₦airaland Forum

Janosky:
Oga , would the Beroans quote this 2nd paragraph statement of page 255 that was repeated in the 1978 Watchtower that it is true ?


However, other procedures may not be objectionable. These include blood tests, hemodialysis, hemodilution, or the use of a cell-salvage or heart-lung bypass machine. Each Christian must decide for himself how his own blood will be handled in the course of a procedure, medical test, or current therapy. Each doctor may perform these procedures slightly differently. So before accepting any surgical procedure, medical test, or therapy, a Christian needs to find out exactly how his own blood will be handled."

Oga, Just continue in your " Beroan" ways.

Does being a Witness affect comprehension?

The first paragraph is what applies to Transfusion, stored blood being given back and it was banned before the update.

The second paragraph is about the use of blood while the surgery is ongoing. The moment , not Stored.

Pls comprehend

Janosky:
w78 6/15 pp. 29-31
Questions From Readers

● A doctor said that prior to surgery a patient could have some blood withdrawn and stored, in the event that a transfusion is needed during surgery. How should a Christian view such use of his own blood?

From the standpoint of those in the medical field, this procedure may seem quite practical. There are grave dangers in accepting a transfusion of someone else’s blood. Seemingly fewer risks are involved if a person is given a transfusion of his own blood. So there is a trend among doctors to use the procedure called “autologous transfusion.” This involves drawing off the patient’s own blood and “banking” or storing it for transfusion purposes when necessary. If not needed by the donor, the blood may be used for other patients.


So, if medical personnel suggest that a Christian permit some of his blood to be withdrawn and deposited in a blood bank for later transfusion purposes, the Christian is not without guidance from the Bible as to the proper course.
He can mention that ancient Israelites were told that removed blood was to be ‘poured out on the ground as water,’ to show that it was for God and not to sustain the life of some earthly creature. (Deut. 12:24) And he can refer to the pointed command that Christians ‘abstain from blood.’ In view of this, how could he allow his blood to be collected in a blood bank for later transfusion into himself or another person?
[/b]

●

What about a device such as a heart-lung pump or a dialysis (artificial kidney) machine? Might a Christian use such?

There are Christian witnesses of Jehovah who, with a good conscience, have allowed these devices to be used, provided that the machines were primed with a nonblood fluid, such as Ringer’s lactate solution.

When this sort of device is operating, the patient’s blood flows from a blood vessel through tubing and the machine (where it is pumped, oxygenated and/​or filtered) and then flows back into his circulatory system. The machine temporarily performs some of the functions normally handled by the patient’s own organs.

Some Christians have conscientiously reasoned that the blood is flowing continuously and that the external circuit might be viewed as an extension of the circulatory system. They have considered it comparable to a piece of tubing that might be implanted in the body to shunt blood around a blockage in a vessel.




Of course, each Christian should weigh what is involved in the use of these and similar devices. He could consider whether he views the blood involved to be blood that clearly has left his body and so should be disposed of or as blood that, basically, is still part of his circulatory system. (Deut. 12:16) Then he can make a decision that will leave him with a clear conscience before God.​—1 Pet. 3:16". Watchtower,June 15,1978.


If you have to relearn English to understand the bolded,pls do.
The Enjoy Life did not discuss every procedure.
Again,this Watchtower,discussed the storage procedure acceptable as well as non acceptable one which Enjoy Life publication refered to the same non acceptable procedure.

What is the conclusion of the 1978 Watchtower ?
"It's your personal decision"
Make una Acholardey & Floww23 dey deceive una selves

You know what I liked here, I quoted Enjoy life forever, and you quoted something from 1978, are you saying your GB is confused?

Going by Dates- Enjoy life forever is the latest, which means that's your Governing body current view before the update, Storing of blood for surgery to be taken as transfusion was Banned. Enjoy Life forever page 255

Thank you for at least trying to prove that the GB is a very confused set of people

Maximus692:
Remember the Beroeans?
They refused to swallow everything yet they were eager to accept that the Apostles are God's chosen! Act 17:11🙂

A Good JW is not A Beroan, A Good JW swallows everything from the Faithful slave. He obeys what is written even if it doesn't make sense from an human standpoint as A recent watchtower said

I repeat you are an Apostate

Maximus692:
All these explanations they understood what they are agitating for is that they have left the organization so why should you remain there?🤣

Why do you keep knocking on people doors despite many shut their door and Indicate lack of interest in such visits?

