₦airaland Forum

casualobserver:
You are missing the point. The messianic leader you are looking for will never emerge 1) because the powers that be will not allow and most importantly 2) the citizens are so conditioned to corruption, to be transactional have apoverty of mind and spirit, mediocrity and servitude they won’t not support his emergence. Therefore good people don’t put their hats in the ring.

The biggest problem are the citizens. They are the ones that will prevent the emergence of good leaders and frustrate his efforts if he manages to get there. Decades of mismanagement cannot be overturned overnight, if a good leader comes in, it will require tough changes, the same citizens will turn again him.

I know many technocrats who have served in government appointments or aspired to elected office, they all say the same thing. Our problem is our people! Even in our daily lives, it i difficult to encounter a trust worthy Nigerian.

If I am contesting for office to help develop and I am sincere, I am a modest reasonable financially comfortable man with no intent to loot. My sim is to get to office and work for the good of the people…..why am I paying you to vote for me? Why am I paying you to be a polling agent? Why am I paying you to attend a rally? Why am I paying you to campaign for me? Why am I paying you to be a spokesman?
Already I have a tough battle fighting the establishment if I win, I will have a tough job fighting the civil servants and Labour unions and you who I am fighting for, I should now be paying you again to vote for me to help you? Me I am financially comfortable, I will manage my comfort, I will send my kids abroad to educate them. Collect your money from those who are willing to pay you and what you see, you see!

Understandably your position is based on emotion and hope to see your country turn around. Read your post again you keep talking about leaders, leaders. You are ignoring the role of the people in this mess!

I am sorry to burst your bubble. I grew up in Nigeria when Nigeria worked, I know what it took. I lived abroad for 2 decades, I know what it is required from the citizens. Past bad leaders have damaged the pysche, soul and spirit of the citizens to the extent that they can NEVER elect a good leader!

That is the point: the leaders you seek exists but they can NEVER emerge from the citizenry we have today! If by some miracle they emerge the same citizens will turn against them when they begin the necessary reforms.

1. The citizens don’t have enough power as things are now to refuse the choice of ideal leaders. Number one they don’t control the security infrastructure of the state (once they hear gunshots they are off because the justice system can’t even guarantee they will be served justice), number two they don’t have nearly as much resources to determine things. The list goes on so let’s not pretend that they have as much say.
2. Even if they come out to protest, they can get shot and nothing will happen. They don’t have power to determine much in this clime. If people have the choice to select their ideal leaders, they will go for it. I know that there are some that have been conditioned to poverty and other vices but Nigerians really really desire a good and working governments. A lot of Nigerians want a better system that works for all. Therefore your number one point that the powers that be won’t allow the ideal leader is where the problem is (a leadership issue).
3. You need to state clearly how the people will frustrate a good leader if he emerges and the powers that be are willing to be fair to allow fair competition. Do you mean people will just say “no we don’t want you?” On what grounds will they reject someone who has a track record of credibility and accountability and good welfare to the people?
4. What tough changes will a good leader introduce that will make the citizens turn against him please? You need to understand that it is the leaders that pay monies for campaign, rally, polling agents, etc. They are the ones that flash the money out and if you flash millions in a poverty-ridden society caused by leadership failure in the first place, there will be many takers. Individuals are willing to campaign for their choice leaders when they find them without demanding anything.
5. The solution is never to continue with a crop of leaders that don’t want accountability. You can never win that war of changing the society with those kinds of people at the helm. The powers that be will fight tooth and nail to ensure that the people remain relegated. They will frustrate accountable governance, rule of law and robust institutions that would check their excesses.
6. There is no question the Nigerian society is terribly affected due to decades of failed leadership which has ensured that the corruption has eaten deep but the way forward is not to continue to support the same system and its promoters but seek to overhaul it. It’s not going to be easy but at east it gives us a fighting chance. There has not been any revolution that came easily.

casualobserver:
You are making my point for me. Except you seem to still insist or don’t get the point that if a system that cannot produce good leaders how can a good leader emerge to change the system?

By definition the leadership options are defective people…..ALL of them! It is a question of levels of defectiveness. Look at the gladiators…Tinubu, Atiku, Obi. The reason these are the choices is because the best refuse to participate. So even with the best will to change, by definition they do not have either the ability or the foot soldiers to execute or both! You can’t give what you do not have!

