₦airaland Forum

Nihilist:
You are the lone voice of stupiditty in this discussion.

I'm a Chelsea fan and maybe I cant hear or see you...but what of the Manyoo fans that can see and hear you embarrass yourself with every post?

Leggo...you need to let go of your foolish opinions and be enlightened.

I respect people with different opinions and I can make decisions based on what I observe.. You came here all the way from your ogogoro joint to spew nonsense all over a discourse that doesn't have the slightest connection to Chelsea FC ; History.
are you not leading a pathetic life son? get back to the joke section where you belong.

bigkesh:
No forward is better than Ronaldo.......Respect the boss

what of Pele?

afrodoc2:
Ronaldo won 2 world cups( 1 as a squad member and 1 as a boss). Also played in 2 final matches scoring 15 world cup goals.
World Cup trumps UCL, Has Messi won any underground world cups we have not heard of?
I am not going into player comparisons but please discuss El Fenomeno with the respect he deserves.

lol.. coogar said he delivers for club and country, surely he must have won on the grandest stage in his club too.. I respect biggie ronaldo of course.

Nihilist:
You talk like a m0ron, look like a m0ron, and sound like a m0ron...but you think you're a physics professor.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

you can't see me, can't hear me... you are a Chelsea fan

elampiro:
I have pulled out the best defenders of all time. None played in Messi `s era.

Even Lucio that is not as good as the previous legends locked out Messi even when Inter fell to 10 men. I wonder what would have happened if he faced Beckenbauer, Baresi, Maldini. And the rest in top 10 from Pele's era.

elampiro are we discussing facts or myths? only Beckenbauer was pele's mate among these defenders, no??
great defenders yet people people averaged one per gme.. sigh

Nihilist:
You are irredeemably dull.

Why stop at comparing Lahm to Messi...why not compare Messi to Oliver Kahn?

but you are quite the retardded imp, my friend.. I simply corrected your nonsense talk.. everyone has an opinion but some of yours should be kept close to your chest

coogar:
go and watch 1966 world cup against portugal. watch 70 world cup against uruguay. pele was nearly murdered in those games. back then, a player couldn't be substituted so you must carry on.

abeg, forget messi!
he's not in the same league as maradona & pele or even the fat ronaldo that won ballon d'or at the age of 20. these ones did it for club & country. it didn't matter who they have in their team.....they always delivered.

messi @ barcelona - 110% good
messi @ argentina - 20% good.

the difference is ridiculous!

did ronaldo win a underground UCL we are unaware of?

Nihilist:
Dude I'm only responsible for what I type, and not what you comprehend

I listed examples of some of the true greats of the game...who have won everything there is to win at club level...with the added distinction of winning the world cup.
I could have listed Thierry Henry instead of Pele/Maradona, Pirlo instead Xavi/Zidane, or Cafu instead of Lahm\Cannavaro.

The point is simple. You need to win the World Cup first before you can stake your claim as the greatest...until then, sit at the next table

I'm telling you as a matter of fact that you are ridiculous to call lahm a true great of the game if messi is on table two

Nihilist:
You seem to have a problem with English comprehension.
What part of that post implies that Lahm is the greatest full back of all time?

you have a problem with continuity ,out of all the names that have been floated today who has mentioned someone who is not regarded in some quarters as the greatest ever in a capacity( overall or in a specific position)

Nihilist:
I split it into forwards, midfielders, and defenders for easier understanding.

Messi is a forward, and will be compared against Pele and Maradona....and yes he is not yet on their level.

apart from the fact that it is ludicrous to consider lahm the GOAT of full backs, the rest is plain ridiculous.

coogar:
maradona actually played with sticks. maradona chose to play for napoli, not the other way round. big clubs begged for his signature but he chose a lower tier team & he proved his worth there. it's easy to win trophies when you play for a big team.

compare oshea's league titles to gerrard. in the near future, someone would opine o'shea is better than gerrard cos oshea won more league titles. abeg, what maradona did in 86 is unrivalled. he was the heartbeat of that argentine team - he provided 5 goals + 5 assists in the number 10 position.

really? he had a defence that conceded just 5 goals in the WC and he played with sticks? LOL..So valdano was an average player?
his Napoli team conceded the fewest goals in the league and he scored 14 goals if I'm right? if I were to dissect this record as we always do our United players you would call him poor.

