₦airaland Forum

Janosky:
Dubious claim of 3 doghead slave.

Revelation 22:13 does NOT refer Jesus.
Jesus did NOT make that statement in verse 13!
Verse 8:13 John reported what the angel revealed to him
Revelation 1:1,6-8 & 22:6,13 refers to JEHOVAH his Father.

Matthew 27:46 & Revelation 1:17-18 refers to Jesus Christ.
Matthew 28:18, he was given authority to bear that title in Revelation 1:17-18

When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.
Revelation 1:17‭-‬18 NIV
So, you agree that Jesus is the 'First and the Last '?
What does that mean?

On your Colossians 1 assertion: do humans as 'image' of God have ALL the fulness of God dwell in them? Use your sense.

Janosky does not also know how the Bible uses the term 'Firstborn'. Is there no Lexicon to help him out?

MaxInDHouse:
Your problem is the way you're so much overwhelmed with texts that you can only read but can't talk about it's practical application!
Remember that @ John 1:1-3 we read:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. This one was in the beginning with God. All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence. NWT

It is evident that John was talking about two separate persons: God and the Word who was with God in the beginning. So if the Word say i am the beginning and the end do you think he is saying he was alone without God?
Well it simply means he knows the Genesis of badness and he will be glad to know the end after all he has played his part perfectly {John 19:30} so the rest lies in the hands of the one who has the power to execute all things without anyone's permission: GOD
The Bible clearly tells us that Jesus always takes instructions from someone greater than him so even if he has played his part he must wait until God gives him the order to act! Psalms 110:1

Now regarding the verse you're worried about let me quote nine verses in the same chapter and let's see how many people were talking there:
...........
Note the speakers in highlighted:
The first in verse 8 says "i, John"
The second in verse 9-11 is the angel sent to deliver the message to John.
The third says "i am the Alpha and Omega" we believe that is Jehovah the Almighty! Revelations 1:8
The fourth says "i Jesus"
The fifth is God's Active Force working with the bride (144,000) so they are speaking what the God's active force is moving them to say!

So how come you picked a verse and say it's Jesus who is speaking whereas Jesus introduced himself when he wanted to speak?

First, on John 1:1-3, I never stated that there weren't two separate persons being referred to there.

Second, on the Revelation 22, I think it is clear to know who is saying what. So, when in verse 12 & 13 we read: “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."
Revelation 22:12‭-‬13 NIV
It should be clear who the one who is coming is. Shouldn't it?
It should be clear who SAID to the churches earlier in the book of Revelation that he is bringing his rewards; shouldn't it?
It should be clear also who "the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End" is. Isn't it?

You agreed that Jesus had in chapter 1 said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.
Revelation 1:17‭-‬18 NIV
Where he introduced himself as the 'first and the last'.

So, why wouldn't it be clear there in chapter 22 who is saying what?

You conveniently avoided verse 12 in your allocation of who is speaking because you knew it related to verse 13 BUT you wanted to separate the two for your convenience in order to make it fit into your standard narrative.

Again, you want to use your preconceived position to interpret Scripture instead of letting it speak to you.

Because your DOGMA will not make you admit that Jehovah was once dead but is now alive you agreed that the 'first and the last' in Revelation 1 is Jesus. Yet you are struggling hard to separate him from the declaration in Revelation 22.

Btw, your interpretation of "the beginning and the end" - it simply means he knows the Genesis of badness and he will be glad to know the end after all he has played his part perfectly - is really interesting if not out rightly funny. Maybe janosky should give us Lexicon references to back it up.
Genesis of 'badness' indeed!

Janosky:
Dubious claim of 3 doghead slave.

blasphemer fraud jw janosky

how you love to call The Father and Son and Holy Spirit of the Bible:
"3 doghead"

Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

janosky:
"the 3 dogheads" etc.
"the ole demon ghost" etc.

Mar 3:29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

sagenaija:
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First, on John 1:1-3, I never stated that there weren't two separate persons being referred to there.

Second, on the Revelation 22, I think it is clear to know who is saying what. So, when in verse 12 & 13 we read: “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."
Revelation 22:12‭-‬13 NIV
It should be clear who the one who is coming is. Shouldn't it?
It should be clear who SAID to the churches earlier in the book of Revelation that he is bringing his rewards; shouldn't it?
It should be clear also who "the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End" is. Isn't it?

You agreed that Jesus had in chapter 1 said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.
Revelation 1:17‭-‬18 NIV
Where he introduced himself as the 'first and the last'.

So, why wouldn't it be clear there in chapter 22 who is saying what?

You conveniently avoided verse 12 in your allocation of who is speaking because you knew it related to verse 13 BUT you wanted to separate the two for your convenience in order to make it fit into your standard narrative.

Again, you want to use your preconceived position to interpret Scripture instead of letting it speak to you.

Because your DOGMA will not make you admit that Jehovah was once dead but is now alive you agreed that the 'first and the last' in Revelation 1 is Jesus. Yet you are struggling hard to separate him from the declaration in Revelation 22.

Btw, your interpretation of "the beginning and the end" - it simply means he knows the Genesis of badness and he will be glad to know the end after all he has played his part perfectly - is really interesting if not out rightly funny. Maybe janosky should give us Lexicon references to back it up.
Genesis of 'badness' indeed!

You just like STORY! STORY!! STORY!!! That's of no practical benefit to anyone.

The highlighted is hilarious, if Jehovah dies then who resurrected Him? Act 3:15
Who answered Jesus' prayer when he begged on his knees? Hebrews 5:7 compare to Luke 22:44; John 12:27

Well my own God JEHOVAH has never died for once, it's his son whom He gave {John 3:16} to die for our sins that died and Jehovah raised His son back to life!

MaxInDHouse:
You just like STORY! STORY!! STORY!!! That's of no practical benefit to anyone.