So you are making my point for me. Leaders are a reflection of the people!

We are forked not because we have bad leaders but because we have bad citizens! Bad leaders can be changed/removed if the citizens rise up but bad citizens can never produce good leaders!

No I’m not making your point. We all agree that the society is in a dire state but where we differ is the cure. At least we agree that all these was largely a fallout of decadence of the Babangida era (leadership).

If the leaders allow the right environment to thrive, the people who you think are terrible without repair will have a new orientation but the problem is that the leaders will never want it because it would scuttle their chances. So these leaders weaponize poverty and lack of education/enlightenment and throw the tribal and religious card to ensure that the people cannot see beyond their noses. Environments condition people to behave in a certain way.

If we are waiting for this current crop to institutionalize good behavior, it’s dead on arrival because:

1. They will never make the electoral umpire truly independent
2. They will infest the judiciary (last hope for the common man) with corruption
3. They will ensure that the institutional checks and balances are totally wiped off
4. They will continue to uphold manual voting and will frustrate the entrenchment of technology in the electoral process
5. They will encourage and promote political thuggery by paying citizens that they have failed to educate and emancipate from poverty, stipends. Etc.

The fight to get leaders that would be accountable is not impossible but difficult given the desperation of those benefiting from the status quo but at least we have a fighting chance. It will take us leaving aside those fault lines that the leaders have tried to instill in us. It will involve us saying yes to the right things and no to the wrong things as follows: Institutional reforms, promotion of technology in the electoral system, checks and balances in governance, etc.

casualobserver:
The Babangida regime was when words like “settlement” and “egunje” were introduced into the vocabulary of the average Nigerian. Babangida democratized corruption and we are paying the price today.

Ofcourse there had always been a small minority of corrupt public officials but under IBB not only did corruption explode in public service but it became rooted in the citizenry and we are paying for the latter today!

The point I am trying to make is that you talk about leaders as if they are imported from abroad? It is from the same citizens that have been indoctrinated in corruption that leaders emerge. Again I know a lot of well meaning people but they will not put themselves up for leadership because it is this same citizens that will sabotage their efforts…..starting from demanding rice or money to vote for them.

The head is a reflection of the body because it is from the pool of citizens that leaders emerge! The few good eggs will never rise to leadership except as appointees of the bad eggs. And when they do they will have to dance to the tune of the piper or quit in frustration.

Only a thief can lead a den of thieves! The hope is you have a reformed thief who understands the ways of the thieves and knows how to checkmate them. Put a technocrat in a leadership political position. Today and odds are he will fail unless he has a godfather. That’s why I laugh when some clamour for the likes of NOI or Adesina. They can perform only as appointees under the cover of a political leader who is himself a gangster! Because you need to be a gangster to run Nigeria if today talk less reform it.

1. In any society (even the best of them) you have the good, bad and ugly. The same way you know some good Nigerians that will not venture into politics because some Nigerians will be asking for egunje, that’s the same way some well meaning ones are not able to make it in because the system is rigged in favour of transactional politicking. Security apparatuses, state money, manual voting with all its deficiencies make it easy for their contemporaries who are benefiting from the corruption to get voted and then do the biding of their predecessors. The good ones have little chance.

2. Leaders who are into this thing will not intentionally relinquish power by strengthening institutions (i.e. making the umpire truly independent, strengthening the electoral law, favouring technology, punishing electoral offenders, etc). We should be looking for people who will want to put power in the hands of the people to make their own choices rather than swim through the tide that the political actors dictate for them.

3. Evil that uses evil to get power wouldn’t intentionally undo that evil because it will affect them. So long as we have people at the helm who are not only gangsters but profit continuously from gangsterism because they must hold on to power, then there is no end in sight for the decadence in society.

4. It’s not easy to get these kinds of good leaders in not mainly because they don’t want to but because the system makes it difficult for them to win. It’s not easy but possible and it starts from you and me supporting what is right, it’s me and you supporting accountability and transparency and not making excuse why we should continue to entrench political rascality. It’s never easy but possible. Any people movement in the world that has succeeded has succeeded because of unity and solidarity. For example, a true Nigerian that means well for the future of this country should not be recommending manual election processes but should argue in favour continuous entrenchment of technology so much so that it becomes increasingly difficult for political desperadoes to cheat. This is the institutional reforms we are taking about.

