9jaRealist:


And so your answer is to punish Dangote for the FAILURE of the NNPC?
Like I said, a very STRANGE s/hole nation and people - celebrate/defend failure and detest/punish success. SMDH
>

Who said anything about punishing him ? What reasonable people are clamouring for is a truly free market . Who told you he won’t make money if he plays fairly ?
Dangote dropped prices in 2014 from 1700 naira to about 1200naira . He dropped again in 2015 by about 400 naira . NO other cement manufacturer in Nigeria makes announcements like that . Dangote reduces/increases prices as it suits him and they follow.

This is the same reason why people support Yahoo/419/corruption etc . They refuse to question but celebrate Success blindly. AND that is why Nigeria is a 3rd world country .

Igboid:
You are not making any point.
Ibeto was forced and rightly made to go through due process before Nkalagu cement acquisition.
That's how it should be in ideal world.

Ebonyi state government made sure he pays every single dime the state is entitled to and that the host community are carried along as well.

You can't say to have lawfully acquired a company without carrying the host community along. You are into business and not exploitation of the people, all involved parties (business man, state government and local community) must and should benefit from the business.

Either way, your post still has no relationship with mine.
You left the point I raised and dived into another thing all together. More of obfuscation. I

It was NOT “before” the acquisition...
He had already LAWFULLY acquired Nkalagu before his fellow Ibo kindred came out swinging.

And abegi, what section of Nigerian law mandates “carrying the host community along” to LAWFULLY acquire a business?
It may be good practical business practice, but not a legal requirement and if it was there would be hardly any corporate acquisitions in Nigeria!

Anyway, not surprised by the mentality....
I have said here several times, most Nigerians would rather “own” 100% of NOTHING than a smaller percentage of something. SMH
>

CSTRR:

This is a stupid argument.

Dangote is the market leader. His prices determine the prices of other Brand and he knows it.
That is why he is not bothered.

If dangote sells cheap, others will sell cheap.

Stop making stupid arguments.

LMAO!

So now you agree that Dangote has competitors?? I thought you all always cry about Monopoly and how Dangote killed other competing firms in Nigeria?

Whoever depends on Nairaland urchins like you for credible news would nearly assume that Dangote cement is the only brand in the country given the extent y'all cry about monopoly.

After crying on Nairaland about monopoly, you will still carry your cash to the market to buy the same Dangote cement even though I have uploaded facts indicating we have over 15 cement manufacturers in the country. Of course, you won't patronize the 15 because they sell at higher prices than you can afford. Yet Dangote is your problem? You people are not Well.

Simple economics won't bow to your tears. Dangote PLC sells the cheapest Cement, Noodles, Pasta, Salt and Sugar in Nigeria. That's the fact. Take it or cry on. Dangote is not your problem.

blaise26abj:
Who said anything about punishing him ? What reasonable people are clamouring for is a truly free market . Who told you he won’t make money if he plays fairly ?
Dangote dropped prices in 2014 from 1700 naira to about 1200naira . He dropped again in 2015 by about 400 naira . NO other cement manufacturer in Nigeria makes announcements like that . Dangote reduces/increases prices as it suits him and they follow.

This is the same reason why people support Yahoo/419/corruption etc . They refuse to question but celebrate Success blindly. AND that is why Nigeria is a 3rd world country .

Huh?! Not sure who you have been reading (or maybe you are struggling to comprehend), but I never said anything like that...

Why would anyone say that when Dangote is making money and “playing fairly” - unless you can point to any laws that he’s breaking. Meanwhile, you seem to think there’s a problem with a business modulating the prices of its products. Perhaps, you think that government should be setting the prices and even the production quotas of goods. You know, like they used to do in the old COMMUNIST SOVIET UNION. LOL!

What a STRANGE people and STRANGE S/hole country...
Currently a DESERVEDLY 3d World s/hole but inevitably heading towards “4th World” crapola!
>

Aconomist:
Rabiu is asking the government to liberalize the industry and allow more companies to get involved.