The highlighted is hilarious, if Jehovah dies then who resurrected Him? Act 3:15
Who answered Jesus' prayer when he begged on his knees? Hebrews 5:7 compare to Luke 22:44; John 12:27

Well my own God JEHOVAH has never died for once, it's his son whom He gave {John 3:16} to die for our sins that died and Jehovah raised His son back to life!

You want to latch on to an escape route!

You agree that Revelation 1: 17-18 refers to Jesus don't you?

Are there two different 'First and the Last' between Revelation 1 and Revelation 22?

That shouldn't be a difficult question to answer by one who belongs to the only "God's approved organisation"; should it?

sagenaija:
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You want to latch on to an escape route!
You agree that Revelation 1: 17-18 refers to Jesus don't you?
Are there two different 'First and the Last' between Revelation 1 and Revelation 22?
That shouldn't be a difficult question to answer by one who belongs to the only "God's approved organisation"; should it?

I have answered you countless times but the TRINITY dogma won't allow it sink into your mind.

Since you've admitted that Jehovah and Jesus differs then both of them can't be the one who died nah!
JEHOVAH says He is the Alpha and Omega.
Jesus said he's the beginning and the end.

Both of them were together from the beginning till now and since Jesus will live forever surely he will see the end of all badness nah!

That doesn't change the fact that they are two separate persons!

MaxInDHouse:
I have answered you countless times but the TRINITY dogma won't allow it sink into your mind.

Since you've admitted that Jehovah and Jesus differs then both of them can't be the one who died nah!
JEHOVAH says He is the Alpha and Omega.
Jesus said he's the beginning and the end.

Both of them were together from the beginning till now and since Jesus will live forever surely he will see the end of all badness nah!

That doesn't change the fact that they are two separate persons!

Where did I admit to what you are stating there?
Like they say: "Don't put words into my mouth!"

God the Father and God the Son are two separate persons but one in essence.

Jesus is Alpha and Omega. First and the Last, the beginning and the end and Alpha and Omega are all for emphasis pointing at the same thing!

sagenaija:
Where did I admit to what you are stating there?
Like they say: "Don't put words into my mouth!"
God the Father and God the Son are two separate persons but one in essence.
Jesus is Alpha and Omega. First and the Last, the beginning and the end and Alpha and Omega are all for emphasis pointing at the same thing!

Well Jesus is Archangel Michael (commander of all the angels in heaven) to me and since he is standing for the salvation of God's people no other angel has been said to do so! Daniel 12:1 ; Revelations 12:7

MaxInDHouse:
Well Jesus is Archangel Michael (commander of all the angels in heaven) to me and since he is standing for the salvation of God's people no other angel has been said to do so! Daniel 12:1 ; Revelations 12:7

ALL angels worship Jesus - "And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says, “Let all God’s angels worship him.”
Hebrews 1:6 NIV (See also Revelation 5).
'All' means without exception.
NO angel receives even worship by man not to talk of worship by other angels. (Revelation 19:10; 22:8-9).
Therefore, Jesus is greater than ANY CLASS of angels (including Archangels - btw, there are other Archangels apart from Michael) for him to be worshipped by them.

On Daniel 12:
“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.
Daniel 12:1 NIV
In context Daniel is being told that Michael protects his (Daniel's) people - Israel. By application it would apply to protecting to all God's people. Protection NOT salvation!

In Revelation 12:7 Michael is clearly distinguished from Jesus. Jesus/the Lamb are specifically mentioned there.

Bottom line, Jesus is in a CLASS of his own! Higher then the angels. Higher than ALL.

sagenaija:
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ALL angels worship Jesus - "And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says, “Let all God’s angels worship him.”
Hebrews 1:6 NIV (See also Revelation 5).
'All' means without exception.
NO angel receives even worship by man not to talk of worship by other angels. (Revelation 19:10; 22:8-9).
Therefore, Jesus is greater than ANY CLASS of angels (including Archangels - btw, there are other Archangels apart from Michael) for him to be worshipped by them.

On Daniel 12:
“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.
Daniel 12:1 NIV
In context Daniel is being told that Michael protects his (Daniel's) people - Israel. By application it would apply to protecting to all God's people. Protection NOT salvation!

In Revelation 12:7 Michael is clearly distinguished from Jesus. Jesus/the Lamb are specifically mentioned there.

Bottom line, Jesus is in a CLASS of his own! Higher then the angels. Higher than ALL.

The word mistranslated WORSHIP in those verses is "OBEISANCE" which means "obey him" only one person is to be worshiped and that is JEHOVAH! Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:29

There are so many similarities pointing to Michael as the son of God who was transformed into the womb of Mary.
At Daniel 12:1 that verse clearly stated that Michael will rise up for the salvation of God's people, you may not understand what Daniel is saying {Daniel 12:10} but Paul expatiate that the real Israelites are those who keeps the faith not just someone born in Israel {Romans 2:25-29} so Daniel was talking about the time when the Messiah will show up for the salvation of mankind. This happened in the first century and only few Jews accepted his teachings. So it's the same Michael that came in the person of Jesus!

Beliefs are meant to be refuted by critics from all angles so whether the beliefs are based on the truth of God's word or not critics will rise to refute it.
So what is the secret behind the truth that will continue to hunt critics of God's word?

Well it's the WORKS of true faith because credulity is founded on lies all those holding it will never be able to practice it to be point of seeing any benefit, of course they will stubbornly keep to it even when they're not united in what they're saying {Luke 11:23} but the truth will unite people from all races and make them one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers because that's God's will for mankind. John 17:20-23 compare to Micah 4:1-3
Once a global family of peace loving worshipers suffice under Jesus Christ then the rest are ripe for destruction!
So whatever argument they're putting up against the truth will continue to hurt them because they will see real faith at WORK while their own faith will remain inactive in all places! James 2:18-26

Jehovah's Witnesses are working throughout the earth and making people turn away from politics and racism, they are embracing one another as one family, they have vowed never to raise weapons against anyone for any reason whatsoever! Isaiah 2:2-4
So whoever thinks he has anything to say against them should check himself because their righteousness is from their God! Isaiah 54:17

May you have PEACE!

