₦airaland Forum

Obuks,
Believe it or not the solution to price hikes and guaranteeing supply is a properly implemented deregulation exercise. The process is on course the only snag funding as the license owners have refused to provide counterpart funding and for a foreign investor the local party must carry some of the risk its simple business sense.

If you have looked at the my posts you would have seen that i not only criticised but also made some suggestions.

If the intention is to set up the refineries ourselves? Let me give you an overview of the logistics involved (note this is neither exhaustive nor arranged in order of precedence)

1. feasibility study
2. business plan
3. promoters of the company come together and provide funds for initial expenses such as legal fees, consultancy fees, incorporation fees, site acquisition etc
4. incorporate a company
5. procure the guidelines for registering a refinery and commence the process
6. register the refinery
7. procure funds for the take-off and operation of the refinery
8. procure the equipment for the refinery
9. enter into EPC and technology contracts for the construction, installation and operation of the refinery
10. enter into crude oil sales agreements to ensure steady supply of crude to the refinery
11. enter into take or pay contracts with marketing companies to ensure a minimum level of income for the refinery
12. enter into employment contracts with staff
13. procure equipment suxh as computers, vehicles etc.

Let me stop here lest i give away trade secrets.

A refinery is not childs play so my suggestion is that you understand what it is about before you decide to set up one.

Delarontus thumbs up you hit the nail on the Head!

Its only the uninformed who make such statements

Your guess is as good as mine!

They are perennial late developers, so cant really say if their performances will pick up later on they have shown that they are not down and out until the final whistle.

Abeg na siddon look i dey

delarontus:
We can use this thread to pass a bill on smoking in public since everybody agrees that smoking should not be done in public because of the health risk it portends for non-smokers.

That is the first step then others must follow. Like i said the issue is not a lack of legislation, but a lack of implementation/follow through.

Lets look beyond passing the law, what do you suggest after that?

kay:
Joftech, you have made me very sad. Know why? Because the same problem with the Nigerian populace is what is rearing its ugly head in this discussion. For just daring to suggest that we all contribute only N1000, Joftech is insinuating that Omo Alhaja is looking for a new gold mine and has the audacity to suggest that we pay him to build the website. Joftech, you are a very selfish Nigerian! In fact, its your type that is exactly the problem with Nigeria, because its your type that will get into government position and begin to `chop'. Once again Joftech, I repeat, you are a very selfish Nigerian.

Klex, I like your own submission. Unlike Joftech, whose brain seem to be a made up of components from a money counting machine, your submission was much more objective. Believe you me, I don't know anything about the logistics. But I know we can start by selling this idea to NLC. Their strikes are no longer working. A change in tactics is of paramount importance. NUPENG, PENGASSAN and the rest are affiliates of the NLC. They are the ones that should work out the logistics

And to the second point you raised. Conservative estimate puts the population of Nigeria at 120m. That figure multiplied by N1000 gives you 120 billion. Half that amount will comfortably build two to three refineries.

Klex, why don't we for once jettison the problems associated with a project like this and look at the possibilities. Ideas are what moves the world. This is an idea. Let's move with it and see how far we can go.

It will only cost us N1000 and it just might be the solution to all our fuel problems

kay,
What i am asking is what evidence do we have that the NLC can run a refinery? have they provided documentary evidence, is it their word of mouth or are we simply foisting upon them a responsibility they cannot possibly discharge? forget about them please.

They do not have a solution to the incessant price hikes. This particular increase was so ominous given the rise in the cost of crude oil in the last few months everybody knew it was coming what did NLC do? furthermore, i am not convinced of the good intentions of the leadership of the NLC. Why must there be a fuel increase before they engage government constructively? It seems that the NLC is only interested in grandstanding and fighting price hike even with the glaring evidence that the strike option is played out. Is that all we are about? what of those silent labour injustices whats going on there? rampant casualisation, abuse of expatriate quotas, have they even pushed for a review of the workmens compensation act which is the only legislation that deals withe workers health, what of the Labour Act? There is so much for them to do!

Regarding capital do you sincerely believe that you will call upon Nigerians and everybody will contribute just like that? if you are asked will you not think it is 419? You know that we have a unity issue. I am simply saying do your research and come up with a business model, work out the logistics of commencing operations, then come and sell me the idea, thats all i want to see. It is very unrealistic to expect the people of this country to fund such a venture based on what an idea? Even so, we have so many people who have never in their life amassed as much as N1k at a time. If we are serious, lets look to venture capitalist organisations and foreign financial institutions and to do that you must have carried out a feasibility study and have a business plan to be even get your foot in the door.

Baba will not miss this golden opportunity. You know that his acolytes already call him OBJ of africa. i believe he fancies himself in the mould of the great Mandela. However, it does appears that his brusque manner of doing things is actually effective on the continent.