coogar:
all forms of tackling have been removed from the game. pulling an opponent's shirt is a yellow card these days while gentile tore maradona's shirt into pieces in 82 without getting carded.

van basten had to retire prematurely because of injuries. footballers these days are in paradise. messi wouldn't have survived in 50s/60s. the gh-therapy he had as a kid so that his bones could develop wasn't in exist de in the 60s. messi would have been a midget like aki & pawpaw had he been born in the 60s

Ifs, buts..
Why would anyone bring up a scenario where messi is basically handicapped? we are comparing peak performances here and all you have said about rough defending is actually recent history, I have not seen any outrageous 'foul' on Pele go unpunished. please give me a link and let me be informed

coogar:
trophy count is high because of the club he chose to play for. even guardiola is struggling to keep up with the achievements he had at barcelona.

messi is nothing without barcelona. at least xavi, iniesta won 2 european championships & a world cup without messi. what has messi won without iniesta?

And maradona played with 10 other sticks eh? Napoli went on the equivalent of the spree City embarked upon a few years back , you think its a joke to fork out a world record fee ? in his first year in Napoli he wasn't even rated as the best player in the team

Nihilist:
World Cup is the biggest trophy in football....

Winning the world cup is one of the prerequisites for sitting at the same table as Pele and Maradona, Zidane and Xavi, Cannavaro and Phillip Lahm.

zidane , cannavaro , xavi and lahm are greater players than messi? I hope I'm misconstruing your post

Messi is an underachiever but his trophy count dwarfs that of Diego.. watch the goalpost shift

afrodoc2:
LOL see back and forth o.
But who is that said Messi is already a greater legend than Maradona and Pele?
Unfortunately he has to win the world cup to get that accolade. Until he does he would be slightly below them on the next rung with Cruyff, Best, Di Stefano.

I said so, messi a better player than Pele. I trust my own two eyes more than what a bunch of retired almost senile players tell me, I have seen messi live and seen Pele's hames on YouTube and quite frankly it was not all it is made out to be, Pele had the flamboyance that comes with being Brazilian but I doubt if anyone can sit through a clip of him running circles around teams and not just wonder what they were feeding the defenders. There was zero tactical defending, you would basically see 3 defenders converge at the right corner leaving enough space for two elephants to have a tap dance before tapping into tho empty net ( elampiro's heroic keepers would have dived before the shot ).
Just watch Pele

elampiro:
No you should be the one to think. How old is club football? About 80 to 100 years before Pele. How come Pele owns the highest number of goals in a single season in Brazil? If he scored 58 goals in 1958 why did anyone else not score 150 against the suppossed far weaker defenders long before Pele arrived football world?

Pele's legendary skills made his defenders at his time look stupid. The same defenders Ganicha and some other legends from Germany, Spain, England, France, Argentina find hard to beat to score.

When Ronaldinho used leg over to dribble Ashley Cole in world cup quarter final, was Cole an slowpoke to have gone the wrong way completely? Cole was the best left back in the EPL around 2006.

Before Maradona no one could get past two defenders that period, but Maradona turned same defender to mugus.

how old is Association football itself?
elampiro, as always you have farted instead of communicating. a simple Google search would reveal that the closest thing to a league in Brazil was founded in 1933. how many players had the hype Pele had? It is not news that your 'legends' count goals scored in five-a-sides so I won't dignify that question with a response.
so maradona suddenly taught people how to get past defenders? So George best was merely teleporting to get past them eh?

elampiro:
Pele played in stone age, he is remembered for ever. Zico played in digital age, he is almost forgotten and unknown to under 25 boys and girls.

In last world cup final Argentina came face to face with Neuer about 4 times, they all miss, including Messi.

One vs one have always been scarce, but legends make them look cheap.

lord knows I didn't say legends had the one on one, I'm telling you even the sweeper could run the full length of the pitch and still be left face to face with the opposition keeper. no be only scarce na farce... so you think the world cup has as strong a pull as the UCL presently? you are more delusional than imagined bro

elampiro:
ZICO IS BETTER THAN MESSI.

IN 20 years Messi would be forgotten.

Defenders of old were even better. Which defender today can match Baresi, Maldini, Stam, Adams, Carlos? DEFENSDERS ARE REGRESSING SEF.