Janosky:
Psalms 90:2 "before the mountains were born or you brought forth (Hebrew "Yalad" the earth"
2 Questions for Sparrow:
Colossians 1:15 & Genesis 5:2, are humans and Jesus Christ in the image of the invisible God?

Psalms 90:2 (NIV) how did Yahweh born the mountains?

so mountains also are begotten of God? Yet, is begotten Same as create?

Janosky:
Romans 11:35-36 ,& Colossians 1:15, Jesus the first born of every creature came through his Father.

You won't bring Greek lexicon here hypocrite because you know first born also means preeminence which is what Paul meant there

A man will tell his friends, "I built my house at the age of 35"
Emusan LIENUS, that man @ 35years built his house through whom?

Rather put it this way, that the man will claim he built his house BY HIMSELF or His OWN HAND laid the foundation of His house

Is Emusan willing and ready to receive SENSE?

Yes I'm ready, do you?

Janosky:
Matthew 28:18, he was given authority to bear that title in Revelation 1:17-18

When they're lying mouths are being exposed, and the seed of their father the Devil is being exposed, this is what you get.

You don't want to agree openly that Jesus is the Beginning and the end, you have to come up with that nonsense

Even imagine, your bro Max is saying Jehovah is Alpha and Omega while is beginning and the end

Can you show him Greek lexicon so that he'll know both "Alpha and omega" is the same as "the beginning and the end?"

MaxInDHouse:
The word mistranslated WORSHIP in those verses is "OBEISANCE" which means "obey him" only one person is to be worshiped and that is JEHOVAH! Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:29

There are so many similarities pointing to Michael as the son of God who was transformed into the womb of Mary.
At Daniel 12:1 that verse clearly stated that Michael will rise up for the salvation of God's people, you may not understand what Daniel is saying {Daniel 12:10} but Paul expatiate that the real Israelites are those who keeps the faith not just someone born in Israel {Romans 2:25-29} so Daniel was talking about the time when the Messiah will show up for the salvation of mankind. This happened in the first century and only few Jews accepted his teachings. So it's the same Michael that came in the person of Jesus!

When words are now said to be wrongly translated all in a bid to make things fit your standard narrative one can only see an attempt to devalue the Son.

I think even your brother janosky, who is into Lexicon and co, will confirm to you that 'worship' in that Hebrews 1:6 means WORSHIP and nothing else, unless he too wants to be cheeky and switch Lexicon or disregard Lexicon and switch to your translation here. Janosky, if he truly the 'expert' he wants to put himself forward to be should know that the Koine Greek of the New Testament is EXACT. It leaves little room for guesswork.

The book of Hebrews clearly shows the SUPERIORITY of Jesus Christ over all angels, over Moses, over previous worship systems, and over all creation. To therefore say that, in the context of a SCENARIO IN HEAVEN, God the Father is simply telling the angels "be respectful to him" with regards to God the Son means you're being scarce with the truth.

Look at this clear statement of Jesus:
"that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him."
John 5:23 NIV
Did you see 'just as they honour the Father'?
Maybe you will begin to re-explain what 'just as' now means. Your "deeper understanding" will move its meaning from what is plainly stated there.

If you read Revelation 5 and still claim it is not worship that is given to the Lamb then JW must have pumped so much garbage into your brain that you have brainwashed yourself to think contrary to every truth.

When the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, when they declared "You are worthy", when the myriads of angels added their own voice, and "every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them were saying: “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!” (5:13), MaxinDHouse is telling us that they are simply making 'obeisance' and not worship, then maybe they were also simply paying 'obeisance' to the Father who was there with the Lamb. Or will you now tell us that even though they were doing the same actions to both the Father and the Lamb who were there TOGETHER, we should see it as worship to the Father and 'obeisance' to the Son. You guys can always find ways to 'SLICE' worship for the Father from for the Son even when both of them were the focus here.

I am aware that your organisation has, over the years, changed position on the worship of Jesus.

There is ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural support for your claim that Michael was the one transformed into Mary's womb. If there is one please show us.

You guys appear to have forgotten that both Michael and 'one like a son of man' were mentioned in the book of Daniel. Were they ever equated as one and the same there in Daniel? No!

Why you have chosen to elevate the teachings of men over and above the CLEAR position of Scripture leaves one amazed!

sagenaija:
When words are now said to be wrongly translated all in a bid to make things fit your standard narrative one can only see an attempt to devalue the Son.

I think even your brother janosky, who is into Lexicon and co, will confirm to you that 'worship' in that Hebrews 1:6 means WORSHIP and nothing else, unless he too wants to be cheeky and switch Lexicon or disregard Lexicon and switch to your translation here. Janosky, if he truly the 'expert' he wants to put himself forward to be should know that the Koine Greek of the New Testament is EXACT. It leaves little room for guesswork.

The book of Hebrews clearly shows the SUPERIORITY of Jesus Christ over all angels, over Moses, over previous worship systems, and over all creation. To therefore say that, in the context of a SCENARIO IN HEAVEN, God the Father is simply telling the angels "be respectful to him" with regards to God the Son means you're being scarce with the truth.

Look at this clear statement of Jesus:
"that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him."
John 5:23 NIV
Did you see 'just as they honour the Father'?
Maybe you will begin to re-explain what 'just as' now means. Your "deeper understanding" will move its meaning from what is plainly stated there.

If you read Revelation 5 and still claim it is not worship that is given to the Lamb then JW must have pumped so much garbage into your brain that you have brainwashed yourself to think contrary to every truth.