5. Who are those that will change the systems? It’s not a mechanic or teacher, it’s still the leaders. Rather these leaders entrench poverty and subservience then they throw the religious card and continue to control the people to their selfish benefit. In summary, corrupt politicians typically will entrench systems that will transform the society so waiting for them to do so is going to be an effort in futility. If we demand for good governance, at least we have a fighting chance but if we rely on people who will kill for power, there’d be on end in sight.

casualobserver:
If you confirm that I got your message by just reading the 1st sentence, it means the rest of your post was drivel.

I did read the post this time because it wasnt that long. Again i refer you to my previous post, whether the chicken came before the egg or vice versa, this is where we are. The problem of Nigeria at this point cannot be fixed by "good leadership" there is a whole generation (i call them babangida's children born after 1985) who are the workforce of the country but were raised in corruption and selfishness and an era of "anyhowness".. and they are the majority of Nigerians and they will resist any attempts at change despite saying they want change. Not excusing the older generation but they can be rewired because they know good from bad, they know good from bad, they know patriotism. These 40 and belows...they have no reference point for good citizenship, I gave up on the young generation when i saw what became of the endsars movement. they missed a golden opportunity to redefine the country and instead started cashing out. where are the leaders of ENDSARS and what are they doing today..that tells you all you need to know. Just random leader of protest, you sold out to get a cushy gig abroad and thats our problem. And these are youths!!

A country's leadership is a reflction of its citizens.

To me the greatest hurdle for Nigeria is the damaged pysche of its citizens.

1. I’m happy you referenced the Bababguda era. Ths was a time when corruption was institutionalized in the country. If you recall the words “Chop I chop.” This was the era when corruption was being normalized and it started from the top to the bottom.
2. It’s not only in a society but any system at all the body takes the shape of the head - it’s inescapable. It’s too much to expect an orderly functioning society when the system that is to enforce that order is broken. It’s just like expecting a lecture hall without a teacher (or if the teacher is seated outside) to be without dissaray. Yes there would be disarray because every student will do what’s right in their own eyes.
3. If there was no need for leaders in a society, then why do we have them? It’s because 200 million individuals from different backgrounds, walks of life, exposure, education, life aspiration, social status, etc cannot lead themselves successfully in a co-ordinated manner. It’s impossible and that’s why we have leaders in every civilization.
4. The leaders have the instruments to enforce the right behaviors but followers don’t. If there is any hope for Nigeria that there is a paradigm shift in th business of leadership.

casualobserver:
Fix your self and your neighbor first, I really didn’t read through your post and the previous one simply because from the 1st statements I know it is just another Nigerian blaming others for the problems of which he himself is part of the cause. Nobody is coming to see you.

Nigerians are always pontificating then they go and behave like bad citizens they are.

I see that you didn’t read the post and yet you got the message so that’s a good one. I’m pleased. And just to be clear this is not about blaming others for one’s problem. It’s stating the obvious that in a society that lacks proper administration of justice and law and order, people are conditioned to be bad. The administration of law and order in a society is the exclusive preserve of leadership. You don’t like it but it’s the truth.

casualobserver:
That ship has sailed! The few honest well meaning and capable people do not venture into public leadership because the citizens won’t appreciate him and even when one does he will be frustrated by the same citizens.

Nigeria is rotten to the core. Which came first the chicken or the egg is at this point academic.

Like I always say on the subject. If Awolowo were to govern this batch of Nigerians he would be a disaster because he is too much of a gentleman to govern this criminal nature of the average Nigerian. Awolowo governed at a time when the average Nigerian had honour, integrity and a sense of patriotism.

The average Nigerian todays lacks both.

It is what it is!

So do we keep supporting bad leadership because “everybody is bad?” I don’t think so. I don’t think the reason why there is a dearth of genuinely good people in political offices is because the citizens wouldn’t appreciate them. They may not venture because the power play between the citizens and the rotten political class is very skewed in favour of the political class. In other words even the people that want to select good leaders have little power to resist bad political players who are in in game for their personal benefit. These guys have the security architecture in their favour, they have state money to spend and waste to achieve their goals, there is little or no checks from institutions so they have their way most times even if it’s against the common wish of people.