Look in the mirror

MaxInDHouse:
*In the first century was the spirit of God working with Jesus when he chose Judas Iscariot to serve as an apostle?

*Was the spirit of God working with the disciples who performed many miracles only to turn their backs on Jesus whose name they used to perform miracles?

*Was the spirit of God working with the Elders when many brothers they taught and baptized turned out to be AntiChrists?

Jehovah's Witnesses aren't different from their first century counterpart so it's you who is expecting what is not possible:

PERFECTION!🙂

You don't even believe what insight and "Faithful slave" said about the issue of Judas, you are an Apostate. Thank you for confirming to everyone that Insight and the rest are poisonous food from the GB

MaxInDHouse:
You are the most pitiable among these people because you don't know what is happening and instead of you to listen carefully to both side before judging you just decided to take side.
Well the only ground for disfellowship among us is outright rebellion not just error!😟

Not according to your own publications, adding to the pile of evidence that your religion is man made , aside appointing False spies proving no holy spirit in appointment.

How could so called men appointed by holy spirit do the error here ? Can u admit elders decision not guided by holy spirit ?

Going by this screenshot, how many such person were disfellowship in errors?

See below

Janosky:
[b] Take note of John 6:44, "no one comes to me unless my Father draws them".
Who drew the ones in Rev 2:14-15 & Rev 3:9 into the congregation promoting false teachings & immorality?
Most of them held positions of authority & their bad influence were pervasive.
Then in John's day and now.

However, Overseers are often appointed under the guidance of holy spirit.
It doesn't mean we can't lose guard ,like Samuel . 2 Sam 6:6-7.
Like most of the 7 congregations lose guard

when the scripture says no one comes to me except the Father draws them, it was proving the point that those who were drawn into the first century congregations were honest persons AT FIRST.

In fact here is a text from Act 13:48

The people who were not Jews were pleased with what they heard and praised the Lord's word. Everyone who had been prepared for everlasting life believed

This automatically Strike out the comparison you re making with the seven congregation!!!! , The Agents were never drawn by the Father, it was a Mission organized to imprison and Jail. Their appointment if anything proved the Appointment in the religion has nothing to do with holy spirit.

Now back to you admitting appointment in the JW can be lose guard on some appointments, I take it to mean you admitting There are many Elders among you who are not chosen by holy spirit.

And GB members are chosen from this pool of Elders. There is a serious problem!!! And low key it explain why so many policies cause harm to you members.

1 Timothy 5:24
"Some people’s sins are obvious, preceding them to judgment, but the sins of others surface later".

People with ulterior motives may attempt to sneak into positions of authority.
Jehovah who sees the heart would always expose such & flush them out in unexpected ways and means [/b].

Jehovah will do that only if the religion is his own and he appoint their leaders. In JW land, that's not the case. To use your words , a haven of "loseguard " appointments.

A set of GB members ban beard and trousers for many years, people were mistreated, ostracized over this . Hairy people suffered under this administrations, but this set of GB live their lives to the very end. Despite Making a WRONG UNSCRIPTURAL POLiCY, nothing happened to them.

Disfellowship persons were mistreated for years in the kingdom hall, sitting at the back, ignored, yet some set of GB members make that policy, they all live to the end of their life, until others came and said You can greet them now

Some members reject Education and scholarship that could have better their lives, now struggling financially, the people who cause this Hardship Were not weeded out, they lived as GB to the very end of their life. Enjoying travelling and attention


New set came and overturn the decision. The overturn proved it's a group of men becoming Elders and making their way to GB , to control millions of life's.

Janosky:
Matthew 15:13 & 1 Timothy 5:24, Jehovah will have His way & do His will at the appropriate time.

Matthew 15:13 states: "But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up"
The bolded,
Are you admitting those Appointment of Agents and Secret spies has Elders were not planted by God's holy spirit ?