When the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, when they declared "You are worthy", when the myriads of angels added their own voice, and "every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them were saying: “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!” (5:13), MaxinDHouse is telling us that they are simply making 'obeisance' and not worship, then maybe they were also simply paying 'obeisance' to the Father who was there with the Lamb. Or will you now tell us that even though they were doing the same actions to both the Father and the Lamb who were there TOGETHER, we should see it as worship to the Father and 'obeisance' to the Son. You guys can always find ways to 'SLICE' worship for the Father from for the Son even when both of them were the focus here.

I am aware that your organisation has, over the years, changed position on the worship of Jesus.

There is ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural support for your claim that Michael was the one transformed into Mary's womb. If there is one please show us.

You guys appear to have forgotten that both Michael and 'one like a son of man' were mentioned in the book of Daniel. Were they ever equated as one and the same there in Daniel? No!

Why you have chosen to elevate the teachings of men over and above the CLEAR position of Scripture leaves one amazed!

Your agitation is pointless!
You're trying to equate Jesus with the Almighty God by quoting scriptures here and there just to support your TRINITY doctrines, i too am equating Jesus with Archangel Michael using the scriptures.
So we will continue to argue forever and ever if allowed, the only way out of this fruitless arguments is to present a GROUP of people PRACTICING what we are saying and the BENEFITS or RESULTS in their midst.
No matter what you quote if your faith has no PRACTICAL WORKS that everyone can SEE {Matthew 5:13-16 compare to James 2:18-26} then it simply means you don't understand what you're quoting, the LETTERS is what you keep twisting so the SPIRIT that supposed to actuate the minds of your fellow worshipers and move them into action will not be there! 2Corinthians 3:6

Emusan:
When they're lying mouths are being exposed, and the seed of their father the Devil is being exposed, this is what you get.

You don't want to agree openly that Jesus is the Beginning and the end, you have to come up with that nonsense

Even imagine, your bro Max is saying Jehovah is Alpha and Omega while is beginning and the end

Can you show him Greek lexicon so that he'll know both "Alpha and omega" is the same as "the beginning and the end?"

You , Emusan, bear your Father's identity and you are known by it officially in your Educational Qualifications, Driver's licence etc.

Matthew 28:18 & John 5:43,Revelation 1:17-18. Emusan knows that Jesus Christ bears his Father's identity by his own Father's authority but you , Emusan comes to this forum to prove your stupidity.

Janosky:
You , Emusan, bear your Father's identity and you are known by it officially in your Educational Qualifications, Driver's licence etc.

Matthew 28:18 & John 5:43,Revelation 1:17-18. Emusan knows that Jesus Christ bears his Father's identity by his own Father's authority but you , Emusan comes to this forum to prove your stupidity.

Good morning brother, i'm still expecting your call!

Janosky:
You , Emusan, bear your Father's identity and you are known by it officially in your Educational Qualifications, Driver's licence etc.

Matthew 28:18 & John 5:43,Revelation 1:17-18. Emusan knows that Jesus Christ bears his Father's identity by his own Father's authority but you , Emusan comes to this forum to prove your stupidity.

Then Jesus is Jehovah

sagenaija:
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When words are now said to be wrongly translated all in a bid to make things fit your standard narrative one can only see an attempt to devalue the Son.

Matthew 4:10 "only Jehovah your God you must worship" and John 4:23-24,"must worship the Father".
Did Jesus Christ tell you Sagenaija to worship him?
Sagenaija,did Matthew 4:10 John 4:23-24 devalue Jesus?
No!
@ Hebrews 1:6 you & some of your Trinity mentors are desperate to grant Jesus what he has said is NOT for him.
Catholic church Jerusalem Bible says No way !

sagenaija:
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I think even your brother janosky, who is into Lexicon and co, will confirm to you that 'worship' in that Hebrews 1:6 means WORSHIP and nothing else, unless he too wants to be cheeky and switch Lexicon or disregard Lexicon and switch to your translation here. Janosky, if he truly the 'expert' he wants to put himself forward to be should know that the Koine Greek of the New Testament is EXACT. It leaves little room for guesswork.

Sagenaija is NOT truthful.
It is public knowledge on this forum, that Janosky sticks with the Catholic Church Jerusalem Bible of Hebrews 1:6: "pay homage to Jesus"
Your fellow Trinitarian devotees who started the the Trinity GIBBERISH said "pay homage"

sagenaija:
The book of Hebrews clearly shows the SUPERIORITY of Jesus Christ over all angels, over Moses, over previous worship systems, and over all creation. To therefore say that, in the context of a SCENARIO IN HEAVEN, God the Father is simply telling the angels "be respectful to him" with regards to God the Son means you're being scarce with the truth.

Max is saying the Bible truth.
Hebrews 1:4 Jesus "INHERITED a name superior to that of angels"
Matthew 28:18, by whose authority?
Trinity shege !!!!

sagenaija:
Look at this clear statement of Jesus:
"that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him."
John 5:23 NIV
Did you see 'just as they honour the Father'?
Maybe you will begin to re-explain what 'just as' now means. Your "deeper understanding" will move its meaning from what is plainly stated there.

Ephesians 6:1-2,"Honour your Father and your mother"
When you honour them, are you worshipping them?
"Honour" @ John 5:23 and Ephesians 6:2 is the same Greek meaning

Sagenaija is desperate to add his Trinitarian TWIST to the holy Scriptures

sagenaija:
If you read Revelation 5 and still claim it is not worship that is given to the Lamb then JW must have pumped so much garbage into your brain that you have brainwashed yourself to think contrary to every truth.

When the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, when they declared "You are worthy", when the myriads of angels added their own voice, and "every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them were saying: “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!” (5:13), MaxinDHouse is telling us that they are simply making 'obeisance' and not worship, then maybe they were also simply paying 'obeisance' to the Father who was there with the Lamb. Or will you now tell us that even though they were doing the same actions to both the Father and the Lamb who were there TOGETHER, we should see it as worship to the Father and 'obeisance' to the Son. You guys can always find ways to 'SLICE' worship for the Father from for the Son even when both of them were the focus here.