I just pray we will not have to commit troops in the event that the conflict escalates, thereby once again condemning our youths to die in a war they know nothing about and has nothing to do with them.

i agree smoking should be banned in public, and it already is. I believe the ban was a policy engineered by the late prof. ransome kuti when he was the health minister.

The fact that you are not aware of this shows that its not enough to merely issue a legislation, because we have a miserable record of enforcement. For instance its already an offence to drop litter/refuse in a public place, to spit, and to do number one l(ets not even talk about number two) in public. But we all know what our eyes see in this country in flagrant disregard of the law! anybody who takes the flyover from dolphin/ fed secretariat early in the morning will feel me. I mean you see a long line of okada riders sitting on the edge of the flyover doing number two just a few metres away from a large police checkpoint.

Also look at this - when baba came in 99, it was reported in the news severally that baba was such a natural person that if he felt pressed, he would stop his convoy to ease himself by the roadside (he's a complete bushman if you ask me).

Maybe what we need to is to always insist that people not smoke around us, promote public enlightenment programs explaining the ills of second hand smoke as well as have law enforcement officers who are interested in performing their primary obligation and who are not the first in line to break the Law! maybe then our laws may just become effective.

Bibi,
Nothing wrong with that system if you remember from social studies class, we have formal and informal education systems in Nigeria, which cater towards different professions. My problem now is that a lot of the apprentices never take the effort to conclude their training before taking off due to the cost of "freedom" as well as their rush to start making money. They in turn perpetuate this lack of knowledge when they take on apprentices (garbage in garbage out). That is the reason for some of the anomalies u see with these artisans. Equally i am sure you have also come across very good artisans as well, not so?. That should make a good case for the system.

The formal education thing and university are not for everybody. As you have rightly stated, we need more trade schools in the country.

It seems you did not follow the case.
Yes, the prosecution alleged that omisore's younger brother alani actually led the team of killers which included fryo to carry out the dastardly assignment. That was the connection to Iyiola Omisore. So please dont laugh be informed!

My point was that everything we think we know about the matter is really in the realm of conjecture there is no hard evidence. but imagine if omisore or fryo's fingerprints had put them at the scene of the crime then we would be talkin with authority.

Having a fingerprint databank will help us do things properly

It is not a misplaced priority at all, infact its been long overdue! For too long we have simply carried on as a disorganised lot. Do you know that Nigerien beggars all have their national ID's? let us have a databank and know who our people are.

I just wish to add that I think the finger print databank prepared pursuant to the scheme will afford the police an opportunity to engage in real forensic policing as is done now the world over and not this their voodoo strong arm tactics( well that is if they can get off their lazy behinds and show an interest in something other than "egunje". Scenario - if the police had taken prints from the bola ige murder scene and run it through the databank, his killers may have been apprehended by now!

I got my ID card without hassles, If any attempt is made to extort money from you, dont keep quiet take the matter up with higher authorities. This culture of criminal silence and acquiesence of this egunje thing has got to stop we need to resist bribe giving and taking at our individual levels!

omo alhaja,

seems like you have missed my point. What i was simply asking you in essence is if this your idea has been researched thoroughly? has it been implemented successfully elsewhere?, do you understand the logistics involved? Ideas always sound good but implementation may be a mother... What is your plan for following through on this idea? This is not about you its aimed at spurring you to think critically of how you can help the country.

Secondly, refinery capital is not a N1k contribution matter, these things often go for about $300m you must have some alternative source of financing dont u think? cos if you do ur math you'll discover that just getting capital may prove to be a loooong winded venture.

Do you really believe that labour can run a refinery, have they come out to say so? or do you think that oshiomole will not line his pockets if given the chance? the guys drives around in the very latest state of the art jeeps, the guy know good thing abeg!

So i admonish you once more please read and research ( not internet alone) you'll will surely discover practical ways of helping the country.

God
My family and friends and lovers
Airconditioning
Cash
work

Who says if Nigerians buy nepa we will not run it into the ground as well? lets forget all this ideas and get down to the real issues, and like i said before the legal, commercial and political logistics are just too daunting, besides the government has never cared for the people before, why should this situation be any different? Forget this government should do this government should do that mentality. Let our new mantra be self actualisation and self development. When the people are organised it will definitely reflect in good governance.

Joftech please go and read animal farm and see what happens when the "masses are in power"

Omo Alhaja i hate to say this but your ireality is far removed from this country. How many people in Naija do u think can afford this N1k that you are asking us to donate? Abi u dont understand the level of poverty here? This is a country where in Lagos (the commercial capital) you see workers trekking home from the island just because they cannot afford the fare.