Janosky:
In the "Enjoy Life book, the point of emphasis "Some of these......"
Nah you go decide which one to accept or reject.
[B] The book did not discuss ALL procedures. [/b]


The watchtower June 15,1978 article repeats the same counsel in the update #2... " It's your personal decision".

I'm talking about the ones it discuss.

Now listen again

"There are medical procedures that make use of a patient’s own blood. Some of these​— such as a person donating blood or having his own blood STORED ( emphasis mine) in advance of surgery—​are not acceptable for Christians. ​—Deuteronomy 15:23.

It said concerning the area of transfusions, Storing your blood in advance of surgery is not acceptable for Christians, Yes or no?

Janosky:
The desire to please a Superior , would make someone to do the function of an Agent even when he no like that assignment.

One of them got baptized & resigned from the spy work.
He told his Superiors,he found the Truth & his conscience won't allow him to do the assignment anymore.

He was an agent at the point of being an Elder.. in fact,
You are ignoring the majority that Enjoy the work and how they penetrated deep within the network of your religion to fish for information, Who appointed this men who never had good intentions to begin with as Elders... Holy spirit ?

Janosky:
Thank you for saying your view.
Did that publication you quoted explain EVERY treatment procedures in that category which JW's do not accept?

Still, some of that treatment procedures may have variations that are ok for people who chose BT but not ok for JW's.


https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1FLgDE8DM8/

Clearly says Not for Christians. Do you read ?

Is it okay to store your blood for transfusion according to that place in Enjoy life forever prior to the update , Yes or No

achorladey:
John 6:66-68 didn't talk about going to a place or being member of a religious organisation.

To whom should they go to? Not to where? Jehovah's witnesses have turn to whom to to where.

Good catch

achorladey:
As expected

The Crazy part is Russell didn't leave the church to find an already made group to join, he started to study on his own.

achorladey:
E get as e be ooooo. Even the child abusers all join na work of holy spirit. I tire.

Sent you a Mail.

Janosky:
You have the right to air your view but your own Bible proves that some of those false brothers,false prophets had positions of authority.

Can you look at your bible evidence
, this scenario of 2 Peter 2:1-2 & 2 Timothy 3:5-6 played out in social media recently where christendom leaders were reported for adulterous,immorality with several celebrity women conned with false teaching & immoral relationships.
That is how some people with authority in the early christian fold misused their positions to make disciples for themselves,not for Christ.)
👇


Acts 15:1,24
And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved…

Acts 20:30
Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.


2 Timothy 3:6
For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

2 Peter 2:1,2
But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you

Would you be teaching the brethren in any congregation/
/church if you had no position of authority?


Reason on it, pls .

Act 20:28 Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers

According to Act 20:30 you quoted it says " Shall men arise" shall is a future tense.

I don't think you get the basis of the Issue , the issue wasn't about people in authority later becoming rogues , it was did Holy spirit appoint rogue Fakes as Elders in Paul's day? , or they later turn rogue but Initially were faithful?

Janosky:
Moreover, what about Judas Iscariot? Long before he was born, Scriptural prophecies spoke of the Messiah’s betrayal. (Psalm 41:9; 55:12, 13) The Bible even says that “from the beginning” Jesus Christ knew who would betray him.—John 6:64.

In the light of James 1:14-15, Judas was a victim of his own desires.
It could have been anyone else.
The guy too like money & fell.....

If Judas was a victim of his own desires, then insight is right that Jesus chose a good man initially, later on turn to greedy, Yes ?

MaxInDHouse:
Founder?🤣
Ọmọ calm down and reason someone can't be the founder while many of his beliefs has been changed over the years. People do keep the philosophy of real founders.

The point is when he was noticing inconsistent teachings and contaminated foods like what you called the garbage of insight from your faithful slave, he didn't left to search for another religion, He started to Study FoR HIMSELF. He had no intention of starting an organisation as his writings point out.

So next time u blurt out that find a group, let your head remind you that Russell didn't went in search of any performing Group

You are not ready to learn jàre so go and sort it out for yourself.🙂

You are seeing the inconsistency now, since Judas was appointed strictly to be a future betrayal according to you, how do you open your mouth and deny the concept of destiny?