Empty rants borne out of desperation

Or obey Revelation19:10 "Worship God"
Matthew 4:10, John 4:23-24, Jesus and the angel is speaking with one voice.

16th September,2021 @ 9:21pm, Your fellow Trinitarian mentors and BishopKingsley, your fellow devotees, proven beyond doubt that @Revelation 5:14, worship is NOT for Jesus.
You have seen and read that screenshot.
Dump your FALSE claims into the Dustbin.

sagenaija:
I am aware that your organisation has, over the years, changed position on the worship of Jesus.
!

Leviticus 1:1-4 & Hebrews 10:9-10, JEHOVAH changed his position on animals sacrifices.
Does that mean animal sacrifice is valid now?

sagenaija:
There is ABSOLUTELY NO scriptural support for your claim that Michael was the one transformed into Mary's womb. If there is one please show us.


You guys appear to have forgotten that both Michael and 'one like a son of man' were mentioned in the book of Daniel. Were they ever equated as one and the same there in Daniel? No!

Sagenaija, answer these 7 Questions and receive the answer to your questions & claim.

7 Questions
#1
Did Jesus Christ have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#2
Did Paul have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#3
Did God's number one enemy have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?

#4
Genesis 3:15, who is the serpent?

#5
Genesis 3:15, Revelation 12:7-9, 1 John 3:8, who is the seed that defeats the serpent?

#6
Daniel 12:1-2, 1 Thess4:16,John 5:28, whose voice wakes up the dead?

#7
2 Thess 1:7,Daniel 10:13 & Matthew 25:31,who leads his Father's angels in battle?


Sagenaija, don't DECEIVE yourself.

sagenaija:
Why you have chosen to elevate the teachings of men over and above the CLEAR position of Scripture leaves one amazed!

FALSE claim upandan.
Trinitarian devotees: 3 persons GIBBERISH


The holy Scriptures: Romans 3:29-30, Deut 6:4 & Isaiah 54:5, "JEHOVAH God is one,"HE".

Janosky:
Matthew 4:10 "only Jehovah your God you must worship" and John 4:23-24,"must worship the Father".
Did Jesus Christ tell you Sagenaija to worship him?
Sagenaija,did Matthew 4:10 John 4:23-24 devalue Jesus?
No!
@ Hebrews 1:6 you & some of your Trinity mentors are desperate to grant Jesus what he has said is NOT for him.
Catholic church Jerusalem Bible says No way !

Sagenaija is NOT truthful.
It is public knowledge on this forum, that Janosky sticks with the Catholic Church Jerusalem Bible of Hebrews 1:6: "pay homage to Jesus"
Your fellow Trinitarian devotees who started the the Trinity GIBBERISH said "pay homage"

Max is saying the Bible truth.
Hebrews 1:4 Jesus "INHERITED a name superior to that of angels"
Matthew 28:18, by whose authority?
Trinity shege !!!!

Ephesians 6:1-2,"Honour your Father and your mother"
When you honour them, are you worshipping them?
"Honour" @ John 5:23 and Ephesians 6:2 is the same Greek meaning

Sagenaija is desperate to add his Trinitarian TWIST to the holy Scriptures

[b]Empty rants borne out of desperation

Or obey Revelation19:10 "Worship God"
Matthew 4:10, John 4:23-24, Jesus and the angel is speaking with one voice.

16th September,2021 @ 9:21pm, Your fellow Trinitarian mentors and BishopKingsley, your fellow devotees, proven beyond doubt that @Revelation 5:14, worship is NOT for Jesus.
You have seen and read that screenshot.
Dump your FALSE claims into the Dustbin.


Leviticus 1:1-4 & Hebrews 10:9-10, JEHOVAH changed his position on animals sacrifices.
Does that mean animal sacrifice is valid now?

Sagenaija, answer these 7 Questions and receive the answer to your questions & claim.

7 Questions
#1
Did Jesus Christ have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#2
Did Paul have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#3
Did God's number one enemy have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?

#4
Genesis 3:15, who is the serpent?

#5
Genesis 3:15, Revelation 12:7-9, 1 John 3:8, who is the seed that defeats the serpent?

#6
Daniel 12:1-2, 1 Thess4:16,John 5:28, whose voice wakes up the dead?

#7
2 Thess 1:7,Daniel 10:13 & Matthew 25:31,who leads his Father's angels in battle?

Sagenaija, don't DECEIVE yourself.

FALSE claim upandan.
Trinitarian devotees: 3 persons GIBBERISH

The holy Scriptures: Romans 3:29-30, Deut 6:4 & Isaiah 54:5, "JEHOVAH God is one,"HE".

Let me be clear again, and it's not to offend you: you're inarticulate, flutter around from one thing to another, and generally act as if you are comedian. So, it's hard to really follow your line of thought.

You leave posts addressed to you and jump into some other person's without going back to see the flow of things or the progression. Your general attitude makes it hard for co-discussants and I want to believe other readers to take you seriously.

MaxInDHouse:
Your agitation is pointless!
You're trying to equate Jesus with the Almighty God by quoting scriptures here and there just to support your TRINITY doctrines, i too am equating Jesus with Archangel Michael using the scriptures.
So we will continue to argue forever and ever if allowed, the only way out of this fruitless arguments is to present a GROUP of people PRACTICING what we are saying and the BENEFITS or RESULTS in their midst.
No matter what you quote if your faith has no PRACTICAL WORKS that everyone can SEE {Matthew 5:13-16 compare to James 2:18-26} then it simply means you don't understand what you're quoting, the LETTERS is what you keep twisting so the SPIRIT that supposed to actuate the minds of your fellow worshipers and move them into action will not be there! 2Corinthians 3:6

I can equally say that your fixation on practical group is pointless!
Points win an argument.
I have shown you REPEATEDLY from Scripture that Jesus is superior to all creatures.
All I see from your end is the position of men not FACTS from Scripture.
That is why you run away from directly explaining verses presented.