Assuming all of us on the forum buy into this idea; have you thought of the logistics? for instance who would keep the money, who will negotiate with the technical people abi make we build am ourselves? wat will be the size of the refinery, how we go recoup our investments etc....fight go kill all of us! Bros please avoid making simplistic suggestions, thats wat put us in this problem as a country.

It has been said that if u want to hide anything from a blackman, keep it in a book. So i belive that as a first step we need to imbibe a reading culture and revive our learning institutions. This will help us understudy other success stories elsewhere whether at individual, community, corporate and national levels.

Please let us not seek to re-invent the wheel with these harebrained schemes that are simply trial and error initiatives at best at this stage of our national development. There are simply too many success stories to borrow from we just need to know where to look. People, a fool at forty....

Also brothers and sisters in diaspora please come home and contribute their quota to our development, you guys see have seen how things can be done properly so come and share.

Nobody is going to help os we must do it for us.

The refinery problem boils down to the fact that Naija businessmen are not interested in long term investments, instead we prefer to invest billions in "quickies " like real estate. Tell me, which oyinbo man will invest in this refinery business when our own people are shying away? ...well maybe the chinese, but do we want our country run by china men? they are generally quite a crooked bunch and are not terribly fastidious about worker welfare, taxes or corporate social responsibility and are given to capital flight.

Government has granted at least 15 licenses to indigenous companies what has been done with them? instead they are busy looking for who will buy the licenses off them.

Another factor is the hydra headed monster called "vested interest" as generator importers have done to nepa, so are the fuel importers doing to the petroleum sector. It has simply become too profitable to allow the refineries to function. Look at oando for instance they just spent $100m as signature bonus for an oil block (they will probably spend another hundred to get first oil) yet everyday the marketers cry that the business is not profitable who is fooling who!

Baba as well why has he refused to include petroleum importation contracts under the due process office as all other procurement contracts have been? why is he sitting on the petroleum ministry and what has been the benefit to us as a nation for this? i think if he had been an appointee he would have been sacked a long time ago for gross incompetence.

I agree with joftech we need to make judicious use of our natural resources it is criminal that we are "washing our hands with spittle at the riverside"

Seun,
dont u think its a bit high handed of you to reserve the power to annul the popular vote? This Kind of attitude just goes to show that we really have the kind of rulers we deserve.

Is it askin too much for u to set a criteria for nomination and leave the selection to popular vote? Why must u tinker with the process? Whatever is worth doin id worth doing well!

That aside the award thingie is a wonderful idea, thumbs up! But do the winners get cash awards, that will definitely activate my competitive juices

Guys,
Quick point of correction to my earlier post; i have been made to understand that the raid was carried out some weeks ago and the news was only just released. My question: is it fortuitous that this highly damaging news piece was released only after Atiku made his now infamous statement? something nasty is in the offing for Atiku, the final seal will occur when baba appear in his house late at night demanding for pounded yam and bush meat!

To other issues:

joftech you give Atiku too much credit for spoiling the country's inamge, when baba and his family members steal finish where do u think they stash their loot, or you do not think they are helping themselves? of course oyinbo man knows the man is just pontificating about this anti-corruption thing. U see i thank God for Fela and how he blew the lid on OBJ and MKO in those days. Frankly speaking, the man is simply wicked and you cant take that from him. What i see now is that baba wants to take corruption back to the '70s when it was strictly an elitist preserve, where only his cronies are allowed to help themselves he will never accede to the chop i chop syndrome perpetuated by IBB. Its not a mistake that its always the mans real and imagined enemies that get prosecuted for corruption.

Kazey just to address your earlier point the veepee's diplomatic immunity cannot be removed by executive fiat and yes, his wife and direct family enjoy the same protection, therefore it is irrelevant that the house is in her name. Immunity goes with the territory of his job, except he loses that job it cannot be taken away from him. Does the FBI want us to believe that they do not know that our veepee stays in that residence? What happened here is a case of typical yankee arrogance aided by Naija connivance. The Hawks in the OBJ administration have once again taken flight...poor Atiku . Well for him it was fun while it lasted.

This god father/political son fight thing is proving to be a recurring decimal in Nigerian politics. We all know that OBJ was installed in 1999 and 2003 with Atikus assistance but now he is flexing muscles and has even bitten off the finger that fed him all that while.

To me OBJ's day of reckoning will start on the day that his sheenanigans imperils the elitist corrupt way of life in Nigeria, and it begins to appear that business may no longer go on as usual for them, they will find a final solution for him a la abacha, and when i say elitist i mean the faceless mafia who hav been consistently influencing our politics and stealing this country blind for decades.