OH he want the industry to be rescued from self imposed monopoly he himself is enjoying lol

Liberate from what exactly?

virago:
He also did that with sugar some years back and made more than 200% on each bag of sugar before licenses were approved for BUA and Flour Mills of Nigeria. At that time he was the sole producer and distributor of sugar in the country. He wasn't even able to produce all the sugar needed in the country and had to import the deficit. The landing cost of sugar then was 3500 per bag and he sold at 12000 , this was some 7 years ago

Nigeria still imports MAJORITY of its sugar...
Nigeria is NOWHERE near sugar sufficiency, and Dangote is NOT the problem.

Meanwhile, ever heard of Tate & Lyle (later Tate Industries Plc)?
It was the SUGAR GIANT in Nigeria long before Dangote Sugar was even founded.

Furthermore, Flour Mills (a company founded in 1962, when Dangote was a toddler) was also importing sugar...
And finally set up a sugar refinery (but still imports raw sugar from Brazil) in 2013 to benefit from the BIP program.

Let’s stick with FACTS, not feelings.
>

TSBO:


You are missing the point. The point is that the Government is not really handicapped, they chose to be. I'll just leave it at that.

It still boils down to favouritism, cause they're gaining from it..
So it's okay for us to say,when it comes to Dangote,they're handicapped

rhektor:
OH he want the industry to be rescued from self imposed monopoly he himself is enjoying lol

Liberate from what exactly?

Bros, I am still trying wrap my head around that one...
Why would BUA be complaining of high prices when it can simply lower its prices?

BTW, as far as I am aware there’s no extraordinary barrier to entry in cement manufacturing in Nigeria...
So long as one has the several hundred million dollars needed to build a modern plant, they can seek a mining license.
>

Lucrativress:
When it comes to Nigeria's matter,there are some comparisons that are ironic
Who owns MTN,who is Dangote?
Just look at this refinery stuff,left to me, na Nigeria dey pay the entire money for that Refinery
Dangote is highly favored na,on a National level,MTN for where,no na..
Next time compare Dangote and Tinubu or another magnanimous economic Influencer,walahi na the real Influencers be this

Please enlighten the rest of us how Nigeria is paying fir the Dangote Refinery. Thanks in advance...
>

9jaRealist:


Please enlighten the rest of us how Nigeria is paying fir the Dangote Refinery. Thanks in advance...
>

I can't go deep presently but lemme give an overview,first check the loan,second check the amount of the refinery,third check the rate at which they're giving him dollar,fourth check his pay back plan,fifth check the general subsidization they gave him.
See that dollar subsidy ehn,is what I hate the most,so check all those,the information is there on the Net just Google, last time I talked about this issue was last year,I don gba kamu,so elucidating cannuh be that easy again..

Lonelypacifist6:
Dangote is a price maker monopolist, he builds his business on predatory pricing, first he'll crash the price of his products below such that his competition would fall out of business, and then he sharply increases the price again. Predatory pricing in illegal un business.

Lol.. This explanation is not reasonable bro. That term shouldn't be used in an industry with over 10 manufacturers where the supposed market leader has never really differentiated his products. He's simply selling "ordinary" cement like any other company. He didn't add gold to his cement.

This isn't even a Apple vs. Android scenario where Apple sells a $75 phone for $500. Dangote is simply selling cement like others. Tbh, it's either the competing firms are too dum.b to thrive or Dangote has never really had REAL competitors.

Remember St. Louis Sugar?? That's how to apply monopolistic pricing. Firm had no competition for years.

How can you even demonize monopolistic pricing when Companies buy up other companies just to kill them and bury competition?

Monopolistic pricing is evil but your MBA lecturers teach you acquisition and mergers in school and you hail them? Mark Zuckerberg bought Instagram and WhatsApp to preserve his investments and you all hailed him.

Dangote don suffer for una hands.

Igboid:
You are not making any point.
Ibeto was forced and rightly made to go through due process before Nkalagu cement acquisition.
That's how it should be in ideal world.

Ebonyi state government made sure he pays every single dime the state is entitled to and that the host community are carried along as well.