Was does it mean to honour the Son JUST AS the Father is honoured?

When the Lamb and the Father were together and every creature worshipped did they do it only to one of them and disregarded the other?

Where is it in Scripture that Michael transformed into Mary's womb?

Were Michael and 'one like a son of man' ever equated as one and the same in the book of Daniel or elsewhere?

sagenaija:
I can equally say that your fixation on practical group is pointless!
Points win an argument.
I have shown you REPEATEDLY from Scripture that Jesus is superior to all creatures.
All I see from your end is the position of men not FACTS from Scripture.
That is why you run away from directly explaining verses presented.
Was does it mean to honour the Son JUST AS the Father is honoured?
When the Lamb and the Father were together and every creature worshipped did they do it only to one of them and disregarded the other?
Where is it in Scripture that Michael transformed into Mary's womb?
Were Michael and 'one like a son of man' ever equated as one and the same in the book of Daniel or elsewhere?

Pharisees,Sadducees,Scribes and other Jewish Rabbis did more than criticizing Jesus for professing to be the one and only way to God's heart.
They were quoting scriptures upon scriptures justifying their ignorance but what did Jesus have that they don't?
WORKS of faith! James 2:18-26
So present the group of people practicing what you're saying and let's see if your opinion is not based on man-made doctrines.
Only the truth can bring people to act in the same line of thought:

Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth. John 17:17

I have given them the glory that you have given me, in order that they may be one just as we are one. John 17:22

Present a group of people who are SANCTIFIED by the truth of God's word and united in the same line of thought!

As for those arguing blindly they will never be able to unite as one group rather they will continue to contradict themselves all in the name of denominations belonging to the same religion!

"Whoever is not on my side is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Luke 11:23

That's why i keep telling you that fruitlessly arguing and quoting of scriptures can be done by anyone, and of course such a person will always feel he's winning with points, but when it's time to present what everyone can SEE {Matthew 5:13-16} that's when liars will start shouting foul! foul!! Because there's nothing to show for their credulity that they want to equate will real faith that's WORKING! James 2:18-26

MaxInDHouse:
Pharisees,Sadducees,Scribes and other Jewish Rabbis did more than criticizing Jesus for professing to be the one and only way to God's heart.
They were quoting scriptures upon scriptures justifying their ignorance but what did Jesus have that they don't?
WORKS of faith! James 2:18-26
So present the group of people practicing what you're saying and let's see if your opinion is not based on man-made doctrines.
Only the truth can bring people to act in the same line of thought:

Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth. John 17:17

I have given them the glory that you have given me, in order that they may be one just as we are one. John 17:22

Present a group of people who are SANCTIFIED by the truth of God's word and united in the same line of thought!

As for those arguing blindly they will never be able to unite as one group rather they will continue to contradict themselves all in the name of denominations belonging to the same religion!

"Whoever is not on my side is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. Luke 11:23

That's why i keep telling you that fruitlessly arguing and quoting of scriptures can be done by anyone, and of course such a person will always feel he's winning with points, but when it's time to present what everyone can SEE {Matthew 5:13-16} that's when liars will start shouting foul! foul!! Because there's nothing to show for their credulity that they want to equate will real faith that's WORKING! James 2:18-26

If quoting the Scripture is now a fruitless thing then it is all the more clear that you prefer 'deeper understanding' of men to God's sure word.

Any group can argue that they are United in what they believe or stand for. I am yet to see a Catholic who doesn't believe that his church is the one true church and that they are practicing the one true religion. In fact, he will say that the rest are 'Protestants' against the one true group.

The Grail Movement believe in Jesus. But as what? A great man? An enlightened Master?

At the time of Christ on earth even groups that were usually divided along different lines were united against him. Show me the Scriptures those in the time of Christ quoted and I show you that it was more for self-preservation than the search for the truth.

So, the issue is not group. Those in error can and do act in the same line of thought. Are members of a group like ISIS not thinking along the same line even though other will say they are in error? The issue is 'what think ye of Christ'. Do you believe he is who he says he is? How can we know who he is said to be? The Scriptures!

If one believes that Jesus was just a good man, is that enough for eternal salvation? What of saying that he was just a carpenter, or a miracle worker, or even a great teacher? If one believes that he was just a prophet, will that be enough to save? If one believes that he was an angel who died for man is that salvific?

Remember Mary and Martha? What was Mary commended for by Jesus? Works of faith? What was Martha indicted on?

Man or group cannot be the yardstick for evaluation. It is the Word of God. But it clear to all that you will prefer your DOGMA-influenced position than the Word of God. You prefer your organisation's leanings than the Scripture.

Apostle John in rounding off his gospel made this statement:
"But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name."
John 20:31 NIV
Belief in Jesus as the Saviour and God the Son is the key issue. Why? Because only God can save; no other creature has the capacity to. If any other creature did, God's statement that 'My glory I will share with no one' will not hold true.

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
If quoting the Scripture is now a fruitless thing then it is all the more clear that you prefer 'deeper understanding' of men to God's sure word.

Any group can argue that they are United in what they believe or stand for. I am yet to see a Catholic who doesn't believe that his church is the one true church and that they are practicing the one true religion. In fact, he will say that the rest are 'Protestants' against the one true group.

The Grail Movement believe in Jesus. But as what? A great man? An enlightened Master?

At the time of Christ on earth even groups that were usually divided along different lines were united against him. Show me the Scriptures those in the time of Christ quoted and I show you that it was more for self-preservation than the search for the truth.

