^^^ Let me expand on that my last post a little bit.

In the Bible, you will see Jesus Christ say, 'today this scripture is fulfilled in your sight'.

Clearly, by 'scripture' the Lord did not mean just any "writing"; He was referring to something more; at least something authoritative on matters of faith; that is at the minimum because you can go as far as 'sacred' or 'divine' etc.

The apostle Paul wrote 2 Timothy which is where he referred to all 'scriptures' is given etc; you can see very clearly that he did not mean just any writing but again, like the Lord, something at least authoritative.

Now check this: the apostle Paul had earlier written the epistle to the Colossians; in that epistle he quoted the Gospel of Luke --- apparently as 'scripture'. (This suggests of course that the Gospel of Luke was written even earlier)

The key point is this: we can conclude reasonably that when the apostle Paul in 2 Timothy referred to all 'scriptures', he was referring to the Hebrew Bible aka the Christian Old Testament and at least the Gospel of Luke and the Epistle to the Colossians.

We can even reasonably argue that he might have contemplated future authoritative scriptures ---- because for example we read the apostle Peter hinting that the Christians will have something else (beyond his oral words) to remind them; many believe that something to be the Gospel of Mark (and even maybe other 'scriptures').



EDITED for typos and little things

And on the different appellations and names of the Roman Catholic Church, here is one I made earlier.


For a start, the Roman Catholic church denomination calls itself ---- the Roman Catholic Church, or even simply the Roman Church.

The last two or three "popes" all did it. Their Church documents do it; and even when they announced the current "pope" they did it.

Of course it is fair for other knowledgeable people to call them what they are ---- no matter their Wikipedia propaganda. So whether it is Roman, Roman Catholic, Romish or even papist --- they are all these things. They are especially "papist" because they place their "popes" above Jesus Christ and agree with their "popes" when the "popes" say only those who submit to the "pope" can be saved! What Jesus Christ said ---- does not matter to them of course. Common idolaters!

The Eastern Orthodox actually have a stronger case to be called "the Catholic Church" (even more than the Roman Catholics) -- if anyone today can be truly called that. But in fact there is no longer "the Catholic Church" strictly speaking; that one became kaput in 1054AD.

The reason people at Carthage in the 5th century and people elsewhere referred to themselves as "Catholic" is largely because they wanted to identify with what the emperor Theodosius declared to be "Catholic" in 380 AD.

These matters were discussed extensively on a number of threads and especially these two short ones.

https://www.nairaland.com/1254965/eastern-orthodox-church-orthodox-catholic

https://www.nairaland.com/1257440/catholic-catholic-back-catholic

In general speech or in general English language, "scripture" has a wider meaning.

In a Christian context, "scripture" does indeed mean "Bible" or the authoritative books accepted by Christians at the relevant time.

By the way, in general English even "Bible" has a wider meaning than that which is understood by Christians.

Martin Luther is being accused of removing/trying to remove books from the Bible!

Here are just a few Roman Catholics who also "removed" at least 7 books from the Bible

Jerome, Erasmus, "pope" Gregory I, "Cardinal Cajetan (the same Luther's opponent)

Oh, meanwhile the Roman Catholics only voted to add the 7 books in 1546 by: 25 for, 15 against and 16 abstained --- they couldn't even get a clear majority!

Oh, and here is something from the Roman Catholic organisation's own encyclopaedia http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2711.htm lol

"38. But it should be known that there are also other books which our fathers call not "Canonical" but "Ecclesiastical:" that is to say, Wisdom, called the Wisdom of Solomon, and another Wisdom, called the Wisdom of the Son of Syrach, which last-mentioned the Latins called by the general title Ecclesiasticus, designating not the author of the book, but the character of the writing. To the same class belong the Book of Tobit, and the Book of Judith, and the Books of the Maccabees. In the New Testament the little book which is called the Book of the Pastor of Hermas, [and that] which is called The Two Ways, or the Judgment of Peter; all of which they would have read in the Churches, but not appealed to for the confirmation of doctrine. The other writings they have named "Apocrypha." These they would not have read in the Churches.