You can't say to have lawfully acquired a company without carrying the host community along. You are into business and not exploitation of the people, all involved parties (business man, state government and local community) must and should benefit from the business.

Either way, your post still has no relationship with mine.
You left the point I raised and dived into another thing all together. More of obfuscation. I

Aluta Continua...

Abegi, from which old communist doctrinaire did you dig out that gem from?
You think all those traders at Alaba are doing it for the benefit of the community and government?

One good thing about free market (capitalist) economies is the belief in “mutuality of interests”....
Ibeto in advancing his own interests creates jobs for the community and generates taxes for the government.

It does not require the obtuseness of PHYSICALLY PREVENTING him from operating the business!
>

9jaRealist:


Aluta Continua...

Abegi, from which old communist doctrinaire did you dig out that gem from?
You think all those traders at Alaba are doing it for the benefit of the community and government?

One good thing about free market (capitalist) economies is the belief in “mutuality of interests”....
Ibeto in advancing his own interests creates jobs for the community and generates taxes for the government.

It does not require the obtuseness of PHYSICALLY PREVENTING him from operating the business!
>

Ebonyi main source of IGR is the solid mineral mining going on there. There are quarry sites all over the state that puts food on the table of the locals.
You can't go to the top and corner it without
carrying those whose very life sustenance depends on it along.
I don't know why Nigerian commoners are suffer heads and favor having the rich get richer on public wealth and resources while leaving nothing for the commoners.
This very disposition of Nigerians is really annoying.

The traders are well taxed by both locals and government. Enter main market Onitsha and open shop and see how far.
You must pay back to the community once you are making profits. You can't be stashing billions built on the penury of the Masses. That's madness.

No amount of jobs Ibeto creates should entitle him to make billions off the people resources without appropriate checks to carry everyone along.

Lucrativress:
I can't go deep presently but lemme give an overview,first check the loan,second check the amount of the refinery,third check the rate at which they're giving him dollar,fourth check his pay back plan,fifth check the general subsidization they gave him.
See that dollar subsidy ehn,is what I hate the most,so check all those,the information is there on the Net just Google, last time I talked about this issue was last year,I don gba kamu,so elucidating cannuh be that easy again..

You do realize that Dangote is BUYING the dollars?
That they are NOT “giving” it to him nor is the price different from the CBN’s window price for ALL manufacturers?

What exactly are foreign reserves for?
So that Nigeria can admire it in the CBN vaults? Or that it be used to DEVELOP the Nigerian economy?

So what does Nigeria get in return for SELLING (not “giving”) dollars to Dangote to help build his refinery?
1) TENS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS IN NIGERIA FOR NIGERIANS;
2) Helps stop Nigeria from spending BILLIONS OF DOLLARS (reported 35% of all disbursed forex) importing fuel;
3) Any exports from the refinery and petrochemicals complex earns FOREX for Nigeria;
4) Generate tax revenues for government to invest in social services and infrastructure;
5) Creates a LOCAL eco-system of petrochemical-based users and industries, subcontractors, etc.; and
6) Introduces cleaner Euro V-standard fuel into Nigeria, rather than the junk that we’ve been importing.

These are just a handful of the benefits just off the top of my head...
But the NET effect is that the CBN sells some dollars and in return Nigeria saves and even earns more dollars.
>

expliciit:
The dangote guy is a criminal, I have known this for a long time base on report and experts opinion that cement should not be more than #1000

When mandetors sing its a rat race

we think it's joke

9jaRealist:


Nigeria still imports MAJORITY of its sugar...
Nigeria is NOWHERE near sugar sufficiency, and Dangote is NOT the problem.

Meanwhile, ever heard of Tate & Lyle (later Tate Industries Plc)?
It was the SUGAR GIANT in Nigeria long before Dangote Sugar was even founded.

Furthermore, Flour Mills (a company founded in 1962, when Dangote was a toddler) was also importing sugar...
And finally set up a sugar refinery (but still imports raw sugar from Brazil) in 2013 to benefit from the BIP program.