So, the issue is not group. Those in error can and do act in the same line of thought. Are members of a group like ISIS not thinking along the same line even though other will say they are in error? The issue is 'what think ye of Christ'. Do you believe he is who he says he is? How can we know who he is said to be? The Scriptures!

If one believes that Jesus was just a good man, is that enough for eternal salvation? What of saying that he was just a carpenter, or a miracle worker, or even a great teacher? If one believes that he was just a prophet, will that be enough to save? If one believes that he was an angel who died for man is that salvific?

Remember Mary and Martha? What was Mary commended for by Jesus? Works of faith? What was Martha indicted on?

Man or group cannot be the yardstick for evaluation. It is the Word of God. But it clear to all that you will prefer your DOGMA-influenced position than the Word of God. You prefer your organisation's leanings than the Scripture.

Apostle John in rounding off his gospel made this statement:
"But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name."
John 20:31 NIV
Belief in Jesus as the Saviour and God the Son is the key issue. Why? Because only God can save; no other creature has the capacity to. If any other creature did, God's statement that 'My glory I will share with no one' will not hold true.

The highlighted is a welcome development then if each group says they are the only group practicing what Jesus taught the next thing to ask is what are the WORKS of your faith! James 2:18
The Bible has been given to mankind so if you want to argue surely see what to tap and hing on for you to claim you're right and others are wrong but then we need to ask what should be the result of faith among believers.
If you're not interested in that then each person can hold on to his/her faith because he or she will have something to keep quoting in support of his/her faith.
That's why Jesus said "by their FRUITS you will know" this means each group will have what they are doing but the true disciples of Christ will have their fruit stand out {Galatians 5:22-23} the qualities listed in those verses is what no imperfect human can meet up but as a group having the spirit of God permeating their gathering imperfect humans will exhibit all those qualities and the whole world will see that there's something unique about this group! Matthew 5:13-16
So my friend the letters you're quoting is the Bible no doubt but the understanding is what you don't have! Daniel 12:10 compare to 2Corinthians 3:6

May you have PEACE!

MaxInDHouse:
The highlighted is a welcome development then if each group says they are the only group practicing what Jesus taught the next thing to ask is what are the WORKS of your faith! James 2:18
The Bible has been given to mankind so if you want to argue surely see what to tap and hing on for you to claim you're right and others are wrong but then we need to ask what should be the result of faith among believers.
If you're not interested in that then each person can hold on to his/her faith because he or she will have something to keep quoting in support of his/her faith.
That's why Jesus said "by their FRUITS you will know" this means each group will have what they are doing but the true disciples of Christ will have their fruit stand out {Galatians 5:22-23} the qualities listed in those verses is what no imperfect human can meet up but as a group having the spirit of God permeating their gathering imperfect humans will exhibit all those qualities and the whole world will see that there's something unique about this group! Matthew 5:13-16
So my friend the letters you're quoting is the Bible no doubt but the understanding is what you don't have! Daniel 12:10 compare to 2Corinthians 3:6

May you have PEACE!

If you are looking for those practicing what Jesus taught the next thing is not to ask 'what are the WORKS of your faith!'. The first next thing to ask is 'what did Jesus teach?'.

Of course, the disciples are our immediate point of reference. What did they say Jesus taught?

So, don't behave as if you're the first set of people to understand Jesus and what he stood for. There were the immediate disciples Jesus. Then those who followed them. What did they tell us about what Jesus taught and what did they think about Jesus? Christianity did not start in 1914 nor should the 21st century Christians think they know better than the first century believers.

You drop verses here and there but don't explain them.

Do you think this has anything to do with Jesus:
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6 NIV

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
If you are looking for those practicing what Jesus taught the next thing is not to ask 'what are the WORKS of your faith!'. The first next thing to ask is 'what did Jesus teach?'.

Of course, the disciples are our immediate point of reference. What did they say Jesus taught?

So, don't behave as if you're the first set of people to understand Jesus and what he stood for. There were the immediate disciples Jesus. Then those who followed them. What did they tell us about what Jesus taught and what did they think about Jesus? Christianity did not start in 1914 nor should the 21st century Christians think they know better than the first century believers.

You drop verses here and there but don't explain them.

Do you think this has anything to do with Jesus:
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6 NIV

Well Jesus said:

By their fruits you will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? Likewise, every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit. A good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, nor can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. Matthew 7:16-18

And James said:

Nevertheless, someone will say: “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” James 2:18

Remember Jesus also said:

“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness! Matthew 7:21-23

So each group will claim their teaching is right and they will quote the scriptures to support whatever they're teaching but it's the result that will expose them. That's what Jesus the founder of this religion said!

MaxInDHouse:
Well Jesus said:

By their fruits you will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? Likewise, every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit. A good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, nor can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. Matthew 7:16-18

And James said:

Nevertheless, someone will say: “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” James 2:18

Remember Jesus also said:

“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness! Matthew 7:21-23

So each group will claim their teaching is right and they will quote the scriptures to support whatever they're teaching but it's the result that will expose them. That's what Jesus the founder of this religion said!

Do you think this has anything to do with Jesus:
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6 NIV

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Do you think this has anything to do with Jesus:
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6 NIV

It is connected to:

In the last days the mountain of the LORD’s temple will be established as the highest of the mountains; it will be exalted above the hills, and all nations will stream to it.
Many peoples will come and say, "Come, let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the temple of the God of Jacob. He will teach us his ways, so that we may walk in his paths." The law will go out from Zion, the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. He will judge between the nations and will settle disputes for many peoples. They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will they train for war anymore. Isaiah 2:2-4 NIV

There is no way you can prove that Jesus is the WONDERFUL COUNSELOR, Mighty God Everlasting Father and PRINCE OF PEACE if you can't present a global family of PEACE LOVING WORSHIPERS who are fulfilling what is highlighted in red.