MaxInDHouse:
Story! Story!! Story!!!
If you find a better performing group let me know!🙂

Russell didn't go finding a better performing Group, he created one. Your logic is so full of dust that Even the JW founder didn't follow it.

My question is this : Do you now believe in Destiny since Judas was appointed to be a betrayal ?

MaxInDHouse:
So insight that most people don't even read has become FOOD to you shey?
Guy no one survives without food that means insight is extra information that could be edited at any point in time not the main food.
That's wisdom for you!😀


Extra information that could be edited or discarded is not FOOD rather what they found helpful in teaching others to become members of the faith.

Edited and discarded 🤣😂😂🤣

Faithful slave produce CONTAMINATED FOOD and POISONOUS FOOD

That's why there are needless deaths and Hardship as a result of their man made policies.

Your PERSONAL opinion!😀
Jesus appointed Judas Iscariot as one of the apostles yet he knew from the beginning what this guy will turn out to be. Judas Iscariot sold Jesus out for money and that's what led to Jesus' execution. Perhaps Jesus wasn't chosen by holy spirit or he wasn't having holy spirit when he selected Judas Iscariot as one of the Apostles!😀

Why rope yourself 🤣🤣
You don't know how much I laughed reading the bolded, Do you by the above agreed that Destiny is real and that Judas was born and Chosen by Jesus for the purpose of Betraying Him ?

Janosky:

Jude 1:4 & Galatians 2:4,2 Cor 11:26, spies (alias false brothers) no be today e start. They infiltrated,embed themselves in the midst of Jehovah's people in Paul's day.

Option A;(according to Flow23 logic)
Jesus disciples following christ were not of God,(example, 1 Cor 15:12 some disciples did not believe Christ resurrection) were false , not genuine because "weeds" existed side by side with them in their midst?

Option B.
The appointment of false brothers into positions of authority e that the Corinthian congregation is not of God,this invalidates the claim that such appointments from the Apostle's Council in Jerusalem were of God?

1Corinthians 13:9 "our knowledge is not perfect.
1 Sam 3:20 &1 Sam 6:6-7,Samuel made similar mistake before Jehovah corrected him.

Is Flow23 learning something from those Bible verses & Matt 13:30 ?
Even when our knowledge is not perfect, Matt 13:30, Jehovah's judgement is perfect .

If only you can think.
The Fact they are directly called false brothers means they were never appointed. CLOCK THAT!

Did any of the verses you quoted claimed those brothers were appointed?

None.

Among Jehovah's witnesses the doctrine stands Elders are appointed by holy spirit. For Secret police spies to have crept in and get appointed proved Appointments in Jehovah's witnesses has nothing to do with God or the JW are false religion and spies were tools from God to punish false religion. Since the GB are also Elders, it invalidate the claim that God chose
or appoint them since Elder appointment in your organisation has nothing to do with God.

MaxInDHouse:
Your PERSONAL opinion!🙂
I told you there are prophecies they are fulfilling that's why millions became submissive to them

Nobody chose them, Elders are evidently not appointed by holy spirit as shown in the case of spies who became Elders only to supply information that led to beating, imprisonment and death.

If God chose those spies it simply means your Religion is Fake.

{Zechariah 8:23} but if you choose to go elsewhere no one is stopping you.
Meanwhile they have said from the onset that they can make mistakes in organizational directions because they are not infallible.
I just don't grasp which part of infallible that's so difficult for you to understand!🙂

If you don't know the meaning of APOSTATES come and stop me from following their directives nah!😀

Watchtower 1992 Nov 15 p.20
“However, loyal elders never try to influence others to reject ANY of the spiritual food provided by God through the faithful slave. As Jehovah's dedicated Witnesses, all of us must be loyal to him and to his organization."

It says " ANY" none


But you reject the Faithful slave spiritual food in Insight? Hi in

MaxInDHouse:
According to them are they infallible?🙂

Of course they were wrong on that as the evidence in the scriptures shows that Judas Iscariot is a lover of material things and right from the beginning Jesus knew he's going to betray him and other apostles knew that Judas use to steal from the money kept with him.

Do you agree with the scriptures or the error found in the Insight?