A typical governor will finish 8 years and appoint his loyalist (most times the loyalists are loyal to the end). This new governor will cover the tracks of his oga and continue in the transactional politicking. This is the main issue. The people are too powerless.

We can’t give up on looking for leaders who are willing to correct institutional anomalies and giving power to the institutions that check excessive power of the executive. There is no one that hasn’t erred before in his/her life but we cannot say “let us continue in the rot since no man holy pass.” But we must say, “who is willing to be held accountable for righting the wrongs even though this person may have not been 100%.”

PS: Note that the test of someone who is truly ready to be held accountable no matter if he/she has not had a 100% record is if they are willing to push policies that empower the people to have a choice and could even threaten their own personal political aspiration. If the people truly have power to choose, political players will ensure that they work for the people. Our leaders today don’t mind doing little or nothing because they know that the people don’t really determine their re-election .

casualobserver:
It is the other way around. It is from the citizens that leaders emerge. If the citizens are rotten…….

It’s a cycle but it can only be corrected by the right leadership. The right leadership is possible because you cannot claim 100% of Nigerians value money more than posterity. If the head is bad, there is no saving the body but if the head is good and the body is bad, the head will change the body it’s just a matter of time.

If there was no use for leadership, then why do we have leaders? Leaders have a unique opportunity to change society because:

1. unlike followers, they are entrusted with the powers of state to enforce the right behaviors by making policies that promote the right behaviors
2. They have the instruments of coercion to ensure that those who do not comply get the stick. This is something that the followers do not have
3. They have a larger reach than a mere individual. Leaders at different levels can influence the community more than a teacher or a mechanic or a banker who is only responsible for his or her immediate family
4. A leader that is telling people to be of a good behavior and is showing good behavior in an exemplary manner will make much impact especially when this leader is technically sound and has a heart for the people and isn’t corrupted.


There is no way to expect a good society when the people that enforce laws are transacting for personal gain but if we have good leaders and a rotten society, the good leaders will ensure that the necessary changes are made and before long there will be societal transformation.

Alliswell248:
The conversation is about tuition fees. Can you compare this to what those in the US pay....average of 30k usd per year.?

Nigerians are too entitled.
They want to get same amount like those in the US, but always criticize the government for everything.

The conversation is not just around school fees but the entire sums needed for training a medical doctor. The foreign schools charge so high but also pay so high for their facilities and equipment - much more than any school here can attempt to. They pay their lecturers much more than what we can ever attempt to do here. All their expenses are in the land of their domicile. If you say NARD is giving wrong stats, you may also produce your well researched and peer reviewed study.

ChiefOkporghe:
Let me indulge you for the last time.
1. The West has always been Capitalistic. Nigeria is more of a Socialistic country. The implication of this is that the West understands that they have to pay for everything. Now, the West could afford to provide these things you mentioned and still charge high because of purchasing power. But Nigeria says “we need more medical personnel so let's make it possible to have plenty even if they don't have the money to pay all the fees as we are just starting as an independent nation".
If you ask any medical personnel who is at least 65 years, they will tell you that when they were in school, the govt was feeding them well.
A lot of things have happened. The govt can't just start charging the full amount. It will lead to chaos and shortage of trained medical personnel. Look at what is happening with fuel Subsidy. Nobody wants to have medical shortage wahala in their regime.
Imagine if it was only Private Universities' that are training doctors...would we have this number of medical personnel currently?

2. Any amount paid at anytime whether it increases due to inflation is a fraction of what should have been the full cost.
Why is the cost of training a medical personnel in a private University higher than that of a govt university and yet both can still work in the same hospital, earn same salary and excel?

See... there's a health crisis approaching and I pity those who don't have the funds to go abroad.
The govt failed by not switching back to full capitalism as we got back into democracy.

Anyways....some people will die... seriously bro.

Look at this.

Medical personnel dey Japa. Meanwhile most are from Govt universities so the government is losing after subsidizing their fees.

If the govt removes Subsidy, there will be a shortage of trained medical personnel as not everyone will be able to afford the fees.

If the govt bans medical personnel that graduated from govt schools from leaving the country until after say 10 years, there will be protest and hospital shutdowns thereby holding the govt ransom. And it's the poor masses that will suffer for it.

The ideal solution would have been a student loan and a way to recover the funds even if the medical personnel Japa.
But will the govt be sincere enough to use the money and create a working environment with benefits as obtained abroad or they will squander it?