I think we should look at the substance of this matter and not be distracted by all this smoke and mirrors.
The issue is not that the VP owns a house in maryland, which of them doesnt have one? We will be deceiving ourselves if we think that these our so called leaders and public officers have not helped themselves to the till (ourselves included if we get the chance), it is the norm in this here parts. who wants to live in Ikoyi and thereafter pack to his village or okokomaiko, after A/C official car to enter molue, who wants to suffer the indignity of waiting for an irregular pension? the person will go crazy! It is not until the system works that this primitive acquisition of wealth will cease because everything is bought with cash we cannot depend on the State, it has failed us! Right now it is only the grace of God that can help a man flee from the temptation of embezzlement.

To the main issue, of course Atiku is going to get the boot either he goes quietly or he will be kicked out. The precedent has been laid by Thabo Mbeki and we all know baba will not be outdone by anybody when it comes to African politics (afterall he is OBJ of Africa! the caped messiah!). You will have noticed that in recent times the VP has finally broken his studious silence, i believe he has seen the handwriting of baba on the wall and he knows that baba is going to destroy him politically. All his acolytes have decamped the man is all alone now and he is fighting for his political life. I do not think it was mere coincidence that after he said baba swore to him that he will quit that his residence was searched. What precipitated that statement after so many years of keeping quiet? They are both playing cat and mouse games with this country. Atiku is on his own, when he should have taken the fight to the man years back when baba started attacking his power base he was doing mumu, now its too late.

If baba pities him, he may be given the option of negotiating his exit. Just watch and see, like i said we have the precedent already!

More the issue is what does baba want? is he seeking a 3rd term? does the man want to die in office?
we are 2yrs to the end of his tenure, yet there is no clear successor; why do these people feel they can play God with our destiny? The man and his technocrats speak a language that does not portray a clear intention to leave by 2007. These are the issues that i believe are putting this country in peril.

My prayer is if that is really the man's intention, may God step into our situation and resolve the problem peacefully as he did Abacha! (no i am not advocating the mans death but if thats wat we need then so be it)

Gina,
I think u meant to say i dont need it. thats fine good luck to ya!

Gina dearie,
...tsk tsk tsk u will never get far with that type of mentality. There are so many wonderful men out there better shine ur eye b4 all the good ones pass u by, and just in case u response is that uv neva met any then i think that says a lot about ur environment, judgment and value system.

hot angel ur beef for the menfolk is maybe getting out of hand. really, do u think men are that dumb that we cannot the signs if a woman is holding back? and if the guy is equally cautious both of u will probably never get anywhere. at some point in time u must fall and it will b hard just pray that the man sef go fall mugu or else.....

Its a dangerous game that John is playing and i believe that he go wound o! John is a snake, he is wat we call a "pant" and i really do not care about his motivation.

If James gets back wit his babe John will not hav anywhere to hide and shame will kill him hopefully. if he likes the girl there are better and more standup ways of toasting her. Even if the girl was his sister, man - woman relationship is not something a 3rd party shld intercede in cos u never know where theyr coming from and if they make up u wont b there and then they'll both hate u for tryin to ruin their lives.

in short John ...mind ur business !

Guys pls why the pissing contest, uv come around to that age old BS argument that women are better than men and vice versa. This is an age old BS argument that no side ever wins. Generalisations really are the source of all the agro btw the sexes. Really i pity the women who think that all men are the same with the same behavioural patterns and so therefore they do not need to understand their man (if uv seen 2 can play that game wit morris chestnut n vivica fox ul get my drift). if u dont take the effort dont complain wen the sh..t hits the fan. besides wats wrong with breakin up with a woman? must we marry every woman we date? is a relationship a prison? am sure even the women wont want that.

A relationship is about discovery its not a prison sentence, pple change, cos a man once said he loves u and that changes that doesnt mean he lied at the time, it may just mean that his feelings hav changed so do u now chain the guy down? no, u let him go!. u may think me selfish but really, if i find out i dont jell with a woman i make for the door; if my reasons are deemed inappropriate, so be it!

Women like to assume too many things; for instance, even when in a "fling" which a partner knows that its all about the sex and nothing else, my experience is that if ur the kind of guy who can afford some of the good things in life, do ur "business" very well and u treat the woman like a lady, she will begin to think things that will only lead to her hurt in the end.

lastly i think wen there is a break up there is too hasty a move to condem the man, from my experience, women usually hav their fair share of the blame, it is thus simply escapist to blame the men alone, why not try thi, wen next any of u girls suffers a break up, sit down think it thru mayb u did som things wrong, mayb the signs were there that u were nt compatible bt for reasons best known to u, u decided to forge on, basically learn something copnstructive from the break up and pls stop lashing out at men as the cause of all ur problem its simply unproductive.

FFF - fine from far but far from fine
oyinbo - white man
cora- lebanese/indian
....ill b back!