You call a player who went past 5 defenders to score a world cup goal ordinary? A player who flicked the ball over a top defender in a world cup final ordinary?

The defenders were poor right? How players did all these things before Pele? Football had been played 100 years Pele, world cup 28 years before Pele. Why was he who came to do the extra ordinary? Wouldnt there have been people to create better records before Pele when the game had less evolved?



Think.

Elamps you should be doing all the thinking here, you've been mentioning the same set of defenders all day ,who were the defenders when Pele played. don't give us players who even I have seen play.. name the defenders who let Pele get away with some of the most ridiculous stepovers the world has seen, you will say the defenders had a license to kill but if Pele with his ivanovic-esque bum can nutmeg and flick the ball over them imagine what cr7 the eternal showoff would do..

elampiro:
I am sure even in 100 years to come you wont have a clip of Messi messemarizing defenders enroute to scoring a world cup goal, not to talk of doing a flick over to score in a world cup final match. Or Messi lifting world cup trophies.

In 100 years time you wont have Messi having a goal per match.

Till thy Kingdom come, you wont have a clip of 17 years old playing in a world cup. Not to talk of scoring 6 goals in 4 matches.



For your information, there are beautiful clips of Zico but no one talks of him today. In 30 years time kids would not know Messi except he wins a world cup. Are we on same page?

lol... in this digital age people will not know messi in 30 years? Words on Marble by Elamps..
Did Cruyff, Best, Cantona win the WC? Elamps, in 100 years a virus would have erased all that is left of Pele nutmegging defenders who were probably all on LSD during the game..like for real the sheer number of times players found themselves one on one with the goalkeeper was amazeballs.

elampiro:
Maradona was an Attacking midfielder , from there he dribbled everyone ahead of him to score.

Messi even played as one of front three in the tournament.

You don't seem to understand the foundation of my argument , defending back then contrary to the myth your like propagate, was terrible. If messi, ronaldo played then ,they would bang in 50 goals each by the winter break. I'm trying to upload some gifs but my network is messing up..
Jair scored because Pele inspired him. YoriYori. and all through the WC and Copa didn't Argentina ride solely on messi?

elampiro:
I am not taking away any of Messi's credit, but if his team mate didnt score, why did Messi not score? Messi missed a good chance in the world cup final. If he scored in the copa final, would the match have gone into extra time?

Pele scored in two world cup final matches, and was obviously the star man. He was easily also star man in club final matches he played.

Maradona, did the extra ordinary to help Argentina win the world cup. He dribbled everyone in his way three times in the quarter and semi final. He went to Napoli and delivered.

Messi also has Mascherano, Aguero, Di Maria, Tevez, Higuian, and some of the best defenders. A team made from two U-21 world cup champions from 2005 and 2007. Messi best player in 2005 and Aguero best in 2007. It's not like Messi is from Greece or Cameroun.

hehe.. Argentina plays two strikers ahead of messi, why don't you blame aguero,higuain ,dimaria and the defenders extraordinaire like rojo and otamendi for failing to inspire Argentina like garrincha and jairzinho did when Pele wasn't up to par??

elampiro:
So how come Phil Jones has never been rape'd. Phil Jones who took out Robben and Ribery?

You call a world cup final defender rubbish? May be you should go and check how many goals that team conceded before Pele murde'red them. To the extent a team mate of that defender applauded Pele. Which meant he had regard for that defender.

1970, Pele also finished Italian defence. Italy had the best defence those days- water tight.

If you saw Video clips of a player world cup over 20 years. what else do you want? He even performed better in his club according to stats and report.

in 10 years I'll show you a video of Cr7 tearing ass in LA liga and UCL over 20 years too..are we watching the same clips? where Pele stands on the by line for 5 secs before a defender got to him? water tight defending abi na waterlogged?

elampiro:
How do I know? The tapes were many, and I was just a boy enjoying life growing up . But my favourite was the one titled 'boys from Brazil'. Because that was basically highlight of all Brazil world cup goals from 1930 to 1982.



Eusebio and Puskas were renowned prolific scorers. Where there is Messi and Ronaldo, there will also be Ibrahimovic and Falcao.