Goodnight

We don’t need to compare what happened 6 decades ago. That era has since passed. If you ask Nigerians to pay the amount that is being paid in US, you will have to justify it because it would mean that cost of facilities, equipment, staff costs, cost of land and building in Nigeria is similar to what obtains in US. But these are different climes. I’d rather you say what is the cost to the schools in Nigeria viz-a-viz the amount they charge or what is the cost to the US schools viz-a-viz what they charge. That will give a fairer picture rather than comparing costs and receipts from two dissimilar climes.

So based on what we have on ground in the Nigerian public schools, would you say that someone that pays $3m in our present economy (not that of US) is being subsidized? If he is being subsidized, what is on ground to prove that he is paying less than the facilities that are CURRENTLY available to his wife?

A private university can decide to charge you 1000% of their costs. If you are not interested, the forces of demand and supply will determine whether they remain in business or whether they will have to reduce their price. They do not get government funds (tax payers funds) the way public universities do so their tuition will definitely be higher than public schools. That a private school is costlier than a public school doesn’t automatically imply that the public school is offering over and beyond what they are getting in tuition and tax payers money.

Again if they are charging N3m yet collecting grants, you cannot just tell the guy paying his hard earned money that he is being helped even when they are benefiting from tax payers money.

ChiefOkporghe:
Of course. If you are paying lesser than your counterparts abroad and yet you're getting same quality of education (prove is that when you go to London you just need a basic training to adapt), that should tell you that you're not paying as much as you're supposed to pay.
Try Private schools in the same “Lagos" and leave govt universities. Can the average Nigerian student school in a private university as a medical student?

That’s more of a compliment for the the student that adapted than the school because the foreign school is not just charging high based on knowledge transmitted to the student. They charge so high because they also pay so high to procure equip. They charge so high because what they pay the trainers is many many times over and above what the Nigerian trainers get. They charge so high because they have to pay heavy dollar bills for infrastructural facilities, rent, etc that dwarfs whatever the Nigerian schools will pay. The question then remains, if someone is confirming that he pays N3m for his wife to attend medical school in a year, what’s the optimal price do you think he should pay that wouldn’t amount to subsidy?

ChiefOkporghe:
The facilities available abroad and just about anything is made possible because the students pay the FULL cost whether through student loans or personal money.
If our medical students will pay the equivalent cost, they will get the equivalent facilities.

It’s similar to saying that because prices in Lagos are lower than the he prices in London, therefore the prices in Lagos are subsidized.

ChiefOkporghe:
Okay. Wishing her the very best.
Thing is, if she is paying that amount, can you now imagine how much the govt is paying as Subsidy to train her compared to her counterparts abroad who would have had to resort to student loans to sort themselves out?

If you want to really know the actual cost (average even) of training a medical doctor, check out Private Universities' costs.

The cost of studying abroad is based on the facilities available abroad, cost of equipment, cost of just about everything that makes up schooling. The cost of schooling in Nigeria is based on the reality of what obtains here. Comparing both wouldn’t do any justice because you are comparing apples and oranges. Just imagine comparing house rent of a similar type of apartment in London and Lagos. They are not the same thing.

LegendHero:
He will count rent just as a father that trained an engineer will count rent.

In USA, on average tuition alone for medial student is over $50k. All my friends that are doctors/pharamacists rake up several hundred of thousand of dollars in school loan after they finish.

Mind you rent and other expense is not factored into that $50k.

I will stop this argument coz it’s giving me headache already. Nowhere in Nigeria will any average parent tell you they spend $25k yearly on their medical student.

You are not the only one that has people that studied medicine abroad. I have loads of stories to tell but the limitation of that worldview is that you tend to see things from your worldview. That’s why studies are done and peer reviewed. The point I am making that you keep trying to refute is that it is not ridiculous to claim that a parent would spend upwards of N1m per medical student in a year. You were quick to discredit the association even when they referenced peer reviewed study, citing your own experience. More so you really cannot compare expenses in Lagos and London. It’s apples and oranges.

LegendHero:
Just as someone studying accounting won’t exclude all those expenses you mentioned. So what are we arguing again?

If a medicine student sold an average of 2M on expenses, then an Engineering student will spend 1.5M on same expenses:

Then we can conclude all Nigerian student spend an average of $15k per annum on tuition and expense.

Is that true using your own logic?

That’s fair enough. In other words that’s what it would cost to train a student accountant, lawyer, doctor etc. It would make less sense if we didn’t include these. Just imagine you ask the father of a student doctor how much he spent to raise his child to become a doctor and he tells you that you shouldn’t count rent. That wouldn’t be accurate, I think.

LegendHero:
I don’t understand what you mean by amount to be spent on annual rent. Are medical student renting a different kind of house from the rest of the universities students?

If your argument is that rent contributed to the money to make it up to $25k, then that means all Nigeria university student spend average of $15k on tuition, textbook, and rent.

Does that make sense to you?

I have not said this is exclusive to medical students. I have only said that the money that a medical student would need to become a trained doctor doesn’t exclude annual rent. It’s doesn’t exclude feeding. It doesn’t exclude clothing, it doesn’t exclude transportation. It doesn’t exclude data and airtime money. It doesn’t exclude books and handouts. It doesn’t exclude power (fuel money). It’s doesn’t exclude a whole lot of things. And to think that it is unthinkable that all these might not cost N1m in a single year, does that make sense?

LegendHero:
Nope, even if it was done 3 years ago, it is still not right.

You agree inflation increased in Nigeria too right? That means some of the expenses would have increased too like books, accommodation, and etc.

Even 3 years ago, nobody spends $15 - $50k on school fees in Nigeria.

You don’t need to defend every decision blindlly. Give it few more days, the medical union themselves will deny that guy that is managing their account on Twitter for propagating fake news.

I don’t think it’s outrageous because we are actually talking about 2021 so whatever is happening now is not the consideration. The entire money to be spent for the entire training of a medical student from annual rent (eg. Unilag axis) to upkeep to feeding to tuition and every other thing. He quoted a study that was peer reviewed. That’s more credit than a tweet. It’s not fake news by any means.

LegendHero:
No private university pay fees associated with school up to $30k in Nigeria in any course.

That’s like 45M naira. Which school pay even 15M per annum?

The study was done in 2021 when the naira to dollar rate was about three times lower. I don’t think it’s too much to claim that tuition, rent (which need not always be hostel accommodation), feeding and upkeep, text books as handouts and other expenses would not cross the N1m mark.

In any case, you cannot use your own example or those around you to judge objectively. That’s the purpose of an article that is peer reviewed. So it’s either you refute the work done or produce work done with a superior argument. That’s more credible than a tweet.

doyin01:
Go and stone your math teacher.. how will $21,000 - $30,000 be equal to 10m-15m ?? Are you saying 1 dollar is 500 naira ??


Maybe private university.....But no federal and state university in nigeria where medical students pay more than 500k per year ...quote me anywhere. .

I repeat nowhere federal and state medical students pay more than 500k per year....

If you are talking about private university , I cannot argue that one..

That’s just an estimate. The article said the peer review was done in 2021. I hope you are not using today’s rates. Well these guys did a peer review. If you think they are wrong, you may as well produce yours.

LegendHero:
Average tuition for medical students is not even up to 600k. Where exactly did you got your 1.5m?

Below is the medical fees for UNILAG. That is 342k per annum. Where did you see 1.5m?

What about texts and handouts? Does every student stay in the hostel? What about yearly upkeep?

Nauttyprof:
This is just an indication that the association also do not know what to respond to. Irrespective of the peer review done, the amount spent on the entire education of a Nigerian Doctor is approximately a year equivalent for students in the US.

For an association to come out to tackle this and at the same time suggesting that Doctors shouldn't show some form of responsibility to the government just shows that the association shouldn't have Nigeria attached to it. It's really sick.

Before you mention or tackle me, I am not suggesting that Doctors aren't free to practice anywhere of their choice but the association coming out to debunk the pastor's statement, of which the point is so obvious is out of place.

No they have a responsibility to speak the truth no matter whose ox is gored. The same way you cannot compare the average amount of rent paid in Lagos to the average amount of rent paid in London, that’s how you cannot possibly compare the amount of tuition paid in medical school between Nigerian and the UK. It’s apples vs oranges.

They have a responsibility to set records straight and this is what they are trying to do. Who doesn’t want the government to invest more in the welfare of the average medical doctor in Nigeria? Who doesn’t want the government to invest more in Medicare in Nigeria? If these things are in place, will we have the politicians engaging in endless medical tourism? And why should they even are about fixed healthcare in Nigeria when they or their family members don’t use Nigerian hospitals for the most part? These are the things NARD is trying to fix and that’s why they are speaking up.

Alliswell248:
Nard is compromised.
21k usd to train a doctor?

Lies

Not lies.

$21,000 - $30,000 comes down to about N10m - N15m for 7 years. A medical student will spend N1.5m - N2.1m yearly on tuition, accommodation, texts, practicals, feeding, etc.

LegendHero:
What are you talking about? Are they the secret service?

What are the other expenses they pay that will make their fees cost $25k - $50k per year?

How many people don see $50k per year in Nigeria to be able to spend only that on education?

There is nothing implausible in this analysis. If we say $21,000 - $30,000 comes down to about N10m - N15m for 7 years. It’s not to hard to imagine that a medical student will have to spend N1.5m - N2.1m yearly on tuition, accommodation, texts, practicals, feeding, etc etc? Let’s tell ourselves the truth.

dederocs:
Think, you think they will do that when she already raised a false death threat alarm, she is lucky they are being lenient on her, legally...the police don't seem to want to intervene in matters affecting politicians I don't know why.

I think you should take your advice to think deeply because you have wrongly assumed that this terrain is an ideal one where law and order is upheld to the letter. It’s called impunity, doing things that are at variance with laws of the land unapologetically knowing that you have enough money and power to rescue you if need be. That’s the norm here.

By the way I have not said Bello did it or Natasha is saying the truth. All I’m saying is that you cannot possibly root for somebody like that knowing his antecedents with your full chest. And by the way if he and Akpabio are pretty sure of their case, we have the courts avaialble to hear their case.

dederocs:
This is to deceive gullible clowns and pawns.

It’s not news that Natasha humiliated Bello, Ododo and co with her helicopter stunt and by encouraging people to come out and support her inspite of the embargo placed on gatherings.

Whether or not he sent boys to harass or threaten the woman’s people cannot yet be said to be true or a lie because none of us was there. However harassment and threatening is not something that is unusual with Bello especially when it concerns Natasha. It was not too long that the man had to destroy public road (imagine such a cannibalistic act) because of his vendetta against the same woman. Is it too much for such a person to do what is being claimed that he did?

theophorus:
Act what Scene what are we in this movie bayi?

Hoodlums comes but no casualty, that one self he good. Make una continue to dey play the game when una tire una go park una load comot.

It could be as a form of threat. The people that sent the bad boys could have just told them to threaten but not harm them. I don’t know why you think this isn’t possible.

nairalanda1:
Most of the crude is being exported because at the end of the day, african countries want money to share, not industrial products to export.

I can’t fault your observation sir

nairalanda1:
You are advocating for subsidies and you call me an oppressor for supporting subsidy removal, and you have chided me for essentially 'advocating we pay more'

Therefore, you want price controls.

LIke most of you on this site, you are not realistic. And anyone who challenges you on that, you get angry with them

I'm not supporting any agbado nonsense. But for an economy to run well, people have to be given the right to make a profit. That includes fuel.

Take it or leave it.

You don't have to like it.

Maybe you should say it the way I said it exactly. And I would repeat it here for the records. Subsidy is not bad in itself but because of the actual context of Nigeria where there is unbridled corruption, it’s a no-no. Why is that so? Because in Nigeria when the government is supposed to offer a benefit to its citizens, the same set of people will go through the back door to enjoy the same benefits aimed at the people.

We saw it with the palliatives that were supposed to ameliorate the sufferings of families in the wake of Covid. Leaders stored bags of food stuffs that they didn’t even need when the populace was wallowing in helplessness. This was supposed to be a benefit to the people. If these guys could board palliatives, what’s the hope with fuel subsidy?

What they and their collaborators were doing with subsidy was that they were receive payment for fuel from government many times over the actual amount brought into the country and in the process really drained our revenues. These are the issues.

In the right circumstances, subsidy is not a demonic policy and that is why many nations subsidize certain products till tomorrow. Maybe you think these nations are being unfair to people that want to make profit but I’ll tell you what, government is not primarily set up to ensure that a private company makes a profit but governments are set up PRIMARILY for the security of lives and property of its citizens. Farmers in US get government support so that they remain competitive against the external market.

If you are blessed an abundance of a mineral resource and you have the capacity to turn that mineral resource to a finished good in commercial quantity locally, is it too bad if you make that product available to your people at a discount if you can afford to do so? I don’t think so.

nairalanda1:
Jesus H. Christ.

The Asian tigers did a lot of massive industrialization, which is something I scream about here on this site.a lot.

We don't and we refuse to do it. Instead we rely on oil. That is why tinubu is a bad leader.

I’m glad you’ve called out the actual culprits here.

nairalanda1:
And then again, they have the following

Saudi 40 million people, ten million barrels of crude a day

Nigeria, 220 million, 1.7 million barrels of crude a day

We are not as rich as the Saudis

Grow up, still.

We are not the only country that had faced poverty before. There are countries that are called Asian Tigers today that were poorer than Nigeria in the 70s.

Mismanagement of resources, defunct leadership and corruption remain the biggest stronghold to our progress. It is leaders not the masses that have been vested with state powers to ensure that behavior is aligned.

These leaders, not the masses, have the authorization to apply punitive measure where necessary, they have the authorization from the state to wield the instruments of coercion to ensure that people fall in line. But if they are not interested in societal transformation but they see leadership as a business of patronage, it would be very unfair to expect that society function properly. It’s just like expecting a jumat service to be conducted orderly when there is nobody leading the way and there is no agenda.

nairalanda1:
In other words you want price controls.

They always end on a sad note

If you can point me to anywhere in my post where I advocated for price controls, I’d wait. What I’m saying is that not all prove increases are market driven. Some price hikes are the result of inefficiency in production and some are a function of interest from a rentier system.

nairalanda1:
That shows you don't get what I say.

Good evening. It was nice interacting with you. But I don't talk with people who want to abuse me.

Come back when you get it.

Apologies if I tagged you wrongly but what I’m trying to say is that you assume that everything in Nigeria is supposed to follow a particular model whilst ignoring rentier interest forces that are in many cases stronger than these established models.

I don’t think Nigerians underpay for electricity and if you do, you can show your workings. When the prepaid metering system came on board, it was not the people that rejected it, but it was the people that wanted to continue their shadiness that would not make it available.

Now subsidies are supposedly gone, but like we had said from the onset, there are interest that would not just go without a fight. You wouldn’t see regulators actively waring against something as important and prideful as a world class refinery that recently exported jet fuel to the US in a country that means business. It was obvious from the onset when they claimed that Dangote fuel quality was poor.

These are the issues beyond the argument of subsidy. We all agree that subsidy is bad for Nigeria at this time for obvious reasons but will subsidy removal automatically weed out the rentier interests? No.

We are all seeing the drama playing out. How that a private refinery is able to ensure that we get fuel for N800ish. This is not government but a private player. Then we now began to see the outcries of the guys that are importing and before we knew it, the invisible hand moved and the result was fuel prices of over N900 with the assurance that it would be N1,000 per liter soon.

That does this tell us? It tells us that if fuel is refined efficiently here in Nigeria, we don’t have to pay through our noses. The reason that we pay in excess apart from subsidy (which is now gone supposedly) is that there is either inefficient production or a leaning towards importation and there is no incentive to end the importation.

We are saying that the negative effects of unnatural price hikes in PMS and leaning towards importation when we have substantial refining capacity being ignored is that it tends to automatically and immediately escalate prices of goods, causes inflation, increase in transportation costs, lower standards of living and higher costs of living, fall in the value of the naira, increased interest rates for small businesses and ultimately the shutting down of business and hopelessness.

nairalanda1:
I'm.not a buhari or tinubu fan.

Please.dont abuse me son.

Yes you sound like one and it’s not bad to admit it. Every time people point out lapses in elected officers, you will always rope in those who don’t have the opportunity to do things differently.

You have consistently opined that “subsidy is bad,” but we have shown you that subsidy is not necessarily a bad thing if it is managed with integrity and the government is serious about development.

It became unsustainable in Nigeria because of massive corruption as Buhari was not aware of his surroundings let alone the number of valid/invalid fuel importation claims that he was supposed to pay for as well as negative economic tactics that put the economy on a long thing.

That’s why it became very unsustainable to the extent that we had to use 90% of revenues to cushion it.