Between Bible and insight which one do you think GB has no right to alter?🙂

It's Valid not to trust them as God's channel like Jehovah Witnesses claimed since they dispense mistakes as spiritual food ?

Are you aware that you saying GB is wrong is you accepting you are an Apostate ?

MaxInDHouse:
Read to understand instead of gullibly sticking to misconceptions.

Many writers paint an entirely black picture of Judas, but evidently for a while he had been a disciple who found favor with God and with Jesus; his very selection as an apostle indicates that.

Please when did INDICATION turn to ACCURATE KNOWLEDGE?

The insight you quoted didn't say that is the perfect understanding but an opinion which gives room for options. Just as paul gives his own opinion not ultimatum:

Now concerning virgins, I have no command from the Lord, but I give my opinion as one who had mercy shown him by the Lord to be faithful. 1Corinthans 7:25

Was Paul an anointed Apostle?
Was this opinion from Jesus Christ?

This is why you people are out of the organization because you don't meditate like the Beroeans! Act 17:11🙂

It says " EVIDENTLY" not indication

Meaning of evidently

Evidently means clearly, obviously, or to all appearances, used to indicate that something is plainly true based on evidence

They are saying those writers are FALSE , and they are true.

Do you agree with them ? Or disagree as the Apostate you are ?

MaxInDHouse:
Choose between what the Bible says and what you want to take since you are bent on accusing fallible men.😀

Do you know that disagreeing with Insight is disagreement with the GB, therefore you are an Apostate?

Janosky:
Oga, who appointed Saul as king of Israel ?
What happened to him later?

Who appointed Uzziah as king?
What happened later?

God dey appoint people wey later do iniquity ,yet you want GB to appoint flawless people.
Guy, you want perfection wey no exist any where on this planet.
I dorf my hat for you .

Saul was Humble when he was appointed, it's a case of good man go rogue,

Secret police spies Enter the congregation simply to Jail and Imprison by scouting for information, why would holy spirit appoint someone whose intention from beginning was to Jail the brothers ?

Option A: the religion is False, and God was appointing those spies as Elders as his instrument to torment False worshippers.

Option B : Elders appointment of any kind is not from God , and since GB are from Elders, this invalidate their claim to Be Gods chosen since Elders appointment is not from God.

Janosky:

I have one question for you;
Oga,which flaw wey God's people no get in your own Bible from Genesis to Revelation?


Perfectionism = chronic dissatisfaction

"Perfection syndrome, or maladaptive perfectionism, is the relentless, unrealistic pursuit of flawlessness, often driven by fear of failure and leading to burnout, anxiety, and procrastination. It causes individuals to set impossibly high standards, resulting in chronic dissatisfaction"


Have a great day.

To claim the appointment are not perfects simply invalidate the claim that they are done by holy spirit, For holy spirit= Perfection. God doesn't make mistakes. Think with your head


If Appointment of elders don't even come from God, it means GB Appointment is man made as well since they are also from Elders pool.

MaxInDHouse:
Choose one for Jesus.

He selected twelve apostles and one of them betrayed as in sold him to death.

So was Jesus fake?😀

No, Jesus Choose a good Person

Unless the truth doesn't have the truth again, is the truth wrong or right ?

MaxInDHouse:
So when Jesus chose Judas Iscariot that makes him a liar shey?
Or you don't know that many back then also think like you today?🤣

Judas was once a Good person until you agree that this writing from Insight isn't led by God
That is the Truth , because the organisation is the truth.

Since Judas was once a good person as the truth organization says . Your point isn't valid


Therefore Jesus choosing Judas isn't the same as appointing Frauds from Government who later hang, kill and Imprison the brothers and sisters through the information they leaked.

Is God using them to punish false religion.?

MaxInDHouse:
They lied or erred?🤣

Every untruth is a Lie. So can people led by God lie in writing that Judas was once a good person?

MaxInDHouse:
Ọmọ suit yourself jàre!🙂

I repeat it again for the sake of those reading

There can only be two options

1. Those spies are appointed by God to punish your members and jail them because your religion is False

2. Those spies are not appointed by God like other Appointment are not from God , it was men appointing men into Elders position in your religion

Suit yourself! I'm okay with any you choose