;d ;d ;d

ramipada:

Dear kunle,
God be praise for such an encouragement. I still feel if we can relate more not only as regard this issues but the way i felt in my spirit is that i need to get to know you better and i wouldn't mind if i can have your email address or if you are always on messenger maybe once in a while we can chat, discuses things together and also an avenue for me to share my own life experience, dealings, error, mistakes and my victory regarding this issue. Please and please, seek the Lord as regarding this things. here is my mail address: johnbiyi@ymail.com or henryericsion@yahoo.com or greatness4lif@gmail.com. my number is 08037538118
I look forward to hear from and may the lord be with you.

Thanx, you would find my email address on my profile

timmy7:

@mowire
couldnt agree with u more nw that petres church is now d reigning and best non institutionalise christianity with d ideal selling point-no tithe and offering -for him,we can nw av rest. U can even see him(petres) feeling cool with himself-he has won a soul 4 christ nw give it to him -and laughing at every bad comments against the other churches,2bad

What soul are you talking about about? The issue here is about fellowshiping with other beleivers who genuinely seek the truth under the guidiance of a sincere leadership that genuinely wants to preach the gospel truth becos they have a real desire to serve God and not becos of the filthy lucre they are going to make from it.

.

Also done with organised,packaged,repackaged and distributed Christianity,,,

Haha KunleOshob I was just about to create a thread on this topic!

InesQor:

Haha KunleOshob I was just about to create a thread on this topic!

I ended up not stopping church attendance, i was introduced to a new church by someone i met on NL. I am much more comfortable with the teachings in my new church than my former church and most other churches

Please may i knw the name of the church ,so as to join u.Tnks

"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears." -- 2 Timothy 4:3

I ended up not stopping church attendance, i was introduced to a new church by someone i met on NL. I am much more comfortable with the teachings in my new church than my former church and most other churches 

A pitiable state. And you're winking instead of weeping.

I wonder why some folks no longer hear the voice of the Shepherd.

@InesQor
Are you considering to stop attending church as well?

OLAADEGBU:


"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears." -- 2 Timothy 4:3

The above scripture aptly describes what is going on in most churches today especially in the pentecostal/ WOF movements. It is one of the issues that informed my decision to stop attending Instituitionalized churches.

Image123:

A pitiable state. And you're winking instead of weeping.

It is you and your deluded version of man made christianity i am sorry for.

OLAADEGBU:

I wonder why some folks no longer hear the voice of the Shepherd.

The voice of the sheperd has nothing to do with man made instituitions called churches. It was heeding the voice of the sheperd that made me leave the fold of man made teachings preasented has God's word which is very prevalent in our churches today.

KunleOshob:

The voice of the sheperd has nothing to do with man made instituitions called churches. It was heeding the voice of the sheperd that made me leave the fold of man made teachings preasented has God's word which is very prevalent in our churches today.

Are you really sure you heeded the voice of the shepherd?

sonya4all:

Please may i knw the name of the church ,so as to join u.Tnks

"Well i must report myself again to this forum, i was in "church" again yesterday i attended the church petres_007 invited me to last week and i must report again it was really a breath of fresh air. Infact for the first time in a very long time i was actually looking forward to going to church and in attending it i was truely blessed. I was able to learn a lot unlike before when i found a lot of loop holes in the shallow dogmatic sermons which now pervade most of our churches. One of the reasons i wanted to stop going to church was becos i wasn't learning or gaining any thing but with crown bible church it is really different, here the truth is not only being spoken it is being practised. With that i might just rescind on the decision i made at the beginning of this thread and become a regular member of this church. Once again thanx to petres_007 for extending me the invitation". Quote from Kunle

@ kunle, please is there a link to the Crown Bible Church?

OLAADEGBU:

Are you really sure you heeded the voice of the shepherd?

I am positively certain i heard the voice of the one and only true sheperd, here is what the true sheperd had to say about what is going on in most ofour churches today:

Matthew 15:3-9:

3 Jesus replied, “And why do you, by your traditions, violate the direct commandments of God? 4 For instance, God says, ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and ‘Anyone who speaks disrespectfully of father or mother must be put to death.’ 5 But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, ‘Sorry, I can’t help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I would have given to you.’ 6 In this way, you say they don’t need to honor their parents. And so you cancel the word of God for the sake of your own tradition. 7 You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you, for he wrote,
8 ‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9 Their worship is a farce,
for they teach man-made ideas as commands from God.”