I'm telling you for a fact that the only videos you would see are of his world cup performances and few Santos games anything else they tell me is hearsay to me. Elamps be frank the videos you saw , the first course of the defenders was to charge like Phil Jones . when you charge like that even bebe would be like Garrincha

elampiro:
I watched plenty of Pele's clips as a kid. In fact I repeated many old school matches in VCR cassette way back. The cassettes ended mostly in Italy 82. There have been footballers, and there have been footballers. They come and go. I love a certain Jaizinho. I love Zico.

After Pele, they said there will never be another magician because football had evolved. Then Maradona came. Later they said it will never happen again. They said Di Lima and Zidain was the end. Then Messi and CR7 came. That is life.

There were also great defenders. They come and go. Football is evolving, but defenders of today could be said to be less effective than Baresi, Maldini, Costacuta, Stam, Adams, etc. If these people were to return to youthful age today, will will walk into any team as the leaders.

I think we should give due to those who deserve it. People are saying football was poor in Pele's time, but how did he manage to average one goal per match when other greats in his time couldn't make 0.4 goal per match?

how many of his 1million goals are on tape elamps? Eusebio, puskas both have 0.97goals/game and we are are assured there is no exaggeration.

elampiro:
What goal ratio did Garricha have? Chalton? All his contemporary.

Kids of these days might say Mike Tyson fought against weakeners, that was why he was able knock people out within minutes, even seconds. When you go back, you will see even in the time of Ali, the fights could be said to be stronger.

are you saying they played harder football then? answer straight up.
were garrincha and charlton strikers elamps??

elampiro:
Brazil won the 1958 World Cup.
Pelé arrived in Sweden sidelined by a knee injury but on his return from the treatment room, his colleagues closed ranks and insisted upon his selection.[21][60] His first match was against the USSR in the third match of the first round of the 1958 FIFA World Cup, where he gave the assist to Vavá's second goal.[61] He was the youngest player of that tournament, and at the time the youngest ever to play in the World Cup.[62] He scored his first World Cup goal against Wales in quarter-finals, the only goal of the match, to help Brazil advance to semifinals, while becoming the youngest ever World Cup goalscorer at 17 years and 239 days.[58] Against France in the semifinal, Brazil were leading 2–1 at halftime, and then Pelé scored a hat-trick, becoming the youngest in World Cup history to do so.[63]

On 29 June 1958 Pelé became the youngest player to play in a World Cup final match at 17 years and 249 days. He scored two goals in that final as Brazil beat Sweden 5–2 in the capital of Stockholm. His first goal where he flicked the ball over a defender before volleying into the corner of the net, was selected as one of the best goals in the history of the World Cup.[64] Following Pelé's second goal, Swedish player Sigvard Parling would later comment; "When Pelé scored the fifth goal in that Final, I have to be honest and say I felt like applauding".[65] When the match ended, Pelé passed out on the field, and had to be attended by the medical staff.[29] He then recovered, and was compelled by the victory to weep as he was being congratulated by his teammates. He finished the tournament with six goals in four matches played, tied for second place, behind record-breaker Just Fontaine, and was named best young player of the tournament.[66]


- So Pele only played 4 matches in his forst world cup just coming from injury inside the world cup, and he could be said to be probably the tournament best player at 17?

oga sit down with your Pele yarns ..imagine flicking the ball over the defenders head for over 200 of his goals, you think its a coincidence all of the ancient players we deify now have almost a goal per game ratio??

SailorXY:
what's all these Pele shittz? any updates about we signing the midfielder & the center back

lol.. na update you want? Goal UK is reporting galatasaray's Mulsera as possible DDG replacement..

Pele scored over 500 goals from friendlies OK. Simple question can you compare the micro short wearing players of the fifties to the modern age ? Humans are designed to evolve and not regress.. you watch YouTube clips and judge based on that,? highlights reel

tsdarkside:
okay... i warned you..but heyy...i have time...let the bashing begin.....

who the hell writes: Personal text: Your face looks like your armpit, I swear! Look...??

someone who's banging your mom without a rubber

tsdarkside:
you,,,smutje,dont even start with me,or else i will concentrate myself on you.....

concentrate on your issues first

MizMyColi:
^^^
Women Rock!
Amazing Creatures, That's What They Are!

no offence, but you do know putting your hand in someone's mouth during a seizure is pointless right?