These are the traditions which the Fathers have handed down to us, which, as I said, I have thought it opportune to set forth in this place, for the instruction of those who are being taught the first elements of the Church and of the Faith, that they may know from what fountains of the Word of God their draughts must be taken."

The Roman Catholic Bible of 25 for, 15 against and 16 abstained is even contrary to tradition.

woky: Enigma, nobody is stoping you from posting, if you knw the good thing to post, post it. But have this @ the bak of ur mind "there is no withness so dreadful, no accuser so terrible as the conscience that dwalls in the heart of every man" if ur conscience approve's what you ar posting here right, ride on!

If you say nobody is stopping me from posting then why do you want me to leave the thread?

And at the bolded, my brother I hope you too really examine your own conscience.

My brother woky, I want to show you one more thing. Please bear with me and pay close attention!

Here is a post I made some time ago https://www.nairaland.com/1006902/friends-want-me-catholic-thoughts/8#11864468

Enigma: ^^^ You are right I said we should close the argument. Sorry, something came up, well disappeared really, is what caused me to make one more post. lol

The answers to all of your questions are contained in the various links that I've provided. I could and can answer them very easily but where will it lead us? Probably going round in circles and fostering animosity unnecessarily. I think the attention that I've paid to the particular point that I've sought to address is enough.

I will remind you that I have not and have not even tried to antagonise or malign The Roman Catholic Church.

Do you understand the things I bolded ---- especially in blue?

In those days I was begging your Roman Catholic madu that we should not fight; I was trying very hard not to disrespect the Roman Catholic Church.

Can you guess what your Roman Catholic madu did?

Do you think that possibly what they did might have contributed to my current more open stance about the Roman Catholic Church?

Meanwhile please note that I can still point to many other posts where I was begging your Roman Catholic madu that we should remain civil and cordial!

Excellent! Good riddance; well, ok depart in peace!

.... saying the truth!

Even a broken clock can be correct at least twice a day.

And alas I and my posts are not being ignored!

woky, good morning my brother.

Please let us try and reason together honestly for one moment --- without sarcasm!

1. When was the last time I insulted anyone on this thread?

2. When was the last time I said something insulting on this thread?

3. If I cannot post here, why should a Roman Catholic be able to post on the Christian Chat thread?

4. If you are able to "appeal" to me, why are you not able to "appeal" to the people who invited me here? Are you afraid of them or is it eye service imma madu?

^^^ Please you are most welcome to "ignore" my posts --- those who will find them helpful will find them helpful!

Come to think of it, if you are ignoring my posts, why are you commenting on them?

Oh by the way if Newman said the quote above, well Machiavelli said these quotes below:

"... the nearer people are to the Church of Rome, which is the head of our religion, the less religious are they. And whoever examines the principles upon which that religion is founded, and sees how widely different from those principles its present practice and application are, will judge that her ruin or chastisement is near at hand....

the evil example of the court of Rome has destroyed all piety and religion in Italy ....

We Italians then owe to the Church of Rome and to her priests our having become irreligious and bad; but we owe her a still greater debt, and one that will be the cause of our ruin, namely, that the Church has kept and still keeps our country divided.
"

If the Orthodox Church did not exist during the "canonisation" of the "Bible", the Roman Catholic Church did not exist during the canonisation either.

In any event, at the end of the century and during the time when the books of the Bible were initially compiled and the canon was being set by tradition, there was no such thing as the Roman Catholic Church. There was even no such thing as "the Catholic Church".

Oh, and if the Orthodox made their canon in "1672", the Roman Catholic Church made it own canon in 1546 without even being able to secure a proper majority.

Simples.

Rich4god:
Ehmmm Enigma... This is another request... Plz leave us alone. If you want to be part of this thread, you are fully welcomed, but this thread is not a place for arguement or trying to show who is right and which church is the best. If you want to argue, open another thread and we will come and settle it there. All I want is to restore the peace in this thread. Like i said earlier, if you want to be part of us, you are welcomed.

I don't really think you want to restore the peace!

If you really want to restore the peace, you will know the right people to talk to and what to tell them.