Let’s stick with FACTS, not feelings.
>

So point out what isn't a fact in my statement , it seems you're the one mixing feelings with your judgement

9jaRealist:


Nigeria still imports MAJORITY of its sugar...
Nigeria is NOWHERE near sugar sufficiency, and Dangote is NOT the problem.

Meanwhile, ever heard of Tate & Lyle (later Tate Industries Plc)?
It was the SUGAR GIANT in Nigeria long before Dangote Sugar was even founded.

Furthermore, Flour Mills (a company founded in 1962, when Dangote was a toddler) was also importing sugar...
And finally set up a sugar refinery (but still imports raw sugar from Brazil) in 2013 to benefit from the BIP program.

Let’s stick with FACTS, not feelings.
>

Moreso Flour mills wasn't selling sugar before 2013 so where are you getting all your bogus facts from

Igboid:
Ebonyi main source of IGR is the solid mineral mining going on there. There are quarry sites all over the state that puts food on the table of the locals.
You can't go to the top and corner it without
carrying those whose very life sustenance depends on it along.
I don't know why Nigerian commoners are suffer heads and favor having the rich get richer on public wealth and resources while leaving nothing for the commoners.
This very disposition of Nigerians is really annoying.

The traders are well taxed by both locals and government. Enter main market Onitsha and open shop and see how far.
You must pay back to the community once you are making profits. You can't be stashing billions built on the penury of the Masses. That's madness.

No amount of jobs Ibeto creates should entitle him to make billions off the people resources without appropriate checks to carry everyone along.

Ah, the return of Das Kapital...

So because they are quarry sites all over, Ebonyi no longer need new jobs?
Before you answer, it may interest you to know that the POVERTY RATE IN EBONYI IS ABOUT 80%!
https://www.nairaland.com/5859369/80-poverty-rate-ebonyi-northern

Meanwhile, befuddled why you are going on about taxes, when I specifically sited the generation of tax revenue as a mutuality of interest.

Nigerians sadly have obsessive mentality of SHARING rather than production....
Hence, a proliferation of such code words as “carrying everyone along” (or chop-I-chop)...
The problem is there won’t be anything to share (or chop) unless there’s production.

Unfortunately, because mostly foreigners generate oil wealth that is quickly SHARED...
The nexus between production and commonwealth is completely lost on most Nigerians.
Probably why someone would think digging up quarries is better than adding value and creating MORE jobs.
>

Lucrativress:

It still boils down to favouritism, cause they're gaining from it..
So it's okay for us to say,when it comes to Dangote,they're handicapped

Lol.. There's no winning this uhn..

virago:
Moreso Flour mills wasn't selling sugar before 2013 so where are you getting all your bogus facts from

Dude, Golden Sugar was incorporated in 2008...
And was importing and selling sugar well before it’s refinery was commissioned in 2013.

FACTS! Not feelings!!
>

Aconomist:
When people ask me why I don't invest in Nigeria, remember this thread and responses like this. Nigerians are addicted to stagnation and justify their own demise -- only a fool would put his hard earned capital into a nation of monkeys like this.

Cement prices around the world range from $3 to $6 while Dangote is selling for the equivalent of $11 for a profit margin of 60% in Nigeria compared to an industry average profit margin of 5% to 12%. He is able to charge these high prices because of low competition -- he kicked out competitors by hoarding limestone resources and convincing the federal government to ban imports.

According to Rabiu of BUA Group, Nigeria's real cost of cement production is the lowest in the world. The high prices are because of price gouging and monopolistic behavior from Dangote.

Dangote, God sees u

9jaRealist:


You do realize that Dangote is BUYING the dollars?
That they are NOT “giving” it to him nor is the price different from the CBN’s window price for ALL manufacturers?

What exactly are foreign reserves for?
So that Nigeria can admire it in the CBN vaults? Or that it be used to DEVELOP the Nigerian economy?