A very good example of man made teachings prevalent in our churches today is that of compulsary monetary tithing based on income which was twisted from the very different example of of agricultural produce tithing in the bibleand presented to the church as the word of God were as it is far from the word and will of God. It is the same mentality that obtains when pastors preach that people should tithe at the detriment of helping their loved ones which Jesus used as a example in verse 5. Yet many of our churche would go against the teachings of Jesus and tell you it is more important to give money to the church than to use it to help those in need.

away4real:


@ kunle, please is there a link to the Crown Bible Church?

Sorry the church does not have a website i can link you to.

@sony4all
The name of the church is crown bible church.

@KunleOshob: No i didnt mean that. When I said I wanted to create the thread I meant expressing my differences with all the wrong practices in institutionalized churches.

What do I do nowadays, for a little over one year? I fellowship with other believers, in their houses. We share the word, dissect and discuss it and we pray together. I attend a Baptist Church at times, though infrequently and only because I help out with the youth ministry there.

I am done with churches owned by men, churches with one ruler and head and whose word is the law. A church is meant to be led by a council of elders, not one al capone that is the godfather figure to be worshipped throughout all the branch offices.

I dont believe any single gathering of believers is meant to be larger than can fit in a house, where great fellowship can be shared and all parts grow. My 2 cents, sir.

InesQor:

I dont believe any single gathering of believers is meant to be larger than can fit in a house, where great fellowship can be shared and all parts grow. My 2 cents, sir.

InesQor, I find this quote most, most interesting. Can you defend this biblically?

@InesQor
Ineteresting, i believe we are in the age of awakening loads of people are beginning to ask questions and in the process getting to understand the true christian faith  as taught by Jesus and the apsotles better. It's so sad that those that have been entrusted to lead the christian churches over the years have consistently and routinely polluted the church with all sorts of man made doctrines and the true teachings of christ based on love for others has taken the back sit. I pray that God would continually reveal his will to us and we would be able to walk in his light.

PS: by the way i used to be a baptist as well[ born and bred]

@JeSoul: sorry im mobile now, so my response is delayed. The Greek word "ekklesia" is used to define church, and means "the called out ones", a word that was used for the first church: Moses and the Israelites in the wilderness (Acts 7:38).

Read v39-47 to see how such a large company of called out ones erred because they cooperated in their large numbers to deliver evil counsel. Finish the chapter and see why they killed Stephen in the discourse.

As to fellowship and administration, recall Jethro's advice in Exo 18:21 to break up the group into chunks for better fellowship. Each chunk of 5, 10 as suggested is a Household, so to speak.

Fellowship is, in the Greek, koinonia, a partnership and social intercourse. The definition makes it clear that its not a very large unwieldy body, and the reason I personally say a house, is that, I can see various Biblical patterns of believers meeting in their houses.

I am not excluding meetings larger than houses, though, but each functional unit within the gathering, delivering the power of the gospel and sharing communion must not be larger than a household that is receiving guests. I am not a fan of crusades a la Benny Hinn. Only been to one in my life: Bonnke in 2000 or so. Make it a maximum of 50 to 100 depending on size of available space.

The key thing is that, like parts of the human body must not atrophy, no one should be able to transparently slip by in the meeting and not BOTH gain AND contribute. More questions?

@Kunle: amen and amen sir.

^^Good points and yes more questions but I think I will open a seperate thread as I think people will benefit from the subject matter. You okay with a seperate thread?

Kunle, I'am also interested in your thots on InesQor's take on the size of a church. Will open a thread on InesQor's green light . . .

sonya4all:

Please may i knw the name of the church ,so as to join u.Tnks

Hi sony4all,

The church doesn't have a website specific to it, but it does have a website with articles put up by the pastor and some other people.
It also has a church directory.

NB: It hasn't been updated in a very long while now due to the busy schedules of the contributors.