Oh and I don't think what to tell them will involve the "battle front"!

Shebi you saw my question s to him --- as well as my reply to you earlier.

Like I asked your pal, what do you have to say about my invitation and to those who invited me!

Meanwhile, do you realise that I am now a fully fledged member of this thread now? I am now well legit!

Rich4god: I saw everything, but on a number of occasion, some of us have made the humble request for you to leave us alone.

OK, you saw everything but you have nothing to say about what brought me here!

You have nothing to say to those who brought me here about it --- oh except to praise them and want to join them on the "battle front" . Some people would think that is hypocrisy!

And who are the some of you who made a "humble" request to leave you alone (apart from woky)?

Ajibam, do you want to point what i've done wrong?

Mind you Iam not 'feuding' with anyone.

Did you people leave me alone or did you not invite me to the thread?

Abi you want to say you did not see my invitation?

As Ubenedictus the quiz master whose post led to my invitation is not here presently, let me help in his role as quiz master!

Which "pope" was actually never ordained as a priest or a bishop?

Ah, it is of course for dishonest people who cry like babies to forget that I was insulted cowardly and gratuitously on the thread before I got involved on the thread. People who are hypocrites don't see that kind of thing.

Such people being cowards want a place where they can insult others but those others should not have a right of reply.

Oh, and organisms and others will continue to point out the lies, fraud and forgeries of the idolatrous Roman Catholic Church organisation; those who want to cry like babies will just have to continue crying like babies.

HumbledbYGrace: ai, no

Thank you HBG.

I have used that statement to replace an old post of mine that was deleted: https://www.nairaland.com/1464338/thread-catholics/27#19719096

Meanwhile, I say again that the old post of mine did NOT break any rule; it was in response to posts by which the person crying here to complain and others referred to me as the "devil".

Therefore I request that Mods kindly leave this new replacement post in place.

Thanks.

Request for clarification

Does the statement below break any rule --- anywhere on Nairaland?

"Indeed the devil never sleeps and always seeks to cause division among supposed Christians and brethren and instead, for example, the devil causes some to say that other Christians are 'separated brethren'."

Crybaby is still whining and crying.

Well, anti catholic living things and others will still be laughing at crybaby and exposing the lies, fraud and forgeries of the idolatrous Roman Catholic Church organisation.

HumbledbYGrace: is Enigma female That's deformation of character.

Oh ho, you see!

They can dish insults but when you hit them with even just a little they start crying like babies. Or threaten to go to Police station .... or to Admin ... or maybe to United Nations!

Whiny crybaby is a liar two-fold.

First he says he does not read my post but now he is reporting them!

Second, he forgets that one only needs to look above hmy post that he is reporting to read his own posts and what he and his compatriots were doing with "devil" that informed my post!

Above, all my post viloated NO rule and insulted no one particularly.

Oh, and bored old ladies and others will keep pointing out the lies, fraud and forgeries of the idolatrous Roman Catholic Church organisation.

woky: ok, ok , ok ok
Enigma, we ar sorry for the insult
pls accept the apology and let us be in peace, though an apology might help, but you can do better than this without one..


Always do what you knw is right..

woky, at least you have now done well on your own part. And I acknowledge that.

However, I am yet to see the chief culprits do anything to make me reconsider my approach. And there are at least four of those culprits if not more.

So, there is still some way to go.

Ajibam: @enigma and other anti - Catholics,
any negative word address to the Catholics in their thread wil not be taken lightly.. you can argue or question their belief, but don't use any provoking or negative statement against them..
especially enigma..

But they can call me "heretic", "devil" among many other terrible things ---- because it is on their "thread"?

And it is my thread too --- because I too am a catholic ----- even if necessary, a "Catholic"!

woky: self-respect is the root of discipline..

Pls, let us be..

And did you and your friends let me be?

After you people invited me to the thread?

After you people were throwing insults at me - cowardly behind my back?

And did you not join the people doing the insulting?

So what do you call all of that? Is it not:

- hypocrisy?
- dishonesty?
- lack of shame?
- lack of integrity?

AND

- lack of self respect?

Amen, woky.