Do you now see why i keep saying you have nothing to show for your faith in Jesus the Prince of Peace?

How can you claim you're a member of his family {Matthew 12:46-50} yet you can't point to any visible group of peace loving worshipers the same way Jesus did?

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Let me be clear again, and it's not to offend you: you're inarticulate, flutter around from one thing to another, and generally act as if you are comedian. So, it's hard to really follow your line of thought.

You leave posts addressed to you and jump into some other person's without going back to see the flow of things or the progression. Your general attitude makes it hard for co-discussants and I want to believe other readers to take you seriously.

This is a public forum.
Also, you referenced my moniker with a false claim ,why won't I set the record straight?Sagenaija is making FALSE claims upandan for only one reason:
The detailed explanation given with Scriptures evidences and screenshots anyone can cross check , Sagenaija can NEVER refute.
I will allow him to save face and chicken out.


If you believe in the Bible, take your time and respond to this 7 questions in post below...


Matthew 4:10 "only Jehovah your God you must worship" and John 4:23-24,"must worship the Father".
Did Jesus Christ tell you Sagenaija to worship him?
Sagenaija,did Matthew 4:10 John 4:23-24 devalue Jesus?
No!
@ Hebrews 1:6 you & some of your Trinity mentors are desperate to grant Jesus what he has said is NOT for him.
Catholic church Jerusalem Bible says No way !

Sagenaija is NOT truthful.
It is public knowledge on this forum, that Janosky sticks with the Catholic Church Jerusalem Bible of Hebrews 1:6: "pay homage to Jesus"
Your fellow Trinitarian devotees who started the the Trinity GIBBERISH said "pay homage"

Max is saying the Bible truth.
Hebrews 1:4 Jesus "INHERITED a name superior to that of angels"
Matthew 28:18, by whose authority?
Trinity shege !!!!

Ephesians 6:1-2,"Honour your Father and your mother"
When you honour them, are you worshipping them?
"Honour" @ John 5:23 and Ephesians 6:2 is the same Greek meaning

Sagenaija is desperate to add his Trinitarian TWIST to the holy Scriptures

[b]Empty rants borne out of desperation

Or obey Revelation19:10 "Worship God"
Matthew 4:10, John 4:23-24, Jesus and the angel is speaking with one voice.

16th September,2021 @ 9:21pm, Your fellow Trinitarian mentors and BishopKingsley, your fellow devotees, proven beyond doubt that @Revelation 5:14, worship is NOT for Jesus.
You have seen and read that screenshot.
Dump your FALSE claims into the Dustbin.


Leviticus 1:1-4 & Hebrews 10:9-10, JEHOVAH changed his position on animals sacrifices.
Does that mean animal sacrifice is valid now?

Sagenaija, answer these 7 Questions and receive the answer to your questions & claim.

7 Questions
#1
Did Jesus Christ have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#2
Did Paul have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?
#3
Did God's number one enemy have only one identity in the holy Scriptures?

#4
Genesis 3:15, who is the serpent?

#5
Genesis 3:15, Revelation 12:7-9, 1 John 3:8, who is the seed that defeats the serpent?

#6
Daniel 12:1-2, 1 Thess4:16,John 5:28, whose voice wakes up the dead?

#7
2 Thess 1:7,Daniel 10:13 & Matthew 25:31,who leads his Father's angels in battle?

Sagenaija, don't DECEIVE yourself.

FALSE claim upandan.
Trinitarian devotees: 3 persons GIBBERISH

The holy Scriptures: Romans 3:29-30, Deut 6:4 & Isaiah 54:5, "JEHOVAH God is one,"HE".

Emusan:
Then Jesus is Jehovah

Emusan says he is his own Father.

If you read his comments & agree you are your own Father.
Believe him at your own peril.

Trinity shege !!!

sagenaija:
[/size]
When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.
Revelation 1:17‭-‬18 NIV
So, you agree that Jesus is the 'First and the Last '?
What does that mean?

The term “the First [pro’tos, Greek 4413) is not "Alpha" , Greek 1] and the Last [e’skha·tos, Greek 2078) is NOT "Omega, Greek 5598]” at Revelation 1:​17, 18 and 2:8.
In these verses, the context shows that the one referred to died and later returned to life. Thus, these verses cannot refer to God because JEHOVAH has never died. (Habakkuk 1:​12, Psalms 90:1) However, Jesus died and was resurrected. (Acts 3:​13-​15, Matt 27:46)
Jesus was the first human to be resurrected to immortal spirit life in heaven, where he now lives “forever and ever.” (Revelation 1:​18; Colossians 1:​18).
Jesus is the one who performs all resurrections thereafter. (John 6:​40, 44) Therefore, he was the last one to be resurrected directly by Jehovah. (Acts 10:40) In this sense, Jesus can properly be called “the First and the Last.

sagenaija:
[size=6pt]
On your Colossians 1 assertion: do humans as 'image' of God have ALL the fulness of God dwell in them? Use your sense.

2 Peter1:4, Colossians 2:10, says Yes!
The disciples chosen for heavenly life acquired the fullness of God,as partakers of the divine nature!
Where was Jesus Christ when Paul wrote Colossians 2:9?
In heaven off course!
Colossians 2:9-10/1 Corinthians 15:24-27 references Jesus in heaven.

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
Janosky does not also know how the Bible uses the term 'Firstborn'. Is there no Lexicon to help him out?

Colossians 1:15 is Jesus Christ the first of every creature of his Father/Father of all?
Yes!
Genesis 49:3, Is Reuben the first born of every son of Jacob?
The first born Reuben is Preeminent.
Is Jesus the first born preeminent?

In the holy scriptures,Which first born has no Father?
None!!!


Note:

Sagenaija, i apologize if this post came a bit late.
Janosky is a busy man off line.
You may draw my attention to any previous post you want me to respond to.

Shalom.