So what does Nigeria get in return for SELLING (not “giving”) dollars to Dangote to help build his refinery?
1) TENS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS IN NIGERIA FOR NIGERIANS;
2) Helps stop Nigeria from spending BILLIONS OF DOLLARS (reported 35% of all disbursed forex) importing fuel;
3) Any exports from the refinery and petrochemicals complex earns FOREX for Nigeria;
4) Generate tax revenues for government to invest in social services and infrastructure;
5) Creates a LOCAL eco-system of petrochemical-based users and industries, subcontractors, etc.; and
6) Introduces cleaner Euro V-standard fuel into Nigeria, rather than the junk that we’ve been importing.

These are just a handful of the benefits just off the top of my head...
But the NET effect is that the CBN sells some dollars and in return Nigeria saves and even earns more dollars.
>

Please check the rate they're selling the dollars to him..
Thank you..
I think that should answer further arguments

TSBO:


Lol.. There's no winning this uhn..

Eerrrmmmm yes

Aconomist:
If the domestic industry can't produce cement at a reasonable price (they can, Dangote is just preventing it) allow imports. Don't hold the whole construction industry hostage.

I fully agree with you.

Aconomist:
price war is not the solution. The solution is to liberalize the industry and allow more companies to get involved or allow imports

How can u talk of LIBERALISATION so flagrantly when the so called monopoly carteling cement is not Governmental? If u have the funds, what stay ur hands? U can jump into the business this afternoon! U guys are being bleeped by Rabiu and you dont even sense it.

Aconomist:
Nigeria is covered in limestone, most of Dangote's mines have a 250 year lifespan. There is no scarcity of the raw material.

Are people with the finance and capacity allowed to invest in limestone production?

9jaRealist:


Huh?! Not sure who you have been reading (or maybe you are struggling to comprehend), but I never said anything like that...

Why would anyone say that when Dangote is making money and “playing fairly” - unless you can point to any laws that he’s breaking. Meanwhile, you seem to think there’s a problem with a business modulating the prices of its products. Perhaps, you think that government should be setting the prices and even the production quotas of goods. You know, like they used to do in the old COMMUNIST SOVIET UNION. LOL!

What a STRANGE people and STRANGE S/hole country...
Currently a DESERVEDLY 3d World s/hole but inevitably heading towards “4th World” crapola!
>

When a business determines prices for its competitors, it’s monopolistic. That is the point

jaszplus12:

I forgive you 70 times 7, but whatever you call me doesn't make me who I am bro....
Then why result to insults again? Is that your mind?? Are you of the "tribe"?

You are a waste of space. U brought up tribe to derail the thread.

Acidosis:


You haven't said any meaningful thing bro asides the disputable fact that you're a trained economist in the U.S. Well, I'm not a trained economist but I know how to check appropriate places for information instead of making up figures to attack an individual over a perceived industry problem - same individual with the best market price o. Lol.

I have attached the profit/loss profile for the year 2019. So, please check and enlighten yourself. Look at the gross profit, revenue, and profit t attributable to the owners of the company.

Let's even assume your 60% data is correct, how do you explain the fact that his price has consistently remained the best in Nigeria? How come the "wicked" Dangote sells cheaper Cement than "Saint Ibeto" and "Saint Lafarge"? Why can't they crash the price and, consequently, create a price war like many companies in your country of residence do?

Where do you see ibeto cement. Are you really this dumb

9jaRealist:


Dude, Golden Sugar was incorporated in 2008...
And was importing and selling sugar well before it’s refinery was commissioned in 2013.

FACTS! Not feelings!!
>

Now I know you're just deluded or just pulling your "facts" from your arse , Golden Penny was not given their license to produce or sell before 2013 and didn't sell a single bag of sugar before 2013 , I should know because I'm a dealer in their products , and please show us a proof of your "facts" and also where my statement is wrong. I am still waiting

May God save us from our leader in dis country, thy where leader without border. Dangote is jxt figure head lot of silly gvt official aare all behind this.

Aconomist:
The size of the economy doesn't matter. Cement price is selling for between 1,500 and 1,900 in South Africa, which is a large economy like Nigeria.