explain human agriculture needs to ants.

I told you the smashers were evil! I told you long spray was destroying and polluting the air with their pesticides!___ The ants point of view of humans.

Ok makes sense. Can you stipulate these basic laws? Do these laws supercede logic? Does logic apply to the Christian Bible? If so, then Christianity violates the law of contradiction (problem of evil in relation to the omni-God) and thus is irrational. If logic does not apply to Christianity, then it is irrational by definition.

Nferyn,

The Laws of the Christian bible are far too numerous for me to stipulate them all here but I will narrow down a few that I think are pertinent to this discussion.

1. The letter killeth, the Spirit giveth life.

This is an important one because it personally drives a lot of athiest nuts that the bible is not rational.

Trying to read and understand the bible as a way to get faith (understanding), would in fact lead to less faith for a person without the Spirit of God.

The letter (bible) would kill your soul (killeth) if you worked at understanding it from a skeptical point of view.

So understanding this one law should lead you to understand why it would be beyond moronic for me to try to take the bible and convince you of anything.

And that brings up another related law:

2. One can plant, and one can water but only God gives the growth.

In otherwords, talking to christians can be helpful, we can plant seeds and we can water you with the words of the bible but again, we must wait for the Spirit to enter into you before you can actually grow and understand what is being said.

Another related much stronger law of the bible but very related:

3. The wisdom of the world is foolishness to God.

So no list of definitions or rationality's or men's wisdom can overrule for a Christian, the laws of God contained in the bible.


So to answer your questions:

1. Yes, these laws supercede what you may define as logic.

2. Yes, logic can be if you want applied to the bible but the bible promises that you it will fail to penetrate the bible. In fact leave you in worse shape, if you had not tried to apply them.

3. The problem of evil, is not a problem but too many Christians are scared of your reaction to teach what the bible actually says about evil. (I the Lord create the good and the evil.) instead their busy promoting a what I have come to call a "hug god".

The truth is, God creates evil. The same as a parent who spanks a child will be considered evil by the child. God not only creates evil, he created someone to carry out the evil. The same as Bush created the war in Iraq but does not have to shoot an Iraqi for the war to take place. You can guess whose job it is to spread evil in the world, he works for God.

So the bible is not irrational at all, once you actually accept what it truly says: God creates the good and the evil.

Also, I couldn't but comment on what you term TV christians and your ascertion through scripture that it takes feeding the children to begin to know Christ.  Though unintentional (I believe), you have suceeded in painting a picture of salvation through works.  I'm sure you know that not one person will enter heaven based on their good works.  If that happens, then Christ died in vain.

TayoD,

Your whole post was good. I think I sorta repeated it to Nferyn just now. In my way.  

I always think of salvation as something God has done for us, when we were still sinners.

It is finished.

But too many Christians get stuck there, refusing to move along and mature in the gospel.

Let us just go over a few of the verses that the bible talks about "good works".

Eph 2:10  for of Him we are workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to good works, which God did before prepare, that in them we may walk.

Again, your salvation is complete but this is why your salvation was given to you. So you could do good works.

Tit 2:14  who did give himself for us, that he might ransom us from all lawlessness, and might purify to himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works;

Again notice that this is not how to obtain salvation but in fact the reason why you were given salvation so that in giving himself to us, Jesus might get a peculiar people who are zealous of good works. The reason why you were given salvation.


Heb 10:24  and may we consider one another to provoke to love and to good works,

It's our job as christians to provoke one another to love and good works.

Notice Love is something different from good works. So don't confuse loving your brothers as your "good work" in Christ.

And again all of this for people who already have salvation.

Thus knowledge of helping others is a way to know God and what God wants from you.

This is not a how to get saved but more a why you were saved.