This is the link if u're interested: Link to the site

@JeSoul: Dear sis, pls modify the quoted post cos I have edited it for easier reading, and added some stuff. Yes, you can open the thread, but I dont know when I can actively discuss because Im on the move and typing on the phone is such a pain.

Besides, whats your own take on the matter? You may open the thread only after saying what YOU think, sis

^ hehe, you won't let me plead the 5th on this one?

I have discussed this topic with some friends in the past and I do agree that the "size" most churches are today make it impossible or impractical to mirror - in principle, in action and ultimately in truth - a ton of things the early church did. For example communion. Where I have seen no solid footing is whether it can definitively be biblically said to be flat out wrong - this is where I have questions.

Don't worry about replying. I'm sure others will have their input, you can get to it whenever you can, it will still be there.

Modified. Here it is: https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-429243.0.html#msg5877667

JeSoul:


Kunle, I'am also interested in your thots on InesQor's take on the size of a church. Will open a thread on InesQor's green light . . .

The large size of churches we have today actually don't have any scriptural basis, however i would not condem it as wrong but true fellowship is lacking in churches of such large size. In the early churches they used to share meals, there was always feasting which formed an essential part of the fellowship but today it is completely missing except for the occassional holy communion were tiny rations of bread and "wine"[as opposed to full meals] are given out in observation of Jesus commandment. The mordern church as tried to re-enact the close knit fellowship which the early church had through house fellowships and house cells but the sharing of meals is mostly missing in these fellowships and some of them still collect "offerings" which they re-mit to the church for what ever purpose. But large congregations [not churches] are not entirely unscriptural as Jesus used to have several open air sermons in which thousands were recorded to attend. A very obvious example was when Jesus fed 5,000 men after one of his sermons. In summary i won't condenm large church congregations as long as they provide a platform for true fellowship, but then again large congregations are unnecessary as i don't see any benefit in it for the congregation themselves apart from the intituitional church that stands to make more money from a larger congregation.

Every time I see a post by KunleOshob, i prepare to laugh because he will most likely refer to greedy pastors who have leaking pockets and can never have enough. LOL.

@JeSoul: thread seen.

[color=12]Doctrines Of Devils[/color]

"Now the spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils" (I Timothy 4:1).

In chapter one of his first epistle to Timothy, Paul warned about false teachers and heresies in the church of his day, evidently particularly implicating the agnostics and their false skepticism and low moral standards.  In our text for today and throughout chapter four, he warns of false teachers "in the latter times," i.e., in our day and in our churches.

Paul had received an explicit (i.e., "express" teaching from the Holy Spirit.  There was nothing vague about it.  The false teachers would, among other things, be "forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats" (v.3), with other false teachings implied throughout the chapter.  What does this teach us about those who today forbid their leaders, both men and women, to marry?  Or those who insist upon certain dietary regimes for spiritual reasons?

These "doctrines" will cause some to "depart from the faith." Evidently, some who consider themselves Christians yet have incomplete discernment, will fall into the trap of "seducing spirits," espousing the "doctrines of devils." The Greek word translated "depart" is apostesontai which means "to fall away" from an original position, in this case, "the faith."  The teachers will typically be hypocrites, "speaking lies," having "their conscience seared" (v.2).  "If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed" (Galatians 1:9).

In this time of great apostasy, we desperately need to know the Biblical doctrine concerning devils (or Satan and his demonic henchmen), for their influence has nearly captured American education and culture.  But we must be on guard against, and teach others to be on guard against, "doctrines of devils." JDM

KunleOshob:

I am positively certain i heard the voice of the one and only true sheperd, here is what the true sheperd had to say about what is going on in most ofour churches today:

It's only you that can tell whether you heard the voice of the true Shepherd or that of a wolf.  What I can deduct from your confessions here on NL along with some of the members of your "church" is that you are against tithes and offerings, don't believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, you (especially ttalk) believe that God created some people to be punished in hell while He has chosen some for heaven, you are not sure what it means to be born again, don't believe that the Bible is complete and inerrant, your misconceptions about the true Church etc.  What is called the doctrines of the devil have found a common ground in some folks that are not comfortable with the doctrines of Christ. This is how cults such as the JW's and the mormons etc started.  The JW's started because of their paranoa about hell fire and yours is starting because of your hatred for the paying of tithes and offerings in Churches.

OLAADEGBU:

It's only you that can tell whether you heard the voice of the true Shepherd or that of a wolf. What I can deduct from your confessions here on NL along with some of the members of your "church" is that you are against tithes and offerings, don't believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, you (especially ttalk) believe that God created some people to be punished in hell while He has chosen some for heaven, you are not sure what it means to be born again, don't believe that the Bible is complete and inerrant, your misconceptions about the true Church etc. What is called the doctrines of the devil have found a common ground in some folks that are not comfortable with the doctrines of Christ. This is how cults such as the JW's and the mormons etc started. The JW's started because of their paranoa about hell fire and yours is starting because of your hatred for the paying of tithes and offerings in Churches.

I don't think I ever implied that God specified some people for heaven and some to be roasted in some fiery fire.
What my posts have indicated as regards hell is that the general conception about it is very likely to be wrong. I do not subscribe to the fact that it is a place of eternal punishment,but a scenario and period(age) of painful but needful chastisement for a better end.
This view on hell is my personal view(not culled from the teachings at the church I worship) which I developed from some personal study of my own.

Even if I belong to a particular group of believers, it does not mean I can't have some views that might be slightly different from theirs.

OLAADEGBU:

It's only you that can tell whether you heard the voice of the true Shepherd or that of a wolf. What I can deduct from your confessions here on NL along with some of the members of your "church" is that you are against tithes and offerings, don't believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, you (especially ttalk) believe that God created some people to be punished in hell while He has chosen some for heaven, you are not sure what it means to be born again, don't believe that the Bible is complete and inerrant, your misconceptions about the true Church etc. What is called the doctrines of the devil have found a common ground in some folks that are not comfortable with the doctrines of Christ. This is how cults such as the JW's and the mormons etc started. The JW's started because of their paranoa about hell fire and yours is starting because of your hatred for the paying of tithes and offerings in Churches.

As usual you have displayed a very high level of ignorance and mis- represented me, what i stand for, ttalks and my church.

@op,thanks,i saw the site,but i didnt see their mission statement or what they believe,can u help tell me all,do they speak in tongues,etc

sonya4all:

@op,thanks,i saw the site,but i didnt see their mission statement or what they believe,can u help tell me all,do they speak in tongues,etc

I said the site is not a church website, but a site that can be traced to the church since most of the articles in it are by the Pastor(along with other people).And besides, I am not the OP
I don't think a mission statement is necessary for such a site since it isn't a church site.
But as shown on the intro of the site, below is the position of the authors of the site:

Pressing For The Crown is dedicated to helping believers in their resolve to earnestly contend for the faith that was once for all time given to the saints. It is intended as a Bible study resource and nothing else. Read our articles and let them provoke you to go spend time studying the Bible.

The articles on this website are contributed by a handful of individuals from different congregations and new articles are added as their personal schedules allow.

Whether or not you agree with a position expressed here, we exhort you above all that you be a diligent student of the Bible and that you entrust your salvation to the capable hands of the Lord Jesus Christ. May God grant His light into our hearts.

If you go through the articles on the site, you can get an idea on the position of the authors on varying issues.
As regards the speaking in tongues stuff, there should be an article among the articles to help your enquiry.

sonya4all:

@op,thanks,i saw the site,but i didnt see their mission statement or what they believe,can u help tell me all,do they speak in tongues,etc

Well i can't quote a specific mission statement but the main objective is to preach the gospel of christ rightlly divided. This means doing away with pre -conceived notions and feeding from the scriptures in it's proper context. The church also attmepts to remove man made regultions from our religious practises and attempts to foister true fellowship amongst brethen there. On the issue of speaking in tongues, whilst the church agrees it is biblical we don't practise it or use it during worship. It is our understanding that speaking in tongues[other languages] was a gift given to the early apostles to aid them in spreading the gospel to other regions were their language was not spoken. We also believe the gift of speaking in tongues is just one of the gifts of the spirit which is not given to all. It is clear from scripures that mandatory speaking in tongues as is practised in most pentecostal churches is wrong and is also self deceit and a mockery of the holy spirit. However if you genuinely have the gift of tongues all well and good but is is not necessary or compulsary